**Unified** DFI LanParty UT 790FX-M2R-M2RS / Phenom /Data Base Thread**

[KTE]

Camp, lowering CPU voltages is exactly what looked like it killed my first 9600BE and since then I am no way going to try it. I started to overclock using lower than stock NB voltage and 1.28v CPU voltage. It went off pretty sudden with C1 errors and never restarted; the last changes I made before it happening for a week under load were lowering NB volts to 1.1v

I would be careful to void undervolting the NB, the common base in all my CPUs giving C1 errors after a while is undervolting the NB - overvolting CPU sub 1.5v is not the problem as long as you can keep the heat around 25°C below maximum core allowed temps.

There's nothing wrong with my current 9850, its the board that blew under load

As for "burn-in": that's a myth, electrically its impossible but there's a big difference between a common engineer and an engineering professor, mountains to moles difference, the latter are the ones who mainly design new CPUs and even they will not be able to explain a lot of CPU happenings we observe. What they "expect" is many times not what we "observe".

Find me one microprocessor engineer who can explain idle instability we all observe.
Find me one who can explain x setting stable, reboot, x setting failed, reboot, higher y setting stable.
Find me one who can explain CPU death after 8 weeks of stock use.
Find me one who can explain the C1 errors on clear CMOS.
Find me one who can explain IMC sudden death when undervolting.

I'll let you know in advance: none. They are strange unexpected behaviors.
In studies, no one is a demi-god, they are humans and they learn things through common laws. Some things are just not in our knowledge unless we have experience of it, simple as that. Everything is proven or negated by practical empirical results, not theory or what someone believes.

Needless to say, I've had these relations within my family for years now, so it's not like I'm going to listen to someone who has less knolwedge, expertise and experience on figuring out microprocessors. Strange, unexplained CPU happenings are still occuring with Phenom.

I've changed onto Abit board to checkout;
a) if the PWM blow with a 9850
b) if I still get idle instability..

[justapost]

Camp, lowering CPU voltages is exactly what looked like it killed my first 9600BE and since then I am no way going to try it. I started to overclock using lower than stock NB voltage and 1.28v CPU voltage. It went off pretty sudden with C1 errors and never restarted; the last changes I made before it happening for a week under load were lowering NB volts to 1.1v

Hmm but you have also tried high voltages and frequencies on the nb before you tried the lower settings if i remeber correct. Also you already had the freezing issues before. Can you remeber a phenom whom had the freezing issues right from the beginning without having applied +1.4V to the nb?
I'm not talking about my dead chip, he definately died due to some lowe level io action caused by sensors-detect.
For me the freezing issues started after i tried to find the nb-vid for 2.4GHz stable and had the system run for ~30hrs with nb-vid's above 1.4V. My 9600BE has had no freezing issues but was simply unstable at reasonable voltages above 2.6GHz. I never tried high nb clocks there and used low nb-vid's.

[KTE]

Hmm but you have also tried high voltages and frequencies on the nb before you tried the lower settings if i remeber correct.

Not on the 2nd 9600BE
Undervolted first to find max stable & max bench with stock voltages.

Also you already had the freezing issues before. Can you remeber a phenom whom had the freezing issues right from the beginning without having applied +1.4V to the nb?

Last 9600BE and this 9850BE. I've not given this one more than stock NB volts yet, its always 1.3VID which gives 1.288-80v under load.

That's why I never pushed the NB on this one, left NB at maximum 2400MHz and mostly 2000MHz because for me, both are easily load stable at stock volts.

However, I'm not sure what is stable with NB anymore.. XP, Vista and Linux are showing different levels of stability for each setting

[Brother Esau]

Camp, lowering CPU voltages is exactly what looked like it killed my first 9600BE and since then I am no way going to try it. I started to overclock using lower than stock NB voltage and 1.28v CPU voltage. It went off pretty sudden with C1 errors and never restarted; the last changes I made before it happening for a week under load were lowering NB volts to 1.1v

I would be careful to void undervolting the NB, the common base in all my CPUs giving C1 errors after a while is undervolting the NB - overvolting CPU sub 1.5v is not the problem as long as you can keep the heat around 25°C below maximum core allowed temps.

There's nothing wrong with my current 9850, its the board that blew under load

As for "burn-in": that's a myth, electrically its impossible but there's a big difference between a common engineer and an engineering professor, mountains to moles difference, the latter are the ones who mainly design new CPUs and even they will not be able to explain a lot of CPU happenings we observe. What they "expect" is many times not what we "observe".

Find me one microprocessor engineer who can explain idle instability we all observe.
Find me one who can explain x setting stable, reboot, x setting failed, reboot, higher y setting stable.
Find me one who can explain CPU death after 8 weeks of stock use.
Find me one who can explain the C1 errors on clear CMOS.
Find me one who can explain IMC sudden death when undervolting.

I'll let you know in advance: none. They are strange unexpected behaviors.
In studies, no one is a demi-god, they are humans and they learn things through common laws. Some things are just not in our knowledge unless we have experience of it, simple as that. Everything is proven or negated by practical empirical results, not theory or what someone believes.

Needless to say, I've had these relations within my family for years now, so it's not like I'm going to listen to someone who has less knolwedge, expertise and experience on figuring out microprocessors. Strange, unexplained CPU happenings are still occuring with Phenom.

I've changed onto Abit board to checkout;
a) if the PWM blow with a 9850
b) if I still get idle instability..

In short Tye its new technology and we are all learning even the engineers so there is no stead fast rules applied as of yet but we will work on that I reckon now won't we?

Theory is subjective for debate as you don't have to be right or wrong thats the beauty of theory I have had quite a time i the past overclocking Psychologists minds with that one when they try using them $10.00 Readers Digest Power Words when talking with me at parties and such they think they are so superior with all this B.S Psycho Babble they Utter you know figuring everyone is as dumb as a bag of bricks compared to them and what not .....So I see it as my duty to shut them down with that Theory sheet myself

[AlabamaCajun]

KTE, you are right Engineers come in many flavors just like carpenters. Architect designs a new house, framing carpenter puts up the walls, finishing carpenter trims it out. Neither one can really tell you what that house is going to do until it's lived in. Come back a few years later and find the garage closed in, gutters added and a door replaced. Things that were experiences of the home owner are somewhat off what the designer envisioned and he never lived there. I don't think there is enough time for chip makers to fully test CPUs today. The need for more power grows daily and competition once bitten turns up the heat.

I don't believe in the magical powers of burn in either but I can't rule out the first few hours you run a new MOBO that it doesn't change. Heat does change things and semiconductors are no exception but this happens within a couple of hours not something you can make happen over a few days. Violins and Guitars age with time and climate changes getting mellower over the years. Chips just are what they are. When CPUs are mounted they go through several tests that stress then under voltages and heat/cool cycles. By the time we get them, they are already "broken in". What I am seeing here through experience and the posts here is a BIOS that grows into out settings and chip settings. I'm taking an approach I used to with my old P4, take it up slowly and in increments and leave AOD alone. AOD was good to let me know where the potential is, now BIOS tweaks can get me to 2.7G+, my goal.

Last week I tried just setting the clock up to 206 and met the BSOD.
Yesterday I started the slow climb with just 204 and Auto Volts.

Today I went in and dropped the VCore to 1.28 and dropped HT to 1800M, saved then reset right after the Save to DMI.
This time I went in to BIOS and raised the clock to 205 and touched nothing else.

Finally the VCore reading in CPUZ is actually 1.28 and speed 2.56G (2.558... as these CPUs seem to have a lot of errors in speed).

"I now see tunnel at the end of my light"

[justapost]

Not on the 2nd 9600BE
Undervolted first to find max stable & max bench with stock voltages.
Last 9600BE and this 9850BE. I've not given this one more than stock NB volts yet, its always 1.3VID which gives 1.288-80v under load.

That's why I never pushed the NB on this one, left NB at maximum 2400MHz and mostly 2000MHz because for me, both are easily load stable at stock volts.

However, I'm not sure what is stable with NB anymore.. XP, Vista and Linux are showing different levels of stability for each setting

Crazy, good that i asked. I had the impression you are somewhat addicted to high NB clocks but have missed that you did not need that much voltage for em. My 9600BE however never ran above ~2.1GHz. Don't get me wrong, i', not a fan of an extreme undervolted nb. I try to find a limit where it starts to get unstable and normaly use 0.05V-0.1V above that for 24/7 use.
The chip stoppen working with 2GHZ nb at 1.3V however.

I contacted the lm-sensors developers and they might blacklist the board for smbus scanning. Meanwhile i'll try to read the sensors-detect code.

[AlabamaCajun]

Anyone have any idea what DFI is doing about these breakable-glass boards?
I guess having all these tweeks has it's drawbacks.

[dng]

i'm sorry if this question is inappropriate in this thread. i got my dfi 790fx dk m2rs board a few days ago. i finally got a chance to fire it up. i'm in the process of testing stability. i can't help, but notice this high pitch sound coming from the pc. anyone have this problem with this board? is there a fix? the sound is deafening and i'm thinking of an rma to newegg. please help.

[Rammsteiner]

AFAIk there's no fix. I think you can RMA it though, but there's a chance your new board has the same issue though.

[dng]

i see, . dare i say it, i'm going to rma for refund and get a different 790fx board. what's the alternative to the dfi? msi? gigabyte? please advise.

[stocius]

i see, . dare i say it, i'm going to rma for refund and get a different 790fx board. what's the alternative to the dfi? msi? gigabyte? please advise.

There is NO Alternative to DFI! jk,lol. I've seen some DFI users witch to Asus but haven't any results yet. Gigabyte or MSI should be ok.

[dng]

does the M2R have the high pitch sound? i wonder if i can even find the M2R anymore.

[stocius]

does the M2R have the high pitch sound? i wonder if i can even find the M2R anymore.

Mine doesn't but some M2Rs do and yeah you might have a hard time what with DFI discontinuing the board. I'll look around for you, if you want.

[Brother Esau]

i'm sorry if this question is inappropriate in this thread. i got my dfi 790fx dk m2rs board a few days ago. i finally got a chance to fire it up. i'm in the process of testing stability. i can't help, but notice this high pitch sound coming from the pc. anyone have this problem with this board? is there a fix? the sound is deafening and i'm thinking of an rma to newegg. please help.

The squeal happens sometimes just bad luck of the draw is all and all of them do not do it thats utter rubbish You can get the D.F.I LanParty UT 790FX-M2R Here.......http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=27484&vpn=LanPart%20UT%20790FX-M2R&manufacture=DFI

[dng]

thank you all for your help, but i might go with the msi. still have 14 days to decide if i want to do the rma. do you know why the high pitch sound? i really the dfi board. i had dfi lan party boards in the past withing the nf4. i switched to foxconn for the 590 and now i'm going back to dfi for the 790fx. if not for the annoying sound, this board is pretty sweet.

[justapost]

As said before I posted my dead cpu issue in the lm-sensors mailing list. Seems there is an similar issue already existing with the DFI Lanparty NF4 SLI Expert.

I mounted an X2 5000BE in the mobo and tried sensors-detect again. This time the system froze but booted without problems afterwards.

With help of jean from the mailinglist we tracked the problem down to an unknown SMBus device at 0x2e. This device seems to exist at the same address in the DFI Lanparty NF4. Probing that device causes the system to freeze here and to reboot on the NF4.

http://bugzilla.kernel.org/show_bug.cgi?id=5889#c18

[Slagathor]

ANy good bios updates laytely or is 415 still the best so far????

[stocius]

thank you all for your help, but i might go with the msi. still have 14 days to decide if i want to do the rma. do you know why the high pitch sound? i really the dfi board. i had dfi lan party boards in the past withing the nf4. i switched to foxconn for the 590 and now i'm going back to dfi for the 790fx. if not for the annoying sound, this board is pretty sweet.

How bad is the sound anyway? Is it nticeable over loud fans? I'm starting to hear things I may not like, but then again it's most likely nothing.

[dng]

it's loud even with loud fans and an open case. i wonder if a bios update will help. i'd much rather find a fix then do the rma. listening to this sound for a long period of time, can give me a headache or permanently damage my ears. i have another question, i migrated my 5000+BE and 4 sticks of crucial ballistix pc6400 from my foxconn 590 sli board to this dfi board. with the foxconn, i can oc to 236x14 with memory speed at 944 and 1:1. i can run the timings at 4-4-4-12 on the foxconn, but on this dfi 790fx board, i can't at all even with high vdimm. of course everything is left at default on both boards. the only thing i changed on the foxconn is the 4-4-4-12 timings. i have to run at default dram config on the dfi at 236x14. sorry, it's my first time using this chipset and the dfi bios is pretty intimidating.

[Jimmer411]

If you can go down with the cpu voltage after you upped the nb voltage it will fail, but after a longer time. That's what i found with the 9500 on the M3A. NB and CPU voltages operate completely independant, assuming that the cpu temperature does not exceed 60°C.

I have no clue why DFI-Engineers recommend the same settings for CPU-VID and NB-VID. I mean that is the benefit from split power planes. In CnQ if the cpu enters p-state-1 the cpu voltage will drop to 1.05V and the frequency to the half of the stock frequency, while the NB stays at stock frequency and voltage.For 2GHz NB-frequency my 9850BE required 1.175V NB-VID.

But I talked about the four SB/NB ... Voltages at the bottom of the PWM page. My system ran perfectly stable with all those at the lowest possible values, but i have a not so power consuming hd2600xt here.

@Jimmy411: Hmm how (un)usable AOD is (with the DFI board) was posted here a few times. It does not read the correct actual values and applies stock voltages to the cpu and the memory, that causes system hangup's if your already bios tweaked system does not run at those voltages.
You can enable some AutoXPress features via red-button mode whom can not be tweaked via the bios. Also you can easily modify single cpu multis with aod. Otherwise you'd need to tweak the p-state registers of the cpu to archieve the same effect. AOD's stability test and auto overclock function both do not find the idle freezing issue many phenom users get here.
Overclocking via the bios is definately more reliable atm.

Alright thats what I was looking for. Ive never been a fan of software based overclocking.


Anyone know if DFI has any plans to release a bios that enables the features enabled in red-button mode?


I was going to pick up a M2RS or non S but then SB750 was announced so Im holding off longer.

[*GameOver*]

Quick question. Has anyone tried lowering 3 cores to say 2.0 and then Seeing how far they can push the remaining core? or is that not a posablity. Seems to me as far as gaming goes that most games only really push one core hard and the rest are just used to 25 ~ 50% so you would gain alot more with one Real fast core and 3 smaller backup cores. My 9850 wont be here till tuesday so i cant test anything. Leme know please =)

Game

[Rammsteiner]

it's loud even with loud fans and an open case. i wonder if a bios update will help. i'd much rather find a fix then do the rma. listening to this sound for a long period of time, can give me a headache or permanently damage my ears.

Ive those noises too and other BIOS's dont fix it. Even worse, when your PC crashes there's a chance the sound is even worse untill you have it shutdown properly a few times.

The sounds are different each time, when Prime95 just completed a test the sound changes etc. If I open Memset the board makes a very scary sound IMO.

But thus far it simply works, and with some nice speakers almost plaing music 24/7, a HD3870 fan fixed at 70% it's barely noticeable for me. Or maybe I got used to it, in the end I got used to a Vantec 92mm Tornado fan too

[KTE]

Thanks for the details Achim

I have not had those weird noises on any board yet with Phenoms BTW.

I am running 2700/2800/2700/2800 stock voltage stable nearly 20 hours now ...
Benched 2800/2900/2800/2800 stock volts too.
Looks like I'm making headway, one core is most likely weak but the rest strong -- that's the one that causes a freeze at the 10-18 hour mark. Trying to figure out which one.
Next setting will be 2800/2800/2700/2800 and you know why...

[dng]

KTE: i've been following your thread on the msi plat. looks like i might have to get this board instead. the high pitch sound is unbearable even if the pc is loud and i have background noises. it's the kind of sound that just pierce thru everything. any advice on the msi board? what's the latest bios? please let me know. thanks.

[KTE]

KTE: i've been following your thread on the msi plat. looks like i might have to get this board instead. the high pitch sound is unbearable even if the pc is loud and i have background noises. it's the kind of sound that just pierce thru everything. any advice on the msi board? what's the latest bios? please let me know. thanks.

Yeah I've heard the sound before, I know what it sounds like.

Latest BIOSes: http://www.msi-forum.de/thread.php?threadid=35629
Best is 1.13B though from November 16th, has all oc options you need with Phenom but for downcore/single core control.
Most stable and with most compatability is BIOS 1.40.
Board will be fine below 1.525v loadline real on a 125W CPU -- after that you are better off with other better, more costly PWM boards.
For Phenom, either get fully compatible 1066 RAM or have some 1066 RAM with some 800 RAM nearby, as when you clear CMOS//pull power plug with something not officially supported, Phenom might give C1 error at startup until you put some 800 rated RAM in there.

Advice? If you have Phenom, keep voltage as low as you can whilst overclocking - by that I mean clock one core at a time before moving up whilst leaving NB stock or very close to stock. Or you might be stuck oc'ing and figuring it out for 6-7 months like us.

All boards are suffering from similar Phenom related problems, mainly BIOS, apart from the PWM screeches.

I'm on Abit AX78 for now, not the MSI.