Mini-Box Cascade

[Gray Mole]

Well the wiring is done and the cascade is now automated

the Carel IR32 is an awful controller to figure out, but easy to program once you do, so it's ok. I was disappointed though, that the switches can't be reversed. It has a 3 pole setup, which is fine. You can just change to the normally closed pole to be normally open (sounds stupid doesn't it?) but the controller will only 'turn on' and not the other way around. When it reaches the temp, it switches to the normally open setting.

So that's all set, it's set to start stage 2 at -40, and for safety will shut down stage 2 at -30.

the thing runs at 350w at around -35 at the warmest, so if it 'falls over' at high load, it shuts down before it even hits the high pressure switch. I already tested that and it's good to see, so there's a double safety there.

It's pretty cool, you don't need to switch on the second stage or monitor it in case of a warmup on stage one. Just does it's own thing

Down side, stage one has a leak but it's the access valve, so no big deal. I've already pulled the gas, and will get that sorted out and recharged tonight/tomorrow.

Stage 2 is still perfect though no leaks and no issues, just -100 action

Turns out my father knows a guy who does industrial 'flashing' stuff out of 16 guage steel. I'm gonna talk to him tomorrow and see, but it may work out to an inexpensive panelling system. Just panels with 90 bent ends. Nothing fancy, but will look decent and be pretty strong. Easy to cut and mod too for fans, not being too thick.

Trying to stay away from wood. It's ok, just not what I like in a big heavy frame.

so will get pics of it pretty soon. not til the panels are there, though One switch and one controller, and if I can, one more display for the evap temp. Should get out to buy a PT1000 probe tomorrow, and if I can get panelled up she's ready to go!



Gray

[Gray Mole]

Well the leak is solved, but I still haven't gotten a probe for the 2nd stage display.

I blame Xmas, just too much to do.

Results are no different now after the regassing, didn't expect it to be.

So it's just the panels, and picking up a probe. Probably would have been done but the Xmas shopping is taking it's toll.

Probably most everywhere and everyone is closed right away so I doubt I'll be making a lot of progress on the last bit til the new year. Shame, was hoping to see it done.

As a cooler it's done but I mean seriously, no one wants a fugly Cascade

I'll just keep playing with it over the next week or so, then I can be sure about leakages or performance. Might even bring it into the house if my roomies will let me but they don't seem to have the same appreciation for this stuff. They're already making me pay for the power.

So it's on hold for a bit, unless I luck out and get to someone that's open this holiday season



Gray

[Gray Mole]

Bit of 'eye candy' for those in the cascade biz, whether a maker or a user I guess.

I moved the K probe to it's permanent location. I like to install it on the neck, up against the evap. It's not about skewing the results, those are posted and common knowledge.

I like it there because it stays there. Doesn't get mangled or bashed around. I've put probes on the side of the evap before and had them get bumped hard enough, usually when they're cold, to bust a wire or smash the sensor and it's a hag to change. I mean, if you have heatshrink and a sensor it's easy, but the guys who buy 'em don't normally have that, so I took to the 'backside install'.

The result is an artificial 'boost' really. The suction outlet of the evap is a great place to tune, since a sudden drop there is really visible and you can get it pretty accurate to load.

However, you get a better looking result. Something to ask about if you're buying one I guess, 'Where is the probe located' will tell you what the result is for sure.



Uh oh, how did it get sideways

So comparing this to my original result, where the probe is as close to the evap as I can get and still get the clip/mount together, about 10 degrees colder.

Probe at the evap, close to the face/load tester = -93 @ 350w / -107 @ 0w
Probe on the neck, up against the back of evap = -103 @ 350w / -116 @ 0w

So it's a question worth asking, not that you shouldn't buy one unless the probe is on the side, in fact I recommend not having it on the side when it's shipped out. The neck is a more secure location imho.

Just that the result when you use it may get you thinking 'Is my mount bad? Why is the evap temp so much lower than the CPU?' in cases where the motherboard is somewhat capable of giving an indication. Mobo's aren't a great way to measure much of anything, but at least if you have an informed position, you can make a better judgement on how well it's installed.

My 2 cents I guess. I'd rather someone knows what temps to expect.

beyond that, -120 is a bit out of the realm of the 2 stage cascade. R1150 can go that cold, but not so much if it's for higher loads unless you look into a 1 to 1.5hp compressor, and even then the mass flow is getting pretty light.

So if it says -120 there is a chance it's reading in a place that's more prone to do it, and that's at the back where it's as far from any heat load as possible. Not saying it's not possible, just that I don't see it as being that likely on a 3/4 to 1hp cascade.

Though even I didn't think it would be as much as 10 degrees.

[Buckeye]

Very interesting Gray. I have not mounted a probe in that location before and didn't know there would be a temp dif like that.

[Gray Mole]

Hey Buckeye

Yeah, I've always done and posted test results with the probe on the side so I get as close as I can to what's going on. Not really about better or worse temps but not knowing what's really there for sure can mess you up with other aspects of tuning. If it's shipped though, it's on the side. Never really thought much about it, but I guess that when it arrives there it might look a lot colder and if someone sees a big evap to chip temp difference, could mess with them and end up redoing the mount over and over

Comes into play a lot more when you're using a 'top down' evap setup. That is, if you have the captube entering at the top you'll get the top portion of the evap cold, and the bottom much warmer, as it's not actually got the capacity for the whole evap with high load.

Base entry (captube drilled so it's spitting onto the base) can be easier in a way, since once you're holding the load, you just 'are' and the whole evap maintains low temperatures.

So if it's top down, the lower you can read the more exact you can get the tuning, and ensure that it's holding the load, AND get the best actual cpu/load test plate temps. Sometimes a warmer evap (in that setup) can mean a colder cpu. So on those, I tune for a balance between best evap temp at the base (close as I can get) and best plate/cpu temp.

Measuring the temp at the neck in a top down evap can actually end up with a result that's much worse, since you're returning at a lower temp (being read) but it's not cooling as much at the base as it needs to.

Some of the 'torch testing' visual results made that really clear, better than explaining. Maybe sometime I'll actually post a pic of it, I just hate the idea of someone doing anything remotely dangerous just because they saw it posted here.

Sorta wish there was a 'pro builder only' section for experienced guys to share details and more in depth results, though some like to play it 'close to the chest' and don't share info as much. I like to, even if only one thing I do helps someone do a better job, it's worth posting it Just some stuff here, you end up worrying a bit about someone who's new doing something they're not really ready for.


Gray

[namegt]

How many hours does it hold the load?

[Gray Mole]

How many hours does it hold the load?

Lolz

Somewhere's around forever I would imagine

I've had it on for around 2-3 hours at most at a single run at 350w. I keep running the load tester on it to make sure it's not seeping out and it's kept holding, so I figure now it's pretty much ready to run on a CPU.

Xmas is slowing me down, but a lot of places are closed, so getting the panels done has been held up.

I have it tuned for around 375w before it 'falls off' so the 350w max should hold a load indefinitely. Haven't done a 24hr test on it, but I might just do that at some point. Not really needed but once I get to a point where I'm looking at throwing it in the Classy's, I probably will.

Cheers


Gray

[nigelke]

dude ^^

I wanna see more of this :p

[Gray Mole]

dude ^^

I wanna see more of this :p

I hope you're talking about the Cascade!

[nigelke]

I hope you're talking about the Cascade!

ehm yes I was

[Gray Mole]

Should have my panels by the end of the week if Xmas doesn't slow that down, and I'll post some 'final' pics

Everything is wired, but without panels it's still kinda ugly never meant to be an 'open' build. Not enough space to make her pretty like that.

Hard to wait though, I'm itching to see the final result! Cold is all well and good, but I'm hoping it's a nice finish.


Gray

[nigelke]

aah

Great ^^

[thebanik]

Aah!!! I can just wish this in my dreams, . Would have so liked a cascade which can hold load of 375W at close to -100C.

[Gray Mole]

I wanted to throw in this pic.

I finished the case off as it was sold to a guy that's pretty local, and it doesn't look bad ad all in the pic

Wood left over from some cabinet building. Makes it look like an old school stereo cabinet I think

Just thought I'd throw that in. Works out great to hold the board on the top while freezing it, since the screws are countersunk and the wood's safe to bench on

'Awww...baby's all growed up'

Gray

Edit: Not my gear though. I forgot/didn't have a chance to get pics before he took 'er away, and this is the only pic he has there. Done well from what I can see though

The HWbot thing (I'm so out of touch) says it's benching on a 990X and getting 5425mhz, and got 6960 on PCMark07.

Sure hope he doesn't mind my posting the HWBot link...

http://www.hwbot.org/submission/2235...90x_6960_marks

No idea of temps though. Nobody tells me anything

[Jort]

wonderfull work !!!

[Gray Mole]

Thanks Jort

And congrats on your cascade work too! SS stuff is awesome but there's something just amazing about a cascade when you finish it off. Now that both of my recent cascades are gone I feel like I need to make another one.

If I was having a hard day or just wanted to relax, I'd throw on the cascade just to watch it cool down. Kind of drowns out all the noise in my head or something.