Gigabyte EX58-UD5/Extreme Discussion Thread

[psyside]

My only other suggestion is to turn LLC (Load Line Calibration) on as it reduces the vdroop you experience when the CPU is put under heavy load. You should be able to lower your Vcore in the bios.

I know what you mean in regards to running 4 less threads than the CPU is able to provide. It was the reason I sold my 940 for the current 920 D0 I run now. In all honestly, having HT on at 4 GHz hasn't made my PC "feel" any quicker, but it was just something I wanted to do.

You should be able to hit 4.00GHz and drop your vcore considerably with HT off, maybe to around 1.275V - 1.300V in the bios (with LLC enabled) depending on your chip.

Thanks for the detailed response dude, but here is the issue. Isnt LLC a bad thing? as far as i know it does make big voltage spikes and its really stressing the cpu, but on the other hand now when you give me the tip i rememeber then in the past few days i saw many users use this, and on top of that Gigabyte have 3 levels of LLC settings in the BIOs or im wrong? (never used LLC before) so i will need some tips about this levels/settings, thanks one more time

[nipper575]

I'll try to answer as accurately as possible, just realise that I am speaking from my own experiences which are not to be taken as gospel.

In regards to LLC, I have never seen it cause voltage spikes with this motherboard, I think the voltage spike characteristic of having LLC enabled is a thing of the past (old motherboards seemed to suffer this problem from what I remember reading). I've owned my EX58-EXTREME motherboard since about 1 month after they were released and it has never had a stock clocked CPU on it, LLC has always been enabled.

As to how many levels of LLC there are, I've reverted to using the F9 bios which only has an enabled|disabled option. Whether the newer bios revisions have another option is not something I know, I have witnessed different levels on newer boards though. Someone else here will have to answer that for you. The only difference between having multiple options would be the aggressiveness that the voltage is adjusted under load conditions. If my board had these options, I would start at the lowest setting and go from there if needed.

[acebmxer]

LLC is fine to use. Just enable LLC level 1. level 1 removes the vdroop. level 2 removes the vdrop and vdroop. level 2 tends to over volt by a bit.

[psyside]

LLC is fine to use. Just enable LLC level 1. level 1 removes the vdroop. level 2 removes the vdrop and vdroop. level 2 tends to over volt by a bit.

Thanks alot guys, so my next step is this.

1.Turn of HT.
2. Turn on LLC (does F12 has different levels?)
3. And i think about changing the ram timings, use 9-9-9-24 instead of 8-8-8-24? does ram timings effects stabillity?

Thanks one more time

P.S. One more thing, i never understand how to tune the VTT, some say 0.5? but what that means? 0.5 compared to what? sorry im a bit noob with OC

[acebmxer]

Try HT off

I dont remember if that board does levels or just enabled or disabled. Either way set it to either enabled or Level 1.

Vtt needs to be no more then 0.5v less then Vdimm. So if you need 1.6v vdimm your qpi/vtt needs to be 1.15 or higher. If you need 1.7vdimm then qpi/vtt needs to be 1.215 or higher... Actual values will vary with board.

[psyside]

Ok, im quite sure my ram is the problem, its cheap A-DATA (budget) ram, how do i know the ram is the problem?

Whenever i turn off turbo, i cant pass OCCT linkpack test or either LINX (full ram testing metod) reason for that is that with turbo (on) the memory ferq is lower then without, (around 15xx vs 1600 @ 4ghz w/o turbo) now im not sure if turbo is increasing the memory ferq during load but im stable that way, and if i turn off turbo and set 4ghz the tests fail after 2 mins or so....BSOD 124/101 now i know this means more vcore/vtt or lower, but i tried crazy high settings and the test still crash, so im quite sure the memory cant go over 15xx mhz. Other then that one more thing makes me wonder...why i cant even boot with memory set at around 1300 mhz with x6 multy and uncore x12? i tought to try that way so i can avoid being memory limited, but that way i cant even boot...let alone testing, what could be the reasone for this i dont know the timings i use atm are 9-9-9-24.

So the ultimate question, pros and cons having turbo on? does turbo mode make the default cpu clock lower (until you put stress on the cpu) and if thats the case, how much stress does it require? 10% load? or much more? is turbo active while everyday tasks?


Thanks guys.

P.S. Im testing with Hypertreading enabled, i tried without it but i get similar results.

[nipper575]

At least whilst you are still testing, keep HT off as you would be hard pressed to get to 4.00GHz on a C0 with it enabled, not without considerably more voltage than having it disabled.

Set your RAM timings to what the manufacturer recommends. Do you have a link for the RAM that you are using? Another thing to try is putting the uncore on 2 x RAM multi + 1 (x17).

As far as I'm concerned, there is no HUGE drawback to having a lower base clock whilst using turbo mode to compensate for it. Obviously your RAM will not clock up as high as it can only run at the base clock x the RAM multiplier. Your CPU will be able to utilise a multiplier that is one level above the norm.

So for example if your base clock is set to 200MHz with turbo on, your CPU will hit 4.20GHz. With turbo off with the same base clock, you will reach 4.00GHz. That same difference (200MHz) is experienced whilst idling when the multiplier scales down (if C1E and EIST are enabled).

[psyside]

At least whilst you are still testing, keep HT off as you would be hard pressed to get to 4.00GHz on a C0 with it enabled, not without considerably more voltage than having it disabled.

Set your RAM timings to what the manufacturer recommends. Do you have a link for the RAM that you are using? Another thing to try is putting the uncore on 2 x RAM multi + 1 (x17).

As far as I'm concerned, there is no HUGE drawback to having a lower base clock whilst using turbo mode to compensate for it. Obviously your RAM will not clock up as high as it can only run at the base clock x the RAM multiplier. Your CPU will be able to utilise a multiplier that is one level above the norm.

So for example if your base clock is set to 200MHz with turbo on, your CPU will hit 4.20GHz. With turbo off with the same base clock, you will reach 4.00GHz. That same difference (200MHz) is experienced whilst idling when the multiplier scales down (if C1E and EIST are enabled).

To bad i got no link or either know what model of ram it is, i know only the brand.. its some budget ram which i bought cause it was the only model available when i bought my pc 2 years ago...

Can you please suggest me some good not very expensive ram, because i think if i got better ram (1600mhz with low default voltage) i could get 4ghz without turbo (im quite sure my chip is decent) and after all almost of all my components are high quallity the only bad part is the ram so i dont want to have "bottleneck" - low quallity...parts on my system.

So i guess ill keep on testing with Turbo on and HT off/on (will try both) and post results. Btw how good is this mobo regarding oc? this thread is huge and i got no time to read it all, so can you give me sone info about this mobo and what BIOS is best to use as well, i have been told the F12 is the best on this forums, but maybe there is some new beta version which could help me with the oc, thanks for your time alot

[nipper575]

If you download CPU-Z and click on the memory tab, it should tell you what timings to run at a specified frequency.

I've never really known which brands of RAM outperform others as it seems to have such a small effect from one system to the next as long as the capacity is the same, that is my experience anyway. I've used Kingston, Patriot, Corsair, G.Skill, OCZ and some other lesser known brands that escape me. They have all at the very least run up to the specification set by the manufacturer.

Unless someone else can recommend something, my recommendation would be to buy RAM that is from a reputable manufacturer, rated to the necessary speed you are chasing so you don't have to OC it and worry about instability and looks nice if you are into aesthetics. Timings have never really done much for me, I'm not really a bencher, my PC is for gaming and other than the amount of RAM in my PC, little else to do with the RAM makes any difference.

As for how good these boards are for OCing, I have no complaints but then I've never really needed to go past 4.00GHz. I think your CPU will limit your OC before the motherboard does. I've used a heap of different bios revisions, betas and finals, I haven't really had a stand out. I've reverted to the F9 bios, I can't for the life of me remember why but it is stable for me. Other than using the early revisions, you shouldn't have any real problems other than incompatibilities with usb keyboards, sleep mode etc...

Sorry for the vague advice, but it's been years since I've really needed to look into the nitty gritty of this subject.

[acebmxer]

Most i7-920s like Odd Multis. If your not going to use turbo set multi to 19. If you want turbo set multi to 20 or 21 in bios. Uncore 2x memory multi or 2x+1 or +2. Some cpu are more stable with 2x+1 vs 2x. (you have to play with this) Higher uncore, bclk, memory multi all will require higher qpi/vtt voltage. Higher cpu multi or cpu speed will need more vcore.
Post a full bios template of your current settings for the given speed that is failing you.

for x58 0x124 is qpi/vtt 0x101 is vcore. If one of these is "WAY" out the error codes can reverse.

From what I have seen i7-920 c0's require alot more vcore to get stable then D0's.

[psyside]

Thanks alot guys, higly appericated, some great tips and suggestions there

And about the ram, i dont care also about timings or speed, what i care is good memory for oc stability etc, but what is confusing for me is next,

Lets say i buy 1600mhz memory kit which is rated at 1.8v, does this means that i will have to use very high qpi vtt to follow the 0,5 rule? lets say 1.4 vtt for 1.8v rated ram? or i can just lower the ram at 1.6/1.65 and start from there? will this metod cause instabillity regarding the ram itself? does memory run good at lower volts then the default ones? thanks one more time.

Will post full template later sorry, atm im to tired

P.S. Omg, acebmxer...that clock is insane..how did you manage 4.5ghz ? are you on water?

[psyside]

Update,

the great just become awesome!

I managed to lower the vcore alot, from 1.41 to 1.38 (BIOS) and cpuz shows 1.344.

My temps are amazing as well



Thanks all for your help, highly appericated, i tried 4.2ghz but no luck till now, im ok with 4.1ghz for now tbh


Noctua NH D14 with AC MX-4, i7 920C0 @4.1ghz (22c ambient room)






And just for reference,




Nexus FLC 3000 with AC MX-4, i7 920C0 @4ghz (21c ambient room)





Ownage.

[nipper575]

Good work.

[acebmxer]

P.S. Omg, acebmxer...that clock is insane..how did you manage 4.5ghz ? are you on water?

Here are my settings for 4.5ghz.

Advanced CPU Features:
CPU Clock Ratio ................................ [20x]
Intel(R) Turbo Boost Tech .................. [Enabled]
CPU Cores Enabled ............................ [All]
CPU Multi Threading .......................... [Disabled]
CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E) ................... [Enabled]
C3/C6/C7 State Support .................... [Disabled]
CPU Thermal Monitor ......................... [Enabled]
CPU EIST Function ............................ [Enabled]
Virtualization Technology ................... [Enabled] << Disabled if you do not use Vmware or Virtual PC Programs
Bi-Directional PROCHOT ..................... [Enabled]


Uncore & QPI Features:
QPI Link Speed .............................. x36
Uncore Frequency ..........................  17X (Always 2x memory Multi or 2x +1)
Isonchronous Frequency ..................[Enabled]


Standard Clock Control:
Base Clock (BCLK) Control ................ [Enabled]
BCLK Frequency (MHz) .....................215
PCI Express Frequency (MHz) ........... [103]

C.I.A.2 [Disabled]

Advanced Clock Control:
CPU Clock Drive ..............................[800mV]
PCI Express Clock Drive ................... [900mV]
CPU Clock Skew ............................. [0ps]
IOH Clock Skew ............................. [0ps]


Advanced DRAM Features:
Performance Enhance ...................... [Extreme]
Extreme Memory Profile (X.M.P) ......... [Disabled]
System Memory Multiplier (SPD) ........ [8X]
DRAM Timing Selectable (SPD) .......... [Manual]

Channel A + B + C

Channel A Timing Settings:
##Channel A Standard Timing Control##
CAS Latency Time ......................8
tRCD .......................................8
tRP .........................................8
tRAS .......................................20

Below values may be left in Auto if you like, generally this is fine.  For those users who DO Set advanced timings manually, please see some of my thoughts and findings about these settings and rules here
XtremeSystems Forums - View Single Post - Gigabyte EX58-UD5/Extreme Discussion Thread

##Channel A Advanced Timing Control##
tRC ........................................ Auto (Should be = tRAS + tRP or above for stability)
tRRD ....................................... Auto
tWTR ...................................... Auto (Must be Write to Read Delay/Same Rank - (tWL + 4)
tWR ........................................ Auto
tWTP ....................................... Auto  (tWTP Must = tWR + tWL + 4)
tWL ........................................ Auto   (tWL Must be CAS Latency -1)
tRFC .......................................80
tRTP .......................................Auto
tFAW ......................................Auto
Command Rate (CMD) ................T1

##Channel A Misc Timing Control##
Round Trip Latency ...................Auto

B2B CAS Delay ..........................Auto


Advanced Voltage Control:

CPU
Load Line Calibration ................. [Level1]
CPU Vcore ...............................Normal (My VID is 1.2500)
DVID.......................................+0.0500
QPI/VTT Voltage 1.150v ............1.355
CPU PLL 1.800v .......................1.50

MCH/ICH
PCIE 1.500v ...........................1.50
QPI PLL 1.100v .......................Auto
IOH Core 1.100v .....................Auto
ICH I/O 1.500v .......................Auto
ICH Core 1.1v ........................Auto

DRAM
DRAM Voltage 1.500v .............. 1.62
DRAM Termination 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-A Data VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-B Data VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-C Data VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-A Address VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-B Address VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]
Ch-C Address VRef. 0.750v [AUTO]

[psyside]

Hey guys, its me again lol.

Here is the thing, with my latest stable oc, which is posted few links above, i get some instability issues (only during LINX) and i know why....the vcore drops ALOT, i set 1.387vcore in BIOS and during Linx load, it goes as low as freaking 1.34 :/ what i find even more frustrating is that, im fairly sure my chip is great, why? because even at (vdrop during load) - 1.34vcore/1.4BIOS (@4.150mhz) the Linx test aint drop fail like 12 mins! its quite a good chip. So in order to avoid this big Vdrop, i had to increase the vcore to (huge 1.41), after that @WIN the default vcore is 1.40 and load is 1.36, now i can get the system stable this way but hey, 1.39 is totaly unnececarry for my cpu at idle....it could be stable at 1.35/1.37 during load! not 1.40 idle, is there anyway to work around this??? please help! its really frustrating...after i notice this im sure my chip can go even further, 4.2ghz easy...if i just find way to fix this, even this is a C0, but i guess a good one.


Few more questions,

1. Is this motherboard issue, BIOS issues or what?
2. Does ram, or any other components affect this?
3.Temps maybe? ( i got fantastic cooling, NH D14 + HAF 932, 1.41 vcore @4.1ghz max temp - 20mins LINX - during summer - 74c..
4 Anything other then this? chip degradation lol?

Does the new Z68/P67 have this issues as well?

P.S. LLC is on and also CPU Thermal Monitor is on, not sure if i should turn off this, it kinda scare me...

P.P.S. Both Cpuz and Eeasytune, show same vcore (during load) so its not false reading.

[psyside]

Bump

[psyside]

Come on guys, anyone?

[Fatbird]

Use LLC2.

[acebmxer]

Hey guys, its me again lol.

Here is the thing, with my latest stable oc, which is posted few links above, i get some instability issues (only during LINX) and i know why....the vcore drops ALOT, i set 1.387vcore in BIOS and during Linx load, it goes as low as freaking 1.34 :/ what i find even more frustrating is that, im fairly sure my chip is great, why? because even at (vdrop during load) - 1.34vcore/1.4BIOS (@4.150mhz) the Linx test aint drop fail like 12 mins! its quite a good chip. So in order to avoid this big Vdrop, i had to increase the vcore to (huge 1.41), after that @WIN the default vcore is 1.40 and load is 1.36, now i can get the system stable this way but hey, 1.39 is totaly unnececarry for my cpu at idle....it could be stable at 1.35/1.37 during load! not 1.40 idle, is there anyway to work around this??? please help! its really frustrating...after i notice this im sure my chip can go even further, 4.2ghz easy...if i just find way to fix this, even this is a C0, but i guess a good one.


Few more questions,

1. Is this motherboard issue, BIOS issues or what?
2. Does ram, or any other components affect this?
3.Temps maybe? ( i got fantastic cooling, NH D14 + HAF 932, 1.41 vcore @4.1ghz max temp - 20mins LINX - during summer - 74c..
4 Anything other then this? chip degradation lol?

Does the new Z68/P67 have this issues as well?

P.S. LLC is on and also CPU Thermal Monitor is on, not sure if i should turn off this, it kinda scare me...

P.P.S. Both Cpuz and Eeasytune, show same vcore (during load) so its not false reading.

Use LLC2.

@psyside the only thing i can say is if your cpu needs that to be stable then thats what it needs and if the vdrop and vdroop are to much for you then you need a x58a-ud5 rev2. Also C0/c1 cpus need more vcore then d0's. If you dont want to buy a new motherboard or a cpu then you need to add more vcore to correct the problem. You could try Dvid. Set vcore to normal then dvid option can be changed. The left colum has your cpus Vid. lets say its 1.25. You need 1.4v for your overclock so you would set dvid to +0.1500 to equal 1.4v at load and vcore should drop at idle if c1e and intel speed step are enabled.

@fatbird orginal ud5 only has llc disabled or enabled no levels of llc. thats why he would need the newer ud5. It has standard=disabled level 1 and level 2.

[psyside]

@psyside the only thing i can say is if your cpu needs that to be stable then thats what it needs and if the vdrop and vdroop are to much for you then you need a x58a-ud5 rev2. Also C0/c1 cpus need more vcore then d0's. If you dont want to buy a new motherboard or a cpu then you need to add more vcore to correct the problem. You could try Dvid. Set vcore to normal then dvid option can be changed. The left colum has your cpus Vid. lets say its 1.25. You need 1.4v for your overclock so you would set dvid to +0.1500 to equal 1.4v at load and vcore should drop at idle if c1e and intel speed step are enabled.

@fatbird orginal ud5 only has llc disabled or enabled no levels of llc. thats why he would need the newer ud5. It has standard=disabled level 1 and level 2.

Thanks alot man,didnt knew i need c1 and speed step enabled, but will this reduce overlock (load test) stability?

One more thing, how is speed step labeled on GB mobos/BIOS?

Thanks one more time!

[acebmxer]

As for stabitly all depends on cpu motherboard/bios. my old ud5 could not do dvid think after 200 bclk. new ud5 has no dvid issues but ater FC bios i think i lost c3-c6 support after 200 bclk.
Some times Dvid can have less vdrop/vdroop not always.

Should be Eist under advanced cpu features

[psyside]

Thanks dude

[JustusIV]

Any thoughts on this guys? I have a UD5 board. My internet keeps dropping. Although i can ping anything on my network. So only internet goes down. It doesn't go down for anything on my network. I have bypassed my router even, same issue. reloaded windows same issue. Cables has been replaced. Both my nic's drop it. I am baffled and about ready to pitch the damn board because i cant play games like this. Looking for any ideas at this point. But I have tried pretty much everything but replacing the mobo with the onboard nic.

[acebmxer]

Any thoughts on this guys? I have a UD5 board. My internet keeps dropping. Although i can ping anything on my network. So only internet goes down. It doesn't go down for anything on my network. I have bypassed my router even, same issue. reloaded windows same issue. Cables has been replaced. Both my nic's drop it. I am baffled and about ready to pitch the damn board because i cant play games like this. Looking for any ideas at this point. But I have tried pretty much everything but replacing the mobo with the onboard nic.

I would start by recommending the basics. Update to the latest lan driver, make sure you have the latest bios version also might want to try to use a modded bios with the latest Lan rom.

Also are you running overclock. If you settings are not stable any more that could cause the nics to flake out.

[JustusIV]

I would start by recommending the basics. Update to the latest lan driver, make sure you have the latest bios version also might want to try to use a modded bios with the latest Lan rom.

Also are you running overclock. If you settings are not stable any more that could cause the nics to flake out.

Actually i found out the cause not sure why or what, but running two 5870's in crossfire caused it. Pulled one out and bam started working. I did all the basic's so something weird is causing it. Anyone have issues with running crossfire causing something similar? i ran a ping test that recorded and i dropped 8% of all pings. for a whole day. pulled the cards, haven't dropped one since.