Best Pumps For Moving Cold Liquid

[gouda96]

Sweet, thanks alot ocme. I am just doing a basic 5200 btu ac unit conversion, so dropping below -40c isn't an immmediate worry

[Lotec25]

This is an idea. I am looking at Fuel pumps on cars. They will work in extreme cold it is just that fact that they run on a battery not on home electricity. Just an idea.

Lotec25

[kingsack]

Car fuel pumps have a very low flow rate. Can you say < 5 gph.

[Lotec25]

i dont know what kind of fuel pump you are thinking of. Maybe a stock Pump. I am talking about a high performance one like this. http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...02&prmenbr=361 that is 120 gallons per hour and that is a small one. Here is a bigger one
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...81&prmenbr=361


Lotec25

[JWB]

The thing is if they do turn out to work well. They are very expensive

[kingsack]

Originally posted by Lotec25
i dont know what kind of fuel pump you are thinking of. Maybe a stock Pump. I am talking about a high performance one like this. http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...02&prmenbr=361 that is 120 gallons per hour and that is a small one. Here is a bigger one
http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/ncommerc...81&prmenbr=361


Lotec25

Yep, I was thinking stock. Now that we are talking high performance items how about high performance racing fuel pump for a snowmobile? That should kick ass at low temps.

[Lotec25]

I know they are expensive. But if you want to get below -50C you are going to have to get crazy. I rember a story where some trucks crossed Russia in the middle of winter and they never had a problem with there fuel. I just thought this up one night while i was trying to go to bed. It just makes since just have to make it work now. I am looking for a cheap A/C unit but for some reason Souther California does not have them used. They got them at Home Depot for 100 dollars i just got to pick it up.

Lotec25

[Calab]

Originally posted by OCme
Ok, I'm hoping lay to rest all the questions I have been getting concerning Eheim pumps 1046,1048,1050, & 1060...

thanks for passing along that information. it's nice to hear an eheim rep say what the pumps will and will not do.

[kommando]

Im getting my mates pump from his washing machine

[OCme]

One key thing to remember is that none of these pumps will move ice, or slush very well and even small pieces of ice solids can damage a pump. Keep your liquid fluid consistency, and if the if the elastomer is rated for the temperature you are chilling to the pump should work fine. Also, do not use acetone in your cooling loop with any pump that uses rubber o-rings as it will surely damage it.

[KennethChong]

Originally posted by OCme
One key thing to remember is that none of these pumps will move ice, or slush very well and even small pieces of ice solids can damage a pump. Keep your liquid fluid consistency, and if the if the elastomer is rated for the temperature you are chilling to the pump should work fine. Also, do not use acetone in your cooling loop with any pump that uses rubber o-rings as it will surely damage it.

yes, that is very true. Personaly, i didnt have a problem with my eheim with -40-45 water, but if you look on e-bay, you can usualy find some all metal pumps, that are mighty impressive.

[Gary Lloyd]

A couple things to keep in mind:

The freeze point is not the same as the slush point.

A centrifugal pump has a pressure drop at the eye of the impellor, which momentarily drops the liquid temperature.

For these reasons, the freeze point of your mixture must be well below the average liquid temperature, or the pump will slush (plug) and/or freeze (break).

[Calab]

Originally posted by OCme
Ok, I'm hoping lay to rest all the questions I have been getting concerning Eheim pumps 1046,1048,1050, & 1060 in this one post as best I can. The elastomer or (o-ring) material used in each of these pumps is called perbunan and was developed by Bayer in the 1930's, the same company that makes aspirin. I spoke to Yannick (Nick) Miller at Ehime and he said that this elastomer was good from -40C to 120C. He said long term reliability below -40C would not be very good and would void the warranty of the pump. So if your chiller temperature is going to be -40C or less then any of these pumps should work fine and give good long term reliability. If you will be chilling colder than -40C then I would avoid using one of these pumps.

OCme, why don't we try to contact the popular manufactureres such as eheim, and see what they have to say about their product in these regards. i would be happy to contact a one or two myself to find out and post my findings.

[OCme]

Originally posted by Calab
OCme, why don't we try to contact the popular manufactureres such as eheim, and see what they have to say about their product in these regards. i would be happy to contact a one or two myself to find out and post my findings.

Any information you could provide on the ability of different pumps would be very much appreciated. The way I look at it, we are all part of a team here at XS. There is "REAL" strength in numbers.

[Calab]

what manufactureres you want me to take?

[OCme]

Originally posted by Calab
what manufactureres you want me to take?

You could research one of the pumps that have been mentioned in this thread if you like such as Taco, Surflo, or Pondmaster, or pick one you think might work from the 10,000 or so that are being manufactured.

[sky]

i'va had a pump of mine freeze in my rez. had a slow windshield solvent / tap-water mixture turned all of it on and went about other things. when i returned, the pump was stuck and i immediately unpluged it. luckily it survived. so after they ice warmed and the mixture got back to its liquid state, the pump could resume work and did so easy.

btw jwb, who's that girl in your av? looks HOT (had to throw that in, sorry)

[JWB]

Delta Goodrem Yeah I actually like the idea of a car pump Lotec25. Plus if they work off a 12v car battery wouldn't we be able to mod it on to take a molex connection?

[Gary Lloyd]

These pump manufacturers (and the block manufacturers as well) better get with the program. Chillers are coming, and the temps are going to get colder. There will be cascade and autocascade chillers, too.

[JWB]

Absolutely agree it is the pump manufacturers that are holding most people back from even lower temps. Havent got a clue about cascade and autocascade chillers though

[sky]

nah i wouldn't expect cascade chillers. that would probably be over the top. it would be nice to have, but i think a lot of cooling power would go to waste that way.
for the fuel pumps. iirc berkut used an old ford fuelinjector (pump?) on of his phase change evaps. might want to look for that thread and / or ask him how he hooked it up.

[Calab]

i have had a few emails with danner mag. i asked for more specific information regarding the o-rings and and explained that the pump would be moving chilled water that could range -0c to -40c. the reply from "BillM" was impersonal...

"The pump will not be able to handle your application."


i asked him to elaborate and asked if he could point me in the direction of a Danner product that would handle the application. i get another impersonal email, but this time it was uninformed and oblivious to what i was asking.

"There aren’t any that will handle your application."


these aren't taken out of context, these are verbatim. no signature, no nothing. i was a potential customer and these are the responses i got, shameful. for this i nominate BillM for this weeks jag bag contest.

[OCme]

Originally posted by sky
for the fuel pumps. iirc berkut used an old ford fuelinjector (pump?) on of his phase change evaps. might want to look for that thread and / or ask him how he hooked it up.

Might be just what we are looking for? Any idea how cold he was chilling to?

[Blergo]

berkut used the fuel injector to controle the flow of refrigerant instead of useign a cap tube or a valve as far as i recall.

Calab the response you got was pretty rude if you ask me, next time it might be worth trying to phone them, thay might be more helpfull on the phone. i find this with a lot of companies unfortunatley.

owen

[OCme]

Originally posted by Calab
"The pump will not be able to handle your application."

"There aren’t any that will handle your application."

Try finding out what type of elastomer is being used in the pumps that you research this will be a better indicator of what the pump is capable of handling. I know members that are using these Danner Mag pumps with no problems down to -40C, which may mean that they are using a perbunan elastomer like the Ehimes. I'm beginning to get the feeling that many of the top water cooling pumps are using this elastomer, but I don't know for sure. If this is the case we need to be researching other pumps like the fuel pump sky mentioned, or the taco pump which is an all metal pump, or maybe the surflo.