Pumps - Series / Separate (What did/would you do)

CedricFP · 09-17-2009, 01:54 AM

After getting some very helpful advice from Vapour a while back about his preference of putting pumps in series rather than doing separate loops, I have finally come to put together my new i7 system and thus updated the loop.

I would like to ask the XS LC public: would you do:

Series

DDC 3.2 (XSPC Restop) --> DDC 3.2 (XSPC Top) --> SR1 120 --> SR1 120 --> PA 120.2 --> PA 120.2 --> VL4 QDC --> XSPC 4870x2 FC --> VL4 QDC --> Apogee GTZ

Separate

#1: DDC 3.2 (XSPC Restop) --> SR1 120 --> PA 120.2 --> Apogee GTZ

#2: DDC 3.2 (XSPC Restop) --> SR1 120 --> PA 120.2 --> XSPC 4870x2 FC

--

I posed this question a while back and Vapour had mentioned that the GTZ might benefit from the extra DDC pump. Further, it also means that when doing CPU intensive tasks (but not utilizing the GPU), the loop can make better use of the total 6*120mm of radiator surface area, rather than being limited to 3*120 in every scenario (and same vice versa, when running a game that doesn't really stress the CPU, for eg.)

However, the Koolance QDC's (2 pairs) might negate the benefit of extra flow for the GTZ through the second pump.

One last question: If filling a loop with two pumps in series, do you only operate the first pump (so that it pumps through the second and onwards) while filling? Thanks.

Thank you XS for your patience on a question that has cropped numerous times.

EDIT: PS. The Black Ice SR1 radiators really are quite incredible.

alacheesu · 09-17-2009, 02:06 AM

I think:
1. You're overthinking this.
2. The difference would likely be very small.
3. The only way to know for sure is to try both options (and post results on XS

)

I voted series, though.

CedricFP · 09-17-2009, 02:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alacheesu

I think:
1. You're overthinking this.
2. The difference would likely be very small.
3. The only way to know for sure is to try both options (and post results on XS

)

I voted series, though.

I sort of suspect I'll do whatever the poll outcomes.

WhiskeyAlpha · 09-17-2009, 02:58 AM

One advantage of running them in series is that a single pump failure in a 'single pump' loop can cause you a real problem, whereas a single pump failure in a 'dual pump loop' is slightly less catastrophic.

Utnorris · 09-17-2009, 03:08 AM

I wouldn't worry about pump failure. There are too many built in safeties to prevent any real damage. If the CPU gets too hot it will shutdown before burning up. With dual loops you are isolating the cpu and therefore should have better temps than with the gpu in the same loop. Increase flow has very little benefit compared to isolating the cpu on it's own loop.

WhiskeyAlpha · 09-17-2009, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utnorris

I wouldn't worry about pump failure. There are too many built in safeties to prevent any real damage. If the CPU gets too hot it will shutdown before burning up. With dual loops you are isolating the cpu and therefore should have better temps than with the gpu in the same loop. Increase flow has very little benefit compared to isolating the cpu on it's own loop.

Good point, and something I was aware of with a CPU loop

Still, I've always felt that other components that may be isolated in an individual loop (GPUs or chipsets for example) might not provide you with the same sort of protection. GPU thermal cutoffs are particularly high and unless I'm mistaken, will not shutdown the system but rather disable/underclock the GPU until the temperature recovers to a more reasonable state.

Presumably at this point it slowly heats up again until failure?

I'm speculating here of course - I've never had the cajones to let my GPU burn up that bad

Spawn-Inc · 09-17-2009, 04:51 AM

i went series with my latest loop for redundancy. n loop in sig.

millertime359 · 09-17-2009, 07:05 AM

Also, unless you are running really slow fans, then the extra cooling potential wouldn't be needed on CPU only tasks. The 1 320 combo should take care of that heat load.

DeanB · 09-17-2009, 08:25 AM

you don't really have any restrictive block in your loop so I would say separate loops.

Hondacity · 09-17-2009, 08:51 AM

true no restrictive block there...

id still go for one big loop...

when everything is idling...on big loops feels alot better

.................option : you can turn off 1pump too

its a lot challenging too

its way more complicated to tubitize

nikhsub1 · 09-17-2009, 08:58 AM

Multiple loops are way over-rated IMO... there is no point to them. One big happy loop is how I always do it

Spawn-Inc · 09-17-2009, 01:41 PM

i have shut off one of my pumps as well as shut off all my fans, and at stock clocks prime95 loaded at 60C or so. but the sounds levels from my yates at 5v is acceptable to me.

CedricFP · 09-17-2009, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by [Koolance] Dean

you don't really have any restrictive block in your loop so I would say separate loops.

Yes, it is certainly a consideration, but would not the GTZ benefit from extra flow? Thanks Dean.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondacity

true no restrictive block there...

id still go for one big loop...

when everything is idling...on big loops feels alot better

.................option : you can turn off 1pump too

its a lot challenging too

its way more complicated to tubitize

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikhsub1

Multiple loops are way over-rated IMO... there is no point to them. One big happy loop is how I always do it

My thoughts mirrored, somewhat. I've always thought multiple loops to be overrated and since I've run multiple loops in the past, I'm sort of keen on going the other way.

Thank for all the input guys.

If filling a loop with two pumps in series, do you only operate the first pump (so that it pumps through the second and onwards) while filling? Thanks.

Hondacity · 09-17-2009, 06:52 PM

yep..imagin the other pump as a 90degree bend

CedricFP · 09-17-2009, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondacity

yep..imagin the other pump as a 90degree bend

I see. Thanks

I was worried that pumping through another pump's impeller might potentially damage it.

Spawn-Inc · 09-17-2009, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CedricFP

I see. Thanks

I was worried that pumping through another pump's impeller might potentially damage it.

mine has been working great for the last 2 months. the only problem with series that i have heard about is mismatched pumps.

i have mine making a 90 as well.

CedricFP · 09-18-2009, 12:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spawn-Inc

mine has been working great for the last 2 months. the only problem with series that i have heard about is mismatched pumps.

i have mine making a 90 as well.

Is having it at a 90 necessary?

Spawn-Inc · 09-18-2009, 03:32 PM

no, for it just worked out that way since i only have to use a short piece of tubing in between the barbs, which by the way was no fun using 7/16" tubing.

CedricFP · 09-18-2009, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spawn-Inc

no, for it just worked out that way since i only have to use a short piece of tubing in between the barbs, which by the way was no fun using 7/16" tubing.

I see. Thanks.

Yes, I used to struggle with thin walled 7/16's around 1 D5. 2 must have been nigh impossible and incredibly frustrating.

EDIT: 16 votes for series, 17 for separate. Haha.

Spawn-Inc · 09-19-2009, 12:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CedricFP

I see. Thanks.

Yes, I used to struggle with thin walled 7/16's around 1 D5. 2 must have been nigh impossible and incredibly frustrating.

EDIT: 16 votes for series, 17 for separate. Haha.

well the pump was a dream compared to putting it on 1/2" plumbing copper, i cut up the end of the tubing 2 times trying to get it on... i had to use soap and boiling water. what a pain.