Pigs flying comment was not to do with CDT process or whether it works or not.
It was with regards to your allowing someone independent into your benching room to monitor some SPI runs, since many people cried cheat.
Pigs flying comment was not to do with CDT process or whether it works or not.
It was with regards to your allowing someone independent into your benching room to monitor some SPI runs, since many people cried cheat.
oh so you can just forget about how it works and go back to what you thinkOriginally Posted by T_M
because everyone cried that and you can just follow
Last edited by Onepagebook; 11-04-2007 at 07:43 PM.
I think this a good case of "lost in translation".
Taking it to PMs.
1.- There are now a lot of varians from CDT (as well as for Copy wazaa) that its difficult to really know if thats the whole point. Theory still works if you can apply it.OK, since you are the author of tweak maybe you will be willing to answer a few questions
1. Is CDT described here correct?
2. Is it full tweak or only 60% as someone mentioned here?
3. Should we see better results than CW if it is only 60%?
4. Should it be working on XP or is this specific to 2k3?
5. Any special registry tweaks without which CDT won't work as good?
2.- I think Kev said this is 60% of the tweak, Actually, it is, but also its not.
In practice, what you see here (the tweak and how to do it) is 100% complete. Even Kevin added some extra comments on pre-job and how to get benching OS ready. In theory, thats were I can say its about 60% or probably less. Still, what its posted already, works, but notneccesarily its the whole theory and arguments behind it.
3.- Probably Yes, since its 100% practically for almost every guy, but you also can get better results with a lot of variations out there.
4.- Yes.
5.- Probably the ones mentioned on Pre benching and all the tweaks you know are neccesary for manage it.
Chill out guys. You'll look low if you wage war over a virtual paper you can't even touch which runs an automated calc we do not control...Let's just standardize and perfect the method, then test and give appropriate feedbacks and try to collaboratively explain what we can.
I can say that SCSI U160 has slower SPi times than an ATA. I was going to test C2D with that too, but I've given up. Its because of the XP check FLAGS when writing to the SCSI that add latency. W2k doesn't suffer from this AFAIK.
I STIL see bulls coming and going around here........
IF a user asks questions about the "tweak" and "someone" responds with pigs flying and things like that, HOW is it possible to continue talking?.... How the user could understand what the other user wants to say?....
IF we aren't getting answers to our questions here, I see THREE things is gonna happen:
1. ONLY OBP has the BEST time in 32M at 3.6GHz in the whole PLANET
What is this that gives him THAT MUCH boost to get ~10 - 15sec LESS than Copy Waza and other tweaks?...... and we are talking about a 20 - 25sec LESS time of a run without Copy Waza and things....
2. Users are gonna start dissapointing more and more of the:
a. not hepling them with more infos IF ANY and
b. having OPB talking bad to them so they will STILL OR JUST STARTING now not to like him nor his additude after all and NO MATTER how much they're trying to be friendly to him and "understand" his point of view, they will finally give it up.
3. QUIT this silly conversation and everyone goes back to his work and OPB to his reviews that he does quite well.......
Someone please come up with the WHOLE "Tweak" IF ANY, so we start testing seriusly and cut the craps.....
INTEL PWA FOR EVER
Dr. Who my arss...
.........
Bsically, I stand my point is correct, if there anyone is see me as pig or cheater, please don't bother to try it and make the whole CDT just look really bad, because you did making it wrong with whole lots of work, then it's still wrong.Then Why bother, and that's the point to keep in mind that if YOU are gonna just accuse me as bulls or cheater again, and I believe I will be with you and have the war contiuned, cuz I don't care you wanna make me a friend or not.
Master Hipro5 say it very correct, basically as long as I come here and post again, I don't even keep those childish in mind, but at least speak like him, I would highly appreciate that. Honestly we are discuss a theory to help people around the world, not argue who is better tweaker in OC.
Not a reply to your post George but something in general I'd like to say that your post reminded me is the emoticon
I can do some real-life XS testing on that if you'd like...
Thanks kain for taking the time to answer some questions.1.- There are now a lot of varians from CDT (as well as for Copy wazaa) that its difficult to really know if thats the whole point. Theory still works if you can apply it.
2.- I think Kev said this is 60% of the tweak, Actually, it is, but also its not.
In practice, what you see here (the tweak and how to do it) is 100% complete. Even Kevin added some extra comments on pre-job and how to get benching OS ready. In theory, thats were I can say its about 60% or probably less. Still, what its posted already, works, but notneccesarily its the whole theory and arguments behind it.
3.- Probably Yes, since its 100% practically for almost every guy, but you also can get better results with a lot of variations out there.
4.- Yes.
5.- Probably the ones mentioned on Pre benching and all the tweaks you know are neccesary for manage it.
Would it be possible to take some of your time to go thru the method i used yesterday and you can correct me on the glaring mistakes i made to cause my CDT effort to fall way short?
I´ve been very busy those days (still until wednesdayThanks kain for taking the time to answer some questions.
Would it be possible to take some of your time to go thru the method i used yesterday and you can correct me on the glaring mistakes i made to cause my CDT effort to fall way short?) Even that, can you post step by step what youve done to manage Cache diversing?
I can help you in that way I think, but sorry if I get too slow because I have a lot of work.
i think thats what we need to focus on, copywaza is basically designed to push your available system cache as close to maxmem as possible, whereas cdt is about balancing your cache diversity, ive been playing with this alot, and im consistently getting 2-3 seconds faster with the methods opb described than my normal copywaza method!
No worries Kain
Here's step by step what i did:
1. Reasonably clean Windows XP SP2 with all updates. Set up OS maxmem=600, pagefile=515~512 in SuperPI partition, and registry large system cache / clear pagefile on shutdown. Set Windows to run in Diagnostic Mode.
2. Set up CDT-IV folders and 3 x 632Mb files. I created the files using 1024x1024x632=662700030.
3. RAR the 3 CDT files into a single uncompressed .rar of size 1.85Gb.
4. Run OPB Cleaner
5. Reboot
6. Open SuperPI and prepare to run 32M, pause at 'Click OK to begin'.
7. Copy RAR file from SuperPI partition to other partition (note it was not to my C:\) - (1)
8. Rest
9. Copy RAR file from SuperPI partition to other partition - (2)
10. Rest
11. Copy RAR file from SuperPI partition to other partition - (3)
12. Rest
13. Check task manager and see 53xxxx / 54xxxx, or 55xxxx / 55xxxx, or 54xxxx / 53xxxx, or even 50xxxx / 54xxxx .
14. Run SuperPI
If you can please give me some pointers on anything in the above that would cause CDT to not give a better boost than just copying across a single large random file.
I even tried "balance method" where after doing CDT (3 copies) out of the SuperPI folder, i then returned all 3 files back into the SuperPI folder and my time was 1s slower, although both my Available and System Cache were higher (but balanced).
Well, your metho is completely different from what has been described bro.
pagefile 512-512 in some way will work with your system available memory and cache. How many partitions are you using? Which is your OS partition? (or why did you moved to another than D: ?
Did you check then your HD was defragmented?
I wouldnt say that, given that i have the same pagefile, set on the SuperPI partition, i have the same maxmem, the same file sizes, same RAR size, copy 3 times the same, find that my task manager gives generally the right numbers the same.
The trouble is i was not totally sure what has been described, as its been re-written about 15 times in different languages and by different people.
This post here: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...25&postcount=2 says to use 512~512 pagefile, supposedly an instruction from OPB himself.
The disk I was using has about 8 partitions of 6Gb (for OS's) and another of about 20Gb and another of 400+Gb.
The reason i couldnt copy the RAR between SuperPI partition and OS was because the 3 x RAR files are too big for my OS partition. If i could just overwrite the file each time then i could do it to the OS partition, but OPB's instructions were not to overwrite.
Partitions were only defragged using Windows XP defrag, and not necessarily prior to the run. Is that important too?
You mention "moved to D:", but the instructions say from from D:\ to C:\, is that what you meant?
Last edited by T_M; 11-05-2007 at 10:01 PM.
I'll be honest with you, Elmor made it pretty crisp clear when he wrote his method and his subsequent replies. After that I find it hard to believe why people are still faulting to follow basic instructions he wrote down one by one and so have others many times. The only reason I could think is, is there another post somewhere I've not read where all these differences are coming from? Or some behind the scenes conversations where people are building on their misunderstandings with other than the guys who have ran it successfully? Because you're not the first and I doubt the last even, but your method was different to what was stated T_M.
FWIW I started reading the CDT thread very late on and followed the last post by OPB/Elmor and was able to do it (albeit not perfectly). If I errored repeatedly, complained to make it clearer and that I don't understand it many times over with how George wrote down to do the CW step by step, the answer I'd get is " <rolleyes> dude go back and read it again, its all there" or just be ignored and mocked. People would get fed up of me. I'm being genuinely frank with you, you can't make it much more simpler, there is no hidden magic or conspiracy trash, what you need to do is all written there and by people adding, detracting and saying stuff about it which Kev did not say or affirm, all this confusion comes about. This is the full method: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&postcount=31
Kain is right you know. Your method is different to what OPB/Elmor stated and different to what I followed and understood by what they wrote too. Still v.good that you're trying genuinely. I'm not speaking on your qs because its best since you asked Kain, that he advises you instead so no more confusion comes about. Its bad enough as it is.
-Copying a single random file across does not give me any gains whatsoever (tried).If you can please give me some pointers on anything in the above that would cause CDT to not give a better boost than just copying across a single large random file.
I even tried "balance method" where after doing CDT (3 copies) out of the SuperPI folder, i then returned all 3 files back into the SuperPI folder and my time was 1s slower, although both my Available and System Cache were higher (but balanced).
-As I listed before, you have to copy the RAR 3) to the SPi drive and 2) to a folder on the SPi drive too. This is intricate to the method.
-Why did you reboot?
-Why did you not overwrite the 1.85GB files each time?
CW does not make a difference in my case many times. Could someone explain that and give me pointers as to why not and how to get a boost everytime? Most likely not because I follow their method step by step. Such idiosyncrasies are there to stay IMO, just like you can pour LN2 in a tube and get 57xx clocks as your highest while another guy on a different day using the same hardware may pour it the same way and be able to achieve 58xx. We don't try and critique that or its underlying principles, we just know what we observed and experienced because its out of our control how a processor will behave. It would be awfully ignorant and jealousy of the first person to say "lol dude thats flat out fake even a pigeon can see that, you cheated, I ran the same damn thing and the processor does NOT go above 57xx, NO WAY!!"
Because i was trying to follow OPB's (the originator) method, in the second post of this thread.
Yes.
Im pretty sure i knew that when the tweak was not working for me, hence my repeated requests to ask someone who can get it to work where am i going wrong (and i dont want to hear another "its just wrong"!)
- Definately gives me gains, in the order of 10s. Which would likely be due to the much increased system cache value (look at my task manager i posted after bootup which only has 1xxxxxx)
- I rebooted because nobody told me not to
- I did not overwrite the 1.85Gb file each time because OPB's instructions say not to (second post in this thread)
Correct, and i never did.It would be awfully ignorant and jealousy of the first person to say "lol dude thats flat out fake even a pigeon can see that, you cheated, I ran the same damn thing and the processor does NOT go above 57xx, NO WAY!!"
Anyhow, looks like i'll need to go back to the ol' drawing board and see if i can better follow the post you just linked me to.
BTW, where did you get the info from OPB on 'balancing' by copying back to SuperPI partition?
Last edited by T_M; 11-06-2007 at 12:49 AM.
That's bad...
You're adding stuff to instructions now.
- I did not overwrite the 1.85Gb file each time because OPB's instructions say not to (second post in this thread)
Jon and Kev both mentioned it. You have to move back the RAR from the first place you copied it to back where you copied it from the first time around.BTW, where did you get the info from OPB on 'balancing' by copying back to SuperPI partition?
Last edited by KTE; 11-06-2007 at 01:01 AM.
This is what confused me on that overwriting stuff.
So, in summary it would be:
1. Setup OS with maxmem, pagefile, etc, OPB Cleaner and then reboot
2. Open SuperPI and prepare to start 32M
3. Create 3 x 632Mb files in a folder (location important?), then RAR them into 1 .rar located in the SuperPI partition
4. Copy that .rar file to C:\ 3 times
5. Copy that .rar file to xxxxxxxxxxxx(?) 3 times from yyyyyyyyy(?)
6. Copy that .rar file back to SuperPI partition 3 times from C:\
7. Wait for taskmanager to balance
8. Run PI
Never heard of the copying it 9 times, so can you advise me on step 5 above?
Last edited by T_M; 11-06-2007 at 01:33 AM.
Another question, you linked me to elmor's method, which was to RAR the file on a seperate laptop, then transfer the RAR onto his computer for use.That's bad...
You're adding stuff to instructions now.
That would indicate to me that the reboot i did should have no effect. Correct?
It is 9 times total like I mentioned.
1. Why reboot though? I didn't reboot and nor did Kev so there was no reboot in the method he mentioned. What happens if you don't reboot, any change?
3. Doubt it. I always have one 3x632MB RAR made already in the SPi partition.
4. From SPi partition to another partition, yup.
5. Copy it from SPi partition to a folder on that partition, i.e. if SPi partition is D:\ then copy the RAR you have on D:\ to D:\CDT\
The rest is right as they mentioned and what I ran.
Great, thanks for a pointwise response
You have mentioned "another partition", not C:\ so i presume then i can use any other partition and not the one that my OS is installed on?
Will do some tests tonight and report back with the differences to my previous runs
After all the good advice from KTE, i thought i might finally see some better results, so i tested again last night (albeit a bit faster) on QX6850 @ 3600MHz (8 x 450), DDR3 running 12xx 6-8-6-15-xxxxx:
1. Create 3 x 632Mb files then RAR them into 1 .rar located in the SuperPI partition. Setup OS with maxmem, pagefile, diagnostic mode, OPB Cleaner and then reboot
2. Open SuperPI and prepare to start 32M
3. Copy that .rar file from SuperPI partition to OS partition 3 times (overwriting, with pause in between to rest taskmanager)
4. Copy that .rar file from SuperPI partition to SuperPI:\CDT folder 3 times (overwriting, with pause in between to rest taskmanager)
5. Copy that .rar file from OS partition to SuperPI partition 3 times (overwriting, with pause in between to rest taskmanager)
6. Wait for taskmanager to balance at 56xxxxx / 56xxxxx
7. Run PI
Tested using 8M first:
No tweak: 2m 58.547s
CDT tweak: 2m 57.000s
Single 4Gb file copy: 2m 56.859s
Tested second with 32M:
No tweak: 14m 11.188s
CDT tweak: 14m 01.969s
So, my results are still no better than copying a single large file from one unrelated partition to another.
Am i going wrong by pausing in between each file copy?
Last edited by T_M; 11-07-2007 at 08:43 PM.
Tim how long do you pause
make sure your available and system cache don't drop to standard idle figures otherwise you will probably see no benefit
probably a good idea to have Windows Task Manager Performance Tab open so you know where you're at
In between each file copy i pause until the available and system cache both stop moving, and are generally 5xxxxx / 5xxxxx.
Each copy has task manager running to show me.
Keep on trying.........IF you see any good resault out of it, let us know.....
INTEL PWA FOR EVER
Dr. Who my arss...
.........
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