Alert - Anyone that is using the Koolance bleed kits take a look

[shazza]

Cleaned up some posts in the first part of this thread ... then gave up as I got to the end. Am traveling this week and internet connection is very poor.

Would just ask that people stay on topic and please don't get into name calling battles with each other.

[Sparky]

But what's the fun in that??

Just kidding, I agree with Shazza. Personal attacks serve no good purpose.

[matari]

I am just going to be mean; I (the customer) should not have use an anticorrosive additive just in case a manufacturer cuts a conner. Now, I am not saying anything about the part in question, that is just a general statement. An anticorrosive additive is not going to prevent corrosion, it is only going to slow the process down. In my opinion the typical premix coolant has no where near amount of anticorrosive needed to slow the process down significantly. The Koolance premix has a decent amount of the anticorrosive, but is more than likely conductive out of the bottle.

[Ultrasonic2]

This is the whole EK nickel plating debate again. How is it the manufactures fault that you dont use the correct fluids.

I know that people say i have a copper rad and a copper block so i should be fine but this only shows a lack of understanding firstly your rad's water channels are probably made from brass that has been SOLDERED together adding more metals (lead and tin) for galvanic corrosion issues. There are other possible locations for additional metal entering the mix too like fitting and the pump it’s self.

If you run the proper fluids you won’t have problems as many issues with Galvanic corrosion.

[Metal Wolf]

If that was the benzalkonium chloride version of PT-nuke, then it could have been a resistant algae. I'm finding a lot of sources say it's not 100% effective, or at low molar concentrations it's not enough to help.

I'm looking around at other compounds to use as biocide. My wife's system, however, has nothing at all in it but distilled and is 100% pristine. Her copper block is stained black with selenium dioxide though, I wonder if that's an answer? It could also be the lack of natural lighting in her case coupled with a UV cathode. She has mesh sides, no acrylic window and a FrozenQ res. There's really practically no outside light in it. Whatever it is, I'll be guinea pigging some compounds when I get my system back up.

I made a bit of an experiment of my build just distilled and no additives of any kind. Went with the black tubing and no transparent parts except for a xspc restop. I made sure there were no nearby strong leds and then shut the case up. It been about 5 month now and the water is still clear and particle free when I check on it. I'll have to wait a few more months when I open it up and check out the waterblock. But I'm pretty sure theres not anything growing in there. Mold is all I'm basically worried about at this point.

[Sparky]

This is the whole EK nickel plating debate again. How is it the manufactures fault that you dont use the correct fluids.

I know that people say i have a copper rad and a copper block so i should be fine but this only shows a lack of understanding firstly your rad's water channels are probably made from brass that has been SOLDERED together adding more metals (lead and tin) for galvanic corrosion issues. There are other possible locations for additional metal entering the mix too like fitting and the pump it’s self.

If you run the proper fluids you won’t have problems as many issues with Galvanic corrosion.

And it then comes back to why the heck is this all of a sudden a problem NOW when it hasn't been years prior?

[matari]

Two reasons:

1) Increase of noobs to water cooling,

2) manufacturers cutting corners.

[Tackleberry]

3) someone should thoroughly check on onsistency of Pt nuke, refered to 2nd point of this.
While all kind of tests are online, has anyone seen tests of PT nuke and its influence on material before release of product.

[matari]

That fits under 2

[Ultrasonic2]

Why now I obviously cannot answer as it’s not my rig. For galvanic corrosion to occur you need dissimilar metals and a current.

Fact one Galvanic corrosion has occurred

This means he is running dis similar metals. So I would suggest that he should look for the less knobble metal.

Fact 2 it’s not Koolances fault that Galvanic corrosion has occurred. It takes to metals to tango and the koolance part appears to be the more knobble of the two reacting metals

[Utnorris]

Why now I obviously cannot answer as it’s not my rig. For galvanic corrosion to occur you need dissimilar metals and a current.

Fact one Galvanic corrosion has occurred

This means he is running dis similar metals. So I would suggest that he should look for the less knobble metal.

Fact 2 it’s not Koolances fault that Galvanic corrosion has occurred. It takes to metals to tango and the koolance part appears to be the more knobble of the two reacting metals

1 - Not sure it's galvanic corrosion.
2 - I have copper or nickel plated copper in my loop, nothing else. I already stated this.

Lastly, again, this isn't my first time water cooling and I wouldn't put two different metals together, knowingly, that would cause issues. I know how quickly corrosion can happen since I built a chiller out of an AC and watched it happened in a maybe a day's worth of time. Before assuming anything else, please ask or read the whole thread.

[Sadasius]

1 - Not sure it's galvanic corrosion.
2 - I have copper or nickel plated copper in my loop, nothing else. I already stated this.

Lastly, again, this isn't my first time water cooling and I wouldn't put two different metals together, knowingly, that would cause issues. I know how quickly corrosion can happen since I built a chiller out of an AC and watched it happened in a maybe a day's worth of time. Before assuming anything else, please ask or read the whole thread.

Yeah I know your good at WC Utnorris and is the one reasons why I ruled out galvanic corrosion. I also know the history of Koolance and the rusting plugs and such too. To me it looked like the tube was rusting.

[Ultrasonic2]

Have read the whole thread

Logically you are experiencing corrosion issues and you know you are so i dont understand the point of this post.

And as i have stated before EVERYONE has more metals in their loops than just copper or nickel

ie your rad wont be made of copper and your pump is not made of copper . blah blah. It really doesn't matter what you reply to the debate about what metals your running in your loop because the evidence is your experiencing corrosion.

YOUR original posts show you are experiencing corrosion issues there's no debating it. Corrosion is a reaction so eliminate the causes of the reaction.

If the reaction is not Galvanic it doesn't really leave many other options it could be rust but that is assuming the tube is ferrous and if it was you'd still be better off with a corrosion inhibiter. As others have said the tube isn't ferrous and therefore can not rust. I personally haven't tested it. Whip out a magnet and you'll have your anwser

It's easy to blame Koolance for this but it's really not going to be there fault.

[Sadasius]

Corrosion is a reaction so eliminate the causes of the reaction.

If the reaction is not Galvanic it doesn't really leave many other options it could be rust but that is assuming the tube is ferrous and if it was you'd still be better off with a corrosion inhibiter. As others have said the tube isn't ferrous and therefore can not rust. I personally haven't tested it. Whip out a magnet and you'll have your anwser

It's easy to blame Koolance for this but it's really not going to be there fault.

Yes corrosion is the obvious answer here but it could also be something else like some sort of bacteria that likes that tube or something. Sometimes many things can come into play but it is usually the new item to the loop that will do it's thing and you can point the finger at it and as well to the company that made it. He had this in his loop for a short duration and there was a reaction. How long was his loop without this reaction? So yes as you pointed out you remove (which he did) the item from the loop and examine it and make sure which he is doing. I do not see the point of your post in arguing the obvious here.

Think we have not known about solder and brass tubes in rads, bungholes and tanks? His loop was fine...He added this item from Koolance and then it was not fine. Now it is a process to find out what is doing what here.

[Ultrasonic2]

look i want to know what happened too as i have one of these in my rig right now.

i think the most important thing to do is test if it's magnetic or not . if it is I certainly WILL be removing it from my loop even though im running an additive.

i can not answer for all rads out there but i know the HL GTX /GTS has brass tubing and copper fins and the tubes and end tanks are soldered / braised together adding those metals to the mix

I am at no point suggesting that you will have any really issues running Copper and Brass in the same loop. i'm mearly making the point that there are more metals in play than most people believe.

http://www.hwlabs.com/index.php?opti...d=18&Itemid=15

radiators are constructed of a pair of header tanks, linked by a core with many narrow passageways, thus a high surface area relative to its volume. This core is usually made of stacked layers of metal sheet, pressed to form channels and soldered or brazed together.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radiator_(engine_cooling)

[Sparky]

You never answered my question

[Utnorris]

Look, I said it before, the tube is not magnetic, please re-read the thread. Second, as I stated before, I do not think it's corrosion because it only happened on the tube and it could be scraped off and there was no damage below. I do think there is a reaction going on, could be an algae, I doubt it, but sure, it could be. It could be a reaction between the PT-Nuke and the tube, but without knowing if the tube is brass or steel, can't confirm or rule that one out. My point is, it's not an easy call saying what it is. I can pretty much guarantee it's not rust, however whatever it is has the potential to clog the system if it gets out of control. The pipe has been sent to Koolance and Tim has already stated he will look at it and give us an idea of what it is.

[Sadasius]

I am anxious to see what it is. Maybe it is an alien life form that traveled across the universe on neutrino's and hit the tube and made a settlement. You never know....Just saying. K... <-< >-> Done!

[Ultrasonic2]

And it then comes back to why the heck is this all of a sudden a problem NOW when it hasn't been years prior?

You never answered my question

Well there isn't really much i can say to this really as it's not my rig so have no idea of it's definitive history

I could give you a list of possibilities but i wont

What i do find interesting is that your implying that the rig has been unchanged for years which is clearly not the case as the res hasn't been made for years and years . and obviously the bleed it is relatively new . so there has DEFINITELY been changes going on over the years.




My point is EVERYONE mixes metals and therefore you should run some kind of inhibitor. Back in the old days i ran just water till i got burnt myself.

[Waterlogged]

And it then comes back to why the heck is this all of a sudden a problem NOW when it hasn't been years prior?

+1. . .plus if it were GC, it wouldn't just wipe off. You have to grind away GC residue.

Hey Sparky, Doesn't the color of that stuff remind you of that little thing you had going on in your res a little while back?

[Utnorris]

Just an update, Koolance now has the tube, so hopefully Tim will post up something here. Also, I took apart my CPU water block just to be sure there wasn't anything going on in there and there was nothing like what was on the tube, so it was confined to the tube from the bleed kit.

[Utnorris]

So they have shipped me a new bleed kit. In the RMA noted there is nothing stated as to what this was.

@Tim, I thought you would let me know what it was if I shipped it back?

[Kayin]

It still resembles red algae like I get in my coldwater aquarium. If it scrapes off with a nail, we're probably looking at something biological in nature. Either that (though this most likely isn't the case) or plasticizer leach (though what would stain it red without a dye in the loop I'm lost on.)

Like I said, I think we need to look at better algaecides for distilled.

[Utnorris]

It'd be best if you submitted an RMA so we can see what's going on.



I said that or additives in the coolant being used. We'll have to take a look when it gets here.



Naturally, convenience can come with other costs. You didn't mention that you've used our coolant before-- not all glycol coolants gunk up blocks. That's not a complaint I've heard with our liquid, and I've seen it several times with other brands.

The fact there are terrible premixes on the market is a problem. Some of the companies which sell coolants don't provide a wide variety of other cooling components. This is just my opinion, but when things go wrong, they're probably less likely to get customer feedback (or have motivation to change things) than companies which make the water block, reservoir, rad, fittings, or whatever was involved.

Tim

Still looking for an answer Tim, I got the replacement and I appreciate it, but it does me no good if I do not know what happened.

[matari]

Maybe the test are not finished, or maybe he is trying to prevent a wild fire.