Official support or not, nVidia's part is going to be 64-bit and use an ARM instruction set.
Official support or not, nVidia's part is going to be 64-bit and use an ARM instruction set.
Particle's First Rule of Online Technical Discussion:
As a thread about any computer related subject has its length approach infinity, the likelihood and inevitability of a poorly constructed AMD vs. Intel fight also exponentially increases.
Rule 1A:
Likewise, the frequency of a car pseudoanalogy to explain a technical concept increases with thread length. This will make many people chuckle, as computer people are rarely knowledgeable about vehicular mechanics.
Rule 2:
When confronted with a post that is contrary to what a poster likes, believes, or most often wants to be correct, the poster will pick out only minor details that are largely irrelevant in an attempt to shut out the conflicting idea. The core of the post will be left alone since it isn't easy to contradict what the person is actually saying.
Rule 2A:
When a poster cannot properly refute a post they do not like (as described above), the poster will most likely invent fictitious counter-points and/or begin to attack the other's credibility in feeble ways that are dramatic but irrelevant. Do not underestimate this tactic, as in the online world this will sway many observers. Do not forget: Correctness is decided only by what is said last, the most loudly, or with greatest repetition.
Rule 3:
When it comes to computer news, 70% of Internet rumors are outright fabricated, 20% are inaccurate enough to simply be discarded, and about 10% are based in reality. Grains of salt--become familiar with them.
Remember: When debating online, everyone else is ALWAYS wrong if they do not agree with you!
Random Tip o' the Whatever
You just can't win. If your product offers feature A instead of B, people will moan how A is stupid and it didn't offer B. If your product offers B instead of A, they'll likewise complain and rant about how anyone's retarded cousin could figure out A is what the market wants.
Eagle A-15 should be 64bit compliant (memoryspace wise). But nVidia is developing their own core logic instead of licensing ARM's stock config- kinda the case of Snapdragon and their scorpion cores.
It can go both ways though- Tegra2 had more custom logic than OMAP4, but after a small driver update and clock boost the OMAP4 more than kept up in both CPU and GPU power. Sometimes it's actually not worth it as ARM's own implementation is quite decent.
You are confusing AMD with Global Foundries. And no. I can't recall AMD or GF published a faked die shot claiming it was something else. GF published a die shot showing they were on track with 32nm. They did however mask it using not to reveal details AMD didn't want to reveal.
Nope. The die shot you are thinking of was a real die shot masked a bit since AMD didn't want to make it official yet. GF would be in deep if they published real die shots without AMDs aproval. And it was never a secret that the die shot was altered, it was official. See the difference?
GF publishing a real dieshot of 32nm altered to conceal information and is open about it is not the same thing as nVidia faking a die shot.
there are several things i noted. several parts clearly look like a cut and paste of gf100. i would do a crappy job with paint to show you this but i dont have the time. secondly, the diffraction looks very strange and unnatural. look at any die shot and you will see clear transitions from color to color. also the caches look synthesized which is highly unlikely.
if it's fake or not who cares. it's not like being fake means project Denver is not coming out eventually. To be honest should be exciting for most people especially with Windows 8 shipping with an ARM build... this could "revolutionize" the PC market if done well. or could fall flat. I would peg it at 50/50 chance of either happening haha.
it is almost hard to imagine what a modern PC would look like though without x86....
CPU: Intel Core i7 3930K @ 4.5GHz
Mobo: Asus Rampage IV Extreme
RAM: 32GB (8x4GB) Patriot Viper EX @ 1866mhz
GPU: EVGA GTX Titan (1087Boost/6700Mem)
Physx: Evga GTX 560 2GB
Sound: Creative XFI Titanium
Case: Modded 700D
PSU: Corsair 1200AX (Fully Sleeved)
Storage: 2x120GB OCZ Vertex 3's in RAID 0 + WD 600GB V-Raptor + Seagate 1TB
Cooling: XSPC Raystorm, 2x MCP 655's, FrozenQ Warp Drive, EX360+MCR240+EX120 Rad's
It's been proven to be fake, in any case. See: first page.
E7200 @ 3.4 ; 7870 GHz 2 GB
Intel's atom is a terrible chip.
Charlie has sunk his teeth into this:
http://semiaccurate.com/2011/03/11/n...dscrew-moment/
Even references this thread.... pat on the head to DarthShader
One hundred years from now It won't matter
What kind of car I drove What kind of house I lived in
How much money I had in the bank Nor what my cloths looked like.... But The world may be a little better Because, I was important In the life of a child.
-- from "Within My Power" by Forest Witcraft
Nope. It STILL runs ARMv7.
And you'll probably be waiting a long, long time before ARM licenses anything nVidia's making.
In fact, if ARM finds nVidia to actually invade their turf, they'll just stop any future licensing. But I suppose Denver is probably more standard design than what nVidia is touting; unlike TI they're not even one of the premier licensees.
I don't understand how a company as large as nVidia can release such poor marketing materials.
Originally Posted by MoviemanMain Rig: Phenom II 550 (x4) @3.9Ghz - Gigabyte 6950@6970 - Asus M4A-785D M Pro - Samsung HDs 2x2TB,1x1.5TB,2x1TB - Season X-650 | OpenCL mining rigs: 2x Phenom II 555(x4) - 1xMSI 890FXA-GD70 - 1xGB 990FXA-UD7 (SICK ) - 1xHD6990 - 1x6950@70 - 6x5850 - 2xCooler Master Silent Pro Gold 1kWOriginally Posted by Movieman
ure right about that. CPUcores are gonna be armv7.
I think theyre talking about the graphics or general ALUs part of the chip. Currently tegra T20s Geforce GPU is at best a Geforce6 derivative, even that is a little overstating.
Its difficult to process any general code on such an old fixed function gpu not even talking about double precision what is the industry asks for.
As we all know 64bits is double precision Floating Point Arithmetic. A feature on GPUs exclusive to GT200 and later GF1x0 GPUs and several ATIs.
The mentioning of 64bit is probably a hint that the future Tegra ALU part will support these gpgpu features.
Thus the Chip can calculate 64bits, albeit not on its CPU, lol.
What nvidia will definitely implement to the CPU is a Physical Adress Extension to allow more than 4gig of RAM (PAE-like).
Oh wait, wasn't it ARM that anounced this feature for the Cortex A15 already? So thats not even nvidas feat.
Dont expect too much from a Company that has not even half the workforce of the weakest competitor (AMD) and most of them in marketing, the others playing games most of the time.
- So there u have it. 64bit computing on Tegra Codenamed Denver!
RAM support and some double precision ALU, thats it.
Last edited by davidzo; 03-12-2011 at 09:57 AM.
While I can't speak to the degree to which the SEC would care about such matters, I think the important portion of the diagram is the layout of where things are. It was never said it was a die shot, just that this was the layout of the die, which it is. They aren't intending this to be a complete release of details . I think people are making far too much of this. As far as concerns the design of the processor, I'd wait awhile before making too many judgments.
Pretty sure they weren't necessarily trying to show it off as a real image, I really think that using this as a rallying cry against nvidia is a little excessive considering that this was an analyst day and nowhere does it say that its actually finished silicon or that the image isn't just a representation.
well, wouldn't showing a Block diagramm show exactly what they could tell us about the architecture now?
Showing a dieshot really is a bit misleading because that assumes that they actually have taped out the chip. Showing coloured blocks like AMD did with Bobcat is not in that Ballpark. Faking Dieshots is trying to deceive Investors about the actual Progress of the Product. In the History of Chips a lot of Designs have ben scrapped even before tapeout, aka in the planning stage, especially from graphics chip companies. Showing a Dieshot concludes that it is taped out and will not be scrapped. But before Tapeout the Product may even be canceled completely.
I wonder if this will have some legal consequences for nvidia. If i was an Investor, i would feel seriously deceived.
You are reading way too much into this, like most people.
This is a slide, there are no claims... its a mock-up just like the wood-screws card. In that, charlie is right... but in neither case nvidia made any claims regarding the product shown. It was more of a simple mock-up, Nvidia probably would be more tasteful if they actually had a disclaimer saying it is merely a mockup, but if they make no claims they aren't liable to anything.
sure its a representation. just like the woodscrews card was a representation.
but for what?
Its definitely not a representation for an Architecture. Taht would be much better shown with Diagrammes and even the Layout would be shown with blocks like in the bobcat sheets.
Its a representation for an actual chip, not for an Architecture. Its meant to give the impression they finished the Designstage already and are working on actual silicon. Thats what they suggest. Its not what they write, but they dont deny it either.
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