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Thread: SSD Write Endurance 25nm Vs 34nm

  1. #2926
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anvil View Post
    What controller and NAND?
    Phison controller with some kind of Toshiba NAND.

    I'm almost 10 minutes in to the first loop and its only written 4GiB. Definitely not a suitable testing drive. I don't know what it would be suitable for... Its basically a Compact Flash card in a 2.5 inch form factor.

    The drive's chassis is maybe the most attractive I've seen, but this is the first SSD I've ever wished ill upon. J.Microns are better than this by a long way I think, and they're not very good.



    This... is sad. I wasn't expecting much, but this is unimaginably terrible.


    Shame on Patriot for ever thinking these drives were a good idea. And this is with the "good" Version 3FW.

    This is a Hall of Shame drive. It's going in the closet, never to be spoken of again.
    Last edited by Christopher; 12-08-2011 at 11:04 AM.

  2. #2927
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    Samsung 830 64GB Update, Day 3
    FW:CXM01B1Q

    GiB written:
    [B]27270.80/B]

    Avg MB/s
    107.83

    Per-day average:
    9090.27

    Last edited by Christopher; 12-08-2011 at 11:34 AM.

  3. #2928
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    @Christopher
    Looks like the patriot don't support ncq. There is no scaling from 4K to 4K16QD on both read and write.
    1: AMD FX-8150-Sabertooth 990FX-8GB Corsair XMS3-C300 256GB-Gainward GTX 570-HX-750
    2: Phenom II X6 1100T-Asus M4A89TD Pro/usb3-8GB Corsair Dominator-Gainward GTX 460SE/-X25-V 40GB-(Crucial m4 64GB /Intel X25-M G1 80GB/X25-E 64GB/Mtron 7025/Vertex 1 donated to endurance testing)
    3: Asus U31JG - X25-M G2 160GB

  4. #2929
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    Todays update:
    Kingston V+100
    283.3777 TiB
    1288 hours
    Avg speed 25.29 MiB/s
    AD still 1.
    168= 1 (SATA PHY Error Count)
    P/E?
    MD5 OK.
    Reallocated sectors : 00


    It has dropped out again. This is the 4th time the last week. There is someting wrong with this one. I'm home again tomorrow and I think I'll try an SE and see what happens.

    Intel X25-M G1 80GB
    108,5066 TiB
    19458hours
    Reallocated sectors : 00
    MWI=64 to 56
    MD5 =OK
    46.66 MiB/s on avg


    m4
    20.1124 TiB
    73 hours
    Avg speed 81.55 MiB/s.
    AD gone from 93 to 89.
    P/E 346.
    MD5 OK.
    Reallocated sectors : 00
    1: AMD FX-8150-Sabertooth 990FX-8GB Corsair XMS3-C300 256GB-Gainward GTX 570-HX-750
    2: Phenom II X6 1100T-Asus M4A89TD Pro/usb3-8GB Corsair Dominator-Gainward GTX 460SE/-X25-V 40GB-(Crucial m4 64GB /Intel X25-M G1 80GB/X25-E 64GB/Mtron 7025/Vertex 1 donated to endurance testing)
    3: Asus U31JG - X25-M G2 160GB

  5. #2930
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.A.T View Post
    @Christopher
    Looks like the patriot don't support ncq. There is no scaling from 4K to 4K16QD on both read and write.
    It's the worst. drive. ever.

    Not supporting NCQ is the least of it's problems. I've used it a little more, and it's actually worse than the numbers suggest.

    My mind is blown.

  6. #2931
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    Still trying to access the M225 since the "Write Error 0" crash and drop out a couple hours ago.
    Nothing I have tried in the to get it back has worked this time.
    I'll keep trying!
    Home PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #1
    GA-P67A-UD4-B3 BIOS F8 mod, 2600k (L051B138) @ 4.5 GHz, 1.260v full load, Corsair H70 (Boots into Windows @ 5.6 GHz per Massman binning)
    Samsung Green 2x4GB @2133 C10, Gigabyte 7950 @1200/1250, Vertex 4 128GB, 4x3TB WD Red RAID10, BR Burner, Win7 Ult x64, CM690, HX750

    Work PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #2 ... Crucial M225 64GB SSD Donated to Endurance Testing (Died at 968 TB of writes...no that is not a typo!)
    GA-EP45T-UD3LR BIOS F10 modded, Q6600 G0 VID 1.212 (L731B536), 3.6 GHz 9x400 @ 1.312v full load, Zerotherm Zen FZ120
    OCZ 2x2GB DDR3-1600MHz C7, Sapphire 7870 @1100/1275, Crucial MX100 128GB, 2x500GB Hitachi RAID1, Win7 Ent x64, Centurion 590, XFX PRO650W

    Music System
    SB Server->SB Touch w/Android Tablet as a remote->S/PDIF->Denon AVR-X3300W->JBL Studio Series Floorstanding Speakers


  7. #2932
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestang View Post
    Still trying to access the M225 since the "Write Error 0" crash and drop out a couple hours ago.
    Nothing I have tried in the to get it back has worked this time.
    I'll keep trying!
    Try the D-flash!
    (of course, you might want to take a screen shot of CrystalDiskInfo before you do.... you won't see that near-PB of writes on in SMART, so documentation is key).

  8. #2933
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    Last CrystalDiskInfo screenshot is from yesterday afternoon. I'd really hate to lose the SMART data by D-flashing. System does recognize it as YADAPONG whatever with the jumper on though. As a last resort I'll try D-flashing tomorrow maybe...MF'er!
    Home PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #1
    GA-P67A-UD4-B3 BIOS F8 mod, 2600k (L051B138) @ 4.5 GHz, 1.260v full load, Corsair H70 (Boots into Windows @ 5.6 GHz per Massman binning)
    Samsung Green 2x4GB @2133 C10, Gigabyte 7950 @1200/1250, Vertex 4 128GB, 4x3TB WD Red RAID10, BR Burner, Win7 Ult x64, CM690, HX750

    Work PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #2 ... Crucial M225 64GB SSD Donated to Endurance Testing (Died at 968 TB of writes...no that is not a typo!)
    GA-EP45T-UD3LR BIOS F10 modded, Q6600 G0 VID 1.212 (L731B536), 3.6 GHz 9x400 @ 1.312v full load, Zerotherm Zen FZ120
    OCZ 2x2GB DDR3-1600MHz C7, Sapphire 7870 @1100/1275, Crucial MX100 128GB, 2x500GB Hitachi RAID1, Win7 Ent x64, Centurion 590, XFX PRO650W

    Music System
    SB Server->SB Touch w/Android Tablet as a remote->S/PDIF->Denon AVR-X3300W->JBL Studio Series Floorstanding Speakers


  9. #2934
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestang View Post
    Last CrystalDiskInfo screenshot is from yesterday afternoon. I'd really hate to lose the SMART data by D-flashing. System does recognize it as YADAPONG whatever with the jumper on though. As a last resort I'll try D-flashing tomorrow maybe...MF'er!
    You tell that drive who's boss!

  10. #2935
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    It's the worst. drive. ever.

    Not supporting NCQ is the least of it's problems. I've used it a little more, and it's actually worse than the numbers suggest.

    My mind is blown.
    I have read about and have seen a U.S. national TV news story on similar drives coming out of PRC.
    No links I don't remember where I saw the news stories.
    They ran the gammet from cheap clones of name brands all the way to a USB thumb drive wired up inside an SSD case.
    Get home and find you have a 4GB SSD- well a thumb drive NAND inside anyway.
    Seems like more work than it would be worth to the scammers.

  11. #2936
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hopalong X View Post
    I have read about and have seen a U.S. national TV news story on similar drives coming out of PRC.
    No links I don't remember where I saw the news stories.
    They ran the gammet from cheap clones of name brands all the way to a USB thumb drive wired up inside an SSD case.
    Get home and find you have a 4GB SSD- well a thumb drive NAND inside anyway.
    Seems like more work than it would be worth to the scammers.
    I should point out that the product description didn't include the model... it had been de-labeled, and no mention of the controller was given in the product description. It was refurbished by Patriot, and all of their refurbished SSDs for sale have refurbished part numbers, like RF32SSD, where the RF stands for refurbished. It's a legit product, just not very fast. I was amazed that in 2009/2010 someone at Patriot thought that the Phison controller was going to be a good product.

    No, the Phison controller just sucks. It's really just a Compact Flash/SD-style controller adapted for use in SSDs. The PS-100 is actually assembled in America like other Patriot products. It has Toshiba NAND (maybe the 40nm stuff) and the chassis is fantastically beautiful. There's just not much going on in the controller area. But the controller and NAND are made in Japan and the drive still has some kind of warranty.


    Actually, I dated a girl for six months who had a really nice chassis too. She didn't did have much going on upstairs, either. She wasn't nearly as cheap as the refurbished Patriot though.
    Last edited by Christopher; 12-08-2011 at 02:00 PM.

  12. #2937
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    No, the Phison controller just sucks. It's really just a Compact Flash/SD-style controller adapted for use in SSDs. The PS-100 is actually assembled in America like other Patriot products. It has Toshiba NAND (maybe the 40nm stuff) and the chassis is fantastically beautiful. There's just not much going on in the controller area. But the controller and NAND are made in Japan and the drive still has some kind of warranty.


    Actually, I dated a girl for six months who had a really nice chassis too. She didn't did have much going on upstairs, either. She wasn't nearly as cheap as the refurbished Patriot though.
    No comment on the last sentence.
    Banishment would be xtreme.

    That suxs the SSD is legit but almost useless.

  13. #2938
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestang View Post
    Still trying to access the M225 since the "Write Error 0" crash and drop out a couple hours ago.
    Nothing I have tried in the to get it back has worked this time.
    I'll keep trying!
    So close to 1PB and you have to drag that M225 over the finishing line by its ears.....
    It's som typical....

    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    It's the worst. drive. ever.

    Not supporting NCQ is the least of it's problems. I've used it a little more, and it's actually worse than the numbers suggest.

    My mind is blown.
    Have you open it and taken a look under the hood?
    1: AMD FX-8150-Sabertooth 990FX-8GB Corsair XMS3-C300 256GB-Gainward GTX 570-HX-750
    2: Phenom II X6 1100T-Asus M4A89TD Pro/usb3-8GB Corsair Dominator-Gainward GTX 460SE/-X25-V 40GB-(Crucial m4 64GB /Intel X25-M G1 80GB/X25-E 64GB/Mtron 7025/Vertex 1 donated to endurance testing)
    3: Asus U31JG - X25-M G2 160GB

  14. #2939
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    Quote Originally Posted by B.A.T View Post
    Have you opened it and taken a look under the hood?
    I will. I'll post some pictures.

    I've seen the inside of one from a review (which also pointed out that it wasn't very good).


    I've voided the 30 day warranty.


    The details are hard to capture, but it's a nice looking chassis.


    Those are TH58NVG5D2ETA20 Toshiba chips, Phison PS3016-S3 controller, Hynix cache


    I assume it was originally built in Taiwan, then refurbished in Texas.






    EDIT.
    So I'm still confused and bewildered by the Phison controlled Patriot. I was wondering what performance would be like with SLC NAND. I imagine it would not be much better.

    So I've bought a brand-new 3M Imation S-Class 32GB Phison controlled SLC drive super cheap. I expect to be disappointed by that drive too, but at least it was cheap and has SLC. Maybe it will be a good contender for a new endurance drive (but I'm not getting my hopes up).

    Has anyone ever used an Imation S-Class 32GB? It's sure as hell no X25-E, but maybe it's better than the Phailzon 100 Patriot.

    I wanted something quirky and off the beaten path to test, and the Patriot let me down. How does any SSD have worse random performance than a Quantum Fireball HDD from 15 years ago? I couldn't complete a run of AS SSD on the Patriot, it would just hang on the random write section. Sequential speeds are decent, but if you encounter any kind of random access, watch out. I don't know if its just starved for cache or if the controller and firmware are just that bad.
    Last edited by Christopher; 12-09-2011 at 02:01 AM.

  15. #2940
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    Kingston SSDNow 40GB (X25-V)

    539.08TB Host writes
    Reallocated sectors : 05 14
    Available Reserved Space : E8 99
    POH 4890
    MD5 OK

    34.40MiB/s on avg (~25 hours)

    --

    Corsair Force 3 120GB

    01 79/50 (Raw read error rate)
    05 2 (Retired Block count)
    B1 46 (Wear range delta)
    E6 100 (Life curve status)
    E7 10 (SSD Life left)
    E9 506372 (Raw writes) ->495TiB
    F1 673981 (Host writes) ->658TiB

    MD5 OK

    106.47MiB/s on avg (~145 hours)

    power on hours : 1925

    WRD decreased by 1 from 47 to 46.
    -
    Hardware:

  16. #2941
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    ^ Well, hopefully the Force 3 can break 1PB
    Home PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #1
    GA-P67A-UD4-B3 BIOS F8 mod, 2600k (L051B138) @ 4.5 GHz, 1.260v full load, Corsair H70 (Boots into Windows @ 5.6 GHz per Massman binning)
    Samsung Green 2x4GB @2133 C10, Gigabyte 7950 @1200/1250, Vertex 4 128GB, 4x3TB WD Red RAID10, BR Burner, Win7 Ult x64, CM690, HX750

    Work PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #2 ... Crucial M225 64GB SSD Donated to Endurance Testing (Died at 968 TB of writes...no that is not a typo!)
    GA-EP45T-UD3LR BIOS F10 modded, Q6600 G0 VID 1.212 (L731B536), 3.6 GHz 9x400 @ 1.312v full load, Zerotherm Zen FZ120
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    SB Server->SB Touch w/Android Tablet as a remote->S/PDIF->Denon AVR-X3300W->JBL Studio Series Floorstanding Speakers


  17. #2942
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    The Force 3 needs to go 2PB vs the other (60-64GB) drives, it's got RAISE and so it will be interesting when things start to develop.
    -
    Hardware:

  18. #2943
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    Well, I tried D-flashing the M225 w/o success ....

    Drive is accessible in "factory mode" so I thought I would give it a shot. First, I ran the NAND cleaner by OCZ for my chips and it definitely saw all those bad blocks. Then I attempt to D-flash and it didn't like that at all -- "High Erase Failure" came up a few times along with "corrupt" and "scan list not found" (don't quote me on that one). Finally ended with see good.bin and bad.bin

    I think SSD makers need to have/use separate flash to store they're FW and other such pertinent drive info on. This way when someone writes 968TB to a drive they can still flash since it won't be stored on the regular drive NAND and then be able access it.

    I'm out of ideas

    Edit: I'm taking the next half of the day off of work...I'm too depressed!
    Last edited by bluestang; 12-09-2011 at 12:18 PM. Reason: spelling errors from being distraught
    Home PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #1
    GA-P67A-UD4-B3 BIOS F8 mod, 2600k (L051B138) @ 4.5 GHz, 1.260v full load, Corsair H70 (Boots into Windows @ 5.6 GHz per Massman binning)
    Samsung Green 2x4GB @2133 C10, Gigabyte 7950 @1200/1250, Vertex 4 128GB, 4x3TB WD Red RAID10, BR Burner, Win7 Ult x64, CM690, HX750

    Work PC -- 24/7 Cruncher #2 ... Crucial M225 64GB SSD Donated to Endurance Testing (Died at 968 TB of writes...no that is not a typo!)
    GA-EP45T-UD3LR BIOS F10 modded, Q6600 G0 VID 1.212 (L731B536), 3.6 GHz 9x400 @ 1.312v full load, Zerotherm Zen FZ120
    OCZ 2x2GB DDR3-1600MHz C7, Sapphire 7870 @1100/1275, Crucial MX100 128GB, 2x500GB Hitachi RAID1, Win7 Ent x64, Centurion 590, XFX PRO650W

    Music System
    SB Server->SB Touch w/Android Tablet as a remote->S/PDIF->Denon AVR-X3300W->JBL Studio Series Floorstanding Speakers


  19. #2944
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestang View Post
    Edit: I'm taking the rest half of the day of of work...I'm too depressed!
    Boss: what happened? why aren't you at work?
    bluestang: I am mourning the death of my beloved M225...
    Boss: Get back here!
    bluestang: I thought you cared...<tears>

    I am working from home today to celebrate 968TB of writes by the M225...

  20. #2945
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    Sad to see the M225 die like this. Maybe there is another way ? Any news on the 470 that someone here tried to read the NAND directly, One_Hertz ?

  21. #2946
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    I just assumed that the M225 would kinda last forever. And now it's gone.

    Sadness.

  22. #2947
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    Samsung 830 64GB Update, Day 4
    FW:CXM01B1Q

    GiB written:
    36318.15

    Avg MB/s
    107.64

    Per-day average:
    9106.05

    96 hours



    The average per day is a little higher. I have an alarm that goes off at 14:27 every day so I can take screenshots. Figuring an exact daily average is going to get much more difficult.

    Having good SMART data is essential, and it's the worst aspect of the 830. Why would they not provide decent SMART data? Why?
    Last edited by Christopher; 12-09-2011 at 02:16 PM.

  23. #2948
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluestang View Post
    Well, I tried D-flashing the M225 w/o success ....
    ...
    I'm out of ideas

    Edit: I'm taking the next half of the day off of work...I'm too depressed!
    What a shame, it did put up a good fight though!

    Let's see on Monday before we close the case.

    Quote Originally Posted by Christopher View Post
    [B][I]
    ...
    Having good SMART data is essential, and it's the worst aspect of the 830. Why would they not provide decent SMART data? Why?
    The 830 is a lot better than the 470, there were movements to other attributes on my drives, not just F1.
    (I don't think I found what they represented)
    -
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  24. #2949
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    Umm... the Samsung's had some major movement... maybe?
    Reallocated sectors went from 0 to 4096



    Unless CDI is wrong about those being reallocated sectors, or it only increments in values of 4096.

    I tend to think of that as a big deal for a 4 day old drive, but it's possible that it's normal. Maybe that's the equivalent of 1 reallocation with the Mushkin or something.

    Maybe it's nothing to worry about.

    EDIT

    Okay, its not a big deal (probably). I had been taking smart data pics with CDI because all ofthe attributes were unnamed with SSDlife. I installed the installer version instead of the portable and attributes are all there. peep it.
    Last edited by Christopher; 12-09-2011 at 06:43 PM.

  25. #2950
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    Todays update:
    Kingston V+100
    Still disconnected. I was home today way to late to start with SE and taking a look at it. I'll do this tomorrow.

    Intel X25-M G1 80GB
    112,7744 TiB
    19487 hours
    Reallocated sectors : 00
    MWI=56 to 45
    MD5 =OK
    44.70 MiB/s on avg


    m4
    28.4050 TiB
    102 hours
    Avg speed 81.38 MiB/s.
    AD gone from 89 to 85.
    P/E 490.
    MD5 OK.
    Reallocated sectors : 00


    @Bluestang
    Sorry about the M225.... It put up a hell of a fight..
    1: AMD FX-8150-Sabertooth 990FX-8GB Corsair XMS3-C300 256GB-Gainward GTX 570-HX-750
    2: Phenom II X6 1100T-Asus M4A89TD Pro/usb3-8GB Corsair Dominator-Gainward GTX 460SE/-X25-V 40GB-(Crucial m4 64GB /Intel X25-M G1 80GB/X25-E 64GB/Mtron 7025/Vertex 1 donated to endurance testing)
    3: Asus U31JG - X25-M G2 160GB

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