Motherboard: What duration of OFFICIAL and ACTIVE support do you expect ?

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03-13-2009, 01:32 AM
InToGraphics

Motherboard: What duration of OFFICIAL and ACTIVE support do you expect ?

I'm surprised that there is no poll for this subject.
This is supposed to be an official support forum.
Or actually I shouldn't be surprised, considering the lack of official support/replies here and at the Quantum Force websites for BlackOps. In less than a year!
I also consider fixing BIOS bugs or optimizing/stabilizing the BIOS as parts of active support.

Please be reasonable when voting.
The poll is for active support, and not for just keeping available the latest downloads for upmteen/donkies years.

Help to improve support.
I will vote for 2 years from intial release.

Robert
03-14-2009, 11:24 PM
zanzabar

legally its 3 years from street date in almost every ware and were i am in california its 7 and that includes bug fix updates and replacement parts or they are obligated to get a newer equivalent product based on the original msrp

i would like 2 years of solid support though
03-15-2009, 09:04 AM
ragingclue

I voted for two years as well. Searching through older threads has answered 90% of the questions I have had so far, but that 10% that I can't seem to get help for... well... I expected better. I hate to throw other manufacturers names out there, but I've always had EVGA motherboards in the past, and their support was beyond stellar. I was warned before getting this board that support would be sparse. I didn't expect it to be almost non-existent. Even OCZ, who I've heard people :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana: about, answers every inquiry on a daily basis....

I spoke with Foxconn support on the phone, and they did try to help me a bit, but they were specific in mentioning that my issues were Quantum Force related because they don't support OC'ing at all. When I explained to him that I haven't had any issues addressed here in weeks, he laughed and said they hear that a lot and he's sorry but that's just the way it's been....

And it's not like the Quantum Force members aren't available for comment or help. Click on their names and "Find posts".... They're very active and posting in other, sometimes non-related, areas of the forum.
03-18-2009, 05:52 AM
Sailindawg

I voted for 2 years active support after intial release, however, with Intel putting out chipsets in continued succession one after another all within 6 months of each other, board manufacturers will more than likely continue with uneven board support.

I bought my x48 board late August understanding that x58 was coming out shortly. I already had a Q6600 GO that had been purchased previously. x48 chipset seemed better suited for my quad than any of the earlier chipsets, x38, p35. I did not expect the quad i7 cpu line to have a <$300 cpu that performed well upon initial release. I figured that performance wise, I'd be current for a while longer.

However, x58 came out a bit ahead of schedule and now there is a glut of high quality hardware in the market that really doesn't differentiate itself except for a few really high end features that may never be utilized. So, typical of manufacturing, in comes the new and further development on existing product ends. Why tweak old product to still be competitive with the newest, latest and greatest? In a sense, planned obsolescence. Does the company make more money obsoleting old product and forcing new purchases, or does the company make more money supporting older product that is still very competitive with newer product?

Now there's a world wide recession going on. Consumers aren't spending. The manufacturers need to wake up. What will help their future sales is not the latest and greatest from AMD & Intel, but their overall product service. What these companies ought to be doing is really ramping up on product support across all product lines, old and new.
03-18-2009, 02:55 PM
InToGraphics

Good going people.
And thanks for adding your motivations to your vote.

EDIT: Regarding OCZ, click on the memory in my signature for an example of OCZ support. I can't complain.
03-22-2009, 07:19 PM
saaya

InToGraphics, what kind of problems do you have?
you cant get 8gb memory stable with 1:4 memory divider and the hard drive detection in bios seems to have a bug and naming the drives wrong, is that it or is there something else? im busy taking care of other things besides the forum, so if you cant get your problem fixed, please pm me. thats for everybody here, if you have a problem and cant get it fixed please pm me. the forum here is a forum as such, to exchange information, its not a support ticket system... if you want support contact the official foxconn tech support or pm me, thanks :toast:

Quote:

Originally Posted by ragingclue

I voted for two years as well. Searching through older threads has answered 90% of the questions I have had so far, but that 10% that I can't seem to get help for... well... I expected better. I hate to throw other manufacturers names out there, but I've always had EVGA motherboards in the past, and their support was beyond stellar. I was warned before getting this board that support would be sparse. I didn't expect it to be almost non-existent. Even OCZ, who I've heard people :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana: about, answers every inquiry on a daily basis....

I spoke with Foxconn support on the phone, and they did try to help me a bit, but they were specific in mentioning that my issues were Quantum Force related because they don't support OC'ing at all. When I explained to him that I haven't had any issues addressed here in weeks, he laughed and said they hear that a lot and he's sorry but that's just the way it's been....

And it's not like the Quantum Force members aren't available for comment or help. Click on their names and "Find posts".... They're very active and posting in other, sometimes non-related, areas of the forum.

hey ragingclue,
thanks for the headsup, sorry you couldnt get your mem stable and didnt like the board. you got it right in your other posts tho, this board was made for the extreme people benching ln2 and not really as a 24/7 gaming system, as a result most efforts on it were used to get it tweaked to tight timings and to run high clocks, not on 24/7 stability and making it easy to use and configure. BloodRage is a whole different thing, too bad you decided to go for another board... but i can understand you.

about quantumforce members, they arent here for support, they might be able to help you but please dont pm them expecting them to fix your problems. If you have any problems and dont get a reply please send me a pm.

theres a new BO bios already but i didnt get it, dont know why... i just checked and they will pass it on to me later today and ill post it here.
sorry it took so long to get a new BO bios...
03-24-2009, 06:26 PM
InToGraphics

Saaya,

Thanks for showing up. I realise that you're here offering to help.

You could add :

this small post here : http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...65#post3670865

your promise of a future (which year and month?) BIOS update with better comprehensible GTL-Ref voltages (near the bottom of post #1) : http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=201022

a fix for the 0.1 VTT voltage difference between BIOS and actual.

this thread : http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=209163

and then some.

But I also have to get all of this off my chest :

I appreciate what you're explaining about the forums. But I disagree. It's too similar with the story of the Quantum Force website. The QF website has been a dead end for ages. It was already dead when I just bought BlackOps in August 2008. And where is the new QF website, without mandatory registration ?
So I disagree.
If what you are saying is correct, then please replace "Official Manufacturer Information & Support" with "if you want support contact the official foxconn tech support". (Or make a sticky in blinking red.)

I wasted so much time with this motherboard. And only now do I officially read "you cant get 8gb memory stable with 1:4 memory divider".
That's old news. I already had come to that conclusion by trial and error. I even mentioned it over at the OCZ forums, long after I came to that conclusion. Post #30 (near the bottom of it) : http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/fo...6&postcount=30.

Quote:

Looks like 1:4 dividers with 8GB is no go.
If only one of Foxconn staff over at XS Forums would confirm (or deny) this.

But, I can make BlackOps boot with 450FSB and a 1:4 CPU400 divider for memory@1780Mhz and CPU@3785Mhz with a Q9550.
Post #6 and #8 :http://www.ocztechnologyforum.com/fo...41&postcount=6
And indeed it's not stable.
But what could have been possible with a little bit more BIOS and hardware tuning by Foxconn engineers ?
Alas, we will never know.
http://www.vectorplayground.com/xtre...04_600X450.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by saaya

..... this board was made for the extreme people benching ln2 and not really as a 24/7 gaming system, as a result most efforts on it were used to get it tweaked to tight timings and to run high clocks, not on 24/7 stability and making it easy to use and configure. .....

This is simply not true. Quoting from the product page : http://www.foxconnchannel.com/produc...D=en-us0000385

Quote:

ATI CrossFireX™ support
3* PCIe x16 slots (2* x16, 1* x4 bandwidth) with ATI CrossFireX™ support.
ATI CrossFireX™ technology harnesses the power of two ATI graphics cards simultaneously to deliver ultra-smooth 3D graphics with more graphical detail than ever before. Ideal for gaming enthusiasts who demand the highest frame rates without compromising on resolution.

Not for gaming : 2x x16 PCI-e, ultra-smooth 3D graphics.
This will only hamper extreme overclocking.

and

Quote:

SONAR Audio
The SONAR daughter card provides professional quality audio for games, movies and other multi-media content. Separating audio circuitry from the motherboard improves signal quality and eliminates interference from power regulation components.
The integrated Realtek ALC885 provides 8 channels of High Definition Audio (HDA) with an impressive 106dB SNR (Signal to Noise Ratio).

Professional quality sound for extreme overclocking ?
Well well well.

Also, I had my doubts, but this paragraph convinced me that aircooling would also be possible. Not so, as it turned out to be. I find this quite misleading actually. But I made the decision to buy out of free will. So I can only blame myself. :

Quote:

4in1 Quantum Cooler
The unique all-copper modular designed 4in1 Quantum Cooler enables effective cooling of the NB, SB and VRM areas. Swap out the NB parts to configure it for air, water or more extreme forms of cooling!

Foxconn and BlackOps are not for me. I was never happy with it. Never felt in control. In fact I lost interest in OC for 4 months because of BlackOps.
Because in early September while I was getting nowhere with overclocking, I registered at Quantum Force only to discover that it was a ghost town. Attempted to register here, but my registration was rejected. I gave up.
Months later I discovered that it was something as trivial as my gmail email address. The mod I contacted earlier regarding this could have been clearer.

The decision has been taken. BlackOps is out. Foxconn takes second place after your direct competitor Flextronics (of Iwill shame) on the blacklist.

Already looking elsewhere now.

Please don't take this personal. You are a person and not the company Foxconn.

When I have my new m/b, I will airbrush the BlackOps with grafitti, just like what I had done with the Iwill DK8N.
03-25-2009, 05:26 AM
BenchZowner

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

your promise of a future (which year and month?) BIOS update with better comprehensible GTL-Ref voltages (near the bottom of post #1) : http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=201022

Saaya is not a BIOS engineer, he talks to the engineers and ask them to do some stuff, but the engineers choose what to do, when to do it and if they'll ever do it.
Unfortunately with the "economical crisis" the manufacturers tend to let people go, and try to run their company with less resources than they should have.
And since the sales of the BlackOps are overshadowed and little to none compared to their newer boards, they're trying to focus more on the newer products than the older ones ( Foxconn's not the only manufacturer doing that, actually every single one of them does that ).

At least you have a very informative post from Saaya explaining what the current BIOS options do and the values applied.

You should try asking the tech support of Asus, Gigabyte, MSI for such complicated settings and see what you'll get ( if you get a response at all :p: )

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

a fix for the 0.1 VTT voltage difference between BIOS and actual.

If you know about it ( it's a known issue ) there's no need to worry, as you can use 0.1VTT setting lower to get the job done.
It's an easy fix and they should've fixed it, at least it's not an issue that you have to depend on the manufacturer to get a working solution.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

But what could have been possible with a little bit more BIOS and hardware tuning by Foxconn engineers ?
Alas, we will never know.

That's mostly a chipset limitation, a newer and more worked out BIOS will more than likely do nothing about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saaya

..... this board was made for the extreme people benching ln2 and not really as a 24/7 gaming system, as a result most efforts on it were used to get it tweaked to tight timings and to run high clocks, not on 24/7 stability and making it easy to use and configure. .....

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

This is simply not true.

It is true in fact.
Extreme overclockers do not use 2*2GB Memory Kits in extreme overclocking.
Extreme overclocking = pushing things to the edge, with sub-zero cooling and running benchmarks aiming for top numbers.

[QUOTE=InToGraphics;3739697]Quoting from the product page : http://www.foxconnchannel.com/produc...D=en-us0000385
Not for gaming : 2x x16 PCI-e, ultra-smooth 3D graphics.
This will only hamper extreme overclocking.

Extreme overclocking includes the usage of 2 or even more powerful graphics cards.

By the way Saaya told you that this motherboard was designed with extreme overclocking in mind, and not as a 24/7 gaming solution.
He didn't say that it's not capable of building a nice gaming PC with it, he just let you know that it's not the ideal motherboard for a gamer, especially if he's not good at tweaking his hardware and manually setting most of the BIOS values on his own.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

andProfessional quality sound for extreme overclocking ?
Well well well.

Being ironic doesn't help or make you seem any better to the readers of this thread.

By the way, gaming rigs do not need 8GB's of RAM.
You need no more than 4GB for gaming.
Also you don't need to get the best overclocking board, neither clock your CPU and RAM at sky high clocks for a gaming rig.
After a certain ( and realistically low ) frequency the CPU stops having any effect on the gaming performance of the system, and the RAM's performance has nothing to do with your gaming experience from the beginning.
Be it DDR3-1066 11-11-11-31 or DDR3-2000 6-5-5-16, it wouldn't make any difference at all in gaming.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Foxconn and BlackOps are not for me. I was never happy with it. Never felt in control. In fact I lost interest in OC for 4 months because of BlackOps.

That's why people instructed the users not to buy such products unless they are very experienced in overclocking and system tweaking.
The same thing happened with the Asus Striker II Extreme.
Check the troubleshooting thread for the SIIE and you'll see ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Because in early September while I was getting nowhere with overclocking, I registered at Quantum Force only to discover that it was a ghost town. Attempted to register here, but my registration was rejected. I gave up.

Well, the Quantum Force website was generally a mess, and only helpful for the guides posted by Shamino.
The forums never worked properly, and were abandoned a few months later.
If I remember correctly, after they set up the Foxconn section here they had the "Forum" link on the Q-F website redirect to these forums ( don't know if it still does that ).
The registrations here at XS.org are monitored and manually approved or denied by the staff, so it takes a while, and you might get rejected if you pick a username similar to the ones that those stupid spammers & spambots use.

Friendly,
Bill

( I mean no offense, so if you feel offended, my apologies and I ensure you that I didn't mean to offend you and I didn't mean a single word that way :) )
03-25-2009, 03:22 PM
InToGraphics

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

Saaya is not a BIOS engineer, he talks to the engineers and ask them to do some stuff, but the engineers choose what to do, when to do it and if they'll ever do it.

Well in the quote below he makes a promise, and this is BEFORE he has even passed it on to the BIOS engineers :

Quote:

Originally Posted by saaya

Ill pass this on to the BIOS engineer and the future BIOSes should have the direct table and no more "+1" or "-4" stuff

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

Unfortunately with the "economical crisis" the manufacturers tend to let people go, and try to run their company with less resources than they should have.
And since the sales of the BlackOps are overshadowed and little to none compared to their newer boards, they're trying to focus more on the newer products than the older ones ( Foxconn's not the only manufacturer doing that, actually every single one of them does that ).

I don't care about "economical crisis". When I bought the board, as in paid for it, the economical crisis was hitting everyone (that includes me), except the richest.
Hang on, I'll ask Foxconn for a refund. Reason : I have to let the board go because of the "economical crisis".

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

At least you have a very informative post from Saaya explaining what the current BIOS options do and the values applied.

I'll remember that when I need the table. I either walk to the filing cabinet where I keep a printout. Failing that I must have saved the thread to my harddisk somewhere or bookmarked it. With the last 2, I still need to print it out first before diving into the BIOS settings.
Or I could have had the table in the BIOS settings of course.
These things happen when you try to differentiate yourself as a company with things and experiments where they are going to be counter productive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

You should try asking the tech support of Asus, Gigabyte, MSI for such complicated settings and see what you'll get ( if you get a response at all :p: )

At least they respond. Besides Gigabyte is repairing a GA-X48T-DQ6 motherboard (which I ruined myself because I was tired at the time) free of charge right now. And because of all the bad news people (including you) write down about support from Asus I hesitated and didn't buy a board from them. By buying BlackOps I didn't do any worse, nor better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

If you know about it ( it's a known issue ) there's no need to worry, as you can use 0.1VTT setting lower to get the job done.
It's an easy fix and they should've fixed it, at least it's not an issue that you have to depend on the manufacturer to get a working solution.

Now that's a good idea. Why didn't I think of that. I'll go one better. I'll type out a list of all BIOS issues for which there is a workaround. Instead of airbrushing the board, I will try to sell it and provide the list to the next potential owner as a band aid.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

That's mostly a chipset limitation, a newer and more worked out BIOS will more than likely do nothing about it.

I also mentioned hardware tuning. That does not include the BIOS code.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

It is true in fact.
Extreme overclockers do not use 2*2GB Memory Kits in extreme overclocking.
Extreme overclocking = pushing things to the edge, with sub-zero cooling and running benchmarks aiming for top numbers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Quoting from the product page : http://www.foxconnchannel.com/produc...D=en-us0000385
Not for gaming : 2x x16 PCI-e, ultra-smooth 3D graphics.
This will only hamper extreme overclocking.

Extreme overclocking includes the usage of 2 or even more powerful graphics cards.

By the way Saaya told you that this motherboard was designed with extreme overclocking in mind, and not as a 24/7 gaming solution.

It is NOT true. You just don't get it. The product page specifically mentions :

Quote:

Ideal for gaming enthusiasts

Quote:

who demand the highest frame rates

How does your

Quote:

a nice gaming PC

stacks up against this ?
These gaming enthusiasts who demand the highest frame rates probably also want to play a game for a couple of minutes ?
Similar to how the overclocking enthusiasts like to achieve the highest overclock for a couple of minutes ?

Quote:

He didn't say that it's not capable of building a nice gaming PC with it, he just let you know that it's not the ideal motherboard for a gamer, especially if he's not good at tweaking his hardware and manually setting most of the BIOS values on his own.

I am not a gamer. Saaya started about gaming. I'm pointing out that what he mentioned is not true and completely opposite of what is to be read at the BlackOps product page. I do know how to manually make the settings on my own mate. Failing support from the company who manufactured the board, I had to do it mostly by myself.
I had to go to the manufacturer of the memory sticks for help with tightening the timings.
Where were you ? Why do you speak up now ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

Being ironic doesn't help or make you seem any better to the readers of this thread.

Look who's talking. You can read my mind and intentions. You also feel like you have to speak up for Saaya. Are you maybe any better than we are ?
Look who's talking.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

By the way, gaming rigs do not need 8GB's of RAM.
You need no more than 4GB for gaming.
Also you don't need to get the best overclocking board, neither clock your CPU and RAM at sky high clocks for a gaming rig.
After a certain ( and realistically low ) frequency the CPU stops having any effect on the gaming performance of the system, and the RAM's performance has nothing to do with your gaming experience from the beginning.
Be it DDR3-1066 11-11-11-31 or DDR3-2000 6-5-5-16, it wouldn't make any difference at all in gaming.

Thanks for this lesson. It will help resolve all the open issues. Again, I'm not a gamer, as in I do not play games. I'm beginning to understand what you hold against Asus support.:rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

That's why people instructed the users not to buy such products unless they are very experienced in overclocking and system tweaking.

Those "people" (whoever you mean by that) were not instructing at the BlackOps product page over at the Foxconnchannel website. Unless you mean over here at these forums ? But that's not where most buyers start off.
Besides it doesn't make sense to instruct a user not to buy such products. S/he already bought the product and is using it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

The same thing happened with the Asus Striker II Extreme.
Check the troubleshooting thread for the SIIE and you'll see ;)

Why bring up Asus all the time ? BlackOps is not an Asus board.
What makes Asus worse than Foxconn ?
The troubleshooting threads for Foxconn BlackOps are in a sorry state support wise.
Asuming that you speak the thruth, this is also the case for the Asus SIIE.
So there is no difference. Just as bad, or just as good. Pick which one you prefer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

Well, the Quantum Force website was generally a mess, and only helpful for the guides posted by Shamino.
The forums never worked properly, and were abandoned a few months later.
If I remember correctly, after they set up the Foxconn section here they had the "Forum" link on the Q-F website redirect to these forums ( don't know if it still does that ).
The registrations here at XS.org are monitored and manually approved or denied by the staff, so it takes a while, and you might get rejected if you pick a username similar to the ones that those stupid spammers & spambots use.

The Quantum Force website Is still a mess, not was. And the redirection to this forum is still there.
Why is the redirection still going to these forums ? When we arrive here it's the same ghost town (dead end). And on top of that we are redirected back to where we came from :

Quote:

Originally Posted by saaya

..... if you want support contact the official foxconn tech support or pm me, thanks .....

And look at what you write in the first paragraph of your post :

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

Saaya is not a BIOS engineer, he talks to the engineers and ask them to do some stuff, but the engineers choose what to do, when to do it and if they'll ever do it.

So what's the point of picking up his offer then ?
I know Saaya means well, he offers genuine help. But I also hear from you that he has no decisive power.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

( I mean no offense, so if you feel offended, my apologies and I ensure you that I didn't mean to offend you and I didn't mean a single word that way :) )

Who cares about apologies. Support is all I ever asked for.

Robert
(Disappointed like hell with Foxconn Support.)

Oh, and tell the black cat that I'm still waiting for a reply :

http://www.vectorplayground.com/xtre...nt-deleted.png
04-10-2009, 01:08 AM
BenchZowner

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Well in the quote below he makes a promise, and this is BEFORE he has even passed it on to the BIOS engineers :

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saaya

Ill pass this on to the BIOS engineer and the future BIOSes should have the direct table and no more "+1" or "-4" stuff

As you can see I marked some words with bold.
He said he'll pass the request to the BIOS engineer and he expected him to change the setting.That's not a promise, neither a guarantee.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

I'll remember that when I need the table. I either walk to the filing cabinet where I keep a printout. Failing that I must have saved the thread to my harddisk somewhere or bookmarked it. With the last 2, I still need to print it out first before diving into the BIOS settings.
Or I could have had the table in the BIOS settings of course.
These things happen when you try to differentiate yourself as a company with things and experiments where they are going to be counter productive.

Taking notes on a paper, or printing a simple text page ain't that hard, is it ?
While it's not the optimal solution, it's still a viable solution.
If the manufacturer is ignoring your requests, you either give up and do what you want ( sell the board, get another board, quit messing with computers, whatever ), or you take action any way you can.
If you searched the web a bit, you could've come up with a BIOS editing guide and you could've moded the BIOS yourself and changed those value labels.
Unless you're going for "extreme" or generally very high clocks you don't need to fiddle with those settings anyway.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

At least they respond. Besides Gigabyte is repairing a GA-X48T-DQ6 motherboard (which I ruined myself because I was tired at the time) free of charge right now. And because of all the bad news people (including you) write down about support from Asus I hesitated and didn't buy a board from them. By buying BlackOps I didn't do any worse, nor better.

I beg to differ.
And if you need more proof than the content provided in my article, I can give you the technical inquiries accounts passwords to log in and see for yourself.
Gigabyte accepted to repair your motherboard that you ruined yourself, but has rejected somebody elses board. Same thing applies to Asus, eVGA, Foxconn, ECS, etc.
Every single case differs, and it depends on the person on the other side of the line ( * phone line/e-mail ).
Actually if you contacted another person he could easily reject your request.
When they ( I'm talking about all the manufacturers in the IT industry ) start treating every customer the same way, then we can talk about it.
The experienced users will need to contact the tech support only in case of a motherboard RMA/Repair or to report a bug/issue, not ask for help about overclocking, etc.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

I also mentioned hardware tuning. That does not include the BIOS code.

What exactly are you thinking of then ?
You think they can "pry open" the X48 chipset and troubleshoot it, find what's limiting or causing an issue and fix it ?
Intel is the manufacturer of the chipset, not Foxconn, Asus, Gigabyte, or DFI, and the only one allowed to modify the chipset is Intel.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

It is NOT true. You just don't get it. The product page specifically mentions :

Well... just in case:

Fiat's page regarding the Punto GT mentions...
"It's a uber fast car, with great handling, smooth gearbox with little to none lag, amazing torque, etc".
Is it true ? Maybe, maybe not.
Who cares.
Companies lie all the time. Every single one of them.
You must be too naive to believe the opposite.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

I am not a gamer.

Then why all this crying about it being or not being a great gaming motherboard ?
If you don't care about gaming, why bother with all this whining ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Saaya started about gaming. I'm pointing out that what he mentioned is not true and completely opposite of what is to be read at the BlackOps product page.

Perhaps Foxconn lied on their website, and Saaya instead of following the companies "orders" was honest with you and told you the truth ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

I do know how to manually make the settings on my own mate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

I had to go to the manufacturer of the memory sticks for help with tightening the timings.

This is a little bit contradicting mate.
It can't be both.
Either you know how to setup a enthusiast's board options, or you don't.

p.s. If the memory manufacturer's tech support guy helped you tweak your timings, then make sure you give them a thumbs up for that ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Where were you ? Why do you speak up now ?

In my closet wearing a psychic's clothing looking inside my crystal ball :p:
I am what I am, I know what I know, in fact I know lots of stuff, but I'm not a psychic.
{ the sentences above are meant as a joke ;) }

You could've opened a thread before regarding your issues and ask for help, and I'd ( and lots of other great people ) would be there to assist you.

By the way I think you're thinking of me as a "anti-Asus" guy or something, if yes, you're wrong.
And if you check this thread you can see how much time I spent helping people solve their issues with their Asus Striker II Extreme.
In fact if you crawl the net ( not only this forum ) you'll find me ( and other people ) helping others with various products from various manufacturers.
There's no conspiracy for everything out there ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

Again, I'm not a gamer, as in I do not play games.

You're not a gamer.
You're not an extreme overclocker.
Why did you buy the BlackOps for then ? ( I'm not being ironic, just asking you a question. Perhaps you made a bad decision this time and bought a board that did not suite your needs no matter what )

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

What makes Asus worse than Foxconn ?
The troubleshooting threads for Foxconn BlackOps are in a sorry state support wise.
Asuming that you speak the thruth, this is also the case for the Asus SIIE.
So there is no difference. Just as bad, or just as good. Pick which one you prefer.

Every manufacturer has a bad and a good board ( sometimes they also have a crappy board as well, not just a bad one ).
The Foxconn Avenger per say is a mess. The BloodRage on the other side is awesome.
The same applies to Asus, the P5E64 WS Professional sucks balls, while the Rampage Extreme is awesome if you get a decent board ( some of them are just bad and are not on par with the average ).
The Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3 sucked, while the GA-X48T-DQ6 was fantastic.
You just have to take a good luck at what you're buying, focus on what you're looking for and what you intend to do with the soon to be bought product, and hit the right product for your needs.

Search the forums and take a look at some threads and you'll find out easily if I'm speaking the truth or not ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

And look at what you write in the first paragraph of your post...

Quote:

Originally Posted by BenchZowner

Saaya is not a BIOS engineer, he talks to the engineers and ask them to do some stuff, but the engineers choose what to do, when to do it and if they'll ever do it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by InToGraphics

So what's the point of picking up his offer then ?
I know Saaya means well, he offers genuine help. But I also hear from you that he has no decisive power.

1) Saaya is your only path to "get your requests to the BIOS engineers".
2) Saaya can help in your various stuff, even though he's not obligated to do so.
3) He might not have the "decisive power" regarding the BIOS bugs or issues that have to get fixed [ not all his requests are granted, but some of them are/were ], but he has decisive power for other things.
And anyways, if you're drowning and asking for help, if you refuse to accept help from John Dickinson, it's not John's fault if you end up dead you know ;)

p.s. Regarding the expected answer from the XtremeSystems staff for your failed registration attempt, your account is working now, so what's the deal.
04-23-2009, 06:12 PM
XmikeX

Seeing as how Blackops recently celebrated it's 1st birthday, I voted for -2- years of support since initial release :D

Seriously, I think -2- solid active years should be the reasonable industry standard (at least), especially with these $300+ mobos (on initial release).

I, in such circumstances, would become a totally rabid fan of the manufacturer, as long as their product was at least par with the competition.

XmX