AMD Llano (desktop) reviews

[Motiv]

I think they used i3-2105, but I agree that review is horrible, the power consumption doesn't even state if it's CPU only or is it system power consumption.


BTW did anyone compare the IQ in games? I've seen a post about Intel's GPU having lower IQ for better FPS.

That should be looked into, although you would be mad to use an intel graphics chip for anything other than 'Hearts'.

[Lanek]

Well.... with the CPU used for Llano, this was expected ( cpu perf ) ... now looking on gpu side ( HC give something like 80% more perf of the Intel IGP for games ) ... This can only look good for the next APU Trinity with a better CPU.

[XRL8]

Well ive read canucks, and glanced for few others.
Seems like a dream chip for the overclocker on a tight budget.
If you are willing to learn how to oc these.You can have +30% or even more gaming performance.
Cpu wise its "enough" for all the mundane stuff people do ,and gaming wise, its usable too.
Im actually building most computers for customers with some sort of IGP and a cheap athlons nowadays.Thats going to be a great step forward.

[Lightman]

Well ive read canucks, and glanced for few others.
Seems like a dream chip for the overclocker on a tight budget.
If you are willing to learn how to oc these.You can have +30% or even more gaming performance.
Cpu wise its "enough" for all the mundane stuff people do ,and gaming wise, its usable too.
Im actually building most computers for customers with some sort of IGP and a cheap athlons nowadays.Thats going to be a great step forward.

I agree totally.
Said many times already, in poorer countries it will be very popular chip. In wealthy countries it will be popular thanks to OEM systems shipping with Llano.

Regarding articles I must agree Hardware Canucks review stands out as best in many regards. Though it is worth reading few more as well to gain better picture of performance and OC headrom. On OC front the spread is quite high, ranging from 3.5GHz to 4GHz. Either overclocking this platform needs some more attention than recent approach of set multi / voltage and you're done, or there is quite a freq. headroom spread between samples.

[repman]

I wonder if you can undervolt it even lower than 0.444V at idle.

[Motiv]

What is worth considering is how will game developers view this chip. Obviously this is only the first generation and thus, there won't be enough of them to go round. Once we hit 'trinity' next year (I believe that is the BD version), then there will be a substantial base of low spec PCs/Laptops that are capable of running the latest games. This could be a problem for Intel, as it doesn't seem to have anything to throw at AMD over these chips.

It will be interesting to see how these chips slot into the games market.

[SKYMTL]

I wonder if you can undervolt it even lower than 0.444V at idle.

Due to the complicated way this chip gates voltage to its different sections (SIMDs, CPU cores, UVD, etc), I wouldn't recommend undervolting.

[Lanek]

What is worth considering is how will game developers view this chip. Obviously this is only the first generation and thus, there won't be enough of them to go round. Once we hit 'trinity' next year (I believe that is the BD version), then there will be a substantial base of low spec PCs/Laptops that are capable of running the latest games. This could be a problem for Intel, as it doesn't seem to have anything to throw at AMD over these chips.

It will be interesting to see how these chips slot into the games market.

Well, we don't know yet how will compare Bulldozer to Intel CPU's .... Trinity will effectively be build around Bulldozer, during AFDS, AMD have explain Trinity gpu will be VLIW4, rumors state a Juniper version in VLIW4. Let's imagine Bulldozer is competitive with Sandybridge line up and add a gpu who can perform close to a HD5770: as you said, this can be really a problem for Intel in this part of the market.

[aintz]

what is the point of making a onboard gpu in those performance range? you cant game properly and it is way beyond enough for htpc purposes.....

[repman]

Due to the complicated way this chip gates voltage to its different sections (SIMDs, CPU cores, UVD, etc), I wouldn't recommend undervolting.

Ok, thank you for the reply.
But since you mentioned the voltage being gated to more sections (than on normal CPU's) does overclocking (thus using higher voltage) have an impact as well (could it be more prone to damage than normal CPU's because of the other components?). I'm just guessing here so correct me if I'm wrong.

[Andi64]

Any overclocking test with the GPU turned off? I saw 4.6Ghz at OBR blog. At 32nm HK the K10 arch should work faster than 4.0Ghz, don't you think?

[Motiv]

what is the point of making a onboard gpu in those performance range? you cant game properly and it is way beyond enough for htpc purposes.....

you most certainly can game with it.

If you are on a limited budget, these CPUs are great. You get a PC that can game, yet still powerful enough for today's apps.

[Motiv]

Well, we don't know yet how will compare Bulldozer to Intel CPU's .... Trinity will effectively be build around Bulldozer, during AFDS, AMD have explain Trinity gpu will be VLIW4, rumors state a Juniper version in VLIW4. Let's imagine Bulldozer is competitive with Sandybridge line up and add a gpu who can perform close to a HD5770: as you said, this can be really a problem for Intel in this part of the market.

I can imagine that Intel is advancing it's GPU tech as quick as it can. If direct compute and openCL become more widespread, then trinity based CPUs will be a major breakthrough (IF BD is better in the CPU area). It will cerainly be a platform that the latest games could be played at resolutions and settings that would be enjoyable to most.

The llano is certainly showing what the future holds. It's the bargain basement level at the moment, but will no doubt raise the standards of both intel and AMDs next gen CPU/GPU hybrids.

[SKYMTL]

what is the point of making a onboard gpu in those performance range? you cant game properly and it is way beyond enough for htpc purposes.....

Gaming on these GPUs isn't an issue at all. Plus, the addition of Dual Graphics means the potential for further increased performance as well.

[Spectrobozo]

what is the point of making a onboard gpu in those performance range? you cant game properly and it is way beyond enough for htpc purposes.....

you can definitely have a good enough gaming experience with this IGP, most of the games will run with good framerate and graphics... obviously this is not good enough for the 1200p AA8x 100fps people, but for 720p and around there it's fine.

I upgraded a PC with an old 7300GT to a HD5570 DDR3 (only slightly better than this IGP), and it was running a slow dual core (core 2 2mb l2 at 2.4ghz), and instantly that PC could run most games well enough, F1 2010 at 1280x1024 and so on...

talking about 5570, I wonder why is not possible to use one in crossfire with the llano IGP, only 6000 series...

[SKYMTL]

talking about 5570, I wonder why is not possible to use one in crossfire with the llano IGP, only 6000 series...

It is due to the limitations of Crossfire's drivers. Remember, you can't combine a HD 5000 and a HD 6000 together even with mixed Crossfire. So combining a HD 5570 with the A8's HD 6550D wouldn't be possible either.

[Spectrobozo]

It is due to the limitations of Crossfire's drivers. Remember, you can't combine a HD 5000 and a HD 6000 together even with mixed Crossfire. So combining a HD 5570 with the A8's HD 6550D wouldn't be possible either.

but isn't the 6550D based on the redwood arch?
here you can see a 6750 and a 5770 working in CF (both juniper gpu..)
http://www.overclockers.com/sapphire...?utm_source=pr

[matose]

Here's our 37 page review: AMD A8-3850 @ lab501.ro
Our sample OC only to 3.7GHz @ 1.52v, but the memory clocks were pretty amazing: 2160MHz 7-7-7-21 1T with Hyper sticks and 2650MHz 8-11-8-27 1T with PSC

[Motiv]

Here's our 37 page review: AMD A8-3850 @ lab501.ro
Our sample OC only to 3.7GHz @ 1.52v, but the memory clocks were pretty amazing: 2160MHz 7-7-7-21 1T with Hyper sticks and 2650MHz 8-11-8-27 1T with PSC

very good test matose. Quick question, how come the i3 managed to run AvP in DX11?

Also, is there any change of showing some OC results for the games too. At those impressive speeds, there must be quite an improvement other stock.

[kl0012]

It is due to the limitations of Crossfire's drivers. Remember, you can't combine a HD 5000 and a HD 6000 together even with mixed Crossfire. So combining a HD 5570 with the A8's HD 6550D wouldn't be possible either.

Did you notice any problems with Hybrid CF (except the fact that many games have no gain from CF)? According to some reviews there are serious micro-stuttering problems.

[netkas]

Here's our 37 page review: AMD A8-3850 @ lab501.ro
Our sample OC only to 3.7GHz @ 1.52v, but the memory clocks were pretty amazing: 2160MHz 7-7-7-21 1T with Hyper sticks and 2650MHz 8-11-8-27 1T with PSC

it doesnt translate 2+ pages tho :P

[bamtan2]

Gaming on these GPUs isn't an issue at all. Plus, the addition of Dual Graphics means the potential for further increased performance as well.

yeah come to think of it, people may be forgetting or downplaying having proper directx 11 support. at least it means someone with a crappy computer could bring home a game and play it. haven't we all done that, played a game at low res and low settings? has anyone benchmarked llano with crysis 2 to see what settings get 25fps? lowest visuals and 1024x768? that is better than a lot of old games I like.

[matose]

very good test matose. Quick question, how come the i3 managed to run AvP in DX11?

Pag 11 to 24 are CPU performance test with MSI R5870 Lightning as VGA card. Pag 26 to 33 are IGP tests

Thanks for watching!

[Hornet331]

very good test matose. Quick question, how come the i3 managed to run AvP in DX11?

Simple, it didn't, it ran in 10.1. The fallback of DX11 is DX10.x so every DX10 card can run DX11 games, you just can't use any of its related features (mostly tesslation).

Preformance at stock is pretty much there where it was expected (from the mobile reviw), but whats nice is the oc potential.

[Stevethegreat]

It's interesting to see an IGP which can finally compete with discrete cards but the 100w TDP is a bit too much for an HTPC system. I believe it's the 65w parts that will make Llano shine.

Any news when they will be out?