This truck, that truck, which truck?!

[breathemetal]

Looking into getting a truck for my next car.

Im tired of cars, Im a truck guy.

4x4 + mud = bliss. Simple.

But I dont have the cash to go get me a massive lifted F250 or something badass like that. And honestly, the gas would murder my wallet.

So. Im looking into "mini" trucks like the Ranger, S10, Colorado. And no i will NOT buy foreign. Argue with me all you want over it, but i will not buy foreign now, nor will i ever, and save yourself the time and dont tell me that "X" brand is more american made than "Y" brand, idc. Okay? Good

In a nutshell:

1. Want a truck
2. Must be 4x4
3. Decent on gas (meaning, not a 12'' lifted behemoth, although, id prefer it if i could afford to drive it)
4. Will be my daily driver

Used, new, i really dont care so much. Dont worry about my price range, just throw me recomendations

[STEvil]

Go diesel if you want fuel mileage. There are no good fuel mileage 4x4 gas trucks, at all... unless you do something like take a Toyota/S10/Ranger and put a Buick 3800 series 2 into it.

Treat the diesel well though, otherwise you'll be into a lot of money to fix it.


Also, lifting doesnt hurt fuel economy if all the under parts were already exposed to the lower draft of air already. What really hurts is large tires and wrong gear ratios.

[zanzabar]

it really comes to what size u want, but for something recent i would go for a 6.0/6.4/6.7L 250 shortbed, they have the variable geometry turbo, u can get some extra power cheap and redo the torque curve with a banks programmer and they have a strong frame with good overall reliability (so long as u change the trans and diff fluids at 60-70k miles)

or for a mini truck u could go for a ranger fx-2 but they dont get vary good mileage, for the mini truck u really need to get a jap truck (like the frontier, they are made in the US) or build up your own as the chevys are mostly junk with no boxed frame and weak engines unless u can find one with a honda motor and the dodge ones are a joke for the sub 3/4ton then they are in 3rd place on the everything but the engine

[breathemetal]

Hmm, ill look at some f250 diesels then.
What years are good years to look for?

[Stoner133]

Stay away from the Fords with the cornbinder motors in them. If you want a diesel go with the Dodge, its got a Cummings motor. Far better then the International motors Ford uses. But beware of diesels in 4x4's the transmissions are the weak link with all that torque. Your premiss of good gas milage and 4x4's doesn't mix at all. Be warned of four wheeling in mud as well. It chews up bearings unless you do heavy maintance on them. We used to have a saying back in the 70's when I got started with four wheeling. "Those strange noises are $100 noises" today its $1000. Are other saying was "Give her hell don't be scared, they make replacement parts everyday"

[zanzabar]

Stay away from the Fords with the cornbinder motors in them. If you want a diesel go with the Dodge, its got a Cummings motor. Far better then the International motors Ford uses. But beware of diesels in 4x4's the transmissions are the weak link with all that torque. Your premiss of good gas milage and 4x4's doesn't mix at all. Be warned of four wheeling in mud as well. It chews up bearings unless you do heavy maintance on them. We used to have a saying back in the 70's when I got started with four wheeling. "Those strange noises are $100 noises" today its $1000. Are other saying was "Give her hell don't be scared, they make replacement parts everyday"

the ford diesels are fine, sure they are not as nice as the cummings but if u buy new u can get one in any super duty, but ether way its better than the duramax and u get a better suspension, frame, rearend/case, trany and cab with the ford over the dodge. so IMO if u dont want to build something up alot the ford is the best bet. for years i would go with go with something with the 6.4L so i think thats 07-10

and for the to much torque thats why u want the vg turbo and a programmer that way u can limit it when u dont need it.


i would look to go to a truck forum before deciding.

[Judaeus Apella]

I vote Toyota. Good truck brand, I've always loved Toyota Trucks. Any who, don't bother getting a truck without four wheel drive... its a complete waste of money.

I've heard that there's nothing as dependable as a pathfinder engine though... do any Nissan trucks have that engine in them? I know the Xterra does, thats why we got it. And they were right. We've had it 10 years and not a SINGLE problem, it really is a reliable engine. We had a small problem with some electronics, but that was fixed pretty easily and that was only recently. I think it was a good buy. I just wish the MPG and foot room was better.

[breathemetal]

Looks like I may be buying new. And i get huge GM discounts...might go with a Sierra or a Silverado

[Judaeus Apella]

Anyone heard anything about the Nissan 3.0 LV9X Engine V6 Turbodiesel?

[Stoner133]

Anyone heard anything about the Nissan 3.0 LV9X Engine V6 Turbodiesel?

Nope but if you can find one the Jeep Liberty with its diesel is one heck of a fourwheeler. But people that bought them don't seem to want to part with them.

[Stoner133]

the ford diesels are fine, sure they are not as nice as the cummings but if u buy new u can get one in any super duty, but ether way its better than the duramax and u get a better suspension, frame, rearend/case, trany and cab with the ford over the dodge. so IMO if u dont want to build something up alot the ford is the best bet. for years i would go with go with something with the 6.4L so i think thats 07-10

and for the to much torque thats why u want the vg turbo and a programmer that way u can limit it when u dont need it.


i would look to go to a truck forum before deciding.

Well for years Ford transfer cases were built by New Process Gear or Dana. GM used New Process Gear transfer cases. Dodge not only used New Process Gear transfer cases but Chrysler ownes New Process Gear. As for axles Ford's heavy duty rear axle was a corporate design not bad, but Dodge used Dana's which are far better. I believe they both still use Dana front axles. When it comes to transmissions GM's Allison holds up to the diesel torque

[Stoner133]

the ford diesels are fine, sure they are not as nice as the cummings but if u buy new u can get one in any super duty, but ether way its better than the duramax and u get a better suspension, frame, rearend/case, trany and cab with the ford over the dodge. so IMO if u dont want to build something up alot the ford is the best bet. for years i would go with go with something with the 6.4L so i think thats 07-10

and for the to much torque thats why u want the vg turbo and a programmer that way u can limit it when u dont need it.


i would look to go to a truck forum before deciding.

Well for years Ford transfer cases were built by New Process Gear or Dana. GM used New Process Gear transfer cases. Dodge not only used New Process Gear transfer cases but Chrysler ownes New Process Gear. As for axles Ford's heavy duty rear axle was a corporate design not bad, but Dodge used Dana's which are far better. I believe they both still use Dana front axles. When it comes to transmissions GM's Allison holds up to the diesel torque the best, Dodge used them as well for a while with the Cummings motor till GM wouldn't renew the contract with Dodge, now they build their own.

[Sparky]

I vote Toyota. Good truck brand, I've always loved Toyota Trucks. Any who, don't bother getting a truck without four wheel drive... its a complete waste of money.

1) he's looking at domestics only
2) I wouldn't call frames splitting in half a good truck

Just saying

[STEvil]

Its "Cummins" guys.. not cummings.

NP205 t-case are the way to go and a solid Dana 60 kicks the crap out of a corp any day, not that they're bad



Picked this up about a month ago.. 12v Cummins, 3 speed auto (manual dodge trannies cant handle the torque, makes for a lot of RPM's on the highway though), Dana 60 front, NP205 T-Case, Dana 70 rear. 600km on 80L of diesel last fill.. sure beats my '96 Chevy 2500 that did 450km/90L gas at best.

[TNTNightstalker]

It really depends if you are going to tow something! If you want to pull a trailer the best is cummins, if your are going to just drive and mud I personally would go with Ford. I know for a fact the fords ride better than a Dodge due the heavy duty suspension on the dodge ( for towing ) My ford F250 rides smoother than my mothers Dodge which is the matching model truck as the F250. But if I was going to tow something I would get the Dodge in a heartbeat.

[The_Beast]

I'd consider the toyota based on this video alone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVkedyQZfwQ

[STEvil]

I'd consider the toyota based on this video alone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVkedyQZfwQ

Then you should get out more.

edit - for mud there is no "best" truck really. Straight axles (trussed dana 44HD/60 preferred for 44" and under tires), lockers, and knowing not to push your transmission too hard are about all you can go with.. for a motor you want usually want something that can rev to keep the tires clean so you'll need up to 500hp+ for big tires..

[Judaeus Apella]

Yeah... they don't make Toyota trucks like that anymore. Wish they did though. Now everything has computer chips, and safety systems, and plastic... its not the same.

What really bothers me about trucks these days is how flimsy and weak the body paneling is. On my 95 Sonoma, the panels were thick metal. You had to lean on it really hard and put your back into it to make it so much as push in a little bit. Now... if I lean on any modern truck... I'm afraid I'll fall through it. Its pathetic. Trucks are supposed to be tough, and rugged, and durable... not flimsy and weak with thin skin. Its like a thin skinned Scandinavian quarterback who cries every time he gets a booboo. Its just wrong...

[zanzabar]

i like my 95 f150, with the twin ibeam and a good amount of loose travel, u cannot get that now and it has good gas in the AC so it gets cold as hell really fast

Well for years Ford transfer cases were built by New Process Gear or Dana. GM used New Process Gear transfer cases. Dodge not only used New Process Gear transfer cases but Chrysler ownes New Process Gear. As for axles Ford's heavy duty rear axle was a corporate design not bad, but Dodge used Dana's which are far better. I believe they both still use Dana front axles. When it comes to transmissions GM's Allison holds up to the diesel torque the best, Dodge used them as well for a while with the Cummings motor till GM wouldn't renew the contract with Dodge, now they build their own.

i thought that ford had the best rear end and transfer case, and the trany was the best on for for performance (not towing, but i dont know on that). also the banks thing is for when u have mudding or offroading when u get wheel slip that makes it so u wont blow out parts.

but i dont think that this the correct place to ask for this topic and get a definitive answer and im not an expert and have not been following the last few years

[ownage]

Treat the diesel well though, otherwise you'll be into a lot of money to fix it.

Isn't Diesel supposed to be more reliable? In general they are.

[breathemetal]

If someone says Toyota one more time, ill report you...lol. I dont want those POS foreign trucks.

[Stoner133]

i like my 95 f150, with the twin ibeam and a good amount of loose travel, u cannot get that now and it has good gas in the AC so it gets cold as hell really fast



i thought that ford had the best rear end and transfer case, and the trany was the best on for for performance (not towing, but i dont know on that). also the banks thing is for when u have mudding or offroading when u get wheel slip that makes it so u wont blow out parts.

but i dont think that this the correct place to ask for this topic and get a definitive answer and im not an expert and have not been following the last few years

The only good Ford rear axle was the 9" 31 spline axle. Dam good one there, no doubt about it. But was only used in the F-150 pickups. The 9" 28 slpine was used in the early Broncos and also was a darn good one. This is evidenced by the strong use of the axles in drag racing.

As for the Twin I Beam front ends, without major reworking they sucked. The loose travel killed them off-roading. We used to laugh at them while watching them try to hill climb. Stock units looked like the truck had a pair of basketballs being dribbled under the front. With major reconstruction to remove that looseness they didn't do bad.

As for Transmissions, My 78 Dodge has well over 178,000 miles on it. Sporting well over 750 hp in its 372 cu in small block with 14:1 compression, roller cam, W-2 heads with roller rockers being fed from a 1150 dominator. All going through the original OEM 727 Torqueflight with a 4500 stall converter. Connected to a New Process 205 transfer case running into a Dana 60 rear with Detroit Locker and 4:10 gears and a Dana 44 front with TrueTrack limited slip and 4:11 gears. That 727 tranny is now 32 years old and still going strong. I play in the sand with it, hill climbing and drag racing. The transfer case is also stil factory stock but didn't come on the truck. It came with the NP203 full time fourwheel drive unit that I replaced for the stronger 205.
The NP203 was used in all Ford, Dodge, GMC & Chevy trucks back then but was chain drive, where the NP205 was gear drive part time 4x4 transfercase.

[Stoner133]

I'd consider the toyota based on this video alone

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVkedyQZfwQ

Did you notice the cab and the box are from two different year trucks? I know it doesn't make much difference. Bet it wouldn't have survied if they had dropped the wrecking ball down on it.

[Stoner133]

If someone says Toyota one more time, ill report you...lol. I dont want those POS foreign trucks.

This person no doubt must work at the GM truck plant located in Flint at the intersection of I-75 & I-69. Glad to see it survied to make part of the New GM. I've never been in there but used to go to the old Buick City complex in Flint often till it was shut down. That place was amazing, back when GM actually built cars instead of just assembled them. You used to need a map to find your way around the what 12 different plants on the site. Place even had its own railroad to service it.

[Judaeus Apella]

T O Y O T A



Weeee!!! *runs around in circles, yelling Toyota over and over again*