Performance preview of AMD LIano vs Intel Sandy Bridge @ ocworkbench

[duploxxx]

can someone explain why all llano scores are rounded to the nearest 100pts?

did you read the thread? the scores are fake just like the CPU's since those won't exist....

[Manicdan]

sorry i couldnt figure out what was sarcasm and what was serious. too many arguments about different product segments.

[SKYMTL]

Honestly, Llano is the one processor series I have been eagerly waiting for. Its potential for the notebook and SFF markets is just out of this world.

This thread however, should die. Simply because there is a massive amount of misinformation that will lead people in completely the wrong direction regarding Llano and future Fusion products.

[[XC] Synthetickiller]

I do take this results in a highly welcome manner, I actually thought llano was not going to perform like it is, absolutely brilliant!

btw you're mixing Llano and BD as described a few posts above

Lolz A8 and A6, both are quad cores. You maybe got confused by the names.

Seems you're confused. Is it that difficult to inform yourself a bit before posting?

Llano A8 ~ Quad core
Llano A6 ~ Quad core
Llano A4 ~ Dual core
Llano E2 ~ Dual Core

AMD FX8000 ~ 4module/8 core
AMD FX6000 ~ 3module/6 core
AMD FX4000 ~ 2module/4 core


The Llano that reaches 2.6Ghz with Turbo is a mobile part


Love reading the nonsense.

As others mentioned ,this is Llano,a mainstream Fusion CPU for mobile and desktop.It's slightly improved phenom II with Radeon integrated on the same die.Results are actually quite good in PCmark also,since SandyBridge nails this test (faster than 990x too,the test is not well threaded and appreciates high clock and ipc). Llano is posting similar scores to top of the line Thuban/Deneb. That's is great for a 65W part .


No,the model numbers(A8,A6,A4) don't represent the number of cores.Top model "A8 somethingsomething" is a quad core at xx.xxGhz with 400SP Radeon on die.These are all dual and quad core Fusion CPUs.Read the above response to hipno650.

Thanks, I've kept up w/ BD, but not Llano (such an odd name).

I like the idea of these in a laptop. I'll have to wait and see if lenovo comes out with an x2xx thinkpad with one, I'd go that route.

Not bad performance for the cpu for the mobile segment.

As to whey they care ONLY comparing this CPU to 1155 and not intel mobile is beyond me. I know it's nice to see how it fairs compared to the desktop segment, but how about mobile vs mobile? Seems a tad stupid to me.

[DarthShader]

just like the CPU's since those won't exist....

And here we go again....

At least an A8-3510MX does exist, since it was mentioned in disclaimers on AMD site (and already removed).

Simply because there is a massive amount of misinformation that will lead people in completely the wrong direction regarding Llano and future Fusion products.

Can you please point out the misinformation and "the wrong direction"?

[Miwo]

Llano is for mainstream PC use. Mainstream PC Gaming is not Crysis or Metro 2033. Try Sims, WoW, SCII. For these games Llano is going to pass with flying colors. Its an obvious choice for system integrators for a light/medium duty system capable of mainstream gaming. With an all in one solution, they can focus on cramming it into cute small form factors (which of course are all the rage) and skimp out even further on Power Supplies specs. Llano was never meant to be Xtreme and I dont understand why people are treating it like its going to be an absolute failure because it will likely not match an i3/i5/i7 in raw cpu performance.

Every product has its place on the market regardless of how gimp you guys think it is. Llano is probably going to be AMDs future bread and butter and is targeting the likes of all integrated solutions and up to Nvidia's GT220/GT240 desktop discrete cards and GT335M and below mobile chips. If you ask me, thats a gigantic slice of the market if Llano can succeed as well as Brazos has in the past year.

[XRL8]

This thread should be deleted and started from scratch, with info that this ISNT bulldozer and that its a mainstream notebook part for the most part.
In the first post it should also be said that cpu cores are weaker than SB and IGP part is more powerful than the SB.

[Hornet331]

I believe the problem lies here. In YOUR opinion there's not much for the GPU inside Llano but for others there might be. I for one like the idea that I will be able to buy a laptop with decent GPU capabilities for less than what was standard before. I want more for less. I would of course like the CPU to be of better standard than it is but I rarely use my computer for heavily threaded apps nor do I decode much. I would however like to play some games, even if that is at low settings. Llano looks to provide better graphics than HD3000 can even in the lower markets but we will see.

I also believe OEMs like this idea. And I do believe that AMD portable market share will grow because of this. Also, this is the first (or second if you count Brazos) version of the APU. In coming generations the integration will probably be a lot better and the amount of workloads that can make use of the GPU capabilities is not likely to get any fewer.

If you say games you have to differentiat... many (and with many i mean a lot) people usually play game on there notebook, but those are the usual casual/family games like bejeweled, popcap, peggle, the xt billion tetris clone etc. or the countless flashbased webgames and of course the facebook games. Those already run with no flaw on current generation notebooks a better igp wont yield you there any additional performance.

Hell look at the stupid success of Terraria... which is a blant minecraft clone, in 2d...

Yes its my opinion, but when I look around in my family and my friends who are not gamers, they do exactly that with there notebooks/computers.

For gamers the power it provides is to low, a HD5550 struggels to provide constatnly more then 30fps on any moderat demanding 3d game that was released in the last year @ 1280x1024.
To me the top variant of the llano igp is like the uggly stepchild... has to much performance for casual games but not enough to provide a decent experience for recent 3d titels.

edit:
For me this seems like the 780G hype all over again. If you look back to 2008 this IGP totaly destroyed the G35/G45 in graphic performance, cpus also where good enough, but they never really took off. Because people vastly overestimated the importance of graphics... and imho thats still the case.

[duploxxx]

And here we go again....

At least an A8-3510MX does exist, since it was mentioned in disclaimers on AMD site (and already removed).


Can you please point out the misinformation and "the wrong direction"?

did you see the list here of the desktop parts and the tests done on this site... well that list doesn't exist. the one you mention on the other hand has indeed already been shown in public.

cpu naming schema is totally wrong, just like in the BD threads.

For gamers the power it provides is to low, a HD5550 struggels to provide constatnly more then 30fps on any moderat demanding 3d game that was released in the last year @ 1280x1024.
To me the top variant of the llano igp is like the uggly stepchild... has to much performance for casual games but not enough to provide a decent experience for recent 3d titels.

so sure about your perf statements or just blind blue?
http://www.notebookcheck.net/AMD-Rad...M.41143.0.html

[Manicdan]

Llano is for mainstream PC use. Mainstream PC Gaming is not Crysis or Metro 2033. Try Sims, WoW, SCII.

i think people underestimate whats really needed to run all these console ports. my 4850 still runs any game at an enjoyable level and 1920x1200. and llano paired up with a small gpu should be quite similar. and ANY game should have options to run at lower settings where its playable and not look like its from 1990. sure a 6900 gpu is almost 3x stronger than my gpu, but what settings does that allow, depth of field, some AA or AF, super high textures, etc. dropping those all off you still have something that looks like the game, but now uses half the resources. there is a hardware limitation needed to see a game and enjoy it, but past that its extremly costly for those few extra features. thats why i like the reviews which find out what max settings are allowed to still get 60fps, because for some of use that extra 100$ on a gpu, is for features we wont really care too much about.

[AbortRetryFail?]

Honestly, Llano is the one processor series I have been eagerly waiting for. Its potential for the notebook and SFF markets is just out of this world.

This thread however, should die. Simply because there is a massive amount of misinformation that will lead people in completely the wrong direction regarding Llano and future Fusion products.

It's hard to have a decent thread with all the 'back&forth'

While folks continue to focus on the graphics side of Llano it should be noted that AMD has consistently referred to the 'GPU' portion of the 'APU' as a SIMD Engine Array.

With AVX logic moved on-chip in the future things might get interesting with Llano.

[[XC] hipno650]

I guess I was mixed up in thinking it was BD. you can see however where my confusion came from because they call it an "A8" CPU and have a series of A6 and A4's not the best naming IMO but thats a minor thing. people are saying how GPU performance is "miles ahead" of Intel. if your looking at this chart and other like it that have come out most of the best case senarios put it at only 2-3x's faster which which good for being faster still leaves you with a useless gaming GPU IMO. and was pointed out earlier. GPU performance only really makes a difference with gaming. In fact I can think of more Programs off the top of my head that can make use of GPGPU on an Intel IGP than ones that will make use of an AMD one that your average joe will use.

[Sesto Sento]

If you say games you have to differentiat... many (and with many i mean a lot) people usually play game on there notebook, but those are the usual casual/family games like bejeweled, popcap, peggle, the xt billion tetris clone etc. or the countless flashbased webgames and of course the facebook games. Those already run with no flaw on current generation notebooks a better igp wont yield you there any additional performance.

Hell look at the stupid success of Terraria... which is a blant minecraft clone, in 2d...

Yes its my opinion, but when I look around in my family and my friends who are not gamers, they do exactly that with there notebooks/computers.

For gamers the power it provides is to low, a HD5550 struggels to provide constatnly more then 30fps on any moderat demanding 3d game that was released in the last year @ 1280x1024.
To me the top variant of the llano igp is like the uggly stepchild... has to much performance for casual games but not enough to provide a decent experience for recent 3d titels.

edit:
For me this seems like the 780G hype all over again. If you look back to 2008 this IGP totaly destroyed the G35/G45 in graphic performance, cpus also where good enough, but they never really took off. Because people vastly overestimated the importance of graphics... and imho thats still the case.

The power it provides is too low you say??

My girlfriend's laptop (core i3 330 with a HD5650) can play a LOT of games with mid to max settings (without AA of course) @ native res (15" 1366).

I can play on that piece of **** notebook games like, GRID, F1 2010, Starcraft II, Sims 3, CS: S, Oblivion, Supreme Commander, Left for dead 2, Far Cry 2, PES 2011, DIRT 2, COD (the new one), hell even CRYSIS it can play (although i have to lower the res to 1024 on that one)... and you say it doesn't have enough power??? All of this on med to max settings (without AA/AF of course (even if some of them i can even enable AA/AF, like CS: Source) all of this on the native res of the laptop)

[undone]

A8-3850 (maybe with turbo or manually overclocked)

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...20&postcount=1

[Hornet331]

The power it provides is too low you say??

My girlfriend's laptop (core i3 330 with a HD5650) can play a LOT of games with mid to max settings (without AA of course) @ native res (15" 1366).

I can play on that piece of **** notebook games like, GRID, F1 2010, Starcraft II, Sims 3, CS: S, Oblivion, Supreme Commander, Left for dead 2, Far Cry 2, PES 2011, DIRT 2, COD (the new one), hell even CRYSIS it can play (although i have to lower the res to 1024 on that one)... and you say it doesn't have enough power??? All of this on med to max settings (without AA/AF of course (even if some of them i can even enable AA/AF, like CS: Source) all of this on the native res of the laptop)

So you you basically confirmed what I said, all the games are older then 2 years (beside SC2).

And the HD5650M is faster then a HD5550 and the res you play is less then what i wrote (1MP vs 1.2MP). You just said that with a faster dedicated card you can play games at decent quality.

[duploxxx]

So you you basically confirmed what I said, all the games are older then 2 years (beside SC2).

And the HD5650M is faster then a HD5550 and the res you play is less then what i wrote (1MP vs 1.2MP). You just said that with a faster dedicated card you can play games at decent quality.

All my laptops are full 1900*1200 so I can never play any game decent not even with any high-end mobile gpu.... he mentioned mid to max settings also, needed on a laptop with that screesize and most of the time bad LCS quality and gamma? your comments run circles around anything to convince yourself... fact remains that for at least the same gpu power on an intel OEM need to add a card which consumes an additional 10-20W and cost more , while this gpu combined with APU will perform even better...... or maybe it is the i330 with only low ghz and ddr3 800 with 2 dimms that is killing the performance of the games.

you cant compare these screen res just on MP since they have different screenformat which has more influence on gpu but then again you know all right......

A8-3850 (maybe with turbo or manually overclocked)

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...20&postcount=1

oh look new cpu naming schema..... now what did i say already a few times?

interesting stock GHZ? or is this turbo 2.0? or OC? let the guessing and news section copy/paste clones start

[Morais]

As far as I know, the only new architecture we'll see this year from BD will be on the desktop market, I do recall some early information posted back months ago regarding what you speak of, which according to the roadmap is scheduled for 2012.

I seriously do not understand where you got BD, Q2 2011, and mobile all in the one sentence

Thanks dude, I just thought for a sec the llano and BD would come to mobile at the same time, sadly they wont. But anyway llano might be an interesting choice if priced correctly, since SB will have absolute no competition in mobile at all.

[generics_user]

So you you basically confirmed what I said, all the games are older then 2 years (beside SC2).

And the HD5650M is faster then a HD5550 and the res you play is less then what i wrote (1MP vs 1.2MP). You just said that with a faster dedicated card you can play games at decent quality.

even the IGP in Llano is able to play modern games at decent speeds @1366x768 which is what most notebooks have

i played Crysis @1920x1200 on a 320SP HD3870 with medium details @30+FPS some years ago so i'm 100% sure that this APU is fast enoug for every game on the market minus 3-4 titles

most people don't care if its medium or high details (most of my friends play games on their notebooks with HD4530s or 4650s which are supposed to be slower than Llano and they don't complain about lack of fun)
average joe goes to a media market, buys one of the top 10 games, puts it into a computer and fires it up without even looking at graphics settings

and AMD targets this audience, cheap notebooks, fully featured, good battery life - they can fill every checkbox in the retail markets at attractive prices

[Lightman]

So you you basically confirmed what I said, all the games are older then 2 years (beside SC2).

And the HD5650M is faster then a HD5550 and the res you play is less then what i wrote (1MP vs 1.2MP). You just said that with a faster dedicated card you can play games at decent quality.

Sorry to be picky, but since when F1 2010 came 2 years ago??? November 2009 for L4D2 is not exactly 2 years ago either
Not to mention PES 2011 and COD:Black Ops (the new one as stated by Sesto).

Even John Carmack in one of his interviews stated that new APU's from AMD will be good enough to play Rage.

Well, I for one will welcome nice 15.6'' Laptop with A8 Llano for reasonable price.

[Hornet331]

and AMD targets this audience, cheap notebooks, fully featured, good battery life - they can fill every checkbox in the retail markets at attractive prices

Well depends on what you define as cheap... the last slides we have seen suggested that the top llano parts are in the 599$+ market.

Looking how much the C/E-series netbook go for basically the same price as the atom+ion books i have a feeling that llano books will go for nearly the same price as i3s+equivalvent dedicated gpu.

On a side note:
Because its quite interestening when you check the notebook market that the 15" zacate books are pitted against previouse generation i3s (350-380M) in the sub 399€ market if you goe above that you already see SB notebooks.

So yeah in the end it will interesting to see where llano will be positioned price wise and what the oem do. But i have the feeling they just will do as with zacate, price them a bit chepaer then similar intel books and cash in the price difference they save on not spending money on a dedicated gpu.

[spicypixel]

Well, if crossfire works with the dedicated laptop gpus too then you can get more bang for buck at the top end of the price range.

[informal]

Beauty of Llano is you get 60% better performance by using Llano+ discrete 5550 or 6550 or whatever comparable 400SP/320SP discrete card is called.With i3/i5 you have no CFX capability.

[Tomasis]

Beauty of Llano is you get 60% better performance by using Llano+ discrete 5550 or 6550 or whatever comparable 400SP/320SP discrete card is called.With i3/i5 you have no CFX capability.

it'd be cool run laptop with crossfire

[nn_step]

Not enough information has been provided to make any conclusion; other than the reviewer didn't do a good job.

[kuroikenshi]

Honestly, Llano is the one processor series I have been eagerly waiting for. Its potential for the notebook and SFF markets is just out of this world.

This thread however, should die. Simply because there is a massive amount of misinformation that will lead people in completely the wrong direction regarding Llano and future Fusion products.

I also agree with Mr. rodent here (or SKYMTL for the avid ones), I do not longer spend as much time researching info about upcoming F1 and BD tech, but its hard to believe some of the stuff that gets thrown around in this thread,

Members should refrain themselves before this thread gets moved to the "garbage" section by the mods.