HCC appears to have gone to 64bit on Linux

[D_A]

Here's a duplicate of my post on the WCG forums: https://secure.worldcommunitygrid.or...age,yes#400675

I'm crunching on Slackware 14 64bit using BOINC 7.0.28 64bit. This is a pure 64bit system with no 32bit libraries of any kind installed.
I noticed a moment ago that I had a number of HCC units both in my cache and successfully completed but searching the forums didn't bring up any mention of a 64bit app for this. I'm quite sure I haven't had any 32bit apps on this machine before so I'm gathering HCC has gone 64bit as well as GPU. Am I reasoning correctly or is something very odd happening?

It would appear things are stepping up across the board with Team HCC.

[PoppaGeek]

If you use the file command on a file name it will tell you things:

file bash

bash: ELF 64-bit LSB executable, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked (uses shared libs), for GNU/Linux 2.6.24, BuildID[sha1]=0x6dafe33f9353cbb054b1b1f7b079545992575757, stripped

The command ps -aef will also list all processes running and for wcg the programs show:

wcg_hfcc_autodock_6.40_i686-pc-linux-gnu
wcg_hcc1_img_7.05_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu

The 2 lines above are heavily edited as it shows a lot more that wraps the lines and hard to read. Anyway it shows project name and 32bit or 64bit.

Here is the full line for a HCC work unit.

boinc 13351 1180 99 07:01 ? 01:00:02 ../../projects/www.worldcommunitygrid.org/wcg_hcc1_img_7.05_x86_64-pc-linux-gnu X0930074491372200609191636.jp2

Even easier maybe is this command:

ps -aef | grep projects

Will then only show WCG WUs although the lines are very long, easier to read if you open the terminal window as wide as you can.

But yeah I have 64bit HCC running on all my linux boxes.

[Evantaur]

GPU support soon?

[D_A]

Logically it will come before GPU support on Mac. There are nearly three times the Linux installs than Mac installs on WCG so it would make sense to get the Linux client sorted first.
I have been abused and called a "troll" on the WCG forums by someone who only started crunching on June 30 this year for presenting that logic, too.

[0ne.shot]

Logically it will come before GPU support on Mac. There are nearly three times the Linux installs than Mac installs on WCG so it would make sense to get the Linux client sorted first.
I have been abused and called a "troll" on the WCG forums by someone who only started crunching on June 30 this year for presenting that logic, too.

Sigh....forums.

[kjeldoran]

Logically it will come before GPU support on Mac. There are nearly three times the Linux installs than Mac installs on WCG so it would make sense to get the Linux client sorted first.
I have been abused and called a "troll" on the WCG forums by someone who only started crunching on June 30 this year for presenting that logic, too.

Definitely. I wouldn't see any other reason why it wouldn't be that case. Plus, I don't know if I would want GPU crunching on Mac OSX. Most users probably don't have a Mac Pro or hackintosh, so they are using an iMac or MBP since they have a dedicated GPU for gpu crunching. I'm not sure I would want to crunch on a GPU in such a small chassis.

[stoneageman]

GPU support soon?

They better get a move on as I'm seeing just 72 days left now

[D_A]

There's a rumor that they have a new GPU enabled project running around naked in the back room (ie. alpha testing) so the next few months will be interesting.

[BlindShot]

Logically it will come before GPU support on Mac. There are nearly three times the Linux installs than Mac installs on WCG so it would make sense to get the Linux client sorted first.
I have been abused and called a "troll" on the WCG forums by someone who only started crunching on June 30 this year for presenting that logic, too.

Linux is FREE ! Why would anyone not use it for a 24/7 cruncher?

[D_A]

Linux is FREE ! Why would anyone not use it for a 24/7 cruncher?

There's more than a few (here as well) that don't feel they can learn the differences (it's no more different to Windows than 7 is to XP, let alone 8) which does make me shake my head more than a little at times but I try not to be critical as it's their machine, their choice and at least they're crunching which is the main thing.

[werdwerdus]

most general computer users have no idea what a "command shell" is or even what "GUI" means for that matter. In that case best not to attempt *nix.

[Aerou]

I actually have good experience setting up Fedora or Xubuntu for novice users that do basic PC activities like websurfing, music, etc. I just have do all the scripting and setting up, a quick one-line DD backup and it's hassle free from there on.

I set it up for them and and they are much happier and relaxed. They used to be frustrated when using Windows. Heck, my mom would tell you her favorite OS is Fedora :P

[jspace]

Mac users paid a lot for their fancy white plastic and brushed aluminum boxes, therefore they feel entitled to piss and moan when something doesn't work or exist.
With FOSS, when something doesn't exist (and you want the complaining party to STFU), you respond with "Write it yourself!"

I put openSUSE on a laptop and gave it to my sister. She was happy with it until she found that Netflix didn't work. It probably wouldn't work anyway on it, but she didn't believe me.

[OldChap]

I have to say that during SC week when I had a network issue I struggled to find the sequence to manually assign addresses under windows ....I would like to think that it is because I rarely have had need to do so in the past.

I was dreading the learning and effort to do the same in Linux.... Then I find that it was the most intuitive and simple layout one could hope for.

If some fine Linux group would "fix" their distro by building some kind of assistant that would load programs in a similar fashion to the way windows does it and generally allow the less computer savvy to be able to get on without learning too much, I feel that windows would become a dinosaur. It just needs that extra layer of easy for the general populace to use while the rest of the users continue as before.

[D_A]

If some fine Linux group would "fix" their distro by building some kind of assistant that would load programs in a similar fashion to the way windows does it and generally allow the less computer savvy to be able to get on without learning too much, I feel that windows would become a dinosaur. It just needs that extra layer of easy for the general populace to use while the rest of the users continue as before.

I'm not sure what you mean. Ubuntu, Mint and many others allow applications to be installed using systems like synaptic that allow a full graphical interface to the whole process. Requiring elevated permissions to install software is one of the reasons Linux is more secure by default than Windows. Windows can of course be configured to do this, it just isn't by default. When I ran it on my kids' machines I did this. It frustrated the eldest son no end but saved me a lot of virus removal.
One of if not the main reason we do so many things with the command line in Linux is that it's faster and more flexible than ferreting through layers of graphical menus even though modern distributions allow that kind of management as well.

[Snow Crash]

most general computer users have no idea what a "command shell" is or even what "GUI" means for that matter. In that case best not to attempt *nix.

So I was recapping some meeting minutes the other day and it took me a minute to realize that the business process person had no idea of the conversation was really about as they had repeatedly used the term 'gooey' in the doc. Gets funnier ... I then realized that the business team was not laughing at the misunderstanding ... they just thought the word sounded funny. So now we phrase things more along the lines of "you know the thing you click" or "when you click the magic button"

[OldChap]

Yes, I get that and I personally am liking Cinnamon Mint mare and more as the days go by.

I just feel that the general populace have gotten used to the way windows lets them download and install so the take up of linux would be far greater if, by some means or other, it were possible to load a program via an assistant in a similar fashion without having to concern themselves about file permissions etc.

I recognise the advantages of command line even with my limited experience but for someone who does not find what they want in the repository and is really only a computer "user" it can be a very big step just now the way things are.

[kjeldoran]

Linux is FREE ! Why would anyone not use it for a 24/7 cruncher?

I agree. When I had dedicated crunchers, they ran linux. However, with GPU crunching, linux is not supported by WCG...yet. Therefore, Windows makes sense .

There's more than a few (here as well) that don't feel they can learn the differences (it's no more different to Windows than 7 is to XP, let alone 8) which does make me shake my head more than a little at times but I try not to be critical as it's their machine, their choice and at least they're crunching which is the main thing.

Yep, that is why we have the linux guide thread in this forum .

I'm not sure what you mean. Ubuntu, Mint and many others allow applications to be installed using systems like synaptic that allow a full graphical interface to the whole process. Requiring elevated permissions to install software is one of the reasons Linux is more secure by default than Windows. Windows can of course be configured to do this, it just isn't by default. When I ran it on my kids' machines I did this. It frustrated the eldest son no end but saved me a lot of virus removal.
One of if not the main reason we do so many things with the command line in Linux is that it's faster and more flexible than ferreting through layers of graphical menus even though modern distributions allow that kind of management as well.

CLI is so much faster for me, but it is not for everyone.

DA, that is genius to put linux on your kids' machine. I am going to do that when I have kids . Thanks for the idea.

[D_A]

Yes, I get that and I personally am liking Cinnamon Mint mare and more as the days go by.

I just feel that the general populace have gotten used to the way windows lets them download and install so the take up of linux would be far greater if, by some means or other, it were possible to load a program via an assistant in a similar fashion without having to concern themselves about file permissions etc.

I could be not understanding what you mean still, but Debian, Ubuntu, Mint, Suse, Fedora and others all have a click and install system of some variety.
In Debian, Ubuntu and Mint it's the Synaptic Package Manager in the System menu or the Software Centre in the Applications menu. It's totally graphical. It already has two methods for doing things graphically in addition to the command line. As for downloading and installing, again you can do that, you just need to download the .deb package (for Debian based systems) or in my case with Slackware .tgz packages. The only difference is that by default a Windows user is the Administrator while a default Linux user is a User. As I said before, this is a security feature, not a fault, and it's something that Windows and it's UAC has tried to emulate even though all you had to do was make the default Windows user a User to have the same benefit and just require the admin password to install software

[hedge]

I could be not understanding what you mean still, but Debian, Ubuntu, Mint, Suse, Fedora and others all have a click and install system of some variety.
In Debian, Ubuntu and Mint it's the Synaptic Package Manager in the System menu or the Software Centre in the Applications menu. It's totally graphical. It already has two methods for doing things graphically in addition to the command line. As for downloading and installing, again you can do that, you just need to download the .deb package (for Debian based systems) or in my case with Slackware .tgz packages. The only difference is that by default a Windows user is the Administrator while a default Linux user is a User. As I said before, this is a security feature, not a fault, and it's something that Windows and it's UAC has tried to emulate even though all you had to do was make the default Windows user a User to have the same benefit and just require the admin password to install software

I suppose he might be referring to the ease of either just downloading and then double-clicking an executable or that most cds have an autorun feature that starts up when inserted that then walks you through the rest of the installation as opposed to either searching through the package manager to find a program or having to download a .deb, .rtm, or .sh and learning how to run these files. It is not difficult, but most people seem to be very afraid of their computer and trying anything new in regards to their computer is like asking them to climb Mount Everest.

[D_A]

In Ubuntu, you can download the installer package file (.deb) double click on it and the dpkg utility (a package installer with a graphical interface if you want to use it) will pick up, ask for the password and install the package. It's been that way for years. The only confusion I see is down to file permissions on Windows being automatically permissive while on Linux not everything is executable by default.
The autorun "feature" is also very commonly disabled on both optical and USB drives and is rightly despised as the source of huge numbers of malware infections.

[haschioz]

http://boinc.berkeley.edu/dev/forum_...id=6698&sort=5

it says they got an ALPHA GPU version for LINUX. let them puppies crunch.

[D_A]

The Linux client has been GPU capable for some time (since the 6.13 series I think) the catch has been that there is no WCG science app that uses the GPU on Linux. Other projects, such as PrimeGrid, GPUGrid and a few others have been running GPU work on Linux for a while, both CUDA and OpenCL.

[haschioz]

oh, ok false alarm then. would it be that much more complicated to compile for linux?

[D_A]

It requires a re write of the source code to jump between OSs. Windows and Linux handle a number of things, like memory access, hdd access and file permissions quite differently and tricks for optimising for one often don't work on the other. The techs will get it done, it will just take time is all.