New WC rig - first timer

[FuryoftheStars]

Hey folks,

While this may not be my first post around these forums, this is my first new thread. I’m not exactly new to system building, although I still have a lot to learn (especially when it comes to brand quality) but these forums have been a great help to me. This is, however, my first attempt at water cooling. (And I must warn you now... this post is kind of long ) I ultimately decided to post this here in the liquid cooling section seems the majority of my questionable acts are with the LC components (look for the s).

I have plans to, sometime in the near-distant future, build a new rig with a WC system in it. I’ve been doing a lot of reading and looking around online for all the different parts and costs. For me, I value quality and performance over cost and noise. I’ve already decided that I will save up the money to buy my system in more or less one bang that way there is no buying something that gets “replaced” by something better before I even finish building my rig.

With all that in mind, I want to run my “list” past all of you and see what inputs you have. The basics:

Case: Mountain Mods Ascension
This is the primary case that I’m looking at. I like it because it is big and should have more than enough room for everything that I want to throw into it. I’m thinking of aluminum to go away from the traditional black that I always get, but am still thinking on that. The case previous to this that I was looking at was the Corsair Obsidian 800D, but ultimately I didn’t feel as though it had enough room for everything I wanted. I also have no experience nor the tools needed to mod a case, so the less I have to do in this regard, the better.
Motherboard: EVGA E760 Classified 3-Way SLI
CPU: Intel Core i7-975
I may replace this one with the i9 if that comes out before I get everything together for my system.
Graphics: 2xEVGA GTX295
Like the CPU, I may replace this one on my list with the 300 series if it comes out before I’m ready to buy.
Memory: 2xCorsair Dominator (3x2GB)
PSU: Corsair 850W (80+ Silver, Modular)
I’m not 100% sure on this yet. I know it is a good unit, but I don’t know if it’s going to be up to handling my system. I’m not sure if I might need a second PSU of some sort (the Ascension does have a second hole for PSUs) or if I might need to go with something different altogether. I saw a liquid cooled PSU on Koolance’s website, but I don’t know the quality or if it’s even worth getting. I’m also not sure if 1 rail or multiple would be best for this system. I know that multiple are more stable, but require a little more work to manage and have an overall lower amp output than single rails.
HDD: 2xWestern Digital 300GB
I’ll put in more HDs as needed, but 2 for start.
DVD/CD: 2xSony DVD/CD RW
Sound Card: Creative SB X-Fi Titanium Fatal1ty Champion
Comes with an external I/O that uses a 5.25” slot. Not a big selling point on me. The PCI-E (x1) slot usage was….
Wireless NIC: D-Link DWA-552 (N-type)
My last computer I bought the EVGA nForce 790i Ultra SLI motherboard. Being the first time I had built a system, just looking at the pictures I thought I would have enough room for 2xEVGA GTS8800 plus a sound card, plus a wireless card. Needless to say I was a little disappointed when everything got to me and I discovered that the 8800s were so big that they covered one of the PCI slots I was going to use for the wireless. I’m hoping that my choice of motherboard for this rig and the use of the particular sound card that I’m getting will leave that slot free for the wireless card this time….
Keyboard: Logitech G19
Mouse: Logitech G9
I already have one of these on my old rig, so I may just switch it over and buy for that one whatever my wife feels most comfortable with getting for it.
Monitor: Acer 22” wide

Ok… now for the things that are a little more closely related to the water cooling:

Pump: 2xKoolance PMP-450S
I'm looking at either this one or the Non-“S” model, whichever allows me to vary its speed via a controller and is still a good pump.
Reservoir: 2xTyphoon III PEC
I’m thinking of buying a third reservoir, a Koolance in-line 120mm v2 simply to have mounted external of the case for easy fluid adding. But I don’t know the practicality of this idea.
CPU water block: Heatkiller v3 1366 LT
HD water block: Koolance HD-60
Memory water block: 6xKoolance RAM-35
There are several accessory connectors that I need to get with these too so that I only need to run one set of lines in to get fluid through all 6.
Motherboard water block: Koolance complete kit for EVGA X58 Classified
Graphics card water block: 2xKoolance GTX295
Radiator 120.3: 3xKoolance 3x120mm
I don’t know how good a brand Koolance is for these. I see the Thermochills and Black Ice, etc get recommended a lot. How much better are they?
Radiator 120.1: 2xKoolance 1x120mm
I’ve been toying with the idea of adding 2 of these so that it’s a little easier to split up some of my loops and get good cooling, but I don’t know if this is just really over kill?

Fans: Looking at the stock fans that come with the case, I’ve been considering on replacing them with others. I also want to get some extra fans to put around the radiators for push/pull configuration. Here’s what I’ve been looking at:
LEDs: 11-13xKoolance 120mm
Voltage: 12v
Current: .31A
Speed: 2200RPM
Static Pressure: 4.1mm-H2O
Airflow: 89.5 CFM
Noise: 30.1 dBa

Regular: 11-13x(opposite the LEDs... I want the internals lit)Scythe 120mm “Slipstream”
Voltage: 12v
Current: .53A
Speed: 1900RPM
Static Pressure: unknown
Airflow: 110.31 CFM
Noise: 37.0 dBa

Now, I’ve seen the Gentle Typhoons, and have even seen many people recommend them. But I have to ask why so many people consider them as being so good. I understand the noise issue, but I mean aside from that.
Voltage: 12v
Current: .083A
Speed: 1850RPM
Static Pressure: unknown
Airflow: 57.7 CFM
Noise: 28.0 dBa

It seems to me the Slipstream is only 1/3 times louder, but for almost double the airflow. Any input would be greatly appreciated here.

Controllers: I ultimately want to get all of my fans on a controller of some sort (at least the extra ones meant for the radiators), either with software readout, LCD, or both (LCD has highest preference to me seems software isn’t as easily seen while running a game). With the Typhoon IIIs, the 2xDVD/CD drives, and my sound card choice, I only have 3x5.25” bays to use. I don’t know how well I can run multiple fans off from one fan controller channel without taking a performance hit. If someone knows the proper math on calculating that, please let me know. (ie, if the channel says 2A max, does that mean I can run 3x0.53A fans on it w/out issue?) I’ve been looking at the following for solutions, in buying multiple of the same, or mix and match:

Koolance TMS-200 and Koolance TMS-EB200
These two together allow me to control (using software) up to two pumps, 6 fans, and get measurements from 10 temp probes and 4 flow meters. 2A per fan channel, but only 6.5A on the whole board (I’m assuming they include pumps in that... which the Koolance ones are 2.1A each). I don’t know if the software supports more than 1 main board, though. No LCD. I think I’ll get at least one of these for the pump control. Uses 1x5.25” bay.

Sunbeam Chromatic Windmill: 7 channels, 10W each (0.83A). 3 temp sensors. LCD only. Uses 1x5.25” bay.

AeroCool Gatewatch: 4 channels, 1.7A each. 4 temp sensors. LCD only. Uses 2x5.25” bays.


Obviously, in addition to all of the above, I need coolant, hoses, adapters, etc. The only thing I am not all that sure on are the hoses. There any one brand out there known for making higher quality hoses?

I appreciate everyone who reads through this for having taken the time to do so. And thanks for all of your help.

[millertime359]

When it comes to fans for rads, the amount of air moved doesn't neccasrily mean it is well suited for a rad. Static pressure is the best measure of performance on a rad fan. The slipstreams are actually not ideal for rads because they don't have the static pressure needed. Gentle Typhoons or S-flexs are great fans for low FPI rads.

I would drop the HD cooler, ram coolers, 1 T3 and pump combo, the 2 120.1s. You probably could drop the other 120.3, but wouldn't hurt to leave it in.

HD don't need to watercooled and ram becomes troublesome to watercool. IIRC, the ram blocks all have aluminum in the blocks which you don't want in your loop. A fan is all you need if you are voltmodding your ram.

edit: primochill pro LRT is great tubing, pick you color.

coolant distilled water and a piece of silver.

edit2; Also, in regards to HDs, why are you not using any SSDs?

I would also step up to a 1000 watt PSU.

[Wolf132]

Yea, SSD's will make your system react way faster. Even if you just use 1 for the OS install and apps and use other hard drives for storage. Id also switch out the 285's for 2x 5870's which are way faster.

Watercooling a hard drive or memory is not recommended unless you just want to spend money. Also, You could also save a decent amount of cash since you are watercooling and buy a cheaper cpu and just overclock it (the main reason for watercooling to me). Buy cheap parts and make them run like more expensive parts.

Pumps, blocks all look good. Bare in mind, d5's have 1/2" plastic barbs that cannot be changed unless you buy one of the mod tops (might be a problem if using 3/8"). I do not see any fittings listed. Compression fittings that are installed correctly are the safest imo. Id prefer XSPC RX or Thermochill rad's but not sure on koolance.

Fan's do not come with mountain mods cases (well the ones i've gotten they didn't). Gentle Typhoon, Zalman ZM-f3's, and Yate loon are all good and not super expensive.

[FuryoftheStars]

Thank you guys for your responses.

I had actually been shying away from the SSDs right now. $700 for 256GB SSD vs $230 for 300GB 10kRPM (I can easily get x3+ the storage for the same price). I've also seen some mixed reviews on SSDs for their speed and heat. I guess I just want to hold off on that right this second. Maybe when it comes time for me to buy everything I'll switch over.

As for dropping the HD cooler, I suppose I could, but I think I'd rather leave it in. I've lost a few computers before due to heat that burned out my HDDs.

The RAM-35s on Koolance's website are listed as having Aluminum casings, and the part that the water actually comes into contact with are their "hydra-paks". They don't say what material these are, though it kind of sounded like it is something that should be compatible with systems containing copper. I guess I should shoot them an e-mail to be sure, but I still haven't heard anything off from my last one yet....

Yeah, I was planning on leaving everything at 1/2"... no stepping down. But you guys would recommend compression fittings over barbed? Does it use the same type of hose or is there a different type for the compression?

And btw, by silver, do you mean a small chunk that sits in the reservoir or flakes or something that run through the whole system?

[millertime359]

Your buying a $1000 CPU, but comparing prices on SSDs?
You don't have to run everything on the SSDs. An Intel X25-M 80 GB or 160 GB for your OP and then your 300 GB for your files. The Intels seem to be the best atm.

There are a few guys that have been running W/Cing for a while here and have even played with ram and HD cooling and haven't found it worth it. Take a look through the worklogs and see how many builds are being done with either atm. low to med speed fans across the HD area and the ram should keep things from overheating.

Comp fittings ar for bling, not because the are more secure than barbs. Some guys are running 7/16" ID tubing over 1/2" fatboy barbs without clamps (IMO, I would still use zipties at least) and those look great too.

Any peice of 99.99% silver will work. I use iandh's killcoils DW and silver is the safest as pre-mixes have lead to the blocks getting gunked up.

[FuryoftheStars]

Hehe... true... I didn't think of that. Yeah, I guess I can switch over to SSDs.

Hmm... ok. Well, I intend to redo the list I have saved here of everything I want to buy to list things in a "need to get" and "optional" section. I'll move the HD and RAM stuff to optional for now till I find out more about it. Guess I'll try looking around for reviews or something that compare the water vs air cooling options for both of those. Even if it's only a couple of degrees difference I might still go with it, although I might wait to buy them compared to the rest of the stuff. If for no other reason than for looks....

[millertime359]

Take a look threw the worklogs here and see what other guys are doing. Those SSDs are pretty sweet as you don't have to place them in the HHD bays. Guys are bolting them to the back of the drive bays so they are out of sight.

Let us know what you come up with. Also make certain you do a worklog. This is going to be a massive system. You got some awesome hardware there.