tell me about: Canada

[Entity_Razer]

Ok so.. here's the thing,

I'm graduating this year (god that felt good saying that) from Uni, and all that "getting into the real world" stuff is about to happen.

Now currently I'm "unbound" in such a way that I have no girlfriend to keep into consideration and i'm considering of moving abroad (Canada is what I'm thinking at) and pretty much live there.

Reason for this is because recently I've seen an add for a Job Happening here in Belgium, in Brussel where there'll be massive amounts of Canadian businesses looking for skilled workers for pretty much all departments since apparently Canada is dealing with some pretty hefty age problems in their own country.

So, since I've always been fascinated with the country I'm strongly considering going to the job happening and seeing if I can't land myself a nice well payed job in the IT industry over in Canada.

So I'm looking for more info, from people who have experiences, opinions, with or about Canada and can help me make my final decision.


So, TL;Dr:

Looking for people to tell me more about their past experiences with Canada, what they know info wise about it,... anything that could help me make my own decision

As added info, I'm a 22 year old male (will be 23 when I graduate) fluent in English & semi ok with French (2nd language of Canada) and when I graduate I'll be a network engineer with a Uni diploma. MCSA/MCSE 70-290 & 70-291 Certified, LPIC level 1 and 2 Certified and Cisco CCNA Certified (hoping to advance the CISCO certification and the MCSA/MCSE certifications up to higher levels / newer tech like 2008 certification).

[Expat GriZ]

If memory serves..ER, I believe I live in your "hood" and being a Canuck can give you a pretty good idea of what you want to know. I'm right across the street from Patrick Fietsens on Pierstraat.

[Entity_Razer]

memory serves very right my friend, I'm from "Boom", which is like... 5 minutes drive :p so perhaps one of these days we'll go out for a drink and discuss this a bit

[One_Hertz]

After living here for 8 years, I would strongly recommend against Canada. If you must move to Canada, move to the West coast. Calgary is a nice city and so is Victoria.

[Serra]

Canada is a country with a lot of land and less people than the state of New York. As a result we tend to be heavily clumped, and in the networking industry you need a higher population density (generally)... so here's my breakdown based on larger cities:
- Don't live anywhere east of Quebec if you want a job
- Don't live in Quebec if you like to drive or speak English. They are also not known for being the most hospitable province in Canada, though old Quebec City and Montreal are certainly worth a visit when on vacation. To be fair to them though, Quebec does have one potentially attractive feature to you: they have their own immigration office that is separate from that of the rest of the country, and it is easier to get a green stamp from them... particularly if you do speak some French. Plus they do have two large cities.
- Ontario: Your primary targets here are Toronto or Ottawa. Toronto has jobs but a crazy high cost of living. Ottawa isn't a lot better, but it is bit better; most of the networking jobs you will find there are government jobs and tend to pay higher. There are also some "smaller" cities of a decent size in Ontario that you might luck out in.
- Manitoba: Write-off. Population is too low
- Saskatchewan: Maaaaaybe Regina. Maybe. Ultra low cost of housing, but not an economic powerhouse. As a side-story, only a very small slice of adults in Sask pay taxes (the rest being elderly or native) and thus the tax burden for everyone else is higher and things like roads are not as well kept. Overall the low cost of housing and lack of traffic do make it economically attractive, just be sure to save for tax season.
- Alberta: Major cities are Calgary (my home town) and Edmonton. Between the two cities there are NOCs from all the major players, and Calgary in particular does have a strong networking root. Things have been slowing down a bit there of late due to the lower price of oil, but that will improve as the price goes up. As this is where I am from and the networking industry is the one that I am in if you start strongly considering this direction shoot me a PM and we can discuss it further.
- British Columbia: You will be living and working in Vancouver if you want to go this route. Very high cost of living, only slightly better than average pay. Beautiful province but hard on people just starting out on their own.
- Areas north (Northwest Territories, Yukon, and Nunavut): Just avoid. There are some jobs up there, but it is way too cold up there to go unless you already have a position lined up.


Edit/Rant: Do keep in mind as well though that we are a younger country and it does show in a number of ways. For example, I now live in St. Louis as the result of a highly unethical business practice by AT&T that is illegal in the US and Europe - they paid our competition not to hire any of their employees until after 6 months after we leave, even if we leave on good terms like I did. Really they completely screwed us all over. What is even more fun is that neither I nor anyone else at my office was aware of this until after they had completed their deal with our competition. And while I am sure I could have won the lawsuit I strongly considered bringing against them for it, I didn't have the time or money to make that happen and so the policy still stands. On top of that it is additionally stupid that they were allowed to do this because excepting for the one office I was in, AT&T was not legally allowed to operate in Canada... so after they bought that floor that I worked on, my career options were suddenly limited to moving around that floor - I couldn't even transfer to AT&T US because they are separate business entities. It is sick, but this kind of thing can and does still happen in Canada. That's OK though, I ended up with a cooler job than I would have had otherwise, and after I do a few years down here I can always come back.

[masterg]

went up to tofino canada over the summer for a few days, loved the scenary, the people were nice and food was good id go back if i had a bigger harley that wouldnt overheat at the top of the mountain passes :p

but i must do a solid for family guy: Canada Sux xD

jk

[STEvil]

I vote Calgary.

Also if you do go through with it beat the crap out of Shaw and Telus for offering such poor service.. please. Thanks.

[Judaeus Apella]

All I know is, is that if you're an american and you move to canada... the nut jobs from fox news will hunt you down and kill you.

[LinusTech]

If I was picking up my life and moving somewhere I'd go to Montreal.

That said, I do love life in Vancouver, BC. It's a terrific city.

All of this is with no consideration for your career, so take it with a grain of salt.

[Vienna]

I agree with most of the posts here in terms of what destinations you should be looking at.

Personally I recommend Ottawa, Montreal, Calgary, and Vancouver.

[YukonTrooper]

Nunavut is probably your best bet.

[zsamz_]

i been to many places around the world and i wont trade it with montreal
its quality of life that counts for me
if you just want to make money it can be done in most countries

[moiraesfate]

I grew up in Alberta, Canada. I've only lived in the United States for a little over a year and a half (will be two years in April).

I'm not sure what to tell you exactly, can you be more specific in what you're curious about?

And personally, I loath Calgary and Edmonton.

I don't know why I don't like Calgary, but if you're in Alberta and you want a busy "this is it" type of place, you go to Calgary. Calgary always has all the stars play there and the like. Anything you want can be had in Calgary.

I can't stand Edmonton but mostly because whoever created the map for that city's layout was smoking pot. They had to be or the layout wouldn't be so bloody weird.

Personally, I'd suggest Lethbridge if you want to live in Alberta, mostly because I grew up there. But there's only about 80,000 people there so its a small city. I miss it horribly, tbh.

Alberta is the most Conservative out of all the Provinces. We are also the only province that has no debt at all but still provides top notch public education and public health care (keep in mind that no public plan covers eye, dental, and drugs. You'll either have to get that through your job or through Blue Cross Health by paying a monthly premium. Blue Cross is a private insurance company).

For the health care, let me put it this way, at that time it wasn't a "your health care is completely paid for" type of plan, it was a "pay monthly premiums to the gvt and get excellent health care" plan. I had been paying into the plan for years, and had a horrible car accident, but had been unable to pay for quite a while (you make $7.60 an hour and see how well you do trying to pay bills), so I owed about $1000 to AHCIP (Alberta Health Care Insurance Plan). I had a car accident and the gvt saved my butt by covering me completely and eliminating my debt. I wasn't able to work for a year and a half, and there was no question that they were going to help me survive.

Living in Canada, it is infinitely better for you if you should ever get hurt or sick, no matter what some crazy people in the United States want to think.

Alberta is alot farmland, quite a bit of tourism, and bits of logging/oil manufacturing (lots of oil rigs), and ranching.

Since Alberta is the most Conservative of the provinces, you'll probably feel the most comfortable there as an American.

Just a suggestion but DO NOT move to Ontario. Yes, it has Toronto whose size rivals that of New York, BUT Ontario is incredibly Liberal and most Americans tend not to like that. Also, you have never experienced snow until you have lived in Ontario. I don't know how they deal with it. The weather out east is simply horrendous. Whereas, Alberta is protected from the most extremes of the weather by the mountains on one side. Alberta has alot of what we call "brown Christmas's". It means that there is no snow for Christmas. Just be prepared for the Chinook wind. Its a wind that can howl like a banshee and occasionally make it hard to sleep if you're not used to it. It can hit hurricane force gusts though thats rare. Alberta is the migraine capital of Canada due to the Chinook wind.

You'd probably have problems if you move to Quebec. Not only do they speak mostly French, they have rather extreme views on things. They had pretty consistent referendums about separating from the rest of the country for a space of about 10 or 15 years but have never left. Most Americans would have a hard time dealing with such a vastly different mindset as the one they present to you.

Don't move to Saskatchewan or Manitoba. They are pretty much nothing but flat prairie land full of farmers. Even the biggest cities don't compare with others in the country.

British Columbia (west coast) is quite simply one of the most beautiful provinces in the country. They have the mountains on one side, ALOT of tourism, logging, orchards (no better fruit in the world than BC Cherries) and the like. They also have Victoria/Vancouver.

Vancouver is becoming one of the biggest hubs for film making. Its second only to California and many tv shows (like X-Files) came out of that city. Its not as big as Toronto, but it doesn't get bad weather. Even at the height of winter, it rarely sees snow. It also has the prettiest marina I've ever seen and a large park about the size of Grand Central Park in New York.

When you are in Canada, don't be surprised at how polite people are. The stories are true. We all say "thank you", "please", "you're welcome", and out of the blue "hello" to strangers just because thats the way we do things. My American husband was shocked the first time it happened to him during a visit and I actually responded like it was normal. In the US, I've actually had people look at me funny when I thank them for doing their job, but I don't see why I shouldn't. Thanking someone for bagging your groceries correctly makes them feel good, encourages future good behavior, and it only costs me a few words on my way out the door.

The country itself is Liberal. That won't change any time soon so don't freak out about it, especially since it pretty much runs like a well oiled machine in comparison to the United States. Religion is considered a private matter by about 90% of the population, and religious nutbags tend to get ignored as though they don't exist so they can't effect any change just because they are screaming loudly.

You have the exact same rights and freedoms as you do in the United States so don't go around claiming otherwise. The difference is that the people pay taxes to ensure that we have proper health care, there are laws preventing certain segments of the population from screwing over everyone else, and the recession hasn't hit nearly as badly in Canada. Canada, despite what some of the uninformed Americans try to say has much lower taxes than the US. In Alberta, I paid a good 8% or even 10% less than I do in Louisiana. Alberta also has no sales tax, though the government charges a 5% GST tax on some goods and services that has decreased by one percent a year for the last two years, and given us all back checks (one year was $600, the year before I left, I got a $400 check from the feds).

Yes, you have the right to have a gun in Canada. But it has to be registered, it has to be locked up, and you have to wait a certain amount of time while the government does a background check on you before you can bring it home. Yes, you can carry concealed with a permit though most people don't. Usually people, if they have them (rare), have shotguns, not hand guns, though I had a friend that had at LEAST 8 pistols and was obsessed with going to the shooting range at least once a month to shoot for at least an hour.

Yes, abortion is legal in Canada, but only under the strictest of circumstances.

Yes, gay marriage is legal in Canada, and most people don't particularly care because it doesn't effect themselves. Churches can refuse to marry gay couples if they want, because the government doesn't care and will marry them in a civil ceremony without argument. It is recognized that no religion has a monopoly on the word "marriage".

There is legally no discrimination allowed in Canada, including religious discrimination. That means you have the right to practice any religion you want (and unfortunately, to proselytize which aggravates me to no end) provided you don't hurt anyone. You need a permit to carry out ritualistic animal sacrifices (which I don't agree, but at least they are usually animals that we eat already). Though you may practice your religion, its another matter entirely to try to get it instituted in the government. You will NOT find the ten commandments, or any other religious doctrine, posted on or around any government building. You CAN join a religious school if you want but it is not government subsidized so you will expect to pay alot more for an education that is varies in quality for each school.

Unfortunately, discrimination is not unusual in Canada, though it isn't against blacks (it has never occurred to me to have a problem with black people because it just isn't part of the culture I grew up in), its against the natives. Something that I find rather despicable since I tend to judge people on a personal level rather than a group level. Yes, reservations exist in Canada. Some are better than others, but none are actually that great. The reservations are mostly left to deal with their own problems, not because no one wants to help them, but because thats the agreement they wanted with the government when the Canadian government gave them their sovereignty. Sorry, I can't remember when that happened but I learned about it in high school (at least 10 years ago).

Canadians do NOT care what religion their Prime Minister is. You won't even hear the tiniest amount of discussion about it because of the attitude that religion is a personal matter.

There is actually very little difference between the Liberals and the Conservatives in Canada. The Liberals are more about the people and the Conservatives are more about money, but they both essentially do whats best for everyone rather than try to push their personal agenda's come what may whether people want it or not.

There is a third party in Canada called The National Democrat Party, or NDP for short. The NDP are basically a farmers party who promotes what farmers need and for that reason they have only been in power once or twice and not for many decades now. They are also mostly Liberal. Basically, that means if the Liberals and the NDP gang up together, they can usually defeat the Conservatives on bills.

Just to let you know a bit of recent Canadian political history. About 6 or 7 years ago, the Liberals got caught giving millions of dollars to special interest groups, which is illegal according to Canadian law. Alot of people freaked out over it, a vote of no confidence (the people demanded it) was called and we had a new election a few months later. The Liberals lost. You'd think thats the end of the story, wouldn't you? But its not.

See... the Conservatives won by not by much. I can't remember the exact numbers, but I'll try to break it down for you. We are a three party system. Lets say the NDP got their traditional roughly 10% of the vote, the Liberals got 44%, and the Conservatives got 46%. Adds to 100% but that doesn't mean much when both the Liberals and NDP are Liberal party's. What this means is that the Conservatives won but they are a minority government because the Liberals and the NDP can still defeat the Conservatives in a vote if they choose to do so (remember, the NDP is mostly Liberal, not ALL Liberal so if the Conservatives can get the NDP on their side for a vote, the Liberals will lose and the Conservatives will win). The Conservatives have what we call "a minority government". That means they have to convince either the Liberals or the NDP that what they want in a bill is a good thing in Parliament or it doesn't get passed. Kind of like what happens in the US Congress.

What this has meant is that every two bloody years for the last 6 years, there has been YET ANOTHER federal vote because the Liberals are acting like big babies and constantly calling a vote of no-confidence and losing every single time. The people are getting sick to death of it.

See, in the United States, you can change governments quite often. If the previous party did a bad job, and they vote in someone else, and the new person has even the remotest trouble fixing anything, the people may actually vote back in the party that caused the problem in the first place.

It doesn't happen in Canada. In Canada, if a party screws up and won't let everyone forget that they screwed up, they are out of power for a long period of time even if the new party makes small screw ups too. Canadians don't put up with that kind of childish behavior and they aren't fickle.

Contrary to popular opinion, Canada may be a bit socialist but that doesn't mean we have no say in what goes on in our own country. Referendums, where the government asks people what they want them to do, actually do happen. Not all the time, but they do happen. And then the government does what the people want based on popular vote.

This means that if you move there, you will be likely to see at least one or two more federal elections in the next few years. I've stopped even bothering to vote for them (very unusual for me since I cherish my right to vote and have voted for every election since I was 18. I'm now 33) even though I'm in the US because I wish they'd knock it off.

However, the government will also do things we didn't vote on (like making gay marriage legal without consulting the public) because as per Stephen Harper (our Prime Minister), "Its the right thing to do". Remember, Stephen Harper is a Conservative. Think what that means in the United States. It means the same thing in Canada, just not to the same extreme.

If someone of power in Canada screws up, they are just out of power. No fuss, no muss. The people don't put up with it. Just like the Liberals are right now (and they need to shut up and live with the fact that they're out of power because people need to forget what they did and move on if they want to get back into power). There is no freaking out, there is no screaming, its just "the end of their position" for that person. They don't get voted back in and corrupt CEO's will not see their jobs continue because the people rule, not the corrupt top.

One of the things about Canada... as much as I absolutely love my home country and I miss it horribly in a heartbreaking way, the apathy displayed by much of the population is often frustrating to me. Its not that people don't care, but I don't ever see Canadians screaming and railing against their government or marching in the streets and the like. It just doesn't happen very often (though I have seen the occasional Canadian come down to the US to march in things like gay parades).

Personally, I've been around Americans too much and have picked up alot of your fire and passion for everything. Not that its a bad thing.

A note on Alberta, I have no idea who is currently the Premier (think: = to Governor). Though I have heard my sister say she doesn't like him but she didn't explain why.

Ok, just a few links for you, two are for provinces I suggest you look into, the last is for Canada itself....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alberta

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_columbia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada

If you have any more questions, curiosities or concerns, feel free to pm me or ask me here.

And moderators, please don't delete my post. I know I talk about politics but its not American politics (which tends to light fires of anger under people) and is for informational purposes.

[Sy[N]tH]

Nunavut is probably your best bet.

I lol'ed

I'd stick with Montréal (Québec), Ottawa (Ontario), Vancouver (British Columbia) or Calgary (Alberta).

And by the way, canadians are friendly all over, even in Québec

[lalPOOO]

Having lived and traveled almost all of Canada, as well as growing up here... I'd base my suggestion on where to live off what kind of place you like. Toronto is of course the centre of the universe, if you like the hustle and bustle of downtown and also enjoy the nightlife, Toronto or Montreal is where you want to be. If you want to pay a bit more but live in one of the most beautiful cities in the world Vancouver or Calgary is where you want to be. Vancouver is a really laidback and chill city, with tons of stuff to do and great weather (doesn't go below freezing) as long as you don't mind a bit of rain. Calgary and Edmonton are decent, but be prepared to be the coldest you have ever been, sitting in your car at -40c thinking about how long it would take you to drive to Florida.Things go a little slower in the west, but there's currently lots of work/oil money floating around there. If you're younger, and want an all out paradise/party town, check out Kelowna. Kelowna has a beach which is warm enough to swim in in march, but also snow covered mountains within an hour if you like ski'ing/snowboarding. Similar to Kelowna you also have Banff and Jasper, if you want breathtaking views and a serious party scene deep in the rockies. Vancouver island/Victoria is also beautiful, but extremely pricey. Definitely check these cities out on googlemaps/streetview.

Places to avoid include: Saskatchewan, Manitoba, Edmonton, New Brunswick and possibly also PEI if you don't want to bored out of your skull. Edmonton isn't awful, but other then West Ed Mall there isn't a ton to do, cost of living is ridiculous and instead of having culture, they just keep liquor stores open till 2am.

http://blog.wishboneltd.com/wp-conte...-winter-09.jpg

[moiraesfate]

About Kelowna, beautiful place if you have the money. My aunt lives there in a beautiful large house on Okanagan Lake. That sand is warm at almost any time of year, and its so pretty. Lots of touristy stuff to do if you like it.

DO NOT move to banff or jasper. Those places are tourist traps. During the off season, they are basically empty and you're paying an arm and a leg just for groceries. On season, you can make alot of money but its only temporarily. I have worked in the hotel industry for 8 years 9 years, 8 of it in Alberta, and I know how it works.

Just to give you an idea, my husband and I spent our honeymoon at Radium Hot Springs in the Rocky Mountains. We had a great little hotel room that was more like an actual apartment, and it was at a great price ($169 a night) for that time of year. They gave us each a free hour long massage at the hot springs as part of a gift package (among other things. The lady that owns Chateau Europe is very nice and even knocked on our door to give us a free bottle of wine to celebrate). We had a full size fridge so we figured we'd go buy some stuff to put in it. Wish we had bought the stuff back home and simply brought it with us because stuff that would have cost us $20 back in Alberta cost over $50 in Radium.

Personally, one of my favorite places is Vancouver.

I'm sorry, please excuse me. Its been almost 2 years since I was home and I miss it very bad. I'm still very happy to be with my husband in the United States but I miss the familiar that I grew up with and am currently having a tendency to go on and on about it. I don't mean to, it just kind of happens. I'll get over it eventually.