AMD Rolls Out new HD 7950 BIOS, Expects Existing Customers to Look the Other Way

[Lanek]

I dont want add the discussion but well ... MSRP are 419$ for the 7970 and 469$ for the 7970GHZ... if ALL 7970 GHZ i have seen are correctly in the 469$ range ( 459-469$ ), many non reference 7970 are with a larger price difference: 419 to 459$ mostly. ( with 3 games free coupon, free shipping and rebate in some case ). I dont know if this is the shops, AIB, partner who have not adapt enough fast the 7970 price, or they play on the fact, not all AIB partners have their GHZ edition on shop. ( you see the Asus 7970 price skyrocket with the DCII, when Asus have not release yet their GHZ edition ).... Add to this all the "custom version " ofc with different price tags ( you rarely see a reference "cooler " one at least )..

Whatever here, prices between a brand or another + special price ( limited to 1 week ), make even reference cards have a 30-40$ price difference depending if this is an HIS, a Sapphire etc .. so yet MSRP given, and what is applied along the chain is offtly different. ( stock, distributors price, AIB choice ). Nothing new there, i dont remember it have been different thoses last 10years.

Does the idea to annonce the 7950 "boost" right now, is a good idea for AMD ? bad timing.. as for the 7970GHZ edition, 1 weeks before the 680 is released will have been an excellent timing. .. Everybody was know the "Power Tune Boost " etc can, will be applied to the 7950 one day or the other. The card was a bit too slow on reference edition, 125mhz difference with the 7970 was too much, then the 7870 was allready too close ( imagine if a 7870 Boost edition is released then ) .. And physically, there's no reason the PTboost cant apply on the cards who support PT.

There's many custom cards who was allready run in the range of the PT boost clock speed, AIB need to take too the lineup, and increase them a little bit. Instead shops flash themselves the cards, you will need a bit of time for see thoses cards appears, specially when some brand have decided to differenciate them a bit a more of the reference. AMD, Nvidia dont sell cards.. AIB sell cards, and competition between them is not a bad thing ( have we allready seen so much custom design and coolers by the past on a same lineup ? )

At the end of the day, AMD could have only play on the price of the 7970-7950-7870.. Many consumers dont buy forcibly the best cards, but money is a big part on their choice. At the same time, the Halo effect make too, some buy extreme low end cards, based on the high range performance reputation. AMD ( ATI) have do it by the past, Nvidia too. remember the x1900XTX and X1950XTX etc. ( in this case, just with higher clock speed and GDDR4 instead of GDDR3 ) .. Im not even sure if AMD had release a 7980 with PTboost, peoples will not have claim, this is just a 7970 with higher clock speed and Boost. Well something we see regulary on CPU side with Intel or AMD who increase the frequency of 100mhz, and up the number anyway.

[LordEC911]

What is really your grudge against AMD.

Unfortunately, he will never say what the true cause really is. It has been there a long time and he generally hides his bias well.

[SEA]

Bingo. To make matters worse, as far as anyone can tell, there won't be a way to distinguish the HD 7950 Rev#1 from the HD 7950 Rev#2. So why not just call it a "HD 7955" or something? Instead, they pressed the panic button, realizing NVIDIA may be coming out with something highly competitive at a good price point and pretty much FUBAR'd their lineup.

So, only naming is problem?
It does not change the product value, though

And yet it still has slightly different name. You are trying to speak your opinion as a fact, but personally I definitely prefer "Gigahertz Edition" to, say, HD 7955

[DeathReborn]

I have found you only praise Nvidia after the Kepler launch and not a single word of criticism for so many goofups on their side.

Just out of interest, what goofups are these? I've been a little out of the loop & would be nice to know what side to go with in a January/February upgrade.

I will say this, AMD has the pricing right now but before it was very bad. Nvidia's pricing right now is just bad, needs to drop $50 or so at least.

[Miwo]

To me, this is a bad trend to be setting for the everyday user. Say in the future, the headroom is present in every reference card regardless of manufacturer...etc. Whats stopping them from releasing paid updates like Intel for a certified speed boost? For example... pay $50 on their website and upgrade your card to the 'XT' version. It sucks for the everyday users with Dells, HPs Gaming PCs because its performance that's hidden from them that they should be getting in the first place. For overclockers - not so much because we can all use manual OC tools and do not have to rely on bios clocks.

[raghu78]

Just out of interest, what goofups are these? I've been a little out of the loop & would be nice to know what side to go with in a January/February upgrade.

1. Nvidia has locked voltage on the GTX 680 chips. EVGA has been selling a voltage unlocked GTX 680 Classified 4GB card for USD 660 at newegg. Everyone knows Nvidia's number one partner is EVGA. You can see that from the launch of GTX 690. Only EVGA had GTX 690 cards at launch. Nvidia artificially handicaps the GTX 680 so that such "so called high end designs with voltage unlock" can be sold for exorbitant prices.

2. The other was the GTX 690 product launch. For the first month the availability was practically a joke. Newegg had 1 or 2 SKUs both EVGA and mostly not in stock. This was for a product priced at USD 1000. Now there are 3 SKUs (hurrah !!!) -1 ASUS and 2 EVGA , with only 2 in stock (both of them EVGA)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...=1&srchInDesc=


3. The other is the vsync stuttering bug which affected lot of Kepler users. That was widely known issue which got fixed quite a bit later after launch.

SKYMTL had no comment on any of these issues. But he conveniently has no problem finding fault with AMD for the HD 7970 Ghz cards being available later than planned even though they are available in plenty now. He also has a problem that the HD 7950 Boost edition BIOS is being made available to reviewers to give a preview of the upcoming HD 7950 models. All future HD 7950 chips will come with the higher core clocks / boost feature and will be validated to work properly with that feature. AMD partners are going to be releasing new models with the higher clocks and boost feature support.

http://images.anandtech.com/doci/6152/7950BBoards.jpg

[Chickenfeed]

Lurking for 8 years only to start posting with hostility now? Really?

There are more factors which influence a buyers choice here then you'd like to have us believe. And what is it to you what people buy? Do you honestly have that much of a vested interest in someones buying decision that it effects your well being?

At the end of the day all that matters to Nvidia and AMD are the raw numbers. And consumer opinion through marketing and media have a profound effect on this.

Updating a product in your product line sans name change is never a wise decision as it creates issues with partners, inventory channels and ultimately your customers. If things are marketed appropriately as such (ala the GTX 260 core 216), there is no problem with what they are doing here but that remains to be seen.

[Lanek]

Huum, raghu .... dont enter driver discussio... whatever is the bugs on AMD or Nvidia drivers this is not forcibly part of the same problem.

Drivers for the 600Series have been really bad, outside the v-sync problem who is not fixed yet ( yeah Nvidia annonce a fix, but it dont fix the problem, ).. The list of problems, bugs is long ( without speaking about some strange limitation who suddenly appears for 3Dvison, or overclocking ) . But drivers of AMD have not been perfect too for the 7900 series.. so i think it is better to let the drivers outside the discussion, before it polluate the thread ( if it was not allready completely down ). There's got enough post with " AMD drivers are bad" ... we will not do the same for "Nvidia drivers are bad" ..

[Final8ty]

Unfortunately, he will never say what the true cause really is. It has been there a long time and he generally hides his bias well.

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthre...6#post33826736 post 8 and on.

[Olivon]

AMD is in panic mode or what ? BIOS ready but cards no ? 225W Vs 150W this time ? Table has turned it seemed ...

[SKYMTL]

http://forums.anandtech.com/showthre...6#post33826736 post 8 and on.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

As far as the thread topic is concerned AMD partners have very good HD 7950 OC designs using HD 7970 PCB like the Sapphire HD 7950 Mhz edition. So if a user has a little bit of common sense he can pick such a design.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814102991

Thanks for bringing that up! You've just illustrated why AMD's release of a "new" HD 7950 without labeling it any differently doesn't make any sense whatsoever past a PR stunt standpoint. NO ONE here is claiming that the HD 7950 isn't a great value. It is one of the best bang for buck cards currently available. Nor is anyone saying that AMD isn't competing very well against NVIDIA.

The problem with the HD 7950 Boost (or whatever it will be called) is one of market confusion rather than anything on the price / performance front. As Anandtech, ExtremeTech and many, many other publications have stated, AMD's knee-jerk reaction could cause a ton of issues for consumers that are looking to buy a $329 card since (as per AMD's own words) there won't be a way to distinguish this "new" card from the others. For some reason, people with AMD tinted glasses don't seem to see this as (at least in the short term) bad for consumers and the market in general. If board partners or retailers decide to do something about it, they deserve a pat on the back since they'll be righting AMD's wrong.

I'll say this again: under no circumstance do I deny the value of this "new" card within the market. What I DO have an issue with is how this is being handled and how it was handled with the GHz Edition launch. I'm not alone either since quite a few other sites have brought this up. Not sure how this is being misconstrued and turned into a "bias".

With all of that being said and knowing this, I don't see how anyone could possibly like the tack AMD is taking with this "launch". As I said, hopefully the board partners or retailers will clean up this mess with some straightforward labeling and product descriptions. And once (or IF) they're widely available, we'll be the first to grab one at the new reference clocks and test it properly rather than reflash an existing HD 7950.

[Kain665]

Obligatory:

[DeathReborn]

1. Nvidia has locked voltage on the GTX 680 chips. EVGA has been selling a voltage unlocked GTX 680 Classified 4GB card for USD 660 at newegg. Everyone knows Nvidia's number one partner is EVGA. You can see that from the launch of GTX 690. Only EVGA had GTX 690 cards at launch. Nvidia artificially handicaps the GTX 680 so that such "so called high end designs with voltage unlock" can be sold for exorbitant prices.

2. The other was the GTX 690 product launch. For the first month the availability was practically a joke. Newegg had 1 or 2 SKUs both EVGA and mostly not in stock. This was for a product priced at USD 1000. Now there are 3 SKUs (hurrah !!!) -1 ASUS and 2 EVGA , with only 2 in stock (both of them EVGA)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...=1&srchInDesc=


3. The other is the vsync stuttering bug which affected lot of Kepler users. That was widely known issue which got fixed quite a bit later after launch.

SKYMTL had no comment on any of these issues. But he conveniently has no problem finding fault with AMD for the HD 7970 Ghz cards being available later than planned even though they are available in plenty now. He also has a problem that the HD 7950 Boost edition BIOS is being made available to reviewers to give a preview of the upcoming HD 7950 models. All future HD 7950 chips will come with the higher core clocks / boost feature and will be validated to work properly with that feature. AMD partners are going to be releasing new models with the higher clocks and boost feature support.

http://images.anandtech.com/doci/6152/7950BBoards.jpg

I actually own 2 7950's, both do over these clocks so the updated Bios won't be an issue 2 me, however...

1. Intel & AMD both do this as well as Microsoft, Apple etc. I don;t like it any more than the next guy but you want more features/options you gotta pay the price for it, even if it's an artificial creation to make more money/appease client companies.

2. 7990 hasn't even come out yet and has had many, MANY delays. The poor stock again is an issue but not unique to nVidia, it's been an issue for many years for both companies & will be an issue again with the 7990 I think. There is a huge bias towards EVGA from nVidia but they are one of if not the best to buy from & worth the price in my opinion. Just wish they did AMD cards too, then I'd hardly ever use another make.

3. I don't know about this as I don't have any Kepler cards but I will find out as soon as the 660 Ti is launched. However, both companies have a swathe of dodgy drives & bugs that persist for months if not years so it's a hit & miss situation, you trade 1 bug for another & it all ends in a padlock at the end of the thread.

Only number 3 I would consider a goofup, the others are just marketing, PR and business decisions, which as usual, defy both logic & reason to the common man.

[tbone8ty]

http://wccftech.com/amd-announce-pri...660-ti-launch/

price cuts

[SKYMTL]

http://wccftech.com/amd-announce-pri...660-ti-launch/

price cuts

Am I missing something? You can already find both cards for about those prices (for custom cooled versions too!).

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814150616
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814127667
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814150616
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814150604
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814103208

However, this could be a cut to the reference clocked HD 7950 so the new "Boost" version can sell at a *gasp!* premium.

[tbone8ty]

true

i hope they cut the 7870 and 7850 some more

[Alex-Ro]

True 250$ for the 7870 and 200$ for the 7850 would be great.If not now,they surely will after GTX650TI(it the specs are the rumoured ones).

[Motiv]

I don't understand the issue here.

AMD are releasing a Bios update that will increase the performance of existing 7950 cards, at the expense of power usage. On top of that, it will have powertune also.

The only downside will be some cards it wont work for, and the user himself will need to install this bios update manually.

So, what's the problem. Sounds like a free upgrade for the majority f people who don't overclock. {insert confused smiley here}

[SEA]

Great wrap up, Motiv!
The only thing - about confused smiles: those loud arguers above should put it now..

[SKYMTL]

Small update. We like being proven (somewhat) wrong: http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/news/...rns-unfounded/

[raghu78]

Small update. We like being proven (somewhat) wrong: http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/news/...rns-unfounded/

Hopefully we will see a review from HWC on one of these cards.

http://www.sapphiretech.com/presenta...n=&lid=1&leg=0
http://www.hisdigital.com/un/product2-725.shtml

[SKYMTL]

Hopefully we will see a review from HWC on one of these cards.

http://www.sapphiretech.com/presenta...n=&lid=1&leg=0
http://www.hisdigital.com/un/product2-725.shtml

It will be neither. We will be reviewing a "reference" design rather than an OC SKU. If need be, I'll put my money where my mouth is and buy one.

[DeathReborn]

Small update. We like being proven (somewhat) wrong: http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/news/...rns-unfounded/

On a personal note PowerColor got the name right. BS Edition indeed.

Provided the 7950B costs not a dollar more than current 7950's I have less of an issue with it.

[SKYMTL]

About that bias argument, the Boost Edition has been posted for sale:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814131478

$20-$30 premium over most entry level CUSTOM COOLED HD 7950 cards.

I believe apologies are in order from the naysayers, no?

[BababooeyHTJ]

IMO, it hearkens back to the days when NVIDIA asked reviewers to use overclocked GTX 460 cards against newer AMD designs, except this time, AMD is passing their spiel off as an "upgrade" which may or may not have any foundation in reality.

On this one, I am taking a wait and see approach after being burnt once before.

I didn't see the problem then either, as long as you include results of the reference card which most sites did. GTX460 overclocked a lot better than 6870. Thats why they could release a card with such an aggressive oc.


Either way, I already flashed my 7950s with a sapphire 950mhz bios. I'm content with that.