A new build, would appreciate advice on the parts

[Source]

Source, The Samsung 830 is actually a bit cheaper. But I somehow have gotten the impression that the Crucial m4 is better.

I read everywhere that the Samsung has a better reliability track record and (on paper and most benchmarks) is also faster.
For example; http://tweakers.net/reviews/2389/3/s...enchmarks.html
Dutch but charts speak for itself. Red is Samsung 830 128GB, on the graphs you can click on one of the names. Both Synthetic benchmarks as Trace-based benchmarks, the 830 scores higher. (128GB).
This is only one (and Dutch) but has accurate and clear charts.

Source, you have a calibrated u2410. Have you tried gaming on the screen? Is the calibration/ICC-profile used in games?

Yes, I game daily on this screen, my calibration software loads the calibrated ICM file(Image Color Matching profile) into the video card:

8-4-2012 22:52 - Load Video Card LUT for Dell U2410(HDMI)-1 from profile -- > C:\Windows\system32\spool\drivers\color\Dell U2410(HDMI)-1-FEB-2012.icm
8-4-2012 22:52 - The calibration data from the profile was SUCCESSFULLY LOADED into the video card.

[Source]

-double-

[Frag Maniac]

I don't see where you're getting that the Samsung 830 is cheap fast, OR reliable. When you look at the OCZ Vertex III, it's specs, price, and popularity on Newegg blows most SSDs away.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820227706

This is the drive I'll probably be getting for OS and progs after I get a high end GPU and a storage drive or two.

[Source]

I don't see where you're getting that the Samsung 830 is cheap fast, OR reliable. When you look at the OCZ Vertex III, it's specs, price, and popularity on Newegg blows most SSDs away.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16820227706

This is the drive I'll probably be getting for OS and progs after I get a high end GPU and a storage drive or two.

I take the Newegg reviews quite lightly. Google Samsung 830 and see for yourself.
I also never said it was cheap, the TS said it was cheaper than the M4, than it is no brainer to pick the 830 IMO.

That OCZ has a SandForce controller in it, your choice but I don't trust that crappy controller to hold my important data.



Scores higher in overall-score.

Random quotes from internet:
http://forums.anandtech.com/showthread.php?t=2237909

830 by far.

OCZ is OCZ and I will leave it at that.
Not a fan of Sandforce chips. Even Intel 520.
The new Marvell chips are showing promise.
Indilinx Everest 2 looks interesting but AFAIK it's only currently available in OCZ Vertex 4 flavor.

See:
http://blog.laptopmag.com/sata-iii-s...e-is-fastest/2
http://blog.laptopmag.com/sata-iii-s...e-is-fastest/3

Amongst the SATA III drives, the Samsung 830 series is the clear winner, performing significantly better than its competitors on both file copies and synthetic tests. The SandForce-based OCZ Vertex 3 and Patriot Wildfire provided fantastic open times, but they were only one to two tenths of a second faster than the Samsung, which beats the field by a wide margin in file operations. If you want to supercharge your Intel 2nd-Generation Core series notebook, the Samsung 830 series is your best choice.

http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1795/5/

Legit Bottom Line: Samsung is not the first name that comes to mind when you think of SSDs, but maybe it should be. Their 830 Series drives perform extremely well and can stand tall with the best of them.

http://www.storagereview.com/samsung...0_review_256gb

Bottom Line
The Samsung SSD 830 is one of few viable alternatives to SandForce-powered SSDs. Its slim body looks great, but more importantly, the entirely home grown solution generally performs great too, with the highest 4K reads we've seen from any consumer SSD to date. It's not all roses, the drive sputters a bit when it comes to 4K writes, but that's not enough to keep us from recommending the SSD 830 as a great alternative for the enthusiast SSD buyer.

http://thessdreview.com/our-reviews/...ble-toolbox/7/

In short, nothing has really changed from the time the 830 was released to the consumer market. It’s still one of the fastest, still has an exceptional track record, and is still a desirable product even as newer drives have come after it. The 830 is fast everywhere. It has tremendous write speed and great read speed. Random performance is quite good too, especially QD1 random writes which eclipse much of the field.

[Frag Maniac]

Hmm, you have me rethinking, I've yet to see that bench results site, and it looks like it may be unbiased. Truth be told the one thing that's kept me skeptical about SSDs, the Vertex series in particular, is that many, mostly with the Vertex 2, have complained about TRIM not working properly, which can affect performance significantly. In the customer reviews some say it's user error or neglect, meaning the drive needs to be left idle long enough each day for TRIM to kick in.

What bothers me though is that a fair number of users said you have to actually manually log off Windows for the drive to recognize true idleness and do the TRIM properly. If that is the case, it is not desirable IMO to have to manually log off Windows. I also wasn't impressed that the OCZ rep I spoke to didn't seem to know, just saying that a certain amount of idle time was required for it to work. He didn't know what amount of time was sufficient, and seemed only vaguely sure that no manual log off was necessary.

I know controller type matters a lot too, but first I just want to be assured I won't have to micro manage an SSD just to get basic functions like TRIM to work properly. Seems to me most any current gen SSD ought to be plug and play enough to perform such functions without baby sitting it. I guess I'll have to start looking at the higher priced drives, but OCZ does have an Indilink now on their Vertex 4 models. It's around $20 cheaper, but seems to show worse advertised write speed than the 830 you referred to, and I don't know how they came up with a claim of 500mb/s on the Vertex 3 if the actual is well under 200. I'm not sure I like their track record for customer service either.

BTW, I found some pretty good prices on both those drives (830 and M4), but if the 830 has better reliability, I'd lean toward it. Seems to be a bit faster overall too. Still though, I want to be assured TRIM will work by itself in the background by just leaving the system idle for a bit.

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?...M4SSD&src=Deal

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?...879070866934b6

This place has 2nd best seller rating to Amazon on Google Checkout too.

[Source]

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?...M4SSD&src=Deal

http://www.superbiiz.com/detail.php?...879070866934b6

This place has 2nd best seller rating to Amazon on Google Checkout too.

Nice, in the link to the M4, there is a code 'HOP2IT' for 10% off.
Also works with the Samsung 830 (or any other item).

$143 for the M4
$165 for the 830

Price differences are also because of:
- M4 is sold bare whilst the 830 (desktop version) has included brackets, cables and software.
- Samsung 830 has a free copy of Norton Ghost
- Brushed metal case on the 830 is also nice
~..But the points above are all extras, SSD itself is of course more important.

[Frag Maniac]

Yeah I'd rather they price it on the bare unit myself. I don't need all that other crap and it just makes it sound gimmicky.

Can you tell me about the TRIM though? Is it a big deal with either of those drives, or can you just let it work in the background while the sys is idle without having to manually log off Windows?

[WhiteFireDragon]

For the most part, those parts you picked are pretty well balanced. I'm assuming you're going for high overclocks? Otherwise just get a CPU cooler in the range of $20-$40. You're looking at only a few degrees difference for double the price. And at this point, I'd wait for ivy bridge as well. Worst case is that it's the same performance at the same price point, but never lower performance for higher price.

[Source]

Yeah I'd rather they price it on the bare unit myself. I don't need all that other crap and it just makes it sound gimmicky.

Can you tell me about the TRIM though? Is it a big deal with either of those drives, or can you just let it work in the background while the sys is idle without having to manually log off Windows?

I can't answer this question myself unfortunately, my 830 is in backorder till end of the month.

Perhaps open a topic about it or some google'ing? Haven't found a solid answer myself, yet.

[Frag Maniac]

Well the only thing I've found so far is in reviews the 830 is touted as being very reliable, but degrades in performance over time. The "over time" comment (AnandTech) is a bit misleading though, because he really just means it's controller's tendency to put off GC/TRIM until there's a significant amount of idle time to manage clutter, like MOST SSD controllers work. Though technically detailed, AnandTech can be very preference oriented in their reviews. He did say that overall it's one of the better drives though, and that right after a TRIM pass the performance shot right back up. This is part of their torture test scenario where they purposely clutter a drive, then see how it performs.

Oddly enough however, after saying he preferred Intel's on-the-fly TRIM, the Intel 510 drive he tested sank to nearly as low performance in his torture test, around 60Mb/s vs 50Mb/s. So I don't see much point to his opinion that it's better to pick a drive with more moderate overall speed, but less of a performance hit when cluttered due to how it's TRIM works. Clearly his review shows that mindset may be flawed. IMO the bottom line seems to be whichever drive has the best combination of value, overall speed, and reliability, much like you said. However it still leaves me wondering just how much idle time is required for the average TRIM pass on a 128GB drive that is say half to 2/3 full.

My current HDDs aren't very fast, but at least they are consistent in speed regardless of their condition. I have toyed with the idea of getting two Hitachi Deskstar 7K3000 2TB drives, or one SSD and one 2TB drive. The 7K3000 of course isn't going to be as fast as an SSD, but it's one of the fastest HDDs and offers WAY more storage space. I'm kinda leaning toward an 830 and a 7K3000. I only have two SATA III slots on my MB.

(EDITED)
After further searching I'm finding Plextor's M3 Pro series to be some of the best SSDs. They refined the Marvell firmware to juice more speed and efficiency out of it regarding how the TRIM works. I find that more impressive than some of these drives that win bench tests by a small margin because in reality, that speed never lasts. Most SSDs always slow down significantly when the drive starts filling up, whereas the M3 Pro maintains high speed even when half full. Unfortunately you can't find bargain prices on it, so $205 is about the best you can expect on the 128GB model. That may be just more reassurance that it's a solid drive though.

[morticus]

Just bought the whole thing, I switched the SSD to the Samsung 830; Source made such a strong case for it, so I changed my oppinion :P
Here is what it ended up in:

Display: Dell U2410
Case: Antec P280
CPU: Intel i5 2500K
Cooler: Noctua NH-D14
Mobo: ASUS P8Z68-V PRO/GEN3
Mem: G.Skill 8GB CL9 1600Mhz Ripjaws Gaming (F3-12800CL9D-8GBRL)
GPU: Sapphire Radeon HD7850 2GB "OC Version"
PSU: Corsair AX 750W
SSD: Samsung SSD 830 128GB
HDD: Seagate Barracuda Green 2TB
CD/DVD: Lite-On DVD±RW (IHAS124-19)

I want to thank you all that posted in this thread and helped me decide on the various parts, but I want to especially mention and thank Frag Maniac for sharing your insights/thoughts

[Frag Maniac]

Let us know how your 830s perform guys, esp after say half full or so. In my findings 40 min seems to be plenty idle time for a TRIM pass following a torture test. Hopefully more like 20-30 min for average use.

[iboomalot]

looking at SSDs Plextor is nice and $149 for 128gig is very competitive price wise

[Frag Maniac]

looking at SSDs Plextor is nice and $149 for 128gig is very competitive price wise

You can only get the older non "Pro" models that cheap (unless you have a source for that amount on the M3 Pro). The older ones have Marvell's default firmware, not the True Speed FW the Pro models have. True Speed is proprietary to Plextor as well, it's not Marvell's FW. The result is much worse performance on the older ones when the drive starts filling up.

I've been thinking about what I've read some more, and as far as I can tell the differences we are seeing in SSD design, or I should say controller design since that's mostly what determines their performance, is that some have controllers with high throughput, others with better data sorting. So some have high max speeds, others better consistent speeds throughout their life and data capacity.

The reason the M3 Pro series stands out is that is has a controller with pretty fast throughput and reliability, but runs on firmware that is purposely coded to handle fast TRIM operations as well. A seq write speed of 420 Mb/s on a 128GB SSD is by no means the highest, but it's much higher than the drives that were previously known as the kings of consistency.

IMO consistency counts a lot. I don't want a drive that has to be kept at minimal capacity and/or left idle a lot to have it work at or near advertised speeds.