5 Stage Cascade Made in Germany !

[G H Z]

Weld is shut?

[ultralo1]

we need a new compressor,

the scroll has a internal hotgasbypass..

hotgastemperature after 10min are >150°C

Check the dump switch and solenoid. That will be the circuit that allows hot gas to be dumped into the expansion tank when disharge pressure is too high.

[Patrickclouds]

its definetly the compressor that opens the internal bypass.
if we start the unit, the compressor opens the bypass only for a few seconds. but after some time it stays open and doesn´t close anymore.

[ultralo1]

Can you get the comp over there?

[Patrickclouds]

yes i think so. sometimes you can find copeland scrolls on ebay.

or we use a different compressor like a maneurop mtz 40 with also 11,6m³/h

[Patrickclouds]

for today we planed to test the unit with nitrogen.
we want to see, if it is possible to condense nitrogen.
but first we had to do some rebuild of the last stage to connect a 20l nitrogen bottle ti the unit.

here you find some pics and 3 little vids
















http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqU-d6-a5ws
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GHDZt1r4Ap8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhG5_xcGN18

[Duh]

0 views I am the first one
Impressive mate very clean

[-EC-UnRockStar]

no you are the second, i view the vids before

[Duh]

it does not count as you have all the pr0n 24/7 and all the knowledge to make that thing put into shame CERN's LHC :P

[Gray Mole]

Very cool

Not 'just' a cascade anymore, but a very high speed LN2 condensor.

It's a bit expensive longterm to make it that way, but attach an air separation system to pull Nitrogen out of the air, and you'd have an incredibly fast LN2 bottle filler

Out of curiosity, did you keep track of how long it took to condense a given amount? I don't know if this, or this 'kind' of cascade is cost effective compared to other LN2 production systems, but it's interesting to see it have an industrial/medical application.

Great project

[Gray Mole]

Oh, and of course it does beg the question...

If you can condense Nitrogen in that stage, you can 'stretch' it too.

Makes me wonder how much, and how cold it could go without much load.

Nitrogen has a pretty steep PT curve. Working in the 5th stage at -10psi or better, could see it reach down to -210c or better? Is there even a -200 club? You guys could be the founding members

Gray

[-EC-UnRockStar]

i am in the -200°C club.


i run a n2 filled single stage in vakuum and break the magic -200°C.

the condenser was a coil of 6mm Copperpipe into a ln2 filled dewar.


i can break the -200 with the cascade but i need the right compressor who doesn´t exists.

i think i must run the 5th stage with a 2 stage compression with intercooler.

LP from -0,4barg to 4 barg and the HP stage from 4barg to 36barg

[-EC-UnRockStar]

i am in the -200°C club.


i run a n2 filled single stage in vakuum and break the magic -200°C.

the condenser was a coil of 6mm Copperpipe into a ln2 filled dewar.


i can break the -200 with the cascade but i need the right compressor who doesn´t exists.

i think i must run the 5th stage with a 2 stage compression with intercooler.

LP from -0,4barg to 4 barg and the HP stage from 4barg to 36barg

[Gray Mole]

Well that's a little like cheating

I know Reggie did that a while back too, pulling vac on a captube LN2 dispenser.

Actually doing this in a cascade is pretty rare, at least for the 'enthusiast' level, and you're about as close as I've seen anyone make it happen here at XS.

I'm a bit jealous too, exactly the sort of project I'd love to take on. Even getting a load of the parts free, it's still a pretty expensive proposition.

You guys rock

[Dualist]

Awesome work guys
Are you gonna try a bottle of helium on it next.?

[-EC-UnRockStar]

its impossible to do that with Helium

you can´t condensate helium with nitrogen

same as Neon

[sdumper]

Very cool!!! I too am jealous. You do much better work then me and seem to have unending sources of money to buy parts.
Great job!!

[-EC-UnRockStar]

and seem to have unending sources of money to buy parts.

but i haven´t enouth money to buy a 3,2l TT

[Danny54]

I've been reading this thread. Don't understand any of it but it sure is fascinating and pretty damn amazing!

So now I'll show my complete ignorance . This is all eventually to cool a pc is it? How on earth does a pc connect to it and what kind of cold temperatures can a cpu actually take ?

[sdumper]

I've been reading this thread. Don't understand any of it but it sure is fascinating and pretty damn amazing!

So now I'll show my complete ignorance . This is all eventually to cool a pc is it? How on earth does a pc connect to it and what kind of cold temperatures can a cpu actually take ?

Yes it will connect to a CPU via a special CPU mount. CPUs are all different but the latest round of chips from AMD and Intel have no cold bugs so they can easily handle Ln2 type temps.

[Duh]

Yes it will connect to a CPU via a special CPU mount. CPUs are all different but the latest round of chips from AMD and Intel have no cold bugs so they can easily handle Ln2 type temps.

wont this go much lower than ln2?

[Patrickclouds]

we continued with testing today.
in the 5th stage we connected two compressors in series to make a two stage compression.
it works quiet good but the 3rd stage is dropping away after some time. we are not sure if in the 3rd stage the massflow is too low and/or the high pressure (8 bar) is also too low.
we reached -176°C but is it only cooled gas or liquid nitrogen that enters the evap? maybe we need some more high pressure.
maybe it could get colder but 3rd and fourth stage are dropping away, so coldest temp was -176°C

the cold cpu evap:


coldest temp until 3rd and 4th stage are dropping:


at the beginning the temps on the hx outs of 3rd and 4th hx look quiet good:


at first 3rd stage drops:

[SexyMF]

How are you finding the PLC programming? Are you tweaking compressor speeds via VSD/VFDs?

[-EC-UnRockStar]

the programming of the PLC was easy .

in the moment are five from six compressors are driven by a VFD.

the desupheater and Condenser fans are driven by VFDs too.

they are controlled by the PLC via 0-10V signal.


i have uploaded the electric plan from the cascade but its rev 1.0

i have lost the final version because my pc had a harddisk damage in summer.

[Duh]

@ unrockstar : there are some terrific applications to recover stuff from FUBAR disks

edit : keep it coming