No. My 830 Mhz overclock was not held back by the cooler but rather the CCC.Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird
Printable View
No. My 830 Mhz overclock was not held back by the cooler but rather the CCC.Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird
I had a guy try to tell me on bit-tech yesterday (a moderator) that 2 x 4890's in CF was about equal to a single GTX 280 :rofl::rofl::rofl: :ROTF::ROTF::ROTF: :rofl::rofl::rofl: :ROTF::ROTF::ROTF:Quote:
Originally Posted by Macadamia
DATA mining time: 9 reviews, 1 chart http://www.madshrimps.be/vbulletin/f...e-chart-63314/ :D
This is the first time I see a company afraid they made a card too good :ROTF::ROTF::ROTF: :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?op...13401&Itemid=1
EPIC!Quote:
Update: ATI not thrilled
Update: ATI has officially confirmed that it does not allow partners to overclock the HD 4770, at least not for the time being.
Nvidia sort of did the same thing with the GTX 275 but actually limited its overclocking potential through component choices and voltage.Quote:
Originally Posted by tenebre
If thats the case, I could easily imagine the rv870 having the specs of this times two.Quote:
Originally Posted by hurleybird
1280 shaders, 256mb memory bus, 32 ROPs, 64 texture. All under 300mm at 40nm.
Revolutionary. I imagine profit margins are quite good on these puppies. If I was ATI I would discontinue the HD4850 right about now... and start making an HD4790.
Brilliant. Thanks for the effort.Quote:
Originally Posted by jmke
To comment on the nvidia out selling ati... the problem with that is it must be true. Simple reason is: I don't know anything about hardware, yet I have heard of "Geforce" and "nvidia", and I probably figure a $130 investment in a video card makes sense, so I buy whatever is in that price range and fits the bill.
Of course I am referring to Americans (who probably make up the biggest market). In europe, this might not be the case at all. On average, people in europe and asia are more knowledgeable in these matters.
In addition, retailers often stock a lot more nvidia variety (oems) than ati. Mostly due to demand and availability...
That should tell you how often to trust their reviews. Like I said before, there is something wrong with a website that only shows one company's video card always beating another, no matter what.Quote:
Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG
I haven't found Bit-Tech's articles to be biased one way or another. Am I missing something?
It'd be nice if 900/1000 or more becomes standard overclocking potential for these card. It'd make for an amazing cheap powerful crossifre setup. It'd be nice if they release the 3870 style stock cooler version for the same price as an aftermarket cooler needed for overclocking a $100 card is a fair amount of the card price.
The good thing is seeing the potential of these cut down cards it makes the potential of the 40nm 5000 series cards seem very promising.
I dunno about bit tech being biased or not,but 2x4980(CFX) is definitely not equal to GTX280 but way faster than that and roughly equal to GTX295... Maybe that mod got confused somehow and said 280 instead of 295.
these cards are now on newegg $109
but it's the cooler shown in the reviews.
no triple support and no quad even though they're be really nice too nice for ATI to do so >_>....
-_- disappointing.
Not referring to yours. Just saying that that's the highest OC on both coolers now.Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
needs faster mem:
Quote:
The performance benefit from the 20 percent overclocking for the GPU and 25 percent for the memory is impressive: On average the card is running 25 percent faster, that indicates a relative bandwidth limitation by the 128 Bit interface.
http://www.pcgameshardware.com/aid,6...eviews/?page=3
Which it won't get because this is meant to be a budget card.Quote:
Originally Posted by tenebre
It already has faster ram, or at least the review samples do. The chips are rated at 4GHz, but are downclocked to 3.2GHz. Heck, I don't even think they make GDDR5 rated that low.Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111
I'm hoping 1000/4800 with a better cooler and ramsinks.
That would one heck of a marketing bonus, 1GHZ for a HD4790..
ATI doesn’t want overclocked HD 4770's
http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/5803/ati08.gif
Not for now
http://www.fudzilla.com/index.php?op...13407&Itemid=1Quote:
We've talked with some top ATI guys today and they wanted to make it clear that for the time being there won't be any overclocked Radeon HD 4770.
As you can read here, Asus obviously jumped the gun disobeying ATI’s instructions and naturally this made a huge reaction from people like Sapphire, XFX and other ATI partners that would like to overclock their own cards.
Today, ATI doesn’t want to see any overclocked card, but this might change in the future, as overclocking potential is there. ATI just recently started letting its partners overclock, but the big issues here is if Asus starts shipping such an overclocked products, the others will want to do the same, and ATI loses control.
We believe that this decision is strategic as it can offer second sales wave once the overclocked cards are eventually introduced, and Nvidia often uses the same strategy. One thing is clear, there won’t be any overclocked HD 4770 anytime soon.
(Follow up to: Asus has the first overclocked HD 4770)
overclocked would mean itl be equal to 4850 speeds, and that could be a problem i guess
1ghz mem is too easy for this card, and that alone would boost speeds by quite a bit
I find it odd that reviewers are comparing at HD4770 to a GTS250/9800GTX+ :ROTF:. This card is targeted for the 8800GT/9800GT and what would have been the GTS 240. And if I remember correctly the the Sparkle and Asus verison of the GTS 250 uses 2 PCIe 6 pin connectors. Furthermore, the GTS 250 cost more then a HD4770 even at their current markup price. Heck I've even checked NCIX and the GTS 250 still cost more then a HD4770. So I honestly don't see why the HD4770 is compared to the GTS 250 specifically.
This card is amazing in CROSSFIRE. They have a review over on Expreview that shows 80% scaing overall through a bunch of games and with 2 4770's the crossfire setup is on average 20% faster than a 4890.
This is insane imagine what it could do with 2 in crossfire with good cooling (Trad2/Twin Turbo/S1 Rev.2) and overclocked to 900/1000-1,000/4,800 could do. I think we may have found ATI's 8800gt finally.
Eastcoasthandle, I think it's because it often outperforms those at it's price point by such a margin that it's a better comparison between the next higher priced cards.
Ninja edit: That assus card above is claiming 971/4,600 with their volt mod software. So we may hit that magical 1,000/4,800 mark with rivatuner and perhaps if needed a slightly higher voltage.
Personally, I think it is because of the performance of the HD 4770 in certain games when compared to the GTS 250 / 9800 GTX+. While I find it is important to test against a wide variety of competitors, there is no denying that the performance of this card is in some cases close to or exceeds that of the GTS 250. However, testing the HD 4770 against ONLY a GTS 250 shouldn't be done due to price factors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eastcoasthandle
Most of the reviews are comparing it to both 9800GT and 9800GTX+/GTS250. Which makes sense given it falls between them both price and performance wise.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eastcoasthandle
SKYMTL, based on your tests, do you think at 825/950 (which should be doable) this will match the 4850 or exceed it?
I don't know about SKYMTL but I'm certain that most cards (>90%) can do 800/1000 at stock voltage. Mem is rated at 1000 so it can do 1000 no prob, core is hugely undervolted for it not to cannibalize HD4850 and save power.Quote:
Originally Posted by LightSpeed
Gigabyte Announced their 4770 Today...
GV-R477D5-512H-B is the model name...
Personally, at some point I think that the 128-bit bus will become the limiting factor on these cards' potential for increased framerates through overclocking.Quote:
Originally Posted by LightSpeed
The way I think of it is this way: if we take a HD 4770 and overclock it to HD 4850 performance, we can equally take that HD 4850 and overclock it so it maintains its lead. I would always rather take a higher performing stock clocked card than overclocking a lower-priced card and hoping for stability. Especially when the difference is ~$30 at some retailers.
at 825/950 I think it will succeed HD 4850 based on results over the web
Really seems like a good and cheap card. This competition really could bring back focus to the PC game scene.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=223256Quote:
Originally Posted by v_rr
He is working on an excuse. Payed research, wrongfully etc etc :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by tajoh111
/me adds tinfoil
Once again thanks for the reviews recap onethreehill :up:
128 bit gddr5 == 256 bit gddr3Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
It still seem limited compared to what memory OC alone shows. 192bit with GDDR5 would have been nice I guess.Quote:
Originally Posted by W1zzard
source? elaborate?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shintai
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...0&postcount=12Quote:
Originally Posted by Shintai
better question is how 6.6gbs pixel fill rate 4770 OC can out do a 4850 with 10.5 pixiel fill rate. ???
:confused:
and that's with 4xaa 16xaf.
because whatever you are testing is not fillrate limited on either cardQuote:
Originally Posted by demonkevy666
I'm a bit confused. HR-03 A fits both X1650 and 4670 according to TR, but in your review you say the 4770 has the same holes as X1650 but different to 4670. :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
The VF-1000 also uses the same mounting holes for both X1650 and 4670.
Try check your own review as one example. % core clock OC, % mem clock OC and actual gain.Quote:
Originally Posted by W1zzard
Your own 10% core, 38% memory. Yielded ~17%.
http://i5.techpowerup.com/reviews/AT...es/perf_oc.gif
You can try again just with the memory?
dumb question, but can you crossfire 4850 and 4770 and achieve decent results?Quote:
Originally Posted by Russian
You are correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mats
How about finding an app that is memory BW restricted since COD4 probably isnt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shintai
Aint memory limited on the GPU? Fish?Quote:
Originally Posted by STEvil
What happens when you can buy a 4850 @$89 after a $20 rebate and by using the promo code "VGA851"Quote:
Originally Posted by LightSpeed
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102824
Not really.Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
One: Your statement about over clocking to 4850-level performance is misleading. The 4770 should be able to OC quite a bit past 4850 performance. Even if you get the most crappy 4770 in the world you could probably increase the volts, OC past 4850 levels, and still have way lower power consumption.
Two: The memory on the 4770 is under clocked by default from the rated 4GHz. Restore the memory clock to the rated spec and you've got a part that should be slightly leading, and not slightly trailing, the 4850. There's no practical reason why we shouldn't look at 4GHz memory clock as "stock".
Three: 4850's aren't really known for over clocking well, and while it will obviously vary from card to card, I think that when you overclock both, the 4770 will more often come out ahead.
So, in my view, cheaper price + better thermals + better performance (on average, assuming both are OCed).... what's not to like?
Speaking of comparing both cards over clocked, that's something I would like to see more of in reviews -- not just seeing which card is faster at stock, but who comes out when both are pushed to their limits.
*nudge, nudge*
any single slot 1gb version on the horizon?
We got ~20% overall performance boost from overclocking 13% on GPU and 37% on memory (850/1100). I'd say both GPU and memory clocks are equally important as far as scaling is concerned, this is a sign that the memory bus width is rightfully chosen. The main idea behind the 128bit+GDDR5 is to make the PCB cheaper, i'd say AMD hit the spot from the price/performance standpoint.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shintai
What i find most interesting though about this card is the fact that two HD 4770's in Crossfire marginally beat the GTX 285, wich is almost double the price of both. If it weren't for the stuttering we get in actual gameplay with multi-GPU configs it would be the best solution there is. Here's a link to our article where we tested this:
ATI Radeon HD 4770
nop!Quote:
Originally Posted by vitaminc
XFX Readying 1 GB Radeon HD 4770 Variant
http://www.techpowerup.com/92732/XFX...0_Variant.htmlQuote:
Following ASUS, XFX is another partner breaking away from the reference design mold for the Radeon HD 4770 accelerator soon after its launch. The company is ready with a variant that features 1 GB of GDDR5 memory. For now, a picture of only its box can be found from an promotional page of the company, with links leading to its 512 MB base-model, but what the one picture we have, reveals a rather lavish packaging. The "X" shaped box shows no signs of a "XXX" branding, or anything that suggests the card features factory-overclocked speeds, though the "1 GB GDDR5" is legible. The card is backed by the company's "5-star" warranty. Its pricing and availability are not known.
http://www.techpowerup.com/img/09-04-29/79a.jpg
That X shaped box is just retarded :|
But a 1GB card sounds good.
Need some help here plz.
Do I wait for the 4770's to be released in SA & go crossfire. Or get 2 1GB 4850's or one 4890?
Says who?Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedjo
All same generation, similar-performance ATI cards have been crossfireable since R600.
HD2900XT was crossfireable with HD3850/70, HD4830 is crossfireable with HD4890. HD4770 is, most likely, crossfireable with HD4670 or HD4850.
"says who?" right back at ya. .. sounds like bs to me.. but i'll waste my time and give those combinations a tryQuote:
Originally Posted by ToTTenTranz
edit: while the system is booting up with new cards i googled that:
http://img.techpowerup.org/090429/Capture176.jpg
was it?Quote:
Originally Posted by ToTTenTranz
No it's not!Quote:
HD4830 is crossfireable with HD4890.
It's not! Can't crossfire 640 SPs with 320 or 800 SPs ;)Quote:
HD4770 is, most likely, crossfireable with HD4670 or HD4850.
hd 4830 + hd 4770 = no cf + system hangs/bluescreen when starting ccc
hd 4890 + hd 4830 = bluescreen at startup.
nuked the amd review drivers and switched to 9.4
hd 4850 + hd 4890 = works
hd 4830 + hd 4890 = works but gives "mismatched but will still work" warning
hd 2900 xt + hd 3850 = no go
so in essence, cf only works with identical asics. rv790 is rv770 with a few non-architectural/non-instruction changes (rerouting of signal lines inside the gpu)
There's a new one, on stock, just air, no mods at all, Vgpu 0,95v....1000Mhz will be possible with 1.0-1.05v on GPU.
http://rasamaha.users.photofile.ru/p...3/83795001.jpg
Nice clocks!
This is awesome! :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasamaha
And I just upgraded my HTPC to HD4670 :p:
big leap form 6.6gb without double the core speed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasamaha
I would like to see 4x crossfire bench.:up:
only 2х possible ( 2 cards)Quote:
Originally Posted by Hell Hound
ATI is going bonkers I think now they'll support tri and possibly quad 4890's, but not tri or quad 4770. :wth:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rasamaha
stock 4770 pixel fillrate is 12Gpix/s,earlier versions of gpuz showed only 8 ROPs for the 4770 and hence half the real fillrate.Quote:
Originally Posted by demonkevy666
where did you get that from?Quote:
Originally Posted by demonkevy666
???Quote:
Originally Posted by demonkevy666
all 4770s are QuadFire capable!
That gives me idea... for a price of this single item:
CPU:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819115200
You can buy all these items:
CPU:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103674
MOBO:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813130223
VGA
4x http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814127432
MEMORY:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820227297
HDD:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16822136073
i havnt kept up with the whole thing, but has power consumption and heat been improved. i think its a shame that its between a 4830 and 4850 in performance and heat, but with the die shrink should be a killer in the perf per watt. i would have upgrated my card with this if the power consumption was where a 40nm with gddr5 should be.
Is there a consensus yet on overclocked 4770 vs. overclocked 4850?
HD2900 and HD3850 can be crossfired, I've done that when HD3850 was just released. I believe it was Guru3D that tested RV670+R600 crossfired successfully back then. I agree with you only identical asics can be crossfired, but only because the driver allowing which cards can be crossfired. The reason is probably really simple, to be sure customers don't have problems with combining totally different cards. With older (modified) or beta drivers there's a change hd4770 and HD4830 can be crossfired. To much hassle off course and not doable on the long run.Quote:
Originally Posted by W1zzard
it's right there in w1zzards review ? on TPU...Quote:
Originally Posted by gamervivek
Page three on the review.Quote:
The HD 4770 supports CrossFire configurations with two cards. I did confirm with AMD that there is no support for CrossFire triple or quad. It wouldn't make sense on such a product anyway.
i specifically asked amd "does it support triple or quad configurations?" their answer was "By design, the 4770 is limited to two cards in CrossFireX"
hadn't seen that review,found it on amd's product page-Quote:
Originally Posted by demonkevy666
http://ati.amd.com/products/radeonhd4700/index.html
4770-
4890-Quote:
ATI CrossFireX™ Technology - ATI CrossFireX™ technology with dual GPU support offers superior scalability so your system is ready to level up when you are2.
too bad,three of these might have been a very very good performance solution for the money.Quote:
ATI CrossFireX™ Technology - ATI CrossFireX™ technology with up to quad GPU support offers superior scalability so your system is ready to level up when you are
yes and as soon as ati enables the sideport r700 will beat gtx 295.Quote:
Originally Posted by ownage
if you really want a best bang for the buck crossfire rig, work with the hd 4830, they are dirt cheap right now
Far from retarded.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shintai
If you are in a local hardware store, and you see 10 boxes from 10 different brands, the X shaped box is definitely an eye catcher.
Agreed. It's gaudy and unpleasant for sure, but not stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by ownage
Im not saying its retarded in terms of eye cacthing. But all the practical issues etc. Same space one takes you use 2 "old" etc. Plus even for carry its a wierd shape.Quote:
Originally Posted by ownage
one more reason to get MSI G70, and four HD 4770 cards ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by W1zzard
single GPU will be your best choice,Quote:
Originally Posted by Wadkiller
less heat, and if CF support in games fails, the single GPU keeps on trucking:)
It isn't practical, but when you buy one all your n00bz0r friends think your are 1337 :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Shintai
Please.. not 4 GPUs with 512MB.. it would be such a waste..Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedjo
About mixed Crossfire, don't mind that chart:
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/1277/wic.jpg
Source.Quote:
Originally Posted by Driverheaven
The capability is certainly there, it's probably just a driver lock.
Finally, Techreport's review
http://techreport.com/articles.x/16820
Why would you want to crossfire different model cards anyway? ATI have enough driver problems with regular crossfire (but getting better), crossfiring different models is just asking for trouble.
perhaps triple and quad crossfire disabled over stuttering concerns.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmke
Is there a lot of titles that don't support crossfire? Would that also be the case if you were to use a x2 model?
The 4770's will be cheapest solution of the lot. Heat won't be a problem since i would be watercooling them :)
Radeon HD 4770 Media Edition VS Retail Edition
http://en.expreview.com/2009/04/30/r...html#more-3356Quote:
Besides Radeon HD 4770 retail edition, AMD has actually prepared another edition for media’s test. The two editions look quite differently, but perform almost equally. As you can see below, the media edition is designed elegantly with a more effective cooler.
The media edition brings 2-3℃ lower temperature than retail edition, but it causes more noises when the fan runs at maximum speed. Let’s check out together what differences they have. The above one of each group is media edition, and the other one is retail edition .........
http://en.expreview.com/img/2009/04/30/4770_3.jpg
http://en.expreview.com/img/2009/04/30/4770_4.jpg
Quote:
Originally Posted by onethreehill
wow... the crappy cooler version has 8 less capacitors and 4 less MOSFETs (I think those are mosfets)...
Speedball 2: Brutal Deluxe doesn't :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Wadkiller
If this was Nvidia, everyone would be arming the mob and getting out the pitchforks. :shakes:Quote:
Originally Posted by onethreehill
Funny thing is that the retail edition will always run at max speedQuote:
The media edition brings 2-3℃ lower temperature than retail edition, but it causes more noises when the fan runs at maximum speed
Probably if the clocks were different and with additional memory. The GPU and memory will probably perform within 0,1% of each other between "review" and "retail". Maybe the OC is different but it seems like everyone is hitting the 830MHz boundary so that doesn't seem to stop it.Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
No. The fan on the retail edition runs at 30% and has small spikes to ~60% fan speed when temperatures hit the mid 60s.Quote:
Originally Posted by kemo
830Mhz is the upper limit of the CCC so the fact that everyone is hitting that doesn't come as a surprise. Judging from what I see, power consumption may be different between the two cards as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by marten_larsson
What I am saying is that ATI sent a product out to reviewers knowing full well their board partners would be releasing slightly "cheaper" versions to retail. If Nvidia did this, Charlie and the whole Nvidia Hate Train would pull up at the station and have their way with it. I know there is no "balance" in this industry or in the minds of people but I personally think someone with both cards should conclusively test one versus the other's power consumption.
If I was one of those reviewers who received the version that won't be available at retail until XFX releases their card, I would be pretty ticked off.
XFX First to Use Premium Reference Design for Radeon HD 4770
http://www.techpowerup.com/92862/XFX...n_HD_4770.htmlQuote:
XFX continues to show enthusiasm with its ATI Radeon line of products, by coming up with the first Radeon HD 4770 accelerator for the market to use the premium reference design for Radeon HD 4770 (model: XFX 4770ST D5 512MB). AMD had come up with two choices of coolers for its partners. Most of them choose the one which is more cost-effective, so the sales margins could be improved in an already tight pricing-segment.
XFX used the premium reference-design cooler and PCB, with a major difference that it comes in black instead of red. XFX has so far had a knack of trying as hard as it can, to color its cards black. The company did so with the Radeon HD 4870 reference design accelerator recently. This card retains the reference clock speeds of 750 MHz (core), and 800 MHz (memory). Given that XFX chose the more expensive parts in making this card, it will pass on the premium to the consumer, making it slightly more expensive than the reference design cards in its league.
http://www.cpusers.gr/attachment.php...1&d=1241094297
Well, after looking at your review and Anandtech's it seems like the power consumption is the same. At idle, it's a bit worse than 4830 (~8W) but at load is better(~18W). Compared to the 9800GT it's about the same too. And I assume by what you wrote and previously written that you have a retail card.Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
The OC potential is locked by AMD to 830MHz, no one should be complaining about not getting to OC above that level IMO.
So maybe it's just you blowing things out of proportion?
I'm not complaining since I got a retail version. What I was saying that that people seem to react differently to ATI's flubs than they do to Nvidia's. It was more a comment about human nature rather than anything else. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by marten_larsson
Since people will soon be (and some are already) using RivaTuner which can clock the card FAR above 830Mhz, it could become an issue.Quote:
The OC potential is locked by AMD to 830MHz, no one should be complaining about not getting to OC above that level IMO.
I can only see only two wires powering the fan so i though no PWM = no fan control :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
Yeah, I was thinking about buying one of these to play around with, in addition to recommending them to some of my friends. This development of the lack of some hardware on the board has really turned me off to this card though. ATi, it isn't liked when nVidia does it, what makes you think it won't be minded when YOU do it? As the picture above shows, even the XFX board is missing the same hardware. No thanks.Quote:
Originally Posted by SKYMTL
The missing hardware (mosfets, capacitors) will make 0 difference, unless you are running LN2 and you absolutely need to run 1.6v through the card :D
I hope your right oohms, cause i just pulled the trigger on two XFX 4770's. Will probably get them end next week.
Regulate the voltage to the fan, and you'll regulate the fan speed. It's perhaps not as "smart" as PWM control, but it should work if the bios/software allows it.Quote:
Originally Posted by kemo
The HD 4770 uses direct voltage control to make sure the fan runs at an acceptable speed.