Main Rig: Phenom II X6 1055T 95W @3562 (285x12.5) MHz, Corsair XMS2 DDR2 (2x2GB), Gigabyte HD7970 OC (1000 MHz) 3GB, ASUS M3A78-EM,
Corsair F60 60 GB SSD + various HDDs, Corsair HX650 (3.3V/20A, 5V/20A, 12V/54A), Antec P180 Mini
Notebook: HP ProBook 6465b w/ A6-3410MX and 8GB DDR3 1600
I suspect if you're into video editing, then OpenCL is a big thing. With Apple especially pushing it, I suspect art packages will succumb to openCL too (Adobe no doubt will be, as can be seen with Flash now happily GPU integrated).
It's not what currently uses it, it's what will start to use it.
Athlon II X4 620 2.6Ghz @1.1125v | Foxconn A7DA-S (790GX) | 2x2GB OCZ Platinum DDR2 1066
| Gigabyte HD4770 | Seagate 7200.12 3x1TB | Samsung F4 HD204UI 2x2TB | LG H10N | OCZ StealthXStream 500w| Coolermaster Hyper 212+ | Compaq MV740 17"
Stock HSF: 18°C idle / 37°C load (15°C ambient)
Hyper 212+: 16°C idle / 29°C load (15°C ambient)
Why AMD Radeon rumors/leaks "are not always accurate"
Reality check
This is starting to remind me of the old x64 and multi-core arguments... "there's nothing that utilizes it, so why are they doing it?" arguments were all over the place, but now who runs a single-core computer? who runs 32 bit OS's (other than benching and people with old computers)? Software developers develop for the hardware (generally speaking)... It probably won't be a big difference to start off, but look at how AMD pioneered 64 bit and multi-core back in the day.
Desktop (and Cruncher #1):AMD Phenom II x6 1090T @ 4.03Ghz | Gigabyte MA790FXT-UD5P (F8n) | G.Skill Ripjaws 2x4GB @ 9-9-9-24-1T 1680MHz | Radeon HD 5850 & 5830 | Silverstone ST75F 750W | 60GB OCZ Vertex 2 3x1TB WD RE3 (Raid 5) | Lian Li PC-A70B
Cruncher (#2): Intel Core I7 920 (stock) | EVGA X58 SLI | G.Skill Pi 3x2GB | 2x Radeon HD 6870 | Corsair HX850 | Some Janky HDD | LanCool PC-K7
Cruncher (#3): Intel Core I7 2600k (stock) | BioStar TH67+ | G.Skill Ripjaws 2x4GB | Antec Basiq550 | Some Janky HDD | Antec 300
Server: Intel Atom | 2x2GB DDR3 | ThermalRight TR2-430 | Some Less Janky Laptop HDD | Fractal Core-1000
Mobile: Lenovo X120e
*from the perspective of a chess nerd*
if you want to get technical chess needs a lot of compute power. there are 10^120 possible games after 80 moves. checkers has been solved by computers but chess will likely never be solved and as of now has only been solved for 6 pieces on the board.
modern chess engines calculate around 15-20 moves ahead for most positions in less than 30 seconds and see almost every tactic which has really changed the game for humans. it's quite complicated to explain why but you can take my word for it. it has revolutionized the chess world in the last 10 years.
^i suck at chess on the PC, rock at it in person.
its touch to read the mind of a machine running at a few jiggahz
2500k @ 4900mhz - Asus Maxiums IV Gene Z - Swiftech Apogee LP
GTX 680 @ +170 (1267mhz) / +300 (3305mhz) - EK 680 FC EN/Acteal
Swiftech MCR320 Drive @ 1300rpms - 3x GT 1850s @ 1150rpms
XS Build Log for: My Latest Custom Case
^i suck at chess on the PC, rock at it in person.
its touch to read the mind of a machine running at a few jiggahz
2500k @ 4900mhz - Asus Maxiums IV Gene Z - Swiftech Apogee LP
GTX 680 @ +170 (1267mhz) / +300 (3305mhz) - EK 680 FC EN/Acteal
Swiftech MCR320 Drive @ 1300rpms - 3x GT 1850s @ 1150rpms
XS Build Log for: My Latest Custom Case
Competition ranking;
2005; Netbyte, Karise/Denmark #1 @ PiFast
2008; AOCM II, Minfeld/Germany #2 @ 01SE/AM3/8M (w. Oliver)
2009; AMD-OC, Viborg/Denmark #2 @ max freq Gigabyte TweaKING, Paris/France #4 @ 32M/01SE (w. Vanovich)
2010: Gigabyte P55, Hamburg/Germany #6 @ wprime 1024/SPI 1M (w. THC) AOCM III, Minfeld/Germany #6 @ 01SE/AM3/1M/8M (w. NeoForce)
Spectating;
2010; GOOC 2010 Many thanks to Gigabyte!
I build allot of home systems for customers. So think of it this way. Two systems. They have the same hard drive, the same RAM, one is using Intel CPU, chipset and GPU the other using AMD CPU chipset and GPU, both using windows 7 FRESHLY installed with the same updates and other programs installed. It has been my experience that in these situations the Intel system responds faster and smoother in general in the OS and in say IE or Chrome responsiveness. (of course the speed at which the page is loaded is almost 100% dependent on the ISP coverage)
you know I do have to hand it to AMD for really pushing it but I think it will be at-least one more generation before it is commonly adopted. but i guess someone needs to push or it will never happen... I just think they focused far to much on it compared to trying to close the CPU gap. As for UI or video acceleration. the new Intel integrated GPU's is more than enough...
I do a fair amount of video editing using lots of Adobe based product and a few others and to be honest they have been saying they will make use of GPGPU for years now and even now it is nothing to write home about. and the big thing is 90% of what I have seen is currently or is being transfered over to CUDA. some of these programs do not recommend using AMD cards because of the heavy CUDA and Nvidia influences that they are starting to incorporate.
good on AMD for pushing GPGPU out but I don't expect to see any reason to switch to them this generation as most apps won't be optimized for it yet. I hope though I'm wrong.
CPU: Intel Core i7 3930K @ 4.5GHz
Mobo: Asus Rampage IV Extreme
RAM: 32GB (8x4GB) Patriot Viper EX @ 1866mhz
GPU: EVGA GTX Titan (1087Boost/6700Mem)
Physx: Evga GTX 560 2GB
Sound: Creative XFI Titanium
Case: Modded 700D
PSU: Corsair 1200AX (Fully Sleeved)
Storage: 2x120GB OCZ Vertex 3's in RAID 0 + WD 600GB V-Raptor + Seagate 1TB
Cooling: XSPC Raystorm, 2x MCP 655's, FrozenQ Warp Drive, EX360+MCR240+EX120 Rad's
Murray Walker: "And there are flames coming from the back of Prost's McLaren as he enters the Swimming Pool."
James Hunt: "Well, that should put them out then."
So you are saying you can tell that your browser loads pages faster on your 2600k at 4.5 than an X6 1100T at 4.4?
Browser responsiveness is dependent on HDD speed, latency and throughput. Maybe you are seeing the difference between two different HDD's or ICH10 vs SB850, in which we all already know ICH10 beats the out of.
The majority of people I know are still on P4 and A64...some have Core 2 Duo and only a few people I know have bought PC's in the last year have a stock 920 or similar.
Anyone looked at that video closely in 720p?
SPi finishes Loop 1 on Llano at 2m 00.493s @ 1.8-2.5 Ghz
SPi finishes Loop 1 on Sandy Bridge at 1m 26.287s @ 3.4-3.8 Ghz
...thats slower, but the Llano chip has a 45w TDP and only 4MB L2
Either one of two things are going on -
1. AMD has MUCH faster cache at 32M and or K10.5 cores respond much better without being starved of cache (1MB per core vs 512KB for Deneb/Thuban)
2. i7 is crippled by having 8 HyperPi vs 4 running at once, despite it bouncing off of 100% load every few seconds.
Last edited by BeepBeep2; 04-26-2011 at 12:48 PM.
Smile
placebo, when intel went away from their old FSB there was no difference at all between amd and intel in terms of resposiveness
in everyday usage i noticed no difference at all between my old Xeon W3520 @ 4ghz; the 1055t @ 4ghz and my current stop-gap i7 860 @ 2.8ghz
everything with 2 128gb raid 0 Ultradrive GX SSDs
(i got the 1055T for rendering so it was an upgrade from the W3520 )
i'm sure that my new i7 2600 is going to feel just the same in non-work related usage
Core i7 2600k|HD 6950|8GB RipJawsX|2x 128gb Samsung SSD 830 Raid0|Asus Sabertooth P67
Seasonic X-560|Corsair 650D|2x WD Red 3TB Raid1|WD Green 3TB|Asus Xonar Essence STX
Core i3 2100|HD 7770|8GB RipJawsX|128gb Samsung SSD 830|Asrock Z77 Pro4-M
Bequiet! E9 400W|Fractal Design Arc Mini|3x Hitachi 7k1000.C|Asus Xonar DX
Dell Latitude E6410|Core i7 620m|8gb DDR3|WXGA+ Screen|Nvidia Quadro NVS3100
256gb Samsung PB22-J|Intel Wireless 6300|Sierra Aircard MC8781|WD Scorpio Blue 1TB
Harman Kardon HK1200|Vienna Acoustics Brandnew|AKG K240 Monitor 600ohm|Sony CDP 228ESD
Youre probably right again ,about this generation.Thing is, pc`s and laptops are being used 3-5 years on average, so if its going to get pushed 2-3 years down the line, hardware must be here NOW.And i have to tell, that really most people doesnt need MUCH cpu power, they need ENOUGH, especially on laptops/netbooks.Same thing goes for GPU, its just that no integrated gfx up until Llano had something thats enough.Everytime i have to explain friends/family/clients WHY their brand new notebook with newest intel stuff "just aint enough" to play a game i get so frustrated over this.And they dont understand why they "have to" have discret gfx...
But it looks this combo is not going to be fast, but enough to do most stuff normal people do.
As for the GPGPU, i believe CUDA will go the way of the glide, theres really no place for it in the desktop segment.Its directcompute and opencl in the future.
As for the UI, i was talking about the future, not vista`s aero.
As for the smoothness, its kinda difficult.Im SURE that XP64 UI is damn much faster than 7`s .Especially when im using NET based software under 7, i literally can see the window be "drawn" .My friends tell me im not well tho :P .
Anyhow, there were tests made, that made clear that in some instances, human eye can "kind of" see up to 500FPS, in short bursts and not whole detail.
You forgt the 3rd option:
i7 has a additional handicap of running also the cfd simulation at the same time. (probably 8 threads).
About the "smoother" BS... honestly thats always so much bs... I have noticed no difference between any of my systems till the A64 days and thats mostly due to the fact that since that point I started using a raptor...
The only time when I'll start to see a more "smoother feeling" again, is when i switch to a SSD.
I don't think anyone is talking about endgaming Chess on Llano. Unless your last name is Karpov though I think even the slowest Llano will be more than a match for 99% of people. I hold the #13 position on Facebook chess worldwide [or I did.. I've been gone so long I'm not sure I show up globally anymore] and can attest that my old Core 2 Duo in my laptop is far better than I am (of course, the FB chess ranking system is very broken... I'm really not that good, just good enough to know how much better than me the computer is).
Last edited by Serra; 04-26-2011 at 04:58 PM.
Dual CCIE (Route\Switch and Security) at your disposal. Have a Cisco-related or other network question? My PM box is always open.
Xtreme Network:
- Cisco 3560X-24P PoE Switch
- Cisco ASA 5505 Firewall
- Cisco 4402 Wireless LAN Controller
- Cisco 3502i Access Point
I was never one to believe the "AMD is smoother stuff" ever since C2D I have always felt that Intel Systems have "seemed" faster. also I'm sure we both know that it's impossible to benchmark "smoothness"
thats an extreme comparison. of course a 4.4ghz 1100T system is going to seem as fast as anything because it is has a massive single threaded boost over stock. I was referring to consumer grade stuff as in like core i3/i5 stuff and lower end Phenom and Athlon quads... i'm not saying the difference is massive or anything and as many people have pointed out it might be placebo.... totally possible but I also notice a small diff between my 2600k at stock and OCed to 5GHZ... the differene however is MASSIVE on say something like a netbook compared to say even a normal laptop (CPU usage over 70% opening IE or anything) you might be right about the chipset difference as well though. put it's part of the whole AMD vs Intel package...
you might be right but I'm talking mostly on lower end and lower clock speed CPU's
for most of the customers I deal with I will always recommend a faster CPU over a faster GPU every day of the week as they are far more likely to boot up movie maker or photoshop then WoW or any other game for that matter. for any one with ANY inkling of gaming usage I ALWAYS recommend a dedicated GPU. this may change with Lano but the trouble is that most more casual games that people may play on a laptop are going to be more CPU bound as far a simulation time is concerned. For example, two of the most popular games for PC right now, WoW and Starcraft 2 are both fairly CPU bound. in which case the Lano GPU might cut it for say meduim/high settings in StarCraft 2 but once a ton of units get going the CPU will die. In which case they are better off spending the extra $100 to get an i7 lappy with a dedicated GPU. I will agree however in saying that for gaming all of the Intel IGP's are total trash...
I do 100% agree that opencl is the future but I see that future as being much farther off then you may think. while it is a "better" solution than CUDA it is newer to market and has a much smaller current dev base than CUDA. also I have heard it is harder to create an OpenCL app compared to a CUDA one. I think more and more people will develop for CUDA and in a few years decide to switch to OpenCL. Software moves pretty slow. Look how long 64bit OSes and 64bit CPU's have been around for, yet still 90% of apps don't natively support 64bit operations...
CPU: Intel Core i7 3930K @ 4.5GHz
Mobo: Asus Rampage IV Extreme
RAM: 32GB (8x4GB) Patriot Viper EX @ 1866mhz
GPU: EVGA GTX Titan (1087Boost/6700Mem)
Physx: Evga GTX 560 2GB
Sound: Creative XFI Titanium
Case: Modded 700D
PSU: Corsair 1200AX (Fully Sleeved)
Storage: 2x120GB OCZ Vertex 3's in RAID 0 + WD 600GB V-Raptor + Seagate 1TB
Cooling: XSPC Raystorm, 2x MCP 655's, FrozenQ Warp Drive, EX360+MCR240+EX120 Rad's
My Rig :
Core i5 4570S - ASUS Z87I-DELUXE - 16GB Mushkin Blackline DDR3-2400 - 256GB Plextor M5 Pro Xtreme
Well, there are two things you should consider.
Unfortunately, many if not most people, go to somekind of market and get a laptop by themselves or by the recommendation of the clerk (which does not care...) and they end up most often than not with a crap one,IGP one.
And second ,laptops with decent specs plus a intel cpu and a discreet gpu cost sizably more.I know that for USA and western europe thats not a BIG problem.However for the rest of the world, its more often than not hard to justify added cost.
Frankly, i dont get why intel lagged in gfx department so long, they have so much resources to throw at this obvious flaw, sandybridge is a big step up, however its still not enough.
As for the SCII and WOW, well i just dont agree that 4 core improved athlon X4 is too slow to be enough for these games, its not like were talking max details and constant 60fps here.But enough ;-) .
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