Breakthrough in TEC efficiency

[Baenwort]

According to http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...ficiently.html researchers at Ohio State, CalTech, and Osaka University have found a way to double the efficiency of Thermoelectric materials.

Anyone around here know how long it might take for this to trickle down to the pads we use?

[makaka]

hope soon , with doubled efficiency tec will be a real competitor to phase change , 226w (cooling module) require (400w) heat , now with the doubled efficiency they can get as low as 300w , this pretty good .
Edit the price has to be low also , i do not make sense to buy those module for > 50 $

[Uncle Jimbo]

According to http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...ficiently.html researchers at Ohio State, CalTech, and Osaka University have found a way to double the efficiency of Thermoelectric materials.

Anyone around here know how long it might take for this to trickle down to the pads we use?

That work is on lead telluride (PbTe) for power generation. For cooling, we use Bismuth Telluride (Bi2Te3). So unless someone tries to do some new doping of Bismuth Telluride TECs, this news doesn't have much application for cooling.

[Serpentarius]

That work is on lead telluride (PbTe) for power generation. For cooling, we use Bismuth Telluride (Bi2Te3). So unless someone tries to do some new doping of Bismuth Telluride TECs, this news doesn't have much application for cooling.

is there any difference of thermoeletric cooling is being reversed to the seebeck effect (power generation)?
or the other way round?

[Uncle Jimbo]

is there any difference of thermoeletric cooling is being reversed to the seebeck effect (power generation)?
or the other way round?

Seebeck discovered that you can generate electricity from heat with dissimilar metals. Peltier discovered that you can create a temperature differential by applying power to dissimilar metals.

So TECs used for power generation are usually called Seebeck devices, and those used for cooling, Peltier devices. Both use the same principles, but lead compunds (lead selenide and lead telluride mostly) are better for power generation - they give more power at a lower temperature differential.

Bismuth Telluride devices (the usual Peltier devices) give much higher temperature differentials but use more power to do it.

You can use a lead based Seebeck device for cooling if you don't need much temp differential. It doesn't make much sense to use a bismuth based device for power generation unless you have a large temperature differential, but some people do it - for example focused solar arrays using ground for cooling.

[Duh]

Seebeck discovered that you can generate electricity from heat with dissimilar metals. Peltier discovered that you can create a temperature differential by applying power to dissimilar metals.

So TECs used for power generation are usually called Seebeck devices, and those used for cooling, Peltier devices. Both use the same principles, but lead compunds (lead selenide and lead telluride mostly) are better for power generation - they give more power at a lower temperature differential.

Bismuth Telluride devices (the usual Peltier devices) give much higher temperature differentials but use more power to do it.

You can use a lead based Seebeck device for cooling if you don't need much temp differential. It doesn't make much sense to use a bismuth based device for power generation unless you have a large temperature differential, but some people do it - for example focused solar arrays using ground for cooling.

As always it is a real pleasure to attend to your lectures, I really enjoy your knowledge

[HDCHOPPER]

yes it is

[repsol_23]

That work is on lead telluride (PbTe) for power generation. For cooling, we use Bismuth Telluride (Bi2Te3). So unless someone tries to do some new doping of Bismuth Telluride TECs, this news doesn't have much application for cooling.

Man, and I was just starting to get my hopes up when I saw your post. Thanks for the info!!

[Scarlet Infidel]

You can use a lead based Seebeck device for cooling if you don't need much temp differential.

What kind of differential are we talking about (purely theoretically)? I'm only planning to use my peltiers with a 20c differential anyway (and might only need 15c with a more efficient peltier).

[Uncle Jimbo]

What kind of differential are we talking about (purely theoretically)? I'm only planning to use my peltiers with a 20c differential anyway (and might only need 15c with a more efficient peltier).

Well you also need a 100C hot side minimum - I don't think you will have much luck

[Scarlet Infidel]

Fair enough. Thanks anyway.

[Stigma]

Hmm well the day that peltiers get close to compressors in efficiency, thats the day you will see a revolution in how PCs get cooled. Highend motherboards will probably use them in stock cooling solutions for chipsets and such even. There is so much you could do with that kind of efficiency...

That said, I've heard this stuff many times before and I have yet to see anythign come of it. I cant remember the name of the company, but several years ago they claimed to have prototypes of a peltier-like device using a quantum tunneling effect that actually trumphed the carnot-efficiency of normal compressors by quite a lot. many years later its not like I've seen them available anywhere. if I could I'd gladly pay thogh the nose to get hold of a device like that.

I'm not saying its not gonna come some day eventually, but I won't be holding my breath. I'l instead be pleasantly surprised when someday in the future they are actually availiable for sale to regular consumers.

-Stigma

[Uncle Jimbo]

Hmm well the day that peltiers get close to compressors in efficiency, thats the day you will see a revolution in how PCs get cooled. Highend motherboards will probably use them in stock cooling solutions for chipsets and such even. There is so much you could do with that kind of efficiency...

That said, I've heard this stuff many times before and I have yet to see anythign come of it. I cant remember the name of the company, but several years ago they claimed to have prototypes of a peltier-like device using a quantum tunneling effect that actually trumphed the carnot-efficiency of normal compressors by quite a lot. many years later its not like I've seen them available anywhere. if I could I'd gladly pay thogh the nose to get hold of a device like that.

I'm not saying its not gonna come some day eventually, but I won't be holding my breath. I'l instead be pleasantly surprised when someday in the future they are actually availiable for sale to regular consumers.

-Stigma

TECs are already as efficient as compressors when set up right - you can get better than 3.5 CoP at 12% of Imax. SEER = COP x 3.792 so that's equivalent to a 13 SEER unit. But you can't get the large deltas of phase change at that efficiency. Still, if you need a simple set up and 10C below ambient, you can get there with TECs.

[HDCHOPPER]

Hmm well the day that peltiers get close to compressors in efficiency, thats the day you will see a revolution in how PCs get cooled. Highend motherboards will probably use them in stock cooling solutions for chipsets and such even. There is so much you could do with that kind of efficiency...

That said, I've heard this stuff many times before and I have yet to see anythign come of it. I cant remember the name of the company, but several years ago they claimed to have prototypes of a peltier-like device using a quantum tunneling effect that actually trumphed the carnot-efficiency of normal compressors by quite a lot. many years later its not like I've seen them available anywhere. if I could I'd gladly pay thogh the nose to get hold of a device like that.

I'm not saying its not gonna come some day eventually, but I won't be holding my breath. I'l instead be pleasantly surprised when someday in the future they are actually availiable for sale to regular consumers.

-Stigma

you should check out how chips are used in fighter jets

[leuler]

Hmm well the day that peltiers get close to compressors in efficiency, thats the day you will see a revolution in how PCs get cooled. Highend motherboards will probably use them in stock cooling solutions for chipsets and such even. There is so much you could do with that kind of efficiency...

That said, I've heard this stuff many times before and I have yet to see anythign come of it. I cant remember the name of the company, but several years ago they claimed to have prototypes of a peltier-like device using a quantum tunneling effect that actually trumphed the carnot-efficiency of normal compressors by quite a lot. many years later its not like I've seen them available anywhere. if I could I'd gladly pay thogh the nose to get hold of a device like that.

I'm not saying its not gonna come some day eventually, but I won't be holding my breath. I'l instead be pleasantly surprised when someday in the future they are actually availiable for sale to regular consumers.

-Stigma

http://www.coolchips.gi/
http://tempronics.com/pages/technology.html

[repsol_23]

Hmm well the day that peltiers get close to compressors in efficiency, thats the day you will see a revolution in how PCs get cooled. Highend motherboards will probably use them in stock cooling solutions for chipsets and such even. There is so much you could do with that kind of efficiency...

That said, I've heard this stuff many times before and I have yet to see anythign come of it. I cant remember the name of the company, but several years ago they claimed to have prototypes of a peltier-like device using a quantum tunneling effect that actually trumphed the carnot-efficiency of normal compressors by quite a lot. many years later its not like I've seen them available anywhere. if I could I'd gladly pay thogh the nose to get hold of a device like that.

I'm not saying its not gonna come some day eventually, but I won't be holding my breath. I'l instead be pleasantly surprised when someday in the future they are actually availiable for sale to regular consumers.

-Stigma

Well, if they were somehow available, I think we would be paying more than just through the nose! I did see something the other day in a link sent to me from my advisor that holds some promise. Might not be commercial anytime soon, maybe this is whats next for military use.

http://www.physorg.com/news125057974.html