IT guys! need your advice/help about IT career

[123456iambelial]

College is so expensive, and I can't waste anymore time.
Someone told me that I can take the CompTIA A+ test; therefore, I can get a A+ certification.
It will cost me almost $200 per test (essential test and IT technician, Remote support technician or Depot technician)

Right now, I am working at the Naval base as a sales person in the computer department. And my hourly is not that much. I am thinking to take the A+ test and look for a better job to earn a little more money.

I think that the essential test is about hardware and building stuff. I think I already covered like 85 or 90% of it. I am sure that I don't want to be a Remote support tech. I heard that is better to take the IT tech because it mostly cover everything.

The IT tech test, is it hard???
Let say I passed the Essential and IT tech tests, do I need to take the other 2 tests or should I move on to a different type of CompTIA certification test?
If so which one should I take next, CompTIA Network+, security+, Server+, Linux+ . There are so many of them, and some of them I have never heard of.

I am ready to go to the library to borrow some books to review.

Thank you in advance

[Serra]

Well I guess my first question has to be whether you have considered taking night courses at college or anything of that nature. I don't know if it's an option, but if so it might be worth investigating.


But on to what you were asking about. I actually didn't know that CompTIA had split their A+ cert into 3 tracks, I find that interesting. It's a good move in my books. So I guess I will have to slightly alter my initial statements for when people ask these kinds of questions. Normally when someone in your position asks this same question I can get away with saying that it's always safe to get an A+ first and make the decision I am about to give you after... but that may not as much be the case anymore.

What you really need to ask yourself is what area of IT you want to get in to. The big areas are (in no particular order):
1. Programming
2. Hardware
3. Server administration
4. Networking
5. Application Usage

To give a quick overview of them all:

1. Programming
- Well this is pretty obvious. Without post-secondary though, I personally wouldn't really look at this. TBH it's no big loss, I have a hard time recommending programming to most people as it changes pretty rapidly. Some people can do it and excel, others can't.

2. Hardware
- This can have a few areas in it. It can be anything from building PC's in a mom-and-pop shop for sale, to putting together server-grade hardware for a large company that is sold worldwide, to even something like running and certifying network cables in offices.
- I will suggest that unless you're inclined to open your own shop at some point, generally building PC's for a career won't get you the Jaguar you want. Some people find it fulfilling, but generally not monetarily.
- Along the same lines, building server-grade hardware really isn't as interesting as it sounds... you can only put a CPU you couldn't personally afford into a socket so many times before it becomes boring. There is some excitement offered if you can get in to something like mainframe assembly though - but typically one does not start their career there. On the other hand, who knows what trying might get you.
- Lastly, for work such as running cables. I traditionally didn't think much of it, but once I got in to the industry and made some friends who do work like that I found out that despite what I thought, they can make some pretty good coin. For the most part they seem to find the work engaging as well as you get a sense of accomplishment out of it.

3. Server administration
- Does the idea of being a server admin tweak your interest? Creating users and groups in Active Directory, creating shares, assigning permissions, and working with database/Citrix/other application rollouts? If so, this might be the area for you.
- A word of advice about this area. The broad term is so generic it is ridiculous, for the most part people specialize in one area or another - ie. Windows domain administration (overdone by people who don't know any better, IMO), Citrix administration (pays decently), database administration (pay can be ridiculous), Oracle... umm... Exchange is another big one. What I'm getting at is that while you do need some basic, generalized knowledge/experience with servers (ie. pursue a Microsoft track), specialized knowledge is another benefit to both getting a job and making more money.

4. Networking
- This is the area I work in. The job: Ensure that PC A can talk to PC B, which can be either 100ft or 100,000 miles away. We deal with the equipment most people don't know of or think about, and our job is to make it work seamlessly to the end user.
- In my opinion, this is not a terribly hard area to get in to and it still pays well above what it should (though it does drop a bit each year), I think because no-one getting in to "computers" thinks about the network side of things. It turns out it's a lot more complicated than just plugging a wire in to a wall.
- You will be starting either as a physical networking guy racking equipment and plugging in cables or (if you're able to) in a NOC somewhere. If you're lucky/good it will be a good NOC, and from there with time and certifications you can move on.

5. Application Usage
- By this, I refer to things like CAD/CAM work. CAD/CAM (again, as my example) traditionally pays well, and you don't always need prior work experience to get in to it.
- I couldn't comment on how long this kind of work lasts for though - your career is tied to a software product. If you go this route (which can work out for many) I would highly suggest keeping an eye on other applications and ensuring you are cross-trained in a few things after you get your first job to help ensure you have a safety net.



So... yeah. You need to choose an area that interests you before anyone can really give you any advice. I'm a network guy, so I say networking. I personally have had a really good experience with it and think the industry can stand to take on a lot more people... but I'm sure others think the same about some other areas. The important thing is that you do something that YOU find interesting.

To keep yourself busy while trying to make a more specific decision though, I would say:
- Keep going for an A+ certification. I would think the "IT Technician" one would be the best... I doubt I'm alone as far as people in industry who don't know they've specialized yet. The other A+ certifications have what sounds like career-limiting wording after them, while the "IT Technician" title sounds like what the original (and highly successful) A+ was about.
- After A+, I would highly recommend looking at a Network+. A basic understanding of networking is required for just about any job, and I think the Network+ really isn't a bad certification for an entry-level "serious" IT job.


Edit: Where about are you located? Maybe, if you're really lucky, some forum member in the IT industry in you area will read the post and might be able to give you some info on what is hot in your region.

Edit II: For 3/4 be prepared to be at least somewhat on call for the majority of your career once you're out of the entry-level work (where, incidentally, you should understand you may have to do shift work). In my office, for example, we rotate among the engineers who will be on call if something happens to one of our clients networks. It sucks, but when an issue comes up that our NOC is not able to resolve because it's over their technical expertise someone has to wake up to restore the connectivity that cannot be down once employees come in to the office in the morning. If you're in a smaller office expect to be on call regularly, though larger companies it may/may not be an issue depending on the circumstances. And, of course, how often you will actually be called depends on the environment you work in... if your company has a terrible infrastructure, often. Highly robust and redundant, never.

[123456iambelial]

Thanks for the well explained IT fields.

I live in Maryland.

What I really want is to become a programmer; however, it will cost me a lot of money in college to become one.
So I am going to make a detour and get a certification, and look for a better job. Of course, I want a stable job because I got some bills to pay.

Right now, I am interested on networking, but I am not really good on networking. The more knowledge I gain the more I become confuse with this field.

I am thinking like this A+ -> Networking+ -> MCDST -> MCSE.
What do you think?

[Serra]

Maryland? That's not a bad place to be really, you have Washington right there, and in general I think it's a good place to be for IT these days. I've never been to the area though, so hopefully someone from those parts can comment further/more specifically.

For the rest of my comments, keep in mind I'm not really in a programming circle at all - so hopefully we can get someone like nn_step in here to give their thoughts on all this as well (at least, I think nn's a programmer).

Since I can't talk about that, I'll talk about the networking side which is the part I do know about. I'll start by saying that although as a network engineer I don't give a flying expletive about the hardware/OS any end device is running, I still highly value the A+ in anyone looking to get in. It's just so... foundational. I've met some guys who can really work their way around in networking well, but lack that basic, foundational knowledge of how computers work and as a result seem to pretty well fail. So I'd definitely stick with the A+. Next, the network+. If you don't know anything about networking and won't be taking private classes, it's a VERY good one to get. Books and material on it typically starts out at a low enough level and builds up that it's not bad. Don't be too worried if you don't get the material right away - with a number of concepts in networking, it never seems to make sense until something just "clicks", then you understand it all.

Okay, now for going forward. So past the Network+ what do you do? Honestly, this is likely to depend on where you get a job in the meantime if you have been looking... or where you are looking to go next. If you want to get in to networking full-on, I would suggest looking at a CCNA. Which, I guess, will necessitate me explaining what a CCNA is. In networking, Cisco is pretty much a monopoly. They're not strictly speaking, but they own between 80-95% of any given market in the area. Kind of like Intel. Part of how they got to be so successful was the quality of their certifications - the first one of which is the CCNA. For more information on the tracks, visit: http://www.cisco.com/web/learning/le...aths_home.html

A basic CCNA will definitely get your foot in to the door at any NOC, and will probably get you a job if you've earned it. But more discussion on that when you're gotten at least halfway through Network+ material.


Offhand, other comments I have are:
1. Whether you want to go the Microsoft route and do server admin stuff or do Cisco you should know that it is very easy these days to do free simulation of the equipment/OS, provided you have a decent PC. For Microsoft you can download a copy of VMWare server and run multiple Server 2008 machines that way to help you study (you can get up to 90 days of free use on a demo from MS.com). For Cisco gear there is a great program out there called GNS3 that lets you simulate routers, firewalls, and to some extent switches. So that's all in your favor.

2. Whatever certifications you go for, earn them. Do NOT use resources such as TestKing, Pass4Sure, etc. They will ensure you pass the test, but you'll be useless in a practical sense. People who use them typically don't make it through a rigorous interview, and if you get a less-than-rigorous interview... well, they typically don't know the material that well so their jobs are harder and you have to ask yourself whether you would want to work for a company that doesn't screen well.

3. Don't get side-tracked. Set goals and work to meet them in your off time. I know dozens of guys who have half of a certification of some kind, and have been at that stage for years. Sadly, I can definitely say that they do not see the promotions/movement of those who do finish their certs.

4. If you make it through the A+ and Network+ legitimately, re-post here. One thing I would suggest at that stage as well is that you take a trip down to the Cisco offices that are in Washington. They often host free seminars and such. The only catch is that you have to know about them to be able to go... but I'm sure people could hook you up. They're great ways to meet people in the industry, and those people will probably all be in a position to help you find a job if you can make some friends. Cisco definitely doesn't hold their seminars with this as a goal, but screw 'em. Worst case scenario, you tell them you work for a small mom-and-pa shop where you occasionally do a little Cisco work and want to get more in to it. It could be a small lie, but it would only be small and it pretty much means they have to put up with you. Come to think about it, I bet if you could call the right person you could get a free tour of the offices. That could be beneficial if you're trying to decide if networking is for you.

[123456iambelial]

Thanks for some great info. I am gonna study A+ first and move to Network+.
I am gonna post back once I get my result. It may take months though, but I will post back.

[Avan]

After you finish A+ and N+ I would look into Security+ and Convergence+ as well. Both are great certs to have, and trust me, employers love seeing this on your resume. When I was job hunting last year in the telecomm field the first thing people asked me was about my certs.

Also if you plan on doing work for the DoD as a gov employee or contractor I would suggest getting the ITIL Foundation V3 cert as well.

Good luck and don't let all the work stop you from reaching your goal.

EDIT: Forgot to add this. Juniper is running a program now that last til Dec 09 that give you free training for their certs and a 50% off voucher for the real test if you pass their pre-test. This knocks the cost of the test down to ~$63+testing center fees.
http://www.juniper.net/us/en/training/fasttrack/

PS...Serra how are you enjoying the crap weather we get in the St Louis area? Gotta love it.

[Scubar]

Dont bother wasting time on the A+ and Network+ Certs, they arent worth a squat since most 12 yr olds can do them. Skip them and save the money for the more useful certs.

[Avan]

Dont bother wasting time on the A+ and Network+ Certs, they arent worth a squat since most 12 yr olds can do them. Skip them and save the money for the more useful certs.

Yes, they are easy and quick to do. Hence do them... Skipping them is a bad idea. The more certs the better when looking for a job. Period.

[TiTON]

Certification are useful only to a point. You don't want to get over certified and have no experience to back it up. Then the certifications have no use in that situation.

Certification doesn't equal experience. Certification means you were able to study well. I actually passed got Cisco's CCNA by reading a book when I flew from the US to Asia. No hands ones or labs at all.

If you want to get certified. I would actually pick more specfici ceritifcations not the general comptia or MCSE. Everyone has those. I would pick something like Oracle DB, Veritas, Cisco, and so forth. It pays to be specialized, and not generic. It feels a lot better when people are knocking your door w/ job offers, versus have to job hunt.

After you have a few years of expereicne, certifications don't really mean much.

- Ton

[Serra]

After you finish A+ and N+ I would look into Security+ and Convergence+ as well. Both are great certs to have, and trust me, employers love seeing this on your resume. When I was job hunting last year in the telecomm field the first thing people asked me was about my certs.

Also if you plan on doing work for the DoD as a gov employee or contractor I would suggest getting the ITIL Foundation V3 cert as well.

Good luck and don't let all the work stop you from reaching your goal.

EDIT: Forgot to add this. Juniper is running a program now that last til Dec 09 that give you free training for their certs and a 50% off voucher for the real test if you pass their pre-test. This knocks the cost of the test down to ~$63+testing center fees.
http://www.juniper.net/us/en/training/fasttrack/

PS...Serra how are you enjoying the crap weather we get in the St Louis area? Gotta love it.

Some good points there, but I have to ask - what makes you say that about the Security+ and Convergence+? I have a Security+ and I don't personally think it's ever done me any benefit... I've had potential employers ask me what it is, but none of them have ever independently known. If you have other, more positive experiences about those I would be interested in hearing them because my personal attitude about CompTIA is that the only exams that actually "do anything" are the A+ and Network+.

That's also a good link for Juniper. I remember when they ran this last year it worked out pretty well for them and people suggested it would be extended through this year, I'm glad to see it was. But outside of telcos and a few (generally smaller) companies, does anyone actually use Juniper anymore? Not that telco's aren't large and valid employers. HP arguably has a presence on the network edge (and is probably growing in that market), but otherwise my experience has been it's Cisco all the way.


As to the weather - Oh man! Today's been terrible. 40.5 degrees (factoring humidity) Celsius today?! WHAT THE **** IS THAT ABOUT?! I'm from Calgary - where it was snowing a few days ago - I am NOT accustomed to this. Hell, I got home to my temporary apartment last night and found that despite leaving the AC on all day the temp was 24 degrees C! I don't want to think about how bad it's going to be tonight, I think I'm just going to plan on going to a movie. And, of course, I have to complain about the humidity. You can't step outside without breaking in to an instant sweat. Overall, I'm questioning the wisdom of my decision to move here rather than Phoenix or anywhere west coastish due to having lower temperatures.

Dont bother wasting time on the A+ and Network+ Certs, they arent worth a squat since most 12 yr olds can do them. Skip them and save the money for the more useful certs.

It's always been my thought that, all things being equal, people with certs will get jobs over those without. Are the A+ and Network+ terribly hard? No, but they do show that you're not just some guy with a vague interest in getting in to the industry.

With that said, I would make it a goal to sit down with a book a few hours a day and rocket through the material and get them over with as quickly as possible, then going for the "meatier" certs.

Certification doesn't equal experience. Certification means you were able to study well. I actually passed got Cisco's CCNA by reading a book when I flew from the US to Asia. No hands ones or labs at all.

If you want to get certified. I would actually pick more specfici ceritifcations not the general comptia or MCSE.

I definitely agree that certification != experience. Experience >>> all. But you do have to use certs to get the experience in the first place... and to be fair, if you keep current with your certs, they can remain useful. At least, that's the case in networking. Cisco/Juniper each have their own expert-level certs that retain their value forever (so far), and you can pick up things like the CISSP. I'm not sure if the same is true for other industries, but I expect it is for at least some applications. I'd say OS's, but that would be implying that an MCSE really was an expert level exam... which it clearly is not.

But as far as the specific certs go - I agree, but only after he picks up the vendor-neutral base (A+/Network+). My reasoning is twofold - first, he doesn't know which industry/subindustry for sure he wants in to. Second, they're decent for giving a person a broad overview of an industry so that when you go and dig in to it further you can understand the "why" behind the "what" a bit better... I just think getting a specific cert (ie. CCNA) would be harder without instruction would be more difficult without having gone through the easier Network+ material first than the combined effort to get both.

[123456iambelial]

I do understand the experience part. I was thinking this last night that once I got my A+ or may be the Network+ too, I am going to go to some charity or something and volunteer as an IT guy if needed while I am hunting for a job. I am going to do that only for experience. The problem is I don't know if they need an IT guy. I ain't working for some company for free though. It got to be something like charity or public library. I wanna be helpful to the people who needs help.

[123456iambelial]

After you finish A+ and N+ I would look into Security+ and Convergence+ as well. Both are great certs to have, and trust me, employers love seeing this on your resume. When I was job hunting last year in the telecomm field the first thing people asked me was about my certs.

Also if you plan on doing work for the DoD as a gov employee or contractor I would suggest getting the ITIL Foundation V3 cert as well.

Good luck and don't let all the work stop you from reaching your goal.

EDIT: Forgot to add this. Juniper is running a program now that last til Dec 09 that give you free training for their certs and a 50% off voucher for the real test if you pass their pre-test. This knocks the cost of the test down to ~$63+testing center fees.
http://www.juniper.net/us/en/training/fasttrack/

PS...Serra how are you enjoying the crap weather we get in the St Louis area? Gotta love it.

If possible, I want to work for DoD.
That link you have provided.
I am not exactly sure what are the "Enterprise Routing," "Enterprise Switching" and "JUNOS Software with enhanced services"
I am sure they are part of networking.

Can please you explain them to me.

Thanks

[MentholMoose]

I recommend enrolling in IT-related classes at a community college. You really will learn a lot, and they are relatively cheap and have flexible schedules. Also, the professors can be a great source of advice. I took a number of CIS courses (network/systems administration emphasis) at a local community college, and all of the professors had real world experience and contacts in the industry. In my experience, it isn't hard to do extremely good in most classes... a little studying and class participation will get the attention of professors, who are eager to help their good students.

Experience is very important in the IT industry, and if you are enrolled in school, you will have a better chance at getting an internship. Internship experience is a good substitute to real work experience, and if you do good you can even get hired! At the community college I went to, the CIS department has a credited volunteer program, where CIS students do work for the local K-12 school district. The school district has actually hired some of these students, and others got jobs through contacts they made in that program.

Yet another benefit is that many colleges have student employees in their IT department. This is a fantastic opportunity to get work experience and make contacts. Also, student employees often get hired when they graduate; I work in IT at a college, and a bunch of my colleagues are alumni and former student employees.

[nn_step]

Here is what you need to do if you want to get jobs in the IT industry.
First thing first, pick what exactly you want to do.
If you want to do IT support work:
Walk into a small mom & pop Computer repair company and offer to work for free if they let you do an internship.
then a year later use that experience to get an actual job.

If you want to do Computer Programming work:
Grab a compiler or IDE and just start programming.
Start working on it until you can program just about anything in your sleep.
Send example work to companies that show that you have talent.
Don't ask for much pay, but get your foot in the door.
[Be willing to move]

If you want a job in Hardware design:
Get a FPGA kit and start getting to work designing circuits
Get good at it, good enough to impress someone in the field.
Send examples to people in the field who you want jobs from.

[Scubar]

Yes, they are easy and quick to do. Hence do them... Skipping them is a bad idea. The more certs the better when looking for a job. Period.

Doesnt always work like that, I dont know of any of the companies around here that take any notice of the A+ and Network+ Certs. They just arent recognised by any decent employers and are hence a waste of time and money obtaining.

[Serra]

<snip>

Won't disagree with the first paragraph, that's certainly an option.

Basically, you recommend teaching yourself from beginner -> advanced/expert level knowledge in programming or circuit design and hope you can ship out an example that impresses someone enough to give you a job? Aside from the fact that the technical people are rarely HR (the ones you also have to convince), this sounds like a path highly, highly unlikely to work out for most people.

Doesnt always work like that, I dont know of any of the companies around here that take any notice of the A+ and Network+ Certs. They just arent recognised by any decent employers and are hence a waste of time and money obtaining.

They are recognized well for entry level work. You're not getting a sysadmin job, but a help desk job is not out of reach. And really, in IT, you do have to start at the bottom. As a quick example, to work as a PC technician in most stores, an A+ is absolutely required. I have also seen people get entry-level network jobs on a Network+ (along with verbal statement that they were pursuing a CCNA).

Plus, really, the knowledge is required as pre-requisite for higher-level certs and you might as well get the piece of paper as well. You get to validate your knowledge for yourself, and if it helps with a job more so the better. Sure you'll spend an extra $300, but to look at it as an expense from a cost perspective, you can pay that off in a year if you can get $0.15/hour more for the effort... and that's pretty trivial.

[3Z3VH]

As a DoD employee, I can tell you Security+ is quickly becoming a deal-breaking requirement for all IT staff. You either have it, or you do not work for DoD.

A+ really means nothing unless it is your only cert.

Net+ is good to have, but honestly, if you are going into networking, you will need a CCNA minimum, and the CCNA will give you all of the knowledge of the Net+ anyway.

MCITP will get you a job with most DoD HelpDesks which is a great place to start. As you know from being in the military, WHO you know is more important than WHAT you know. Once you get into a HelpDesk job, you can move up quickly, especially if you are still researching and gaining certifications while you work there. A friend of mine in the MDA moved up from HelpDesk to SysAdmin, to Server Admin in a matter of two years doing exactly that. With even the most basic MCITP cert, plus your security clearance, you can get a HelpDesk job quickly. Also, the MCITP has a part called Network Essentials, which encompasses most of the Network+ anyway, so again, a Net+ would only be redundant for someone with MCITP. Get the MCITP/EST and go right into a HelpDesk job. HelpDesk will typically start at a GS8 or GS9 with 2210 pay scale. Once you get the MCSE, you will easily be able to move up to GS10/GS11 with 2210, especially if you get a TS clearance.

CCENT/CCNA/CCIE - If you choose to do more networking, rather than server admin, you will want to simply go straight to these certs. A CCENT will get you a quick job with most installations, and give you the in-road to a higher ranked job quickly. The CCNA will be the one that gets you to a GS11 pay scale, while the CCIE is a free-ticket to work wherever you want, for however much money you want... but it is also one of the most expensive and difficult certs to attain in the IT industry.

I do not know as much about the programming side of things, but I do know that programming is the field with the most available positions. If you go to any job posting site, they are FULL of programming jobs, and are very selective on administration... that is because programming is a VERY DRY job to have, and it takes a special kind of person to be able to sit there for days working on the same bit of code without tearing their own hair out.

[nn_step]

... that is because programming is a VERY DRY job to have, and it takes a special kind of person to be able to sit there for days working on the same bit of code without tearing their own hair out.

programming very rarely has to do with working on the same bit of code repeatedly. Often well made code is done once and left alone forever, it is only poorly coded material that actually needs additional work. [Excluding extensions which is actually the action of tacking on more code to old code]

[3Z3VH]

But the point was... how often do you leave your desk in the course of a day ?

Few people can do the same thing day in and day out and not get sick of it.

[RADCOM]

Ideally you'll need a fine balance between experience and qualifications to get up the corporate ladder. Apparently the A+ caries a bit more weight in the US than in the UK (according to my sources anyway). It is an excellent introduction to the world of IT. Education is always a good investment and knowledge is always a good thing. A stint on a helpdesk won't do you any harm and is a foot in the door of the industry. Study as and when you can to increase your capabilities, a CCNA etc for networking , Microsoft or Redhat qualifications and nowadays an ITIL basic qualification will all come in handy. You may even have a creative side and go into web/graphic design. Good luck with your career!

[tomb18]

Here's a different take on things....in the next 5 years, most large corporations will not have IT departments anymore. All servers will be located remotely and they will access them over the net. Help desks will be a service, probably to a third party (maybe India) and salaries will be low.
What you are going to want to do, is become as versatile as you can. Windows, Linux, Solaris, and networking. To get a job as an server admin, you will also need these skills since you will probably be taking care of a server farm.
In case you wonder, our corporation (40,000PC's) will use two data centers only. All local systems will be moved. One in Europe and one in Virginia (cheap from a tax point) This is the way of the future.

[3Z3VH]

In the next 5 years, you say ? Most large corporations take about half that time just to upgrade from one OS to another... I could not imagine they would be able to migrate everything to a remote site and maintain all capabilities using existing WAN transports in under 5 years, and have any sort of success... more or less every company in the world.

The absolute BEST you could hope for, is that in 5 years the CAPABILITY to do this would be there, but there is no way it would be implemented that quickly.

Also, your dev team is still needed for all custom apps and DBs... whether the server is here, or on mars, as long as they have connectivity, it doesn't matter where they program from... and if they try to outsource it overseas, they will see how quickly the language barrier makes their dev budget and turnaround times skyrocket.

What about Network support ? Some guy in India isn't very likely going to be able to come configure the local switch when it loses all connectivity, is he ?

Sys Admin ? Who is going to come show the customer how to set up a new printer ? Even video tutorials aren't going to show the less technically adept how to do it. They need their hand held. Not to mention, who is going to make the customized video tutorials for YOUR network ?

What about companies, or government entities that have offline networks for security ? They have no connections to the outside world. how are they supposed to trust 3rd parties with their data ?

Bottom Line: Local IT staff will ALWAYS be in demand.

[Serra]

In the next 5 years, you say ? Most large corporations take about half that time just to upgrade from one OS to another... I could not imagine they would be able to migrate everything to a remote site and maintain all capabilities using existing WAN transports in under 5 years, and have any sort of success... more or less every company in the world.

The absolute BEST you could hope for, is that in 5 years the CAPABILITY to do this would be there, but there is no way it would be implemented that quickly.

Also, your dev team is still needed for all custom apps and DBs... whether the server is here, or on mars, as long as they have connectivity, it doesn't matter where they program from... and if they try to outsource it overseas, they will see how quickly the language barrier makes their dev budget and turnaround times skyrocket.

What about Network support ? Some guy in India isn't very likely going to be able to come configure the local switch when it loses all connectivity, is he ?

Sys Admin ? Who is going to come show the customer how to set up a new printer ? Even video tutorials aren't going to show the less technically adept how to do it. They need their hand held. Not to mention, who is going to make the customized video tutorials for YOUR network ?

What about companies, or government entities that have offline networks for security ? They have no connections to the outside world. how are they supposed to trust 3rd parties with their data ?

Bottom Line: Local IT staff will ALWAYS be in demand.

^ This.

I work for a company who pushes for server consolidation (which includes offsite usage), and even our most fanciful forecasts don't show the future that tomb18 sees in 5 years.

@tomb18:
Whether you have 2 datacenters or 5 datacenters doesn't make a difference. I'd bet that your 2 datacenters are virtualized, and thus run the same # of OS's that the old one did, just in a smaller footprint. Aside from basic toolmonkey stuff, that still requires the same number of admins.

As to servers all being moved to hosted services... we wish! We try to sell that, but it's not universally accepted, not by far. There are huge issues with adoption.

Now with that all said - will we eventually see things tightening up? Sure. The software industry has already gone through a lot of it. But honestly, it's so easy to start into IT at a much higher salary than a person generally deserves and we can definitely trim some fat. But as it stands, I will remain true to my assertion that now is a great time for someone to get into IT (excepting maybe programming, but really I know nothing about that area) provided they are willing to actually work at staying current and certified.

[3Z3VH]

Besides... if that future does exist... who will maintain these monster computing clusters ? New kids out of college, or the guys who have been working in IT for the past decade already ?

Get some experience under your belt ASAP, even if it is as a Help Desk jockey. All time in the IT field counts when you are looking for an IT job. At least it shows that you have the troubleshooting mindset, and have a familiarity with the terminology and pace of the industry. Anything else is just someone who read a bunch of books and thinks they can do it. Nothing replaces hands-on experience.