[Skinnee Labs] The Pump thread...

[skinnee]

^ on the list and have one in the lab.

[Church]

I just want to find out two things - if MCP35X@100% is same as 3.2 or 3.25 performance wise with same top, and if king is dead, as in if there is any change in top tops currently consisting of EK/XSPC. After all, if swiftech's really manages to pull that off, it might mean that MCP35x with stock top can be used with no compromises in performance + without warranty loss because of dissassembling for top replacement to change to 3rd party one. It might help those wishing to get both performance and warranty.
P.S.
Have you thought of adding noise measurement to pump tests? One from claimed advantages of using 3rd party top is reduced noise vs stock top. Imho it's worth to proove or debunk that claim aswell.

[jumper2high]

Skinnee, how are the dual DP1200 tests coming along? Any chance of results being published soon?

[affiliate13]

Skinnee, how are the dual DP1200 tests coming along? Any chance of results being published soon?

I have been hoping to hear news on this too, but i didnt like to ask given the other gear there must be in for testing.
Any bits of news, when you are ready would be great Skinnee.

[skinnee]

not yet on the dual DP1200, working on the MCP35X with PWM in between radiator tests presently. The other bench is humming along as well.

[skinnee]

In between radiator runs I've been looking at the MCP35X and the DDC3.25's. I have two 35X's and two Koolance DDC3.25's, so I pitted them against each other to see if there were any differences in the PQ curves... and quite surprisingly, there is.

First, here is test of the primary Swiftech 35X and an EK, with 35X-2 I only did PWM @ 70-100% for now.


Yeah yeah, thats great and all, but how about compared to a DDC3.2?.


And what is this PQ difference you speak of between the 35X and the DDC3.25?


Interesting... the 35X's have a higher (better) curve in the typical system flow range, where the DDC3.25 has a steep overall curve and shows higher TDHP below 1 GPM.

As for the PWM control on the 35X's, I definitely see higher TDHP than what Swiftech did, so I have more testing to do there. Gigabyte EasyTune6 is helping me out with the PWM Control, here are the settings I used when running the different PWM %'s. Here is 50% PWM, 10% PWM, and 70-100% shown below.


Individual PQ will be available in the next couple days, I will also start getting test loop flow rate results soon.

[Church]

Wierd, i expected for 35x to perform similar to 3.25 with same tops. Something different in shape of impeller? :/
But anyway it seems that 35X is good pump choice even considering max performance and so is it's standalone top (noticed selling @ several LC shops) compared to EK/XSPC long time leaders.

Skinnee: btw, have you considered also adding to this test 3.1[0,5] pumps? As one of 35X's niches is silent pump aswell because of PWM, it might be interesting to see, at what PWM power % it performs similar to 3.1 and how noisy it is vs it at similar performance level ..

[Martinm210]

Interesting, I like the more rounded shape of the 35X..

[Biffa]

Hey great info as usual skinnee Thanks for that.

Quick q guy's would 2 x EK Supreme HF be more or less flow restriction than 1 x EK Supreme HF plus 2 x SLI blocks?

[Church]

Depends on what gpu blocks and if you connect them in serial or parallel of course. If you'd check eg. skinneelab's gtx480 FC thread, difference flow restriction wise between DangerDen's & EVGA(/Swiftech)'s was very big.

[Biffa]

Sorry, I meant in relation to the equipment in this thread.

[Mazlov]

Thanks for the data, skinnee. I know you don't test noise levels on these babies, but is there anything you can say on that? I'm looking to replace my MCP355 because it's too loud. I figured that an MCP350 would fit my needs well enough since I only have a two-block loop and two rads (240+120), but the 35X is appealing to my inner geek. Thing is, it's a bit expensive to just go ahead and buy it with the risk of being disappointed with the noise levels.

[Martinm210]

FYI, I was interested in trying some sort of pump testing specific to noise, but I havn't been successful in getting any samples from the manufacturers just yet. When I get back from vacation, I may check in with some vendors though. I'm tired of fans but would like to do some pump noise tinkering..

I just see noise as becoming one of the main reasons to continue watercooling myself..not an air cooler out there capable of 800rpm ultra high performance ultra silence, but water is an option. Also once you dial fan speeds way down..pump noise starts becoming a concern depending on mounting and the pump itself.

[Mazlov]

Idd. I have my S-Flex fans down to about 900rpm because making them spin faster did nothing for my temps. As a result, the noise of my pump is bothering me. It would be great if you could manage to do some serious testing on pumps; your work with fans is an absolute must-read.

[skinnee]

I'm deaf as a post, and cannot discern the noise differences of the D5 and DDC. So I am definitely not the best one to comment on pump noise, but I will say I didn't hear any noise difference when the pumps were running 100%. If you wanted to use PWM and throttle your MCP35X down some, noise would also be reduced.

[Holst]

Idd. I have my S-Flex fans down to about 900rpm because making them spin faster did nothing for my temps. As a result, the noise of my pump is bothering me. It would be great if you could manage to do some serious testing on pumps; your work with fans is an absolute must-read.

We should probably start a separate pump noise thread rather than "spam" up this one.

However...

In my experience pump noise can be dramatically reduced (or even removed) with the correct mounting.

The best method I have found to isolate the pump is to suspend it from string (using an old HDD cage) although in my latest build I have used cut up tube to isolate the pump which also works well.
Foam isnt very effective in my experience.

[Mazlov]

We should probably start a separate pump noise thread rather than "spam" up this one.

Should we? I totally agree that discussing tricks to bring down pump noise does not suit this thread, but I do feel that pump noise is an essential part of the total pump performance. As martin pointed out already, improving on noise might just become one of the main factors why people start watercooling nowadays.

[skinnee]

No need to start a new thread IMO. If the noise discussion gets on a roll I'll link the start in the OP.

[Brodholm]

FYI, I was interested in trying some sort of pump testing specific to noise, but I havn't been successful in getting any samples from the manufacturers just yet. When I get back from vacation, I may check in with some vendors though. I'm tired of fans but would like to do some pump noise tinkering..

I just see noise as becoming one of the main reasons to continue watercooling myself..not an air cooler out there capable of 800rpm ultra high performance ultra silence, but water is an option. Also once you dial fan speeds way down..pump noise starts becoming a concern depending on mounting and the pump itself.

Would love to see you test pump noise!

And great work Skinnee!

[Church]

Skinnee: can you please test also new switchable single/dual parallel/serial restops RP-402X2 / RP-452X2 by Koolance? I expect them feature/looks wise to become very popular. Imho no need to test older RP-450X2, as it's priced same but lacks few features of new ones.

[skinnee]

@churchy,

[GeorgeStorm]

So, what rate of flow is recommended as a minimum?

[skinnee]

A heavily debated topic with no exact answer, only opinions/personal preference.

In my own personal opinion, 0.60GPM (2.25LPM) is the absolute minimum I am willing to run for any loop. <runs to get flame suit>

[GeorgeStorm]

Ah ok, just you got me worried when I saw my EK DCP 4 right down at the bottom.
Am running cpu and motherboard blocks with a MCR320, was worried I should really upgrade. But it looks like it's good enough.
How big are the advantages with high flow rates? (in terms of temperature)

[Conumdrum]

Skinnelabs shows flowrate vs temps tests on pumps and other things.

Just take a look at skinnelabs.com.