New to water cooling - Need advice

[MikalCarbine]

I am ordering an opty soon, and I am taking the plunge into water cooling

I want to point out that my case is a P180, and I am using the bottom HD cage(see picture below)


(Old and messy picture)

I want to only cool the CPU, but I might be upgrading to X2 during the summer, so I want it to be able to handle that too. My budget will be $200-$300 (birthday money ) Here is what I was thinking of getting:

Block: Swiftech Storm or Dangerden TDX (Maybe Storm R2, I heard the storm is much better than the Dangerden)

Pump: I'm not too sure about this, I don't know how much pressure I will need for just my CPU (might do GPU when G80 comes out) but I was recommended the MCP655, but I just read the pump guide and it puts a lot of heat into the water... would a pump be nice to put where the middle HD cage is (missing in picture)

Res: I was thinking of getting a 5 1/4 to put in one of the bays, but is it necesary to run one? I have heard that they only decrease the time the water temp will max and not decrease the load temp at all, so I'd rather go with a t-line

Radiator: This is also a finiky part, get one to fit in the case or outside? I would like to get a Black Ice Pro II but how would I rig that in my case? I assume a BIPI would not be well suited for CPU and possibly GPU... Any input?

Tubing: I heard Tygon is the best

Is there anything I am missing? Do most pumps plug into the PSU or a wall outlet? Forgive me for being a newb to WC but I did do some research

Any input is greatly appreciated

[Bail_w]

CPU waterblock: swiftech storm or Danger Den TDX ( not much differences)
Pump: Danger Den D5 or Swiftech Mcp655
No need reservior, use a T-Line instead
Radiator: thermochill PA160 (single ) ,PA122 (double), PA123(double)
Yes Tygoon is the best tubing around.

[IFMU]

Res: I was thinking of getting a 5 1/4 to put in one of the bays, but is it necesary to run one? I have heard that they only decrease the time the water temp will max and not decrease the load temp at all, so I'd rather go with a t-line

Tubing: I heard Tygon is the best

About the only thing I can say for sure about this, been out of W/Cing a bit, is that no, a res is NOT needed. Some do say it can actually hamper performance.
Most use them due to personal choice or difficulties with t-lines.
Like myself, every time I ever tried to use a t-line, I could never get all the air out. Others though have had the best luck with them.
IMO, if you would rather go t-line, then go for it, the res's arent really needed.
Tygon has been said to be the best by nearly everyone, that would be the best call for tubing.
One last thing, something I have noticed is that many people claim that the larger sized tubing gives better results, i.e. 3/4" tubing or ID of 1/2".

Someone will be around to help out with the other questions.

[MikalCarbine]

I was searching around at XS and noticed 1 or 2 people mounting a Black Ice Pro II on the back of their case, which part is used to mount the rad to the case and keep it stable?

[Bail_w]

swiftech radiator box?

http://store.yahoo.com/svcompucycle/mcb120k-blk-28.html

[MikalCarbine]

Ah yes that looks like it

This is gana be pretty expensive =0

[ReD.SkY]

the setup in my sig will work for you, you can get a bip2 instead and a mp-05 pro to save cash

link: http://hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=1021270

look at extrapickles' pic of his p180 with triple rad it is post #12 on the link i gave you

-=-=-=-=-

imo tygon is waste of money, but if you have deep pockets go for it. the mp-05 pro is comparable to the storm (close) and is only $55 ... the D5 pump will rock. The BIP2 or 3 on the outside of case will own! if we both have same setup, you will get better temps

[Bail_w]

Tygon wroth every single peny. it is very flexiable and reliable.

[ReD.SkY]

lol how unreliable is clearflex? it wont dissinegrate will it lol? it is tubing, not a pump

[Bail_w]

well, it wont disintegrate. but i am just saying it wroth every single penies.

[ReD.SkY]

ok lolz

[MikalCarbine]

This is gana hit my pockets pretty harsh, I am going to try to get a lot of it off of Anandtech used for cheap..

I've heard a lot of good stuff about that storm, hopefully I can get one for cheap, as for the pump I still don't know. I am going to go with the T-Line and most likely the BIPII and mount it in the back, the BIP3 is a little too expensive and seems overkill for just a cpu/gpu

[MaxxxRacer]

If you havnt already done so, please read the guides.

[MikalCarbine]

Well the birthday money is in, I've got about ~450 to work with (some of its a little extra I had left over too) and it's time to order my setup

I decided to go for the whole CPU and GPU setup :P
I've read all the guides over again too, here is what I am thinking of

Swiftech Storm Revision 2 (Is it worth paying extra for a R2 or buying a R1 used) - I have a lot of cash to work with, so I don't mind paying the premium for a storm
Black Ice Pro 2 w/ 2 silent fans (suggestions for fans?)
Maze 4 for GPU w/ ramsinks
Tygon Tubing (about how many feet will I need for this?)
D5 or MCP655 (Heard they are the same thing?)
Swiftech Rad Box

Of course clamps and a t-line and t-line cap, but does that look good? I will be placing an order soon, I decided on just buying all new stuff instead of getting it all used from the forums, unless I can find a Storm R1 for cheap. I will be a 3800+ to put under this

[gotfrag?]

I just have a few questions.....
How does a MP-1 compare to a Maze 4?
And how does a 50z compare to a MCP655 in this setup?
Also If you look at ExtraPickles' rad and radbox, it looks as though he cannot plug any cables in, IE monitor, keyboard, mouse....
Has anyone had experiences with a large rad and radbox in the back?

[MikalCarbine]

When you think about it, the radbox is 120mm big, just like the fan, and the fan is off-centered and to the right of the I/O shield, so there will be room, the things below that though (video card, sound card, PCI cards) are another story

[creidiki]

If youve got all that money get a PA, much better to invest money in the better rad than to pay more for the extra 0.05c of the rev 2 storm...

MP-1 will probably give better temps than maze 4 (im nearly certain of it but no test data). MCW60 will also most likely perform better.

Definitely 50Z over D5/MCP655 (same pump, yes) with this kind of setup. Very definitely.

Mikal get 10 feet at least so you have spares - btw i prefer masterkleer 7/16 to tygon, but its down to personal preference.

Best fans would be Yate Loon D12SL-12. Get them from J-Mag here on forums, or online from jab-tech or petras tech shop.

[MikalCarbine]

I'll look into that PA, how much better would it perform than the BIP2?

I think I'll look into getting a used Storm R1 too, especially if it doesn't perform much better for that price premium

Is that MP-1 a new block from DangerDen?

Also, what is AquaExtreme's homepage? Or where can I find that pump and a little more info/price about it. I googled but couldn't bring anything up

I've heard good things about Loons, so I will look into them

Thanks a lot for the advice!

[creidiki]

A fair bit. If its too expensive you could always go for the swiftech MRC220 which is the middle option as far as price & performance go.

MP-1 is an AquaXtreme block, cooltechnica.com.

50Z/MPC600 Rev. 2 info, here and specifically here.

Also in Maxxx's guide to choosing the best pump for your rig

[MikalCarbine]

Haha I know, I was recommended the D5/MC655 from a lot of people though so I figured that would be nice, and I assumed the 50Z would be much more expensive seeing that it is the better pump, but its only ~70! It looks like a great pump, but it worries me that Maxx said it doesn't last as long as the others, this rig will be bringing me through college, so maybe I'll pick up an extra one before I head off this Fall :P

I'll go over all the costs, but I might go with the MRC220, gota look more into it and do some calculations

Again, thanks a lot!

[creidiki]

Itll last you a couple of years at least i should hope ... check the guarantee on it, i think cooltechnica lists it.

If you get 2 run them in series for extra cooling power!

[MikalCarbine]

I am thinking I might have enough for the Thermochill, which I would really like to be able to get :P

I've decided upon getting the Masterkleer tubing, it is SO much cheaper too, will the 7/16 ID be that much harder to fit on 1/2 inch barbs?

I am still torn between the GPU and CPU block, I'd like to get the MCW60 @ Jab-Tech, it comes with the Swiftech Ramsinks that are usually $20 alone but it looks like it has plastic barbs? I'd feel more comfortable getting a MP-01 (if it really does perform better) with metal barbs :P Now for the CPU block, I can't seem to find any used Storms, so $80 for a R2 is pretty steep if it doesn't perform that much better..

Here is a quick estimate of all that I am going to purchase
Item Name Price ETA
Swiftech Storm Revision 2 80
Maze 4/MP-1/MCW60 50
Masterkleen 15 feet 10
AQ50Z 75
Clamps 15
Fillport 12
RamSinks 20
T-Line 6
Swiftech Rad Box 25
5x Yate Loons D12SL-12 30
Fan Grills 5
PA120 or MCR220 50-100
Shipping 25+?
TOTAL 403-455

Seems to be just in my price range, so I might just go ahead with the Storm R2

[creidiki]

Nah, not really. You have to actually push it on - 1/2 tygon just slides on - but if youre lazy you can just heat up the end of the tubing in hot water before putting it on

You can always get separate barbs... DD PerfectSeal are G1/4... the plastic ones are a little trickier cause you have to make sure theyre on tight, and if the tube is twisted the wrong way it can unscrew the barb... but im using them on my storm with no problem.

As for the storm, rev2 costs the same as the rev1 did... when they started doing the new production run they implemented some of the improvements that cathar did for his "might never actually get made maybe 5 maybe 35 of them" storm g7, and thats the rev2. Its just that the difference is so minimal that its not worth upgrading the midplates if you have a rev1, as the top & midplates take up about 80%+ of the machining time and cost accordingly.

Anyway, looks like a great loop... though personally ive never understood the deal with fillports. Yes, its neat but... i prefer being able to just slide my loop right out of the case for filling/modifications/leak testing... and i never top up once the loop is in... change stuff to often for the level to actually drop, lol personal preference i guess

[Repoman]

You asked about mounting the rad on the back of the case, all you need are the longest 6-32 screws you can find. I got some 2 inch ones, they hold my rear case fan, one of the rad fans, and the rad on very sturdy Put nuts in between the rad and case and fans though

[MikalCarbine]

Sounds like a good cheap alternative Repo, I'll look into it

I'll deffinately get the Storm R2 then, are those DD PerfectSeal metal? I went to the DD website and they didn't have pictures or mention it in the description All I have to pin down is what GPU block to get and I think this baby is set

As for the Fill Port, I don't think I will be able to slide my setup out for leak testing, I will be modding the back of my case for the tubing to go through it to the radiator, unless of course I took the rad off and the other stuff out then reattached it After this I won't be changing much, just a new video card this summer and I am all set (I remember saying this about 100 times in the past year or so )