Any other people still getting 166 divider issues with the modded bios? All divider work fine on my board now. :confused:
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Any other people still getting 166 divider issues with the modded bios? All divider work fine on my board now. :confused:
260x9 is definately my sweet spot. 1.5v, stable, lower temps, same scores. My memory is killing me though at only 173.
Dam even with this new modded bios I can't get 280 stable with my plat rev.2 dam tcc5, when i got from 2.5-3-3-7 to 2,5-4-3-7 i gain minimal stablility then when i go to 2.5-4-4-7 i get decreased stablility. :S wtf, I can't seem to get memtest86 to run off floppy with this bios.
Yes i still have the 166 issue but I already knew that for me it wasnt to do with the timings so ive been focussing on 1:1 for a while and NFM bios does help me get higher 1:1 so im happy.
I run my 9800 Se modded to pro at 440 core and 371 memory I use a vga silencer with artic silver 5 but i took off the plastic casing of the vga silencer and the fan and screwed the stock athlon 64 fan into the heatsink So its more like a cpu heatsink design. I have a pci exhaust fan below that to remove the heat.
I used the pencil mod to up the voltage on the 9800 pro and it helped on the core but didnt help at all with the memory but then i have crappy SE memory so 371 is quite good.
Jeez, your 9800se can do more than my new from RMA pro. I wonder how high I can get my Dell ram to go 1:1. Should I try 3-4-4-10 and 2.8v maybe.
Give it a go; you have nothing to lose. :)
Use windows memtest to test it for errors, as it's better than memtest by a long shot IMO.
http://hcidesign.com/memtest/download.html
Lol forget that. 225 is about all it will go. Would you be happy with this:
260x9 CPU
1.48v
133 divider
2-3-2-7 timings
agressive timings and performance mode enabled
Have you tried 290 x 8 with a 133 divider giving 2320mhz cpu speed and 193 ram speed.
Turn off aggressive timing before you try and performance mode.
is this NFM 1T mod 1.8 bios good for UTT ram
You only need the 1T mod bios if you are using a san diego as the option shows with the winnie and venice cpus.
Try and set the timings that the 1.8 HH bios uses in a64 tweaker in windows and if it works flash to the bios and tell us if its good with UTT ram :)
I tried 300x8 when I first got the board. It was unstable, but I'll try it now. BTW, do AT and P-mode help at all. I always left them disabled, but figured I would turn them on since I was underclocking the memory.
I am really contemplating getting a DTR setup. I can get a 3000 DTR with thermalright heatsink for $115, Chaintec NF3 for $55, 1gb Corsair value for $75, and a 6800nu for $160. I am sure I could sell my setup and maybe come out ahead even. The DTR's are beasts. 1mb cache and ~2.8ghz.
Aggressive timings will only decrease your stable OC, but you could try enabling performance mode to see what happens. I always leave both disabled though.
my utt max speed on can hit 260fsb 1tQuote:
Originally Posted by sideeffect
do i need to use the 1.8hh bios
I settled for 260x9 with a 133 divider. Rock stable. Should I enable them or disable them.
If the system is solid with them enabled, then keep it that way. If you want to OC more later though, would be best to turn them off to help with stability. :)
Performance mode will overclock your overclock which is bad because 260 x 9 is your maximum settings. Aggressive timing you might as well enable if its stable because it should/might make your ram work faster.
Most people disable Aggressive timing because they want a high ram speed but because you cant get that anyway its different for you. Your ram isnt really stretched at 167mhz,
NFM the rev 2 sandy bios is it the same with just the hidden options showing or did you do away with the need to have the realtek lan active and hardmod the timings into the bios?
Havnt tried it yet as I use shift f2 alt f3 with the rev 1.
If its the same with just hidden options ill wait for rev 3 :p:
Maybe you could change the layout in rev3 like tictac did with his rev2 he actually says he doesnt mind people using his bios to edit from so might be an idea.
Also was thinking of making some custom boot screens with photoshop if i can make anything good ill brand it with your name and maybe you could use them. If they are good that is ;)
Will performance mode still overclock more if I disable dynamic overclocking. BTW, my limit is 270x9 but that requires more volts and shows no benchmarking advantage. My ram is running 173 2-3-2-7 1T. Also, what about DRAM strenght, spread spectrum, ATI speed up, etc.
performance mode without dynamic overclocking doesnt do anything i dont think.
spread spectrum = off
ATI speed up = off (it does the same thing as dynamic overclocking it overclocks your overclock)
Drive strengh depends on your ram for me it makes no difference what i set so i leave it on normal
@ sideeffect I emailed you. I don't know if you got that mail. I need access to your ftp, just update some stuff. Email me kamilkss@hotmail.com
You have mail :slap:Quote:
Originally Posted by need.for.mhz
I just want to suggest a couple of possible tweaks to the High HTT modded bios. I think that having:
Max Async Latency = 9ns
Read Preamble = 6.0ns
Since the bios is achieving max HTT for memory, i think those timings "might" help a bit. Could you mod a version with those in NFM? Then we could test it against your current version and see which yields higher results. :)
Yes that seems logical You could keep running the hh bios in parallel with a slightly tighter timed bios.Quote:
Originally Posted by CD 1986
If you haven't read my last post, I don't know why I cannot get into windows with any newer BIOS than 1.37Mod. Even at stock speed, I can't :S
Will try 1.95, it is the last bios left to test.
If anyone have an idea, thx a lot.
Regards from Buenos Aires, Arg.
Nicolas .-
Cant get into windows or cant boot? Do the other bios files boot into dos ok?Quote:
Originally Posted by .: Eru :.
Does memtest work ok in dos with other bios files?
is 1.37 bios stable in windows?
Cant get into windows. With 1.37mod is 101% stable, prime 270x10 1:1 all night long...
Memtest works OK....that's why I think that is strange.
Thanks again.
If you look at AMDs BIOS and Kernel developers guide you will see that for higher clockspeed a lower Read Preamble is chosen. For a Board with 4 DIMM Slots it goes like: 9ns 100Mhz, 7ns 133Mhz, 6ns 166Mhz, 5.5ns 200Mhz. If you continue this to 300Mhz a Read Preamble of 5.06ns would be optimal (5.25ns 233Mhz, 5.125ns 266...). Have you tried setting Read Preamble to 5ns?Quote:
Originally Posted by CD 1986
Give me a screenshot of A64Tweaker, I will try and mod a newer BIOS to have those timings, maybe then it'll work. :stick:Quote:
Originally Posted by .: Eru :.
Here it is.
http://img295.echo.cx/img295/4134/cpuztweaker7tg.jpg
Thanks to all, we'll win this battle :P
Max Async Latency = 9ns <----------- Might help when you exceed DRR650!
Read Preamble = 6.0ns <---------- 5.5ns is the sweet spot on Neo2 :)
Thanks for helping
Now, lookie here http://www.swjka.com/k8nneo2bios/?dir=./need.for.mhz
All BIOSes has been revised to Rev.3 :woot:
What's new in Rev.3:
The HH edition is no longer revised because "Rev.3" BIOSes feature same tweaks that HH edition hadQuote:
Changelog Rev.3:
- trrd = 3 clks
- twr = 2 clks
- trwt = 2 clks (trtw in A64 Tweaker)
- tref = 133Mhz 7.8us (removed)
NEED SOMEONE TO TEST THOSE AND VERIFY ^^^ THOSE SETTINGS IN A64 TWEAKER. THANKS !!!
EDIT: Oh, forgot to thank sideeffect for ftp access, thanks mate :toast:
No problem mate.
Ill test the san diego rev 3 now and see what happens :banana:
edit
Rev 3 for san diego works fine all timings show in a64tweaker as they are listed in changelog :D
Testing out the 166 divider now to see what happens.
The timings that you changed all set fine.
Write to read delay time twtr sets to 1 with 166 divider. 200 divider its 2 also read preamble sets to 6.5 with 166 divider. With 200 divider its 5.5.
Maybe they should be set to 200 values
Thanks for testing, 166 divider in Neo2 is totally messed up :banana:Quote:
Originally Posted by sideeffect
So in next release I will force twtr to always set at 2 clks and read preamble at 5.5ns. 1 clk for twtr is way to tight. Probably those caused boot failures when using 166 divider. Thanks for noticing those :)
K fully tested 166 divider and its still not even any where near stable set read preamble to 5.5 and twtr to 2 with a64 tweaker. Htt was set to 290 multi at 10 Resulting memory frequency was 243 mhz failed prime in about 10 seconds and windows memtest in about the same amount of time.
260 mhz ram speed is stable in 1:1 with exactly the same timings. Pc is also stable at 290 htt when i use 133 divider.
am i missing something here. Could this be a high Htt issue rather than a ram issue or are their other timings that a64 tweaker just isnt showing. Also could this be a bad memory controller on my san diego does it have to deal with 290htt or 243 when is the divider put in place.
Why would 290htt at 133 be stable if it was high htt issue with the cpu. Dont really think anyone can answer this was just saying what i have found with my setup.
Im so hoping this is just a san diego issue that will magically dissapear with the 1.9 bios release which is taking forever to come out.
Can you post an A64 Tweaker screenshot of 166 divider v 133 divider @ 290HTT (without tweaking anything). Unless they are exactly the same timings of course. :)
Only visible difference is the tref refresh rate so im focussing on that now to see what works with 166. Maybe 133mhz 3.9us will work with 166 divider.
What tref rates do you get for 133 and 166 divider? I think tref values might be read wrongly in A64 Tweaker however...
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...882#post907882
when I load the
200 divider a64 tweaker shows 200 3.9
166 divider a64 tweaker shows a tref of 166 3.9.
133 divider a64 tweaker shows 133 3.9
I tried setting 200 3.9 in 166 divider before but it doesnt help but i dont think i tried lower settings.
But if the reading is read wrongly then ill have to try all the settings to see if any work.
lol just tried 100 3.9 in 166 divider and memtest crashed bad in like 0.1 seconds :stick:
I'm downloading RMMA (from that thread i posted) to see if the rates reported in the tweaker are different to what the actually are. Best to test all values in any event, since some people get better results with totally different values. :)
I have right mark ill see what it says to.
It shows 7.8 us instead of 3.9 hmm interesting.
Set 133 7.8 us in a64 tweaker and it now shows as 15.6 us in rmma :slapass:
Went through all the refresh rates with athlon 64 tweaker and the lowest that shows in rmma is 7.8 us.
Im going to restart in 1:1 and see what it says then
Ok, i also found that 200mhz 3.9us is actually 7.8us...so the tweaker is wrong. Seems like what ever you select in the tweaker, the actual value is 1 step higher...?
Im in 1:1 now and it still shows 7.8 us refresh interval with rmaa even though a64 tweaker shows 3.9 us. I think rmma is wrong and doesnt read values lower than 7.8.
Or it could be that the actual values are 1 step higher. Looking for another tool that reads the value now :p:
The reason i think rmaa is wrong is because setting 1.95 in a64 tweaker still shows 7.8 in rmaa.
Ok tried with systool which you can get from here http://www.techpowerup.com/systool/ and it shows the same as a64 tweaker but then its very similar to a64 tweaker it could be the same code :p:
Btw systool is ace if you havnt used it because it shows the real voltages of the mobo unlike speedfan and mbm which show wrong values.
I think RMMA is correct, only because...512mb sticks nearly always have a default refresh rate of 7.8us and that is what RMMA is showing on my setup. I could be wrong, but the guys in that other thread seemed to reach the same conclusion.
Tweaker vs RMMA
1.95us ---> 7.8us
3.9us ----> 7.8us
7.8us ----> 15.6us
15.6us ---> 15.6us
Yeh, systool is great...i helped the author set it up for the nforce3 chipset, since he didnt have an nf3 testbed; reading and changing clock speeds etc... Best all in one tool around! :)
EDIT: have you managed to find any tref value which gives greater stability for your setup?
No ive been to busy messing with rmma and systool lol. Going to try some more now. One thought though if 7.8us is the minimum setting what are the other settings actually doing in a64 tweaker ...... :stick:Quote:
Originally Posted by CD 1986
Ummm....
I suppose smaller sticks (eg. 256Mb) might use a lower refresh rate value. And maybe a lower value might help improve performance in some cases. I'm guessing here though. :p:
I think if the value could be set with a 256 mb stick then it could be set with a 512mb stick even if it caused the 512 stick to crash while setting it.
Someone with a 256mb stick test this and see what reading they get with rmma please :slap:
Also, look in Everest to find the default refresh rate of your memory modules...its in the SPD info section. These were taken from my laptop memory modules...they have default of 7.8us, but they are only DDR333:
LOL this is just plain weird, Ok so im running memtest and it keeps finding errors after a few seconds. I change all the tref values each failure and start again but it still errors. (166 divider)
So I leave tref on 133. 3.9us and change the memclk frequency to 183 which takes my ram up to 263mhz and memtest is running fine now ....
edit- everest shows 7.8us for me as well in spd
Good find there! What happens if you boot using the 133 divider and then having A64 startup settings set to 166 divider? Is it still as unstable as booting with the 166 divider from the bios?
Didn't 1.9b5 have a 180 divider in? If so, you might be able to get around your problem that way when it's officially released. :)
Booted with 133 and set 166 with a64 tweaker and still the same errors. So it seems that 166 just doesnt work for me.
The 183 divider is more stable but im not sure if its fully stable yet ill test that now :cool:
The 1.95 beta bios is supposed to be more stable with the 183 divider but doesnt have the option in the bios atm but it has the registers in the bios so it seems that it will be added when the final is released.
However i have never been able to get 1.95 beta bios to load bios setup it boots and loads windows ok but wont load the bios setup menu in dos tried msi beta and murdoks rev1 2 and 3 with no luck. Other people have had this same issue though so hopefully this will be fixed in the final revision as well.
Guys, what BIOS has the 183 divider option? I'm using the 1.8mod and it doesn't have it.
Thanks,
AleX
nothing pre 1.95 does I should say.
Might want to try moving fans to different headers if the bios screen wont show for 1.95. Abit nF7(-s)'s had the same issue which was due to RFI interference on the fan headers.. D27 bios may have been the one with the issue, cant quite remember.
You have to set 183 divider with a64 tweaker from within windows. In my experiance its as stable as 1:1 with my setup where as 166 divider isnt stable at all.
yeah, but thats annoying ;)
Thanks for the info ill give that a try.Quote:
Originally Posted by STEvil
How true ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by sideeffect
I've been using a64 tweaker startup settings for a few weeks now, in the BIOS I just select the 100 divider and in windows it loads the 166 :)
Works like a charm here :)
In fact, I don't even care about the BIOS memory options anymore, since A64 can set it all for me :)
Yeh, but all people wannna VID + 18% and for the same price 183 divider too ;)
I see some very positive effects with 5.0ns read preamble. I'm testing it with
my crappy winnie, cbbid, very very poor memory controller :(
289Mhz (2.5-4-3-7) 1:1 ratio@2601Mhz Winnie w\ 5.5ns preamble = winmemtest error at ~ %500. w\ 5.0ns preamble it goes without error forever :)
this was on rev.3 180 bios, so i think 5.0ns is coming in rev.4 Anyone also gets positive results?
I always use 5ns and most screenies i see of a64 and nice tccd clocks are 5ns.
I also think 5.0ns is the way to go, but be careful with that.Quote:
Originally Posted by need.for.mhz
I integrated read preamble 5.0ns in one of my bios, but my system wouldn't boot @ 200mhz then, so if you do a cmos reset with rd 5.0ns built in you might no longer be able to boot.
yes 5ns is nice. This will be the last bios that i will release before v1.9 offcicial bios. It's like an improved HH edition:
- 5.0ns read preamble (forget about it :( )
- twr upped to 3 clks (2 clks in rev.3)
- trtw upped to 3 clks (2 clks in rev.3)
what's need to be done:
- DQS, which does better job in terms of stability (faster, slower or off)
- ugh........... the tref value.....headache I believe default is 3072 no?
Many people may reach 300fsb with rev.3 easily, but those who have crappy memory\cpu's mem controller, this bios will be for you. Participate :)
EDIT: @digitalfrost, yes i know about that
EDIT: Oh men, just realized, 5.0 will be no go. hard to boot at 200HTT :(
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...id=33247&stc=1
haha, yes!, beat my personal record on crappy cbbid winnie :toast: so this shows cpu and mem needs a lot of tweaking.
Nevertheless you can integrade read preamble of 5.5ns for the people who use dividers.Quote:
Originally Posted by need.for.mhz
To get 5.0ns working we'd need to readout current clockspeed and do an if-then-else, so say, enable it at >=266Mhz, but I don't know how to do that.
yeah, good idea but it seems impossible. In Neo2 bios timings are changed only when divider is present. But hey, wait, how about hack gig lan like tictac and insert code there. Um but that wouldn't work either, gig lan is probably enabled by default no? Only options is to insert code somewhere to some useless option within the bios that is disabled by default
EDIT: We have only one option left, Hack EPA logo; which is disabled by default. Insert 5.0ns read preamble there and once we reach high htt, just enable the EPA logo
EDIT2: maybe make realtek gig lan disabled by default using modbin :) ??
How measure tension meter electric vcore? Where on mainboard? Which places in? Please give me some snaps, because otherwise, I will not apprehend... :P
PS. Sorry for my english... :)
----
Great bioses NFM :D
sorry to interrupt... jus here to say good effort guys !!!
sorry i can't participate... too busy with my exams now.
gambateh !!!
Yeah thats easy. But integrating the code in nic.rom I have no idea how this stuff works.Quote:
Originally Posted by need.for.mhz
I already looked at tictacs file using disassemblers but I don't get it.
Enigma: Take a look at the VCore mod thread, maybe there you will find a picture http://xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=41350
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...id=23902&stc=1
HI:
With my tester in this point I read 0.2v les than "real" vcore I see in bios and windows. Why???? This is the true Vcore mesure poin??
Thanks
Hi all, I read fast reply ... finally is it possible to set DQS Mode to faster ?
Wow is this the XP90 ? I like how it also cools the ram
Its possible with modded bios.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonic9
@digitalfrost: Okay fast reply ! I wait THE modded bios with DQS Mode to Faster !!
@NFM: Thanks for your modded bios :-) and in your screenshot, what the multiplier used ? and what voltage ? thanks ! I want 280-290 of fsb sync'ed too ;-)
@Sonic9
I believe I used 7x multiplier, but 9x did the job also. 289x9=2601Mhz stable max on my winnie. v2.8 for my ram, default voltage for cpu at 7x multi, at 9x multi 1.536-1.55
@kasius
Winchesters are undervolted by v0.1, also Neo2 flactuates
So faster DQS Mode proves to be more stable?
My friend use a DFI nf4 and the only stable configuration is done with DQS Mode to Faster ... but for mee I continue to prime my system ... but my brother kill it and plays GTA sometimes argh
@NFM: the Rev3 has 5.0ns ??
Nope, if it would, the board would be trash, it wouldn't boot at all! U use 5.0ns when you exceed ~270 fsbQuote:
@NFM: the Rev3 has 5.0ns ??
oh okay , thanks for this tip ... I'm french so I don't understand at the first read ;-)
So, there I try too. I had near exactly 1,8V and i don't believe that the motherboard give such tension... :|Quote:
Originally Posted by kasius
in bios: 1,4 + 5%
on meter electric: 1,8V
Some other ideas?
@ need.for.mhz
DQS skew will be very different for everyone, it's basiaclly the skew delay.
Which is the small time difference when signals are received compared to one another.
It will most of the time be within a certain range especailly on the same board, but depending on the rams can be very different, maybe we can test will only 808 brainpower pcbs and see if the same settings helps everyone with the same ram pcbs and chips too maybe.
Read preamble of 5ns works better for me as well.
Can someone sen me this bios: v1.8Mod [NFM] Rev.3 BIOS
nfm's server seems to be overloaded :(
mail: gregat [a] gmail.com
Tnx
is it possible to get less than 1.1 Volt for the CPU on that board?
The Bios option is ignored. When I set it to 0.8 Volt and 800 Mhz defaultspeed, I get in Windows always 1.1 Volt.
Other Tweakers like RMClock or Clockgen show also that problem. No less than 1.1 Volt. :(
I got a Venice 3000+ and 1.8 normal bios. Is it because the Bios doesnt know the CPU?
Server is my server and i doupt it can get overloaded. Maybe just a isp issue try again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonman
Why would you want under 1.1 volts anyway the chip would run super cool at that voltage.Quote:
Originally Posted by mapel110
I'd just like to thank NFM for his modded boises! Using 1.80 rev2, i just broke 30s for the 1st time in the unpatched Super-Pi 1M (29.988s)...at 10x280 and 1:1 memory @ 2.5-3-3-7. :D
Next i'll try the SSE3 patched version and break 29s. ;)
I need a bios to run 300HTT, 3x HT, 8x CPU, 133 divider, 2.5-3-3-10. I can't boot at that currently. I a, using 260 HTT, 9x CPU, 133 divider now. That would be fine if there was a 150 divider.
Blinkme323 if your system doesn't even post at these settings a bios mod can't help you. The code is executed at end of the bios part, so does your system hang after the bios finished, or does is not post at all?
Edit: 1.96 BETA is out. http://msi-forum.de/thread.php?threadid=17502
Hi, I've got Winch + 2x512 corsair xl v1.1 maxes out at 240htt, using 2.5-3-3-8
cpu@280x10 -166 max /mem at 234 -- Pi 32mb stable, hoping might get few more mhz with a newer bios- on 1.36b @ moment.
I see a few new bios, which one's should I try?
OR which one's should I NOT try :)
I read the whole thread(quite a few times) but most of the memory settings info is well above my head sorry.
Any advice truly appreciated :)
Edit: this memory dosn't like twr = 2 clks - trwt = 2 clks when set in A64Tweaker, guess I'll stay where I am until I get better memory.
When I first got my mobo, I was running 1.8. I maxed out at 2.43cpu, 215 memory, and HTT was 315 but I didn't try to go higher. Now with the modded bios, which works great at my current setting, can only do 285 HTT. I need the best bios for a high HTT. Ram timings don't have to be real loose.
Nice one mate :banana:Quote:
Originally Posted by CD 1986
I tried NFM rev3. I could boot at 290-300 but blue screened while loading 2000. I am back to 265x9 instead of 295x8. They would do the same thing except I wouldn't b e underclocking my memory. BTW, I am only using 1.45v somehow. I doubt it is stable but I am typing from it.
1.96 beta gives me same error as 1.95 beta
Warning : Have Option Rom Can not be invoke (vendor ID: IODEH Device ID: OODFH)
The bios boots windows loads ok just cant enter bios setup. I tried removing all the fan headers but it didnt help. :slapass:
any ideas?
What flashing method did you use?
If you used winflash, make sure you ticked all the boxes so that the DMI area is updated as well as the main block of the bios, since 1.9b has a different bios structure from the older bioses.
Just flashed 1.9b6...
- the CPU multiplier option is now selectable and works
- the voltage options are back in % over-volt (upto 10%)
- the 216, 233, 250mhz memory dividers don't work correctly
- 183mhz divider not selectable in bios, but visible in modbin6
Maybe someone could try and activate the extra mem divider options, and the extra over-volt options? NFM? :)
I can't find anything on this mobo and the A64 X2 cpus. Did I just miss it or did MSI leave us hanging?
I believe that the new 1.9 bios will support X2. I just loaded on 1.9b6 and on the bootup screen (right hand side) it says "1 CPU" detected, therefore its probable that it can detect more cores also. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by flenser
pls where to download this 1.9b6 biosQuote:
Originally Posted by CD 1986
Thanks!
I hope they wait to release it until they get it right.
1.96 download link:
http://msi-forum.de/thread.php?threadid=17502
I'm really busy right now :( Will get back later today. btw nice to see 1.9B6 BIOS out.Waiting for offcial release :toast:Quote:
Maybe someone could try and activate the extra mem divider options, and the extra over-volt options? NFM?
just everybody hang on
Waiting too. We will see that MSI guys knows to make!Quote:
Originally Posted by need.for.mhz