Gigabyte MA790FX DQ6

[Fulgore0rb]

EDIT: Just got another answer from Gigabyte. Apparently since Prime95 wasn't written for Vista... they don't seem to consider instability of that application a problem; they want to know what else has problems. Okay... how about the Vista OS itself. It reboots itself with nothing else running while using the Gigabyte DS5 motherboard at default settings. I'd say that was a "slightly bad" thing.

I am SO getting fed up with their responses.

@Keithlm: If your running that memory at 1066 still I'd suggest you try running Memtest86+ for 10 passes on just Test#5.

Now that I'm not running 64bit Seti@home I haven't had a crash- something with 64bit is jamming up the works- I'll blame Gigabyte since my CPU has been tested on an ASUS board with 64bit PC Mark Vantage. 32bit Seti@home is just fine.

[KTE]

I'm on my 3rd Phenom and 3rd Mobo and they all actually act pretty much the same reguardless of settings. I see these guys with 3.x Ghz benchies and can't help but think they are all just Suicide Shots, benchable but not stable...

Hehehe

[Daveburt714]

Hehehe

You making fun of me man...

Guess I was a little disgruntled that night....
Anyway, I got my K9A2 back today, a day early even! Thanks UPS and MSI...

I'm gonna pull the chip in a few minutes and put the 96BE back in the DS5 so I can do some testing with the K9A2 and the 9850....

I'm sure it's gonna hit 3.5 stable!!!

I'll let ya folks know my results, and hopefully at least give you a clue as to how many of my problems (if any) were related to the DS5 itself...

[Daveburt714]

Ok Folks... It's like 3 hours, and 6 beers later..

Maybe it's because I was weened on the K9A2 w/Phenom, but this board just feels SO MUCH BETTER... Granted this is an early evaluation, and I'm not sure where it's going to end up, but I can tell you that it makes alot more sense than the DS5 ever did with the 9850!!

Marginally better on the CPU clock (2.8 seemed stable) and substantialy better on the NB clock, 2400 seems doable! I couldn't even get Stock 2000 on the DS5...

I'm using the 1.4 Bios, that came installed on my RMA'd board... The one wierd thing is that reguardless of what I set my Mem V's at it cranks them up to 2.16v's, higher than I would like, but if your running a DS5 turning up Mem V's might help stability...

Oh well, it's frikin late, guess I need to go to bed... Early evaluation though is that DS5 Bios definetly has problems!

[KTE]

Nay, I would never do that. Did you click my links?
Basically, what I'm point to is: my CPU is not a great one, infact its below average. 2756MHz is max fully stable on all 4 cores at once at <any voltage>

But, individually clocked, I can run 3000/2900/2700/2800 at stock volts perfectly fine
Granted I'm on a board that allows no more than 1.38v maximum.

Also, I'm testing 210HT at the above multis now and its running fine, 1.38v. Don't know how long it'll last.

Keep in mind, max stable is 3055 1.35v on all cores in stability testers.

I beleive yours is better

[Aussie FX]

Ok Folks... It's like 3 hours, and 6 beers later..

Marginally better on the CPU clock (2.8 seemed stable)

Dave, you should have had 12 beers then you might have got to 3.5.

I'm sure it's gonna hit 3.5 stable!!!

You need a DQ6 for that.

[dyeager]

Back to the Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5, the Phenom x4 9850, and 1066 RAM for a moment. I have had my system for almost a month. Yet to get any real use out of it.

It passed diagnostics but the PC was not stable from day 1. Ready boost was immediately jettisoned. Power supply was temporarily exchanged with a larger unit from another pc -- no difference. Found the 1066 settings in the bios too limiting for anything other than automatic with unganged 4 modules, which was subpar compared to the memory specs (memory vendor gave up – now there is a notation on some memory sites that 1066 memory support is limited to one channel – shouldn’t unganged get around this?). Processor died a slow death over 2 weeks, finally registering error on diagnostic tests – exchanged . Have also had some other crazy problems. Now I have it so it only crashes every couple of days. I have to remove the battery to get it to restart after it freezes. Gigabyte had me test it with a “supported” processor. I will likely exchange the motherboard and reload the OS.

I have done some tests with overclocking the CPU and graphics, but I must get it stable first. I think most of the difficulties in this thread are due to multiple issues, which definitely includes the bios.
*** I was told by gigabyte earlier today that a bios update to support phenom 9850 could be released in a week or two.

>>> What 1066 memory do people have working in a stable system using 4 modules? Is anyone getting full memory spec speeds?

P.S.: My failed processor was not overvolted. It did run 10 degrees Celsius hotter than the replacement. My system temps are in the 30’s.

[G0ldBr1ck]

>>> What 1066 memory do people have working in a stable system using 4 modules? Is anyone getting full memory spec speeds?

I finely got around to pulling out my crappy G.Skill 2x2g ram and puting in 4 sticks of CORSAIR Dominator DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) and this solved all my problems with the ram finely. No stability problems at all at 1120Mhz 5.5.5.15 22 2t. Im so very happy at last! Now I just hope i can get a refund on the G.Skill ram. I havent tryed to OC the dominator's anymore at all yet. this was just the first settings i booted with and havent messed with it sence.

seems to be the perfect ram for the phenom and DQ6. I would assume the DS5 as well.

[Fulgore0rb]

...Now I have it so it only crashes every couple of days. I have to remove the battery to get it to restart after it freezes. Gigabyte had me test it with a “supported” processor. I will likely exchange the motherboard and reload the OS.

Funny, I asked gigabyte support about if they had plans to add 9850 support and they said "The 9850 shouldn't be an issue with the latest BIOS [F5]"

... I would assume the DS5 as well.

HAHA you'd be surprised- I bet this thing has a self-destruct built into it.


On another note: I have two different half-way 'decent' dialogs going with Gigabyte support (decent meaning they actually seem to be comprehending more than 10&#37; of what I say and respond in something higher than pidgin english- which is rather sad since they require the question to be in english in the first place).

Dialog 1: Phenom support is flawed- and I can proove it with a 64bit application that runs fine with a non-phenom but freezes a Phenom everytime on the DS5. -They insist I use a non-phenom on my board before they investigate. Honestly WE are doing every bit of troubleshooting for these guys....

Dialog 2: Maximum tRC setting in the BIOS is 42 @1066... And I HAVE TO PROOVE IT WITH A SCREENSHOT before they acknowledge my request to increase the supported rating... WTF do these guys really not know anything about their own BIOS?!?

I think that certainly finalizes it- This is DEFINATELY the first and LAST Gigabyte motherboard I'll ever own... 'Tech support' shouldn't be this ignorant and stuborn to provide tech support.

[G0ldBr1ck]

Fulgore0rb: The Dominator ram I spoke of only needs 22 tRC for EPP. all other timings are correctly set as well.

Ditch the G.Skill you wont regret it. It was made to run on Intel chipsets only. with completly diffrent timings then the on die Mem controllers are capable of.
Even if you got the G.Skill runings with a bios fix at the correct EPP Timings. its only gonna be performing to the Intel mem controller performance lvl. Almost completly defeating the advantage of the IMC's.

This is my logical deduction anyway. with 9850be@3.0ghz and the same G.skill ram you have at 800mhz my 3d score was 15704. then i changed the ram out to the Dominators and changed nothing else at all just ran the dominators at 800mhz with its correct timings 5.5.5.15-22 t2. And my 3d score went to 15815.

I then set it to 1066 with small oc to 1120 And not a single problem.

[keithlm]

Fulgore0rb: The Dominator ram I spoke of only needs 22 tRC for EPP. all other timings are correctly set as well.

Ditch the G.Skill you wont regret it. It was made to run on Intel chipsets only. with completly diffrent timings then the on die Mem controllers are capable of.
Even if you got the G.Skill runings with a bios fix at the correct EPP Timings. its only gonna be performing to the Intel mem controller performance lvl. Almost completly defeating the advantage of the IMC's.

This is my logical deduction anyway. with 9850be@3.0ghz and the same G.skill ram you have at 800mhz my 3d score was 15704. then i changed the ram out to the Dominators and changed nothing else at all just ran the dominators at 800mhz with its correct timings 5.5.5.15-22 t2. And my 3d score went to 15815.

I then set it to 1066 with small oc to 1120 And not a single problem.

Actually that ram is "optimized" for Intel. It does not mean that it is "intel only".

For me the RAM ran with no problems on the DFI 790FX-M2R board. It can't run worth a darn on the Gigabyte 790FX-DS5. (And as your 3dMark06 scores show... there is not much of a difference.)

If (and hopefully when) Gigabyte actually fixes their bios... this ram should be just fine. It might be possible that Micron ram could run a bit faster... but not really enough to matter. (100 points in 3dMark06 is not enough to count.)

EDIT: Bios timings are not an exact science. They did not design and create this memory "just for Intel". They created the memory and discovered that it works at such and such timing; which may favor Intel. But that doesn't mean that if you change something else... like tRFC=195ns... that many of the requirements for the other timings might change enough to work. It also doesn't mean that it is "Intel ONLY".

[HeamothoraxUK]

Hi All,
Bios F5C for DQ6 is available for download from
Gigabyte site.

[G0ldBr1ck]

keithlm: Yes, I completly understand all that. But the fact that G.Skill has the ram listed for use with intel chipsets means that Gigabyte has no obligation to acomodate this ram and probly wont. The G.Skill just did not like running outside of its EPP timings at all and these boards cannot offer the timings needed. Therefore its usless to me at least for now with this setup.

[Daveburt714]

Just a quick update Folks... Here are my current useable settings after only 2 days with the K9A2 (I won't say stable yet, not enough testing):

Keep in mind the best I could get on the DS5 with this chip was 2.7 with a 1980 NB, and a 1500 HTT!!

Aussie:I know it's not 3Ghz, but it's a helluva lot better than what was getting with the DS5.. I get the feeling that there are alot more differences between DQ6 & DS5 than we initially thought!

KTE:I didn't realize your smilies were links. I'm assuming you used AOD for testing, do you have a system for core clocking? Just wishful thinking... I'm sure it's just turn one core up at a time and wait to see if it crashes (sigh...)

Keithlm:I agree with you, I don't think there is anything wrong with the G.Skill kits. If anything it's the fact that the DS5 just doesn't handle 2x2Gb very well...

HAHA you'd be surprised- I bet this thing has a self-destruct built into it.

This was my first experience with GBT too. Needless to say, I'm not too impressed either....

[keithlm]

Apparently the DS5 does not support the 9850.

I just received this from Gigabye: (oops spelled it wrong. But then maybe NOT.)

The 9850 processor is currently still being validated by our testing department. Please revert back to an different processor for now until the validation is complete and whether if passes all tested, if so the processor will be updated and listed on our support list

I'm looking very closely at the Nvidia offerings now. But I'm still partial to the DFI.

Gigabyte doesn't appear to be very receptive to supporting the "premium" AM2+ CPU on their middle of the line AM2+ motherboard.

Luckily I am not poor... so I can write them off and move on and buy something from a company that appears to actually want to support the AM2+ CPU and get rid of this obvious nightmare.

I am actually almost to the point of NOT CARING even if they DO come out with a new bios in the next few days... by then I will be so fed up that I will DEFINITELY not care.

BTW: DO NOT BUY A GIGABYTE MOTHERBOARD. IT IS GARBAGE. I'm not usually this vocal... but this is BEYOND unacceptable. It is a travesty.

Very sad considering they list support for the 9850 on the DS4 and the DQ6. Apparently they may not support the 9850 on their "premium" garbage that they are currently selling as something that is "in between" their other two motherboards that DO support the 9850.

(Which makes no sense since it is BETTER than the DS4. But so be it. That is ENOUGH FOR ME. I hate writing off $180.00... but I'd rather write it off NOW rather than have to deal with these jokers.)

So... now it comes down to DFI... or a new Nvidia chipset. I have until about Tuesday of next week to decide if I want it when I get back home from this business trip. But I know that the DFI board I had for a short time had no problems at 2.9Ghz and this memory. (And I think 3.0Ghz would have been easy.) But then.. I don't overclock.. I always go back to "stock". But I'd STILL rather have something that was actually reliable. Based on Gigabytes response... I can NEVER count on them being "reliable".

Gigabyte. I thought you made nice stuff... I had a VERY good 6800 video card from them years ago... heat pipe stuff. But they are no longer acceptable.

Revert back to an older CPU and forget about the DS5 if it does not pass their tests? AS IF. GOODBYE GIGABYTE. You are becoming the JOKE of the motherboard market.

(Hey... I'm drunk. But I'm now mad enough that a few hundred dollars means NOTHING. And as I said... even if they came out with a new BIOS TOMORROW that suddenly solved all the 9850 problems.. I might still take this motherboard and break it into small pieces to make sure NOBODY could EVER get screwed into thinking it was worth using.)

Actually I just sent them this response:

Thank you for your response.

I have had enough. Now I am angry.

I am now in the process of posting to several "enthusiast" forums to make sure that everybody understands that they should AVOID BUYING anything from your company AT ALL COSTS. Maybe I won't stop everybody from buying from your company... but I suspect that I can at least stop a few hundred people from buying anything from your company.

Have a nice day. I hope you all die in a fire.

(Yeah... maybe a bit too much. But I don't get this mad normally.)

[Daveburt714]

Geez Keith... You seem like such a nice guy!!

"Have a nice day. I hope you all die in a fire.", MAY have been a bit much though...

If ya go the Nvidia route, I'd like to hear your opinions...

[KTE]

DQ6 is a much better board than the DS5 - less problems and erratic behavior. They haven't priced them differently for no reason

KTE:I didn't realize your smilies were links. I'm assuming you used AOD for testing, do you have a system for core clocking? Just wishful thinking... I'm sure it's just turn one core up at a time and wait to see if it crashes (sigh...)

Nm, nice going there.

I'm using Sams Phenom MSR Tool to change multis - still testing, my Plat is dead and the Abit 770 has problems with max voltage being ~1.35v. I don't have another 790FX board here yet.

Full stability, i.e. 2 day minimum - just multi changing.

core 0-1-2-3
3000/2900/2700/2800 stock volts
3000/3000/2800/2800 1.38v which shuts down after 18-26 hours (PWM)
3000/3000/2700/2800 1.36v same as above
3000/3000/2700/2800 1.35v same as above
3000/3000/2700/2800 1.344v unstable core1
3000/2900/2700/2800 1.344v max stable so far

Testing 1.344v to see if it does eventually shutdown - just had a shutdwon after 33 hours uptime due to MB PWM cutting the power suddenly.

[-= rtz =-]

Keith

I think u cannot generalize like that,saying that the whole company and their entire line of motherboards and products not related to motherboards are crap is just nonsense.They made a fluke with the DS5 or its BIOS obviously and thats it.

Phew,thank god i didnt go with the DS5 I was in a big dillema,first i almost went for ds4,then ds5 but eventually i took DQ6 and Im not regreting it one bit

A question for DQ6 owners: Im on the stock F2 bios,must I flash first F3 then F4 and then F5 or can I immediatly flash to F5?

[Rammsteiner]

core 0-1-2-3
3000/2900/2700/2800 stock volts
3000/3000/2800/2800 1.38v which shuts down after 18-26 hours (PWM)
3000/3000/2700/2800 1.36v same as above
3000/3000/2700/2800 1.35v same as above
3000/3000/2700/2800 1.344v unstable core1
3000/2900/2700/2800 1.344v max stable so far

What are those symptoms like when your PC shuts down? My PC sometimes restarts for no reason me thinking the CPU is unstable (when testing). But if it's caused by overheated PWM's (my G15 makes my PC restart if I normally shut down. I need to shut down by PSU switch).

Or an uber lock up where even power/reset buttons dont work anymore. Also happens sometimes to me. But I do have a 70mm AMD fan pointed at PWMs, also a 60mm exhausting air from behind the motherboard I/O plate. So Ive no clue what cooling it else would need.

[KTE]

What are those symptoms like when your PC shuts down? My PC sometimes restarts for no reason me thinking the CPU is unstable (when testing). But if it's caused by overheated PWM's (my G15 makes my PC restart if I normally shut down. I need to shut down by PSU switch).

You mean you can restart the system with the G15 normally but not in this case?

If it shuts down like that, my system needs to be left off using the PSU switch which'll clear CMOS and then restarted again [not instant].
Many times my USB keyboard/mouse also fail to work at boot.

Basically, I choose to run stock volts, all is fine for days.
But when I choose to run anything above 1.344v at a stable setting to leave it running for more than 18 hours; between the 20-32 hour mark, it just cuts power and shuts down randomly
Never happens before that, I mean I game it many times, Crysis, Fear, UT and stability test/bench it - nothing.

PWM temps are 30-60°C idle/load, which is well within range for them. Most of the time it happens mostly idling too, like maybe using explorer or switching Fx tabs, etc.

I haven't had it before with Phenom

[keithlm]

Keith

I think u cannot generalize like that,saying that the whole company and their entire line of motherboards and products not related to motherboards are crap is just nonsense.They made a fluke with the DS5 or its BIOS obviously and thats it.

Yeah... I know. They shouldn't let me drive a keyboard after I've gone out for beer.

But I CAN generalize like that. If this is the support we get with the 9850 on the DS5 board which is a fairly new release and not something that is EOL, then what can owners of Gigabyte equipment expect when AMD releases their 45nm chips? More of this same "quality" treatment?

This does not make me want to own ANY Gigabyte in the future; regardless of whether the DQ6 is a "better" board or not.

And at this point I say: It doesn't matter whether they "decide" to support the 9850 or they "decide" not to support it. Of course that would not be an acceptable path; not supporting a 125W chip on the cheap 770G motherboards is one issue... not supporting it on one of your "premium" boards is a completely different issue. Especially when you support it on the next step DOWN in your lineup.

I just wish I had read something like this post before I bought Gigabyte, it would have steered me clear of Gigabyte at all costs. I originaly had the the opinion that this was a "middle of the road" quality. Now I have updated my opinion. You do not want to buy Gigabyte unless you have absolutely NO OTHER CHOICE.

Sure, it was the only choice I had at the time I bought it. It was in stock at a local store and I didn't want to wait; I had just waited 5 days for my DFI board to get shipped back to Newgg. I didnt want to wait another 3 or 4 days.

But buying the Gigabyte brand is going to be the equivalent of taking 2 hundred dollar bills out of my pocket and burning them in the trashcan. Only burning money like that would probably provide some enjoyment.

[Lightman]

Some good news - BIOS F5C for DQ6 released!!

Took them some time to add INB voltage adjustment . Now if they only can add to that and allow overvolting (another 2 months maybe )!

[Aussie FX]

Keithlm You sure have my sympathy, Gigabyte have treated you like sh*t. I don't deal with their support anymore. If they can't get anyone there who speaks English It's only the most common language in the world afterall.....

However as KTE pointed out, you haven't got the top of the line motherboard so overclocking shouldn't be as good. I would have been angry if a DS5 outperformed mine for $100 less.

Dave Only poking fun mate.

Lightman How's the new bios.

rtz Yes you can go straight to F5 although I would recommend going to F3 first as it reflashes the backup bios for you too.

[keithlm]

Keithlm You sure have my sympathy, Gigabyte have treated you like sh*t. I don't deal with their support anymore.

Got a another reply. I guess they either ignored my last comment... or didn't really understand it. (Which is much more likely.)

Originally when they said to revert to an older supported CPU... what they REALLY meant to say was that I should revert to an older supported CPU and test to see if my motherboard itself is stable and has no apparent problems requiring an RMA. (And YES it works fine with zero problems when used with a 4800+ and the same memory. I can even overclock it... but I didn't really bother.)

Although their insinuation when they said: "if we decide to support the 9850 we will post it on the website" kind of made me... ANGRY ENOUGH TO CHEW NAILS. (Or rather I would break all the molecular bonds with my ANGERVISION&#174; and the nails would just fall into powder.)

If they can support the 9750@125W but can not support the 9850@125W then they have some major problems that goes beyond the BIOS.

(If I underclock the 9850 to the 9750 speeds... it is STILL unstable; although it does take longer to crash/reboot. Actually I would bet that the "supported" 9750@125W is just as unstable... but I haven't seen anyone with a 9750@125W on this motherboard.)

BTW, just to let everybody know, it seems the correct translation of the word Gigabyte is: Ggthxbye

(Being stuck in a hotel in Ohio doesn't make me any more patient. I want to GO HOME. NOW. I hate business trips.)

[dyeager]

I agree with Keith. Their website was too slow around the time I ordered so I took the "Phenom Supported" notation at it word. You are also buying for future upgrade capability, which lack of 9850 support also brings into question. This upgradeability was the main reason for purchasing this over a q9450. Lack of 1066 support for 4 modules at close to full memory specs is also puzzling.

My quest for stability on this system... its getting easier to say what I have not replaced yet: Motherboard (RMAing now), video card, disks, os (reloading). I try to think of alternate uses for this motherboard and the Phenom 9850. No good choices.

More experience with SPD editing and debuggers than I would like. Had hoped to be pushing the system to higher limits.