Gonna go DSLR, D90?

[The[R]eaper]

@dave_sz: No hard feelings man. I read the review on K20D and it seems like a great camera but im pretty much set on a nikon though and I do appreciate your recommendations.

@[XC] itznfb: I did consider the D80 since there are some great kits out there like this one for a great price. I dunno this might sound stupid but i do want the larger screen, dust reduction, newer sensor, etc. If those are overrated then ill definitely consider the D80 as there are better kits out there for it.

Until i can go and actually check it out in person (damn snow) ill be able to make a decision. I just wanted to get some thoughts on it before i go get one.

oh and i plan on taking pictures of mostly wildlife, people, cities, and prolly some indoor, and concerts possibly. Pretty much everything . I hope that helps and thanks again.

[Nate P.]

Shift your focus from the body to the lenses. The lenses are exponentially more important than the body. For example, you are going to need very different lenses for indoor shooting and wildlife.

[itznfb]

@[XC] itznfb: I did consider the D80 since there are some great kits out there like this one for a great price. I dunno this might sound stupid but i do want the larger screen, dust reduction, newer sensor, etc. If those are overrated then ill definitely consider the D80 as there are better kits out there for it.

no i wouldn't say those things are overrated. having the larger screen on the D90 is definitely a nice feature. the new sensor apparently fixes some problem the D80 had with noise. so if those things are important to you then go with the D90.
i wouldn't base any decision on the kit itself. the D90 and D80 come with pretty weak lenses. the D50 actually came with a much better lense than either of those. when i purchased my D90 instead of going with a kit and purchased the body and a 18-55mm VR (which you can get in a kit with the D80) and i also purchased a 55-200mm ED VR. someone may be able to recommend a better lens, but for under $1200 i can't think of a better nikon starter kit.

[Dave_Sz]

does the nikon kit 18-55 really cost $150?

nevermind. I guess you just overpaid a bit for the 18-55 and the 55-200...

[itznfb]

does the nikon kit 18-55 really cost $150?

nevermind. I guess you just overpaid a bit for the 18-55 and the 55-200...

you should really be banned from this section. you provide absolutely nothing insightful and just flambait all day long with your pentax ranting.

[Nate P.]

does the nikon kit 18-55 really cost $150?

Its damn well worth the money, great starter lens.

[Dave_Sz]

you should really be banned from this section. you provide absolutely nothing insightful and just flambait all day long with your pentax ranting.

whine whine whine

how about this then.

Dear OP, merry christmas to you. In this season of giving I would like to give you the gift of saving yourself some money. Please visit adorama.com or bhphotovideo.com or beachcamera.com. These place have the items you're putting in your stocking this year, for less than amazon. Ho ho ho, merry christmas...

[ANP !!!]

no i wouldn't say those things are overrated. having the larger screen on the D90 is definitely a nice feature. the new sensor apparently fixes some problem the D80 had with noise. so if those things are important to you then go with the D90.
i wouldn't base any decision on the kit itself. the D90 and D80 come with pretty weak lenses. the D50 actually came with a much better lense than either of those. when i purchased my D90 instead of going with a kit and purchased the body and a 18-55mm VR (which you can get in a kit with the D80) and i also purchased a 55-200mm ED VR. someone may be able to recommend a better lens, but for under $1200 i can't think of a better nikon starter kit.

Do add a 50mm f/1.8 or SB400, both or either of them are great addition to the list for a little more money.

[Soulburner]

IMO you'll eventually want more than the SB400 can offer...

[YugenM]

IMO you'll eventually want more than the SB400 can offer...

Agreed

As for the lens recommendations:
Have you considered the 35mm f/2D? Haven't personally used it so I can't comment on that aspect, but 50mm f/1.8D on a crop body may be awkward (though it isn't for me), and I find shooting with a prime to be way easier than zooms.

[MaxxxRacer]

IMO you'll eventually want more than the SB400 can offer...

Yup, one indoor portait and you'll want throw out the 400 and pick up a real flash. That said, I have to admit that the best on camera flash I have ever seen is the sony, simply for the way it pivots to do portait shots.

[ANP !!!]

I mean for a starter SB400 is decent enough, and its easy to carry around, its SB600 that really start to deliver, but you have to consider the size and price.

[YugenM]

I mean for a starter SB400 is decent enough, and its easy to carry around, its SB600 that really start to deliver, but you have to consider the size and price.

Flash units aren't that big

[berk]

What do you want from your Camera?

Between the D90 and the Canon 40D,i'll take this from DPreview:

D90
Image quality comparable with its peers
Excellent viewfinder
Superb high resolution LCD monitor
Automatic chromatic aberration correction improves performance from all lenses
Punchy but not un-natural colors (and plenty of control if you want to change them)
Good dynamic range - and Active D-Lighting to help make the most of it
Useful in-camera RAW processing option
Excellent degree of customization (reversible dials and meter ease transition from other systems)
Fast Autofocus with useful control options
High sensitivity performance up there with the best we've seen
Sophisticated wireless flash commander built-in
Programmable FUNC button with useful list of functions
Configurable 'My Menu' (and option for FUNC button to access the top item on it)
Excellent build quality, tight shut lines, quality materials
Instant power on, very responsive in-use
Auto-focus assist lamp rather than requiring flash to be raised
Control over high sensitivity noise reduction
Customizable automatic sensitivity (ISO)
Easy to use playback / delete combination
Status LCD panel on top of camera (we still like them)
Fast continuous shooting mode
Good SD card throughput and USB 2.0 transfer speed
Extensive retouching features including D-Lighting, Red-eye reduction and distortion correction
Good battery life and precise charge-level indication
Dedicated help button provides in-menu assistance
HD video

40D:
Excellent resolution, good per-pixel sharpness
Good tonal response, dynamic range extended compared to competition, EOS 30D
Highlight tone priority option delivers even more dynamic range with very little downside
Trademark Canon CMOS noise free images, remain detailed even at high sensitivities
New 'High ISO speed noise reduction' option removes any trace of chroma noise, film grain like
Confidence to use camera at high sensitivities (ISO 1600, 3200)
A/D conversion now 14-bit (questionable real-world advantage), RAW files recorded as 14-bit
Excellent long exposure capability, no noticeable hot pixels even at 30 seconds with NR off
Wide range of image parameter adjustment (-4 to +4 for most)
Live view on LCD with 5x and 10x live magnification and 'drop mirror' auto-focus
Instant power on time, excellent operational speed, always feels responsive
Just over six frames per second continuous shooting, although high shutter speeds required
Good nine point auto focus system, works well even in low light
Slightly larger viewfinder, optional focusing screens
ISO sensitivity now permanently displayed on top LCD and viewfinder status bar
New warning screen if CF door opened during write (no more lost images)
Quieter mirror mechanism, very quiet in live view (3 silent shooting options)
Supports both EF and smaller, lighter EF-S 'digital' lenses
Excellent build, very robust, compartment door weatherproofing, good ergonomics
New AF-ON button brings consistency of control with EOS-1D series
Proper RAW+JPEG with immediately selectable JPEG image size
Optional sRAW reduced resolution RAW
Dust reduction from Canon's 'Integrated Cleaning System'
Excellent supplied software bundle, remote capture and good RAW conversion (DPP)
Quick magnification up to 10x (perfect for checking focus), easier panning (joystick)
Excellent battery life, light weight and small batteries
E-TTL II flash metering, includes distance information from lens
Even larger 3.0" LCD (although no increase in pixel count)
Playback jump by 10, 100 images or by shot date or screen
Fully customizable 'My menu' surprisingly useful
Three user memories via 'C1/C2/C3' on mode dial
Optional WFT-E3 wireless transmitter (802.11 b/g) / vertical grip

I think the 40D is an absolute steal at this moment in time,cashback offers bring the price down to £500 here.Bargain!!!

[Soulburner]

For 200 dollars I would much rather go with the Nikon system. Better lens selection IMO. There is a reason for the price premium of Nikon & Canon cameras. Its the lenses.

I missed this.

I don't know, I find myself thinking it would be nice to have a Canon so I can have access to more lenses that Nikon just doesn't make, mainly the f/4 L lenses like the 70-200.

Then I think about what body I would get, and suddenly the enthusiasm disappears.

[Nate P.]

Haha, I think about the awesome bodies that become available with a Nikon system, and then I think about the lenses (and their price tags!) and suddenly the enthusiasm disappears.

[Soulburner]

Yeah Nikon has awesome lenses, but they seem to only want to cater to the newbies and the Pros willing to pay top dollar. For the advanced amateur / semi-pro / hobbyist there is no middle ground.

[The[R]eaper]

ok guys i got to check out the D90 today at bestbuy. ill just say that i will be ordering it soon

i also checked out the canons but the nikons fit my hand better and just seemed overall to have a better feel or grip.

It also didnt seem very heavy to me and thought it was pretty light with the 18-105. They were selling the kit for $1299!!!! adorama has it for $1095 w/ free shipping

so i think im gonna go for the kit w/ the 18-105 to get familiar with it all.

Then prolly grab the 55-200 later if i need it, and the 50mm f1/8 prime as it seems to be very good and highly recommended.

So is there anything else ill need? extra battery? cleaning kits? how often do you guys clean your camera/lenses? and what SDHC cards do you guys recommend? i was thinking about a couple of these here or should i just get a 8GB extreme III card?

sorry about the barrage of questions Thanks guys i really appreciate all of your help

[Soulburner]

Get a Nikon lens pen.

I have 2 batteries, its insurance if I ever manage to drain one. Which is hard but not impossible to do in 1 day with these newer cameras.

I would get 2x4GB cards. I always buy from Newegg or Amazon when I can get free shipping.

The next thing I would recommend, before buying any other lenses, is an SB-600 flash. This will improve your indoor shots more than any lens no matter what it costs.

[ANP !!!]

As Soulburner said, I would get a extra Battery, maybe 2 if you go on a long holiday. And 2 x 4GB depending on your use, don't get high Capacity cards. Add in a SB600 before you buy the 55 - 200mm, after noticing how often you click indoor shots.

[The[R]eaper]

ok ill get the lens pen and a couple 4gb cards also and have a looky at the SB-600. Thanks

[itznfb]

i also checked out the canons but the nikons fit my hand better and just seemed overall to have a better feel or grip.

i feel the same way. i really didn't like the way the canon felt in my hand. plus my dad has a ton of nikon lenses from his F4 that i could borrow. those are the 2 reasons i purchased a nikon over the canon.

[Nate P.]

i also checked out the canons but the nikons fit my hand better and just seemed overall to have a better feel or grip.

Very true for the lower end Canons (Rebels), but once you get into the 20/30/40/50D's, its much better.

[YugenM]

Very true for the lower end Canons (Rebels), but once you get into the 20/30/40/50D's, its much better.

40 and 50 kinda felt semi-gimped in the ergonomics department when I was goofing off at Best Buy today, but not everybody is me, and my friend looooooooves how his 1D Mk.III fits into his hands.

[MaxxxRacer]

I missed this.

I don't know, I find myself thinking it would be nice to have a Canon so I can have access to more lenses that Nikon just doesn't make, mainly the f/4 L lenses like the 70-200.

Then I think about what body I would get, and suddenly the enthusiasm disappears.

Knowing more about photography I feel the same way. Canon has some excellent lenses, but Canon has nothing that will give me the excellent Auto-ISO, insane AF system, excellent body design, and ADR with the same price point as my D300. Canon just doesnt have anything. What would be awesome is if Canon actually got a brain about the 5D MKII and redesigned the body to be comfortable and with an upgraded AF System that will be in the 1D MK4, they would have a excellent system that would convert some Nikon users.

The one thing that is really pissing me off with nikon is that they have two types of lenses. F2.8 pro lenses and F5.6 consumer lenses with VR that just are not up to more demanding tasks. If you want something inbetween you are left with your thumb up your but, or with 3rd party F2.8 lenses like you and I have.

On a side note, I've been sick all this week so I havent even exchanged gifts with my parents so I dont have my Tamron 18-50 yet.