Whats the best pump out there today?

[bloomstomb]

Im doing one huge loop, just wondering what pump to get. I already have a swiftech mc655 pump, and I plan on adding another on the opposite end of the loop.

[geoffsthaboss]

you just need one

[Navanod]

my my...what a big can of worms this thread just opened up
lol

[bloomstomb]

Is having 2 bad?

What can of worms did I just open ?


Thing is I already HAVE one of the swiftech pumps, so thought I could save some money by putting another one on the other end of the loop. The pump is swiftech mcp655.

Its going to be a realy big loop. Thank you all for the replies, please keep them coming.

[Utnorris]

It would be better to seperate the video cards from the cpu and create a second loop. This will keep the heat from the gpu's, which is a lot, from being dumped on the cpu. Not sure why you want to do one loop instead of 2. Use two PA120.2's or TFC's dual 120 rads instead of one 4 120mm rad. You will get better flow and temps from two loops vs. the single one you are proposing. Why are you trying to limit it to one loop?

[Waterlogged]

Is having 2 bad?

What can of worms did I just open ?


Thing is I already HAVE one of the swiftech pumps, so thought I could save some money by putting on on the other end of the loop.

Its going to be a realy big loop. Thank you all for the replies, please keep them coming.

The "can" you opened, is indeed fraught with peril. Some, like geoff, will indeed say the Iwaki. There is very little, if anything to dispute this. Problem is, you need a separate power supply to run it. Then others, like myself, will say the MCP355/DDC 3.2 is the best when paired with an aftermarket top. There are test numbers to prove this all over the place and are easy enough to find by searching. Then you also get others yet who will come in a proclaim the D5 is the best due to it's reliability and try to bludgeon anyone that says anything good about the DDC's because they had a pump or two die a very very long time ago when Laing was making a much older revision. They just can't seem to let go and move on, and this topic will spiral out of control until it's finally locked or deleted by some heavy handed mod.

That, is the "can" you have opened.

[NaeKuh]

.. Thread...

my my...what a big can of worms this thread just opened up
lol

cuz your talking about a man pump.



And a man pump requires its own psu:

[bloomstomb]

It would be better to seperate the video cards from the cpu and create a second loop. This will keep the heat from the gpu's, which is a lot, from being dumped on the cpu. Not sure why you want to do one loop instead of 2. Use two PA120.2's or TFC's dual 120 rads instead of one 4 120mm rad. You will get better flow and temps from two loops vs. the single one you are proposing. Why are you trying to limit it to one loop?

I have been using a single loop for a while now and already have the equipement in place for it. The single loop I have now is q6600 running at 3700mhz, NB of 680i and last on the loop is a overclocked 8800 ultra. Ultra never breaks 50c even under load.

So the reason I want to run on one loop is because I already have the equipement. 8 fans, the huge asskicking radiator.

Now I have heard alot of people say the q9550 runs cooler than the q6600 and that the gtx280 runs cooler than the 8800 ultras.

So all I am doing is adding another 2 cards (cooler running ones) to the end of the loop.

I fully believe this 480mm radiator will be able to carry this load and more, why wouldnt it? Anyway Im sticking with it. Infact Im thinking about throwing the SB and mofsets into the loop as well. My only concern is head. So I was just wondering if I could throw in another swiftech mcp655 on the loop or something else.

[IanY]

I say its not smart to run a giant loop. It would be wise to seperate your cpu from everything else, and the best practical pump for that is a DDC 3.2 with aftermarket top, or two of them in series.

As to Iwakis, its still not smart to lump your cpu along with everything else.

Your cpu is minutely temperature sensitive and has immense direct bearing on whatever overclocking you are doing, or none at all. The rest, such as the video card, and the NB/SB etc., will hardly make a difference with a 10 degree differential.

[Cutless009]

Why do you need a 2nd PSU to run the Iwaki? Surely if you had a 1200watt psu (or maybe even the 1600watt Ultra X3) you could run this on it?

[bloomstomb]

The "can" you opened, is indeed fraught with peril. Some, like geoff, will indeed say the Iwaki. There is very little, if anything to dispute this. Problem is, you need a separate power supply to run it. Then others, like myself, will say the MCP355/DDC 3.2 is the best when paired with an aftermarket top. There are test numbers to prove this all over the place and are easy enough to find by searching. Then you also get others yet who will come in a proclaim the D5 is the best due to it's reliability and try to bludgeon anyone that says anything good about the DDC's because they had a pump or two die a very very long time ago when Laing was making a much older revision. They just can't seem to let go and move on, and this topic will spiral out of control until it's finally locked or deleted by some heavy handed mod.

That, is the "can" you have opened.

Im with you there. I dont want to deal with another powersupply,so that leaves the expensive iwaki pump out the loop.

Can I use 2x mcp655's in the same loop? Can they both be connected to the motherboard for power? (I already have 1 and I could save alot of money by getting one more and calling it the day).

Also, what is a aftermarket top?


+ rep guys thank you for answering my questions. Awaiting responses.

[FuriousSalesman]

Why do you need a 2nd PSU to run the Iwaki? Surely if you had a 1200watt psu (or maybe even the 1600watt Ultra X3) you could run this on it?

The most a computer power supply can provide a pump is 12 volts. The Meanwell Auxiliary power supply can provide up to 24 volts of DC power. The Iwaki pump is rated for 24 v. The Meanwell also lets you dial the power lower to 18 volts or maybe lower. How do I know? Because I own one too.

[T_Flight]

I think the question is what is the "best" pump for you, since "best" is a relative term.

The Iwaki's are the Xtreme beast, and there is no doubt. All one has to do is look at the specs. They move water at bigtime flows...period. They require a 24v variable power unit though to run them and dial them back to their less than 18v sweet spot. The pump is large, but everything is relative. It is extremely powerful, and should last forever.

The MCP 655 is a good all around pump also if you were going to run in series you'd want matched pumps. The DDC 3.2 is slioghtly more efficient with a pump top now though, and the tend seems to be going it's way in the small pump market.

The DDC 3.2 is pretty much the best small pump out there. It pretty much requires a top to run it's best. It also really needs the larger fittings like most of us are using. Don't know what size you are using, but most of these aftermarket tops are made for G 1/4 fittings. They perform really well.

If you have alot of restrictive things in the loop dual pumps or an Iwaki might be good, but as was stated earlier when you get that much stuff heat dump becomes an issue and it's better to slit the loops up to dual or even 3. It's been said on here that this is the age of multi loop setups. As computing power increases I can see that becoming more and more common for the watercooler. It was almost nonexixtant 6 years ago, but now it's becoming the norm.

Personally I'm starting off with a single loop just for cost savings, and to learn with, but plan on going dual loop later. It really comes down to cost, and what you are looking for. The 3 I posted about are all good pumps. I;'ve read alot about them. Those are the chosen 3. If you go with any of those you really can't go wrong. Since I'm new and am buying all new stuff, I'm going with the DDC3.2 with new Petra Top when available, or may go with another Top depending on timing. Alex and the folks at Petra's have helped me alot and have been very nice, and have spent alot of their time helping me on the phone, so I'm gonna try and wait patiently for his new top.

There are lots of tests out there that have been done, and lots of info int he stickies that still applies. There are a great mnay threads on this subject also.

[bloomstomb]

I say its not smart to run a giant loop. It would be wise to seperate your cpu from everything else, and the best practical pump for that is a DDC 3.2 with aftermarket top, or two of them in series.

As to Iwakis, its still not smart to lump your cpu along with everything else.

Your cpu is minutely temperature sensitive and has immense direct bearing on whatever overclocking you are doing, or none at all. The rest, such as the video card, and the NB/SB etc., will hardly make a difference with a 10 degree differential.

Like I said, I have no choice in the matter. I make good money but I am no bottomless pit. I have to try and see if this works before I go spend another arm and a leg on another loop.

I do have one of the best and biggest radiators available, modified to be even better (with a hood). I was running my q6600 at 20 20 25 25 temps on idle at 1.5vbios 3700mhz, so like I said, I am not concerned about a COOLER RUNNING CPU q9550.

I do have the cpu first in the loop tho, obviously.


Thanks for the reply.

.

[bloomstomb]

I think the question is what is the "best" pump for you, since "best" is a relative term.

The Iwaki's are the Xtreme beast, and there is no doubt. All one has to do is look at the specs. They move water at bigtime flows...period. They require a 24v variable power unit though to run them and dial them back to their less than 18v sweet spot. The pump is large, but everything is relative. It is extremely powerful, and should last forever.

The MCP 655 is a good all around pump also if you were going to run in series you'd want matched pumps. The DDC 3.2 is slioghtly more efficient with a pump top now though, and the tend seems to be going it's way in the small pump market.

The DDC 3.2 is pretty much the best small pump out there. It pretty much requires a top to run it's best. It also really needs the larger fittings like most of us are using. Don't know what size you are using, but most of these aftermarket tops are made for G 1/4 fittings. They perform really well.

If you have alot of restrictive things in the loop dual pumps or an Iwaki might be good, but as was stated earlier when you get that much stuff heat dump becomes an issue and it's better to slit the loops up to dual or even 3. It's been said on here that this is the age of multi loop setups. As computing power increases I can see that becoming more and more common for the watercooler. It was almost nonexixtant 6 years ago, but now it's becoming the norm.

Personally I'm starting off with a single loop just for cost savings, and to learn with, but plan on going dual loop later. It really comes down to cost, and what you are looking for. The 3 I posted about are all good pumps. I;'ve read alot about them. Those are the chosen 3. If you go with any of those you really can't go wrong. Since I'm new and am buying all new stuff, I'm going with the DDC3.2 with new Petra Top when available, or may go with another Top depending on timing. Alex and the folks at Petra's have helped me alot and have been very nice, and have spent alot of their time helping me on the phone, so I'm gonna try and wait patiently for his new top.

There are lots of tests out there that have been done, and lots of info int he stickies that still applies. There are a great mnay threads on this subject also.

Thank you for taking your time . Your reply makes alot of sense to me and also helped me make my desicion of going with another mcp655.

I am in the same boat as you, and will go 1 loop, at least till it becomes necessary to go another loop.

But that said, I think my radiator deserves a second look by some of you guys trying to help me. Its a 480mm radiator with room for 4 120 mm fans. Thats pretty huge right?

And I have 8 120 mm fans doing the push pull deal to get even more heat dispersion.

Do anyof you use 2 loops with a bix 480?

[NaeKuh]

Butt kicking pump to match J/K

with 2 pumps on same rad will increase heat dump to the loop

winner! 26m head FTW!

[luxbel]

k, i have the q9550. now, my mega loop is also in the works. i don't have plans really to overclock, so not looking for the lowest temps possible. however, if you already have 1 MCP655, just get another one and run both at the same setting. you want, if you go down the route of two pumps, both of them to be exactly the same or as close as possible.

now, that being said, there are a few things i've seen around here:

best practice: multiple loops. people suggest this a lot. it has more to do with the fact that some are looking for the lowest temps possible to extend their overclocking abilities. this may or may not apply to you.

cost/efficiency: 2 loops - usually: CPU only, GPU + accessories in another. matter of taste on how you want to do this, but you'll have members here suggesting a CPU only for best cooling possible, and a secondary loop for everything else, as iany suggests.

if your case can accommodate either of the above, i would follow their advice.

if you're like me, with a small case, then remember: you're sacrificing cooling ability (the number of blocks will impact flow - which means you need to start looking at low restriction blocks and shortest tubing possible) because of the amount of heat you're dumping into the loop. My planned loop, since i'm still waiting for a couple of parts to finally get here, is cpu -> gpu -> sb -> nb -> mosfet 1 & 2 -> ram. without the ram block in the equation (or the flowmeter, for the moment being) i should be roughly at 1.2 to 1.4 GPM, more than enough as everyone suggests - all this with a mcp355 with an XSPC top. will i be able to overclock this beast? probably not much before i start affecting the temps of the entire system. do i care? not really.

but only you can answer that last question. do you care if you can overclock the q9550 on a mega loop?

[Utnorris]

The reason I say to split the loops is that you are adding two additional cards that run very hot. However, if you do want to run on single loop then I would grab another MCP655 exactly like what you have and then two EK D5 tops. I would then connect them in series, maybe using a sli or cf interconnect (http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...ducts_id=21542) rather than tubing, this would be the easiest way to add it into the system. This should give you plenty of flow, which is what I believe you are trying to get. I would also look at doing a push/pull fan setup on your rad to compensate for the added heat dump by the additional video cards. Notice I did not mention the added heat by the CPU, that's because you are correct that it will run cooler (should) than your Q6600, but 3 GTX280's will add a lot of heat into your loop that your single 8800 did not. Worse case scenario is that you can try this and if it does not get you the results you want then you can easily break it up. Good luck and make sure you post your results please.

[Shocker003]

You can try one of these out
http://www.aquatuning.de/product_inf...054-Pumpe.html
9m head

OR this

http://www.aquatuning.de/product_inf...Netzteil-.html
5,6m head

[Sadasius]

I am doing the same as you but instead of one 480 I have two 240 GTX's. I say you will be fine with what you are planning and don't need to split it in two loops. Just make sure your fans are good one's however especially if it is a GTX. They work better at medium high to freakin nuts speeds. Also remember that bleeding two pumps on one loop is extra fun too. You will have to run one pump first then the other when there is sufficient water in the loop. After that your shaking your case like a madman and making new curse words.

[Scubar]

Butt kicking pump to match J/K

with 2 pumps on same rad will increase heat dump to the loop

LoL. Makes the Iwaki look like a water pistol.

There isnt really a best pump because it depends on your needs. There are alot of pumps better than the Iwaki if you bother to look for them, chances of needing that amout of power though is extremely slim.

[Eddie3dfx]

Is the laing d5 more reliable than the Eheim 1046?

[AndrewZorn]

Reliability is going to be hard to compare with these pumps, for so many reasons:
- Unintentional abuse (running dry when bleeding, dyes/additives, corrosion)
- Revisions
- Chance

I think people still see D5 as the more reliable one because of its large/robust construction, and from the bad DDC3.2's from before.

I have a D5, but I don't think I fully understood the 3.2 when I bought it. The D5 was suggested for me on this forum.

[StAndrew]

I find it hard to believe a single MCP655 cant handle your loop. How many computers are you cooling?

Sure there might be better options (the MCP355 with its top seems to be a fav around here) but I dont think its worth the extra $$$.

Look at the heads on both, the 355 wins by about 1.5PSI. Im sure an aftermarket MPC655 top will help boost performance to at least match the MCP355.

Try this:
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ighlight=X-Top

[IanY]

Like I said, I have no choice in the matter. I make good money but I am no bottomless pit. I have to try and see if this works before I go spend another arm and a leg on another loop.

I do have one of the best and biggest radiators available, modified to be even better (with a hood). I was running my q6600 at 20 20 25 25 temps on idle at 1.5vbios 3700mhz, so like I said, I am not concerned about a COOLER RUNNING CPU q9550.

I do have the cpu first in the loop tho, obviously.


Thanks for the reply.

.

Hi Bloomstomb,

Do you live in the City or round about? In the context of NYC, "bottomless pit" has taken on whole new dimensions in this day and age.

Anyway, you appear very well heeled, with your triple SLI and quad ram and quad core machine. Expanding a second loop only requires a second pump and perhaps a second reservoir, unless you believe in T-lines.

The cost is really limited to the second pump plus a bit of incremental tubing, if even that.

Nevertheless, it was just a suggestion. If you want to stick to a single loop, the best approach would be an identical MCP655/D5, which you no doubt can use because some serious head pressure is required to plumb all those blocks.

Cheers to you and best of luck.