GTX360 or PA120.3 ? which 1 to buy ?

[serialk11r]

Of course the additional 120mm cannot equal 5C. 5C on top of all that would be like giving the rad 1500W. Sure 5C could happen, you just need 50C water Okay look I didn't do any hard math but I hope you get my point, just compare the surface area increase, the temperature increase of the water, the cooling capacities vs. temp difference, etc.

[Marci]

IIRC according to Marci the GTX480 starts to outperform the pa120.3 at the 1000-1200rpm mark.

No. According to RADICAL53's testing, the GTX480 starts to outperform the PA120.3 at the 1000 to 1200rpm mark when using YateLoon fans. I haven't said a word on the matter myself, and the airflow involved hasn't been mentioned as yet for this 480 > 120.3 comparison.

[Marci]

PA160 with 1x Panaflo M1A @ 7v: CPU - 21 GPU - 22
HE120.3 with 3x ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ : CPU - 18 GPU - 19
PA120.2 with 2x ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ : CPU - 17.7 GPU - 18
2x PA160 with 1x ^^ on each ^ : CPU - 15.8 GPU - 15.1
PA120.3 with 3x ^^ ^^ ^^ ^^ : CPU - 15 GPU - 15

Note delta between PA120.2 and PA120.3 with fixed heatload (500-ish watts) in excess of that which we're talking here... 2.7 degrees difference for a surface area / airflow increase of a single additional fan... (see link in my sig for full figures...)

For reference, masaville's rig in question here works out to 373w heatload if it's an E6700, Dual 8800GTX's, all at stock, with an assumed 18w for pump heatdump... which (with a PA120.3) should be coolable to a 10 deg Air > Coolant Differential at the radiator by 80-ish CFM fans (Panaflo 120mm H1A @ 7v) assuming flowrate between 5 and 6lpm. In a room temp of 20 deg C, this gives a baseline of 30 deg C to start the c/w calcs from.

[Marci]

Just heard from masaville - he's using SilenX Pro fans on both rads - if that helps diagnose stuff Cathar...

Features

* Fan Swept Forward Fan Blade Design
* Smoother, Thinner Fan Blades
* Highly Efficient Hybrid Bearings
* Silicone Vibration Dampening Mounts
* Weighted Steel Screws
* Sleeved Power Cable
* 3rd Wire RPM Sensor
* 100+K Hours @ 25C MTBF
* 3->4 pin Power Converter Cable

Specifications

* Fan Dimensions: 120 x 120 x 25mm
* Fan Input: 12V/2.0W
* Fan Speed: 1600 RPM +/- 15%
* Air Flow: 58 CFM
* Noise Level: 14 dBA
* Three Pin Connector
* Four Pin Connector

The airflow and noiselevel figures are "questionable" at best based on SPCR's testing iirc... with those particular fans I'm guesstimating the PA120.3 would at BEST shift 300w of heatload... should also be noted there is an XSPC Passive Reservoir in the loop also, positioning of which if insufficient fans were used on the PA120.3 and XSPC res were in the airflow path would result in coolant being heated additionally, thus negating part of the radiator's cooling effect... XSPC Res = aluminium car oil cooler - http://www.xspc.biz/reservoirs.php

[masaville]

Yikes....this thread is way over my head. Sorry, I'm not watercooling guru and I'll be the first to admit that, but I can tell you what I tested with if that helps.

E6700 with dual 8800 GTXs in the loop
680i MB
850 Strider PSU
Dtek Fuzion block, DD 8800 blocks, XSPC passive res, Tygon tubing, OCZ 5+ thermal paste, MCP655 pump (at max setting)

Loop order is rad > res > pump > cpu > gpu > gpu >

For the tests all tubing was the same length and no other blocks, pumps, etc. where changed/removed. I simply swapped the reservoirs and bled them after the swap to make sure all of the air was out of the loop. In this case I used G200 coolant with distilled water, 80/20 mix (usually use Fluid XP, but I didn't want to waste it). Fans on the rads were Silenx Pros, 1400rpm, 72cfm (apparently, decent fans though) and rads were tested with fans at min and fans at max.

I can say that at max fan setting the 480 did outperform the 120.3 as mentioned earlier, but as someone mentioned earlier maybe there's a problem with the loop? Should the difference in temps between the two rads be that much and if not, what do you think the problem could be? I'll flush and clean the loop this weekend and redo it see if there was a problem.

Are there any threads on the board that anyone knows of with a similar rig/rad where temps have been posted that I can use for comparison?

[masaville]

i still dont see how you could not attribute an addional 120mm of rad to 5c.

assume for a moment the all mighty god of the gods pa3120 is equall in flowrate reduction and heat-dissipation at a given airflow rate to a gtx 360. could an aditional 120 be equal to that 5c?

did you change anything between the two tests other than the rads massa?

Nope no change at all. Everything the same, fluid mix to top off the rad replacement coming from the same jug. Just swapped the rads and topped it up, bled out the air, and loaded it up. I'm going to redo the loop this weekend and see what the results are. I'll be sure to post some concrete numbers for the board gurus to analyze heh.

[ANP !!!]

Where are the numbers bro i want them .

[GMX]

thx guys
I think i will just buy a PA120.3 . screw the budget, i want the best quality

btw.. i want a shop that can ship to my country (India) recommend a good shop with international shipping

Where are the recommendations. I want them bro. lol

But seriously now, you would pay almost 2.5-3 times as much for a PA120.2 or put up with a GTS240? That's how it will be inc. shipping from either DDstore or Themorchill.

[ANP !!!]

Where are the recommendations. I want them bro. lol

But seriously now, you would pay almost 2.5-3 times as much for a PA120.2 or put up with a GTS240? That's how it will be inc. shipping from either DDstore or Themorchill.

Shipping for the whole will be like under 80$,

i can get a GTX360 for 126$ shipped
and a PA120.3 for like 171-175$ shipped. I mean thats a bit of difference, almost 50$.

Do any1 here have tested the GTX360 ? i really cant see even 1 test done..

[ranker]

Thermochill supports this board and vise versa, so any opinions on who is better will be bias. I have never used the PA120.3 but I have a GTX360 and it gets better temps than any PA120.3 with the same setup (E6600+8800GTX) that I have seen on this board.

Bottom line, find your own facts, don't trust what people say here. That's what I did and i'm glad that I did

( Don't bother flaming, I won't read it )

I call shenanigans. Back up your "data" please. We have hundreds of people always looking for the best performing parts. If what you said was true, Thermochill would have pulled off the dupe of the century fooling all of our hardcore enthusiasts here.

2) GTX's? Why bother when for the same price you can get Swiftech Rads. If you cant afford a PA, then the only other option is a coolingworks/Swiftech rad. I've found all other rad's to be crappy.

[SNiiPE_DoGG]

well idk where you are getting off accusing us all of being bought off by Thermochill, which is ridiculous, but there is some LOGIC as to why they are good:

-the Thermochill has more tube surface area, this results in inherently better cooling, why? because the fins (which GTX has a billion of) don't do all that much cooling, most of the heat wont ever get to the fins.

-the GTX has small tubes, they are MORE restrictive than the PA (albeit still providing decent flow)

- the GTX has so many fins that you need a delta fan to actually get the same air throughput of the PA.

these things I have said make sense by logic, please don't come in hear arguing against logic, or you will lose. It's universal rule #1

[Grinch]

Sounds to me like you are trying to justify being cheap and not buying the PA120.3. There's no polite way of saying this... don't be penny wise and pound foolish.. just buy the PA120.3.

AGREE 100%

thermochill FTW!

[Fossil]

It's pretty reasonable to buy a BI radiator if you can't get a Swiftech one. That's why I have two BI rads: one of them only cost me A$25, I couldn't get postage on an MCR for that.

As for temps, you also need to thing carefully about the ambient temp. The effectiveness of any cooling device improves with temperature differential. My typical room temp is 22C or more: either I have the heating on or it's warmer than that just by dint of the weather. Suffice to say that fact renders a 17.5C CPU temp unachievable with vanilla w/c, and so I am quite happy with the temps I get (which are maybe 4C above ambient, but not like I measure with anything more accurate than TAT, I'm hardly fussed, my machine is stable).

Back on point: unless you control ambient temp, your temp readings don't mean a thing.

[ANP !!!]

LOL guys... ok i give up.

Ordered a TC PA120.3 directly from their website, my friend ordered 3 of them 1 for me n 1 for another friend.

Ordering rest of the things tomo thru sidewinders.

Thx guys anyways.. i just found it hard to convince myself getting something inferior.

[phelan1777]

you will not be disappointed, I have four blocks in my loop, and the PA handles them well. Granted I am using an RD30 to move water, so I am not quite sure how much that influences performance.

I might even add a 5th block, just to see what it can really do.

[septim]

z z z z ANP you guys made the wise choice. z z z

[theteamaqua]

no one ever compare these 2 RADS , and there r so much fight about the 2 , and PA120.3 always wins after those fight

[GMX]

LOL guys... ok i give up.

Ordered a TC PA120.3 directly from their website, my friend ordered 3 of them 1 for me n 1 for another friend.

Ordering rest of the things tomo thru sidewinders.

Thx guys anyways.. i just found it hard to convince myself getting something inferior.

how much was shipping?

FOr me direct from Thermochill was over 1/2 the price of the product it self....

[ANP !!!]

how much was shipping?

FOr me direct from Thermochill was over 1/2 the price of the product it self....

Me n my friends bought 3x PA120.3s. So it was 76Pounds of shipping for the whole package n each PA costed 46Pounds.

So 46+25.33 Pounds for Each PA120.3 shipped.

Shipping was DHL Express worldwide 2-3 days , (thats the reason why its expensive, i think they dont have any other shipping option )

[Edit]I just tracked the shipping n it has already arrived at my friends place , he will ship it to me hopefully soon man that was fast.

Time is GMT +5.30

[SiGfever]

As I have stated before when you have to compare a 120.4 to equal (or surpass) a PA120.3 what is the point? Now a PA120.4 would be the Godzilla of all rads.

[Jedda]

ANP
Wow Things have changed since I shipped through Delhi in the '70s!
One side of the airport to the other took a week back then. lol

[ANP !!!]

Rads arrived..

[Bun-Bun]

Being a GTX owner I thought I would come give my $0.02 even though you already chose and purchased a Thermochill.

I have a GTX240 and my only problems with it is it is a 240... wish it was a 360 but due to my case it was the best I could fit. I probably would have gone with a thermochill but it wouldn't have fit either due to how much bigger they are over the GTX.

Looking at my performace vs PA120.2 there doesn't seem to be much of a difference but I am also running 70CFM fans in push pull (gives about the same performance 114CFM Panaflo's in pull alone and is much quiter) as where the thermochill only needs 50 or less CFM.

Basically Thermochills are the low CFM optimized RAD and are the best out there. If you can fit it... get it.

Also some others have mentioned previously and I can now attest to... the desner fins on the GTX causes problems with dust and such... Last night I started stress testing and my water to air delta quickly climed to 6°C when it used to be 3°C... At closer inpsection of the rad I could see it was clogged with dust and cat hair... canned air didn't help but my vaccumm did pulled out a huge ball of cat hair and then my water to air delta dropped... This would be less of a problem with thermochills.

GTX are good rads and don't deserve all the bashing they have gotten. I am happy with my performace for now but my quad core really needs a tripple 120mm rad... That being said though... if you can fit it... and have the cash, there is no reason not to get a thermochill.

@Cathar's post regarding CPU temp vs water temp... It is not linear. There are secondary heat paths and other heat sources that are cooled. When my Ambient drops by 2°C my water temp drops by 3°C and my CPU drops by 3-5°C.