Kepler Nvidia GeForce GTX 780

[Vardant]

We've been talking about this review and the new features for more than five pages now.

[Musho]

We've been talking about this review and the new features for more than five pages now.

Oh sorry, my bad. Thought it was a different review

[trinibwoy]

Lol...

[DarthShader]

It wasn't written by him.

My bad.

What would you want:

A) A technology that throttles clocks (ie: AMD's PowerTune) to ensure a given TDP is met.

B) A technology that has been given enough headroom so it increases clocks to ensure an ASIC always stays at or near a given TDP.

I know which one I would choose if the rumors are correct.

First, I was just pointing out the boost will make accurate benching a bit harder. Not saying which one is better.

Second, both technologies are basicly the same thing. All you need to do is boost the clocks solidly but leave powertune limits low. When an application will put a load high enough not to reach the set clocks, it will appear like the card is boosting the clocks as high as possible to meet target TDP. Exactly the same thing. Except it mechanism is incompattible with marketting. Throotling = boo. Boosting = Yay.

I am betting Powertune is going to be done like that on the 8XXX cards, possibly even on a 7970 refresher if it comes.

[BeepBeep2]

My bad.


First, I was just pointing out the boost will make accurate benching a bit harder. Not saying which one is better.

Second, both technologies are basicly the same thing. All you need to do is boost the clocks solidly but leave powertune limits low. When an application will put a load high enough not to reach the set clocks, it will appear like the card is boosting the clocks as high as possible to meet target TDP. Exactly the same thing. Except it mechanism is incompattible with marketting. Throotling = boo. Boosting = Yay.

I am betting Powertune is going to be done like that on the 8XXX cards, possibly even on a 7970 refresher if it comes.

+1
Results will differ from card to card, game to game and scene to scene...(whereas something like Intel/AMD Turbo benefits are seen mostly in single thread workloads where performance can be predicted)

PowerTune is more of a reverse turbo.

[Lanek]

What would you want:

A) A technology that throttles clocks (ie: AMD's PowerTune) to ensure a given TDP is met.

B) A technology that has been given enough headroom so it increases clocks to ensure an ASIC always stays at or near a given TDP.

I know which one I would choose if the rumors are correct.

AMD dont throttle anything down with Powertune, even on 6990 .... Powertune and the turbo boost are absolutely not the same and not aimed at the same thing .... In one case it is here for limit the TDP if needed, the other one is here for overclocking the card when it think it is possible or needed.

On the other hand, it will be needed to see how this boost work in details for gaming, instead of just benchmark: If the card is able to OC to 1100mhz under a 2 min phase bench, is it the same when you are playing ? or do just play at 1006mhz ? Will you see the same fps or is it just boosting benchmark score ? what happend when your card is going high in temps after 1hour of gaming ?

The reported graph for TDP show a strange thing, each 3Dmark GT test start high.. ( max...) and go down as the test is going, if you compare with framerate and the load given on the test ( each test start at a low level of charge increasing as it goes to the end, easy to check with fps, as you start high, and end with low fps ), here the tdp decrease from 50W from the start of the bench and the end ( during the test )... does the bench start with 1100mhz? and go back to 1006 then ?... is the difference is really of 50W? if you compare with the 7970 curve, the curve increae in each test, the nvidia decrease in each test.


IF the Turbo boost was based on TDP you should see it going to his max limit and trying to stay there, not decreasing it. ( it will not be a flatline, but it will not look like this )


Indeed this is a nice feature, but im not sure the impact is yet exactly what we want it is. Same goes for suround ? can we compare 3 monitors running at full speed ? and 2 at half speed and the main at full speed ?
( what this? we are not able to use 3 monitors on one card at full speed, so we use 2 at half and 1 ? )

( You are testing the card, so you can try a little test: increase the vcore and let stock clock, then run 3Dmark 11, read the increase in TDP and check the difference.. )

[SKYMTL]

AMD dont throttle anything down with Powertune, even on 6990 .... Powertune and the turbo boost are absolutely not the same and not aimed at the same thing .... In one case it is here for limit the TDP if needed, the other one is here for overclocking the card when it think it is possible or needed.

PowerTune absolutely can throttle some results. Its entire point is to downlock the ASIC if TDP is surpassed. You are right though: PowerTune is the exact opposite of Turbo Boost. Turbo is meant to INCREASE performance while PowerTune is meant to DECREASE it if necessary.

[LordEC911]

PowerTune absolutely can throttle some results. Its entire point is to downlock the ASIC if TDP is surpassed. You are right though: PowerTune is the exact opposite of Turbo Boost. Turbo is meant to INCREASE performance while PowerTune is meant to DECREASE it if necessary.

Wow... really?

One allows the ASIC to be clocked as high as possible but makes certain it stays within TDP limits and gives consistent performance across the vast majority of situations.
The other keeps the base clock relatively low to make certain it stays within the TDP limits in the outlier situations and tries to dynamically change clocks when not in those situations.

[SKYMTL]

Wow... really?

One allows the ASIC to be clocked as high as possible but makes certain it stays within TDP limits and gives consistent performance across the vast majority of situations.
The other keeps the base clock relatively low to make certain it stays within the TDP limits in the outlier situations and tries to dynamically change clocks when not in those situations.

Glass half empty kinda guy, aren't ya?

[GoldenTiger]

http://www.shopblt.com/cgi-bin/shop/...ORDERID!#Specs

Maybe we will see a 500 msrp, if we count the 560 there as preorder being high as usual.

Listed lower than 7970 on neutron pricewise....

[Lanek]

PowerTune absolutely can throttle some results. Its entire point is to downlock the ASIC if TDP is surpassed. You are right though: PowerTune is the exact opposite of Turbo Boost. Turbo is meant to INCREASE performance while PowerTune is meant to DECREASE it if necessary.

Please... outside Furmark ( hpefully ) this was constated only in Metro benchmark... ( in general you will end with more fps in the game instead of the bench, who is really hardcore ).. push the slider to +20% and problem is solved. But this was not the point.. anyway.

[boxleitnerb]

I've seen other instances where PowerTune is throttling in games. I'd take a solution that gives me guaranteed performance and possibly more every day over one that might throttle if I push settings to high.

[Mechanical Man]

Glass half empty kinda guy, aren't ya?

I think this is just a different way of throttling.

Think about it. Other one sets default clock to high, then throttles when power is too high, other one sets default clock low and then oc's when power is low. End result is pretty much the same. Its just about how one describes it, now with turbo on cpus, its marketing wise to sell good old throttling as turbo and instead of saying negatively feeled "throttle" say rising clocks...

[aussie-revhead]

Sorry guys but what is this 1006mhz 680 clock? Surely its not default, so is it max overclock, turbo or other??

[MaddMuppet]

Sorry guys but what is this 1006mhz 680 clock? Surely its not default, so is it max overclock, turbo or other??

My understanding is that it is a Turbo function.

[Russian]

Sorry guys but what is this 1006mhz 680 clock? Surely its not default, so is it max overclock, turbo or other??

Give it some time... there will be good information in due time.

[boxleitnerb]

1006 is default, 1058 is turbo. The 700 MHz that have been floating around are most likely a wrong reading by GPU-Z and co.

[cal_guy]

Absolutely not. Stop putting words in my mouth.

While PowerTune HAS been proven to throttle in some games (Metro 2033 and Shogun 2 in some cases) I prefer to have a technology that swings both ways. If an application demands too much, clocks can be lowered but if a game doesn't tickle the limits of TDP, the extra headroom can be automatically used for higher clock speeds. Intel already does this with their Turbo Boost and (IMO) it works quite well.

I'm not sure it makes much of a difference in a GPU scenario. Let's assume a hypothetical GPU bin that can function up to 1.1 Ghz. A GPU with turbo would start at a lower clock and than proceed to the turbo clock if TDP room is available and then fall back once the maximum TDP is met or exceeded. In a PowerTune scenario the GPU would start at 1.1 Ghz as long as TDP room is available and then similarly retreat once the maximum TDP is met or exceeded.

[Leeghoofd]

That's what the theory says, but how does it function in reality ? The last is what really counts isn't it ?

[Kristoferr]

Default voltage maximum overclock. +11% GPU.

[LordEC911]

Glass half empty kinda guy, aren't ya?

Just giving a different perspective...
Have you got around to playing with it yet? I've heard there are some oddities but hopefully they will be worked out soon.

I've seen other instances where PowerTune is throttling in games. I'd take a solution that gives me guaranteed performance and possibly more every day over one that might throttle if I push settings to high.

Guaranteed isn't exactly what I would call it.

I think this is just a different way of throttling.

Exactly. Two different solutions.
Can only wait and see which one works the best.

[boxleitnerb]

So the 1006 MHz aren't guaranteed?

[Andrea deluxe]

So the 1006 MHz aren't guaranteed?

1006 are the stock 3d frequncy.

[LordEC911]

So the 1006 MHz aren't guaranteed?

I read that wrong. I meant the turbo isn't guaranteed, nor consistent.

[Andrea deluxe]

http://vr-zone.com/articles/nvidia-g...iew/15273.html