X1600XT Info And Updates Thread

The X1600PRO is out, albiet with slow as hell ddr2...and looks exactly like the X1300PRO w/ ddr2. As the Inq reports, the 6800GS's only challenger is super MIA....

Quote:

---

Partners are being dead silent about X1600, pulling all the stops to get as much X1300Pro's on the market, and satisfy the need of market for expensive cards in the form of 512MB GDDR3 ones

---

http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=28073

I've been checking Pricewatch, Newegg, PriceNetwork, All my local computer stores past week...only the asus ddr2 version is out...its slowly making me boil in the head. I'm not seeing green as of yet, but that could change.

Perkam

well perkam get used to it xD at least until r580 i hope ati learned that everybody loves to buy the new stuff when they are announced

the only ones i have seen are also X1600Pros.
i think the reason there is no XT to buy is cause it maybe will nvr hit mass prouktion.
i think maybe they r waiting for the Geforce 7600 or atleast waiting till they know its specs this so they can make some last minut spec changes to the X1600XT, so they wont again miss out on alot fo cash like with the 6600Gt vs the X600Xt and later the X700.

Some how.. I don't think anyone is really surprised

it could be ATI's hesitating. Maybe trying to think of a better contender for that price spot. They still have to fill that $300 spot too. Who knows, they may hold out for the X1800 Pro, which shouldn't hurt your feelings any Perkam. :p:

Its available right now in Europe and Australia/New Zealand. I know a friend who is picking one up from a local shop in Melbourne. Made by GeCube.

But yeah, it would be one hell of a deal. An x1600XT outperforms a 6600GT and it has 1.2ns RAM! I don't know what default clocks are, but I am pretty sure it can be overclocked quite a bit. I am pretty sure it would do quite well.

If I was looking for a $200 video card, thats what I would get. But its not available here, which is obviously not a small issue.

Why buy an X1600XT when 6800GS is available for the same price?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DZ1234

Why buy an X1600XT when 6800GS is available for the same price?

---

We want Competition so that the prices drop and we can get more stuff

EDIT: flame removed
-saaya

Then why don't you wait til after the X1600XT comes out, and when prices fall to reflect performance?

Buying it only tells ATI they can get by with less competitive products at the same price range. This card should be priced more like the 6600GT ($150 or so).

Ahmad, why in the world would you buy an x1600xt when the 6800gs out-performs it in everything, and can be gotten at the same price? It also has all the same features/effects, and a few the x1600xt doesn't have.

Also, I highly doubt you found an XT, when you can scourge to the ends of the internet and not find a store that even HAD one, much less has one....

I think what ATi is doing this round is only actually showing up with part of their lineup, because they plan on replacing them very soon. This way, they won't be stuck with extra stock that they can't get rid of because no one wants them because better stuff came out.

Yes, they're going to lose money on designing the chip in the first place, but these chips are going to be short lived regardless, so the whole situation makes sense. Push out a few high-end, a few low end, and a few low-mid end to cover til the end of the year. Early next year show off your real hand.

For now, they're filling this gap with the X800GTO, to finish moving those R480 and R420 cores that've been building up for oh-so-long. By not releasing the x1600xt, they give the X800GTO it's market space to keep on making sales, even though the 6800GS is a far better buy.

It's pretty obvious what ATi is doing, atleast it's obvious to me... Think like a business man here guys.

the x1600 is still in heaven

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DilTech

Ahmad, why in the world would you buy an x1600xt when the 6800gs out-performs it in everything, and can be gotten at the same price? It also has all the same features/effects, and a few the x1600xt doesn't have.

---

Didn't read the rest of your post, but I can think of 3 reasons why I would get an x1600XT:

1- Don't need an identical card to do crossfire if I have a CF mobo
2- GS is $70 more expensive here in Canada
3- x1600XT has full SM3.0 support
4- Has much more vertex shading power which is something that will be used in future games and is therefore more futureproof

One more than three and I would add one that the x1600XT can be overclocked (don't know how much yet).

TBH with you, I actually thought it was a POS just from the amount of negativity ATI has been getting. But one friend was considering a budget card in Australia so I looked it up and I was surprised by its performance. Also, the 6800GS is about $100 more expensive to him, so this is the perfect card. It might have been the GS before, but for a price of $199, I can't see myself getting anything but the x1600XT.

@Ahmad
the 6800GS overclocks very very wel.

how can the 6800GS cost 70 dollars more if the X1600XT isnt even in stock?
overhere in europe the X1600XT is also very cheap but im not going to compaire its price to the 6800GS yet seeing the price of the X1600Xt can just as well go up again once its instock.
And the 6800GS also Sm3.0 support

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nn_step

We want Competition so that the prices drop and we can get more stuff EDIT: flame removed
-saaya

---

6800GS already has competition.
X800GTO is faster than X1600XT and you can get one for 180$ :stick: Not mentioning it's softmoddable

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Starscream

And the 6800GS also Sm3.0 support

---

I would look more into it if I were you. Thats all I am going to say :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ahmad

Didn't read the rest of your post, but I can think of 3 reasons why I would get an x1600XT:

1- Don't need an identical card to do crossfire if I have a CF mobo
2- GS is $70 more expensive here in Canada
3- x1600XT has full SM3.0 support
4- Has much more vertex shading power which is something that will be used in future games and is therefore more futureproof

One more than three and I would add one that the x1600XT can be overclocked (don't know how much yet).

TBH with you, I actually thought it was a POS just from the amount of negativity ATI has been getting. But one friend was considering a budget card in Australia so I looked it up and I was surprised by its performance. Also, the 6800GS is about $100 more expensive to him, so this is the perfect card. It might have been the GS before, but for a price of $199, I can't see myself getting anything but the x1600XT.

---

1 - Read up on driver release notes..
3 - wow....no real SM3 support? http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ilies/slap.gif

Quote:

---

One more than three and I would add one that the x1600XT can be overclocked (don't know how much yet).

---

I dunno..almost every GS clocks over 500Mhz? hello?

Quote:

---

4- Has much more vertex shading power which is something that will be used in future games and is therefore more futureproof

---

:lol2: :rolleyes:

wtf man...where the heck did you live lately.....under a big fat rock?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nn_step

We want Competition so that the prices drop and we can get more stuff
EDIT: flame removed
-saaya

---

Chill man.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ahmad

I would look more into it if I were you. Thats all I am going to say :)

---

According to microsoft's DCT test, the 6 series delievers a sharper image than required with DX9c, this is why it failed said test, but it wasn't an identical image. It's a *BETTER* one.

The 6800GS is *THE* midrange card to own.

As for the guy who said the x800GTO, only the GTO2's are not lazer locked, and therefore ONLY the GTO2 can be modded to the x850xt. Problem is, they've jumped to $300, putting them in line with the 7800gt prices, which outright stomp them.

I've read almost each and every review on the X1600, and the 6800GS....the 6800GS reviews so I could see X1600 performance using newer drivers since it came out after the initial x1600 results were announced.

The X1600 is the first mainstream SM3.0 card by ati...and seeing that the next 3dmark will require SM3.0, that's a big selling point for me. The GTO doesnt have this feature, but the X800GTO2, though SMO 2.0b, which has a 100% unlock rate to a X850XT, is priced at the same level as the lowest priced GS here in canada ($250CDN), so if I wanted an ATI card at the same price level with better performance, I had my choices there too.

This thread was created to discuss how ATI softlaunched the X1600 (term paper launch draws a crowd :shakes: ) and promised availability on Nov. 30th. Why the concern then ? At least for th X1800XT when they promised first week of november, it wasn't available right away, but we knew it was coming...Here, it looks like the X1600XT launch will miss the christmas rush and will continue to lose customers to Nvidia's GS, two of which cards were recently used by MickeyMouse at HWA in SLI for 28k+ in 3dmark03.

I just want to see the X1600XT at retail with multiple vender offerings before christmas...

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DilTech

According to microsoft's DCT test, the 6 series delievers a sharper image than required with DX9c, this is why it failed said test, but it wasn't an identical image. It's a *BETTER* one.

The 6800GS is *THE* midrange card to own.

As for the guy who said the x800GTO, only the GTO2's are not lazer locked, and therefore ONLY the GTO2 can be modded to the x850xt. Problem is, they've jumped to $300, putting them in line with the 7800gt prices, which outright stomp them.

---

DilTech, that's untrue. The Connect3D X800GTO has been known to be unlockable. I wouldn't be surprised if other X800GTOs can be unlocked.

you honest think a x1600xt can keep up with future games with more intense requirements when it cant even outperform a last gen card from nvidia?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

I've read almost each and every review on the X1600, and the 6800GS....the 6800GS reviews so I could see X1600 performance using newer drivers since it came out after the initial x1600 results were announced.

The X1600 is the first mainstream SM3.0 card by ati...and seeing that the next 3dmark will require SM3.0, that's a big selling point for me. The GTO doesnt have this feature, but the X800GTO2, though SMO 2.0b, which has a 100% unlock rate to a X850XT, is priced at the same level as the lowest priced GS here in canada ($250CDN), so if I wanted an ATI card at the same price level with better performance, I had my choices there too.

This thread was created to discuss how ATI softlaunched the X1600 (term paper launch draws a crowd :shakes: ) and promised availability on Nov. 30th. Why the concern then ? At least for th X1800XT when they promised first week of november, it wasn't available right away, but we knew it was coming...Here, it looks like the X1600XT launch will miss the christmas rush and will continue to lose customers to Nvidia's GS, two of which cards were recently used by MickeyMouse at HWA in SLI for 28k+ in 3dmark03.

I just want to see the X1600XT at retail with multiple vender offerings before christmas...

Perkam

---

Hey perkam....not trying to be a smartass here, but why is it so hard for you to get a 6800GS....the X1600XT is a joke and performance is absolutely horrible...only the biggest fanboy would get one.....why can't you just open your mind and get a GS....it's not worth it to stick to one brand in particular...and to be honest, it's a bit silly too...

Oh...and did I mention that the GS is already way under $200? :)

- Tim

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DilTech

According to microsoft's DCT test, the 6 series delievers a sharper image than required with DX9c, this is why it failed said test, but it wasn't an identical image. It's a *BETTER* one.

---

Please stop with this garbage. The apologists need to let things go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DilTech

According to microsoft's DCT test, the 6 series delievers a sharper image than required with DX9c, this is why it failed said test, but it wasn't an identical image. It's a *BETTER* one.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bar81

Please stop with this garbage. The apologists need to let things go.

---

Do any of you two actually have any proof (official statement by Microsoft)?

Thanks

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ahmad

I would look more into it if I were you. Thats all I am going to say :)

---

This applies to you too, ahmad.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by krille

Do any of you two actually have any proof (official statement by Microsoft)?

---

Quote:

---

Hey perkam....not trying to be a smartass here, but why is it so hard for you to get a 6800GS....the X1600XT is a joke and performance is absolutely horrible...only the biggest fanboy would get one.....why can't you just open your mind and get a GS....it's not worth it to stick to one brand in particular...and to be honest, it's a bit silly too...

---

Thanks for the honest response. I dont mind constructuve criticism and you have a good point. As i stated however, the cheapest 6800GS here in CDN is $250, same price for the X800GTO2 w/ a 100% unlock rate to X850XT, which can be clocked to stock score of a 7800gt (7k) in 05 on air as well.

The X1600XT due to multimedia features, VIVO and such, plus that every X1k card has avivo capabilities built in, which will be unlocked in future drivers. Its also only mainstream card at the moment with native Windows Vista LDDM support. You dont get the GS or the XT to play games at 1600x1200 4xAA 8xAF, not that you can't, but for me its more of having the R5xx architecture with future proof features etc. I dont game as much anyway, so again its the multimedia features for cheap that I find attractive. Plus it pays homage to my current 9600 which has been w/ me for so long, doesnt feel right upgrading to a GS with how well its served me :bows: ;)

ALSO, gentlemen i dont wish to see a back and forth ati vs nv argument going on here, so pls follow krille's advice and provide evidence of your claims, which, above all, should be related to the topic in question.

Thx.

Perkam

Quote:

---

doesnt feel right upgrading to a GS

---

Well this just says it all. Well, he is Canadian, I think Perky wants to support ATI :D :D

@Perkam
it is true that ATI has said certain features wil b unlocked in future drivers but i am one of those people that first wanna see and then wil believe.
If u compaire the 6800GS and X1600XT on base of their multi media features yes the X1600XT has a small lead.
But the more u game the bigger the lead is for the 6800GS. If u dont game then go for the X1600XT but id stil wait for ATI to unlock all fo the promised features.

i also use my PC for alot of multi media stuff but am atm selling my 2nd PC and building a cheap one for those purposes.

@Ahmad
Nvidia fails Sm3.0 cause the picture rendered isnt 100% identical to the one wich it should render, this can happen if the rendered picture is worse or better. So im yet to see a reason why Nvidias implementation of SM3.0 is better or worse then the standard.

For ATI they also fail SM3.0 due to a missing feature.
If the missing feature is important i dunno, ATI says it isnt important but on the other hand the R500 (the one in the xbox360) has this feature and there r future games wich wil also make use ofit allot.
So if ATIs implementation is good or bad we will see when those games arrive
So to be short there aint a single card that fully follows SM3.0 for 100%.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ahmad

I would look more into it if I were you. Thats all I am going to say :)

---

you're a tool. That's all I'm going to say.

It's less about supporting ATI than preferring it. Preference is different from supporting or blind loyalty. I dont defend either company if they're wrong, and I'm never praising either one. But that doesnt mean that I dont have a preference as to which card at the end of the day I'll fell better having in my comp.

Quote:

---

t is true that ATI has said certain features wil b unlocked in future drivers but i am one of those people that first wanna see and then wil believe.

---

A treat for you :) http://www.chip.de/artikel/c1_artikel_17670022.html :)

Quote:

---

If the missing feature is important i dunno, ATI says it isnt important but on the other hand the R500 (the one in the xbox360) has this feature and there r future games wich wil also make use ofit allot.

---

Answered in the ATI News Thread: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...=72799&page=32 .

Perkam

Hummm cheapest 6800 GS here is 270$ cdn and gto2 is 300$....

Hey softpain :) Which province are you in? It could potentially differ based on which retailer you check.

The one at Genitech used to be 250..now at 300 ($250USD) cos good ol ncix loves increasing their prices. But yea, PC Village has an X800GTO2 for $280 ($240USD) and ncix has a promotion for a $250 ($215 USD) GS here: http://www.ncix.com/products/index.p...4&promoid=1015 ... so they're $30 apart. I'm hoping the x1600xt will be <$250, but i'm gonna need one which cools the ram as well, unlike the reference cards.

Perkam

@Perkam
Ive seen several reviews of this tool but is it already available?

and about ATi and SM3.0
what i said was that ATI also doesnt follow the SM3.0 standard for the full 100%
towards Ahmad who brought up that Nvidia fails Sm3.0 test but forgets that ATI also fails it.
I know that the r520 etc are able to emulate (or however its called) VTF on their desktop cards.
If this will influence performence with games that use VTF alot cant b said atm.
Ofcourse ATI says that their way of it wil b just as good as the way as it is described in the SM3.0 standard but we wont know that till games apear that make extensive use of it ofcourse.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

It's less about supporting ATI than preferring it. Preference is different from supporting or blind loyalty. I dont defend either company if they're wrong, and I'm never praising either one. But that doesnt mean that I dont have a preference as to which card at the end of the day I'll fell better having in my comp.

A treat for you :) http://www.chip.de/artikel/c1_artikel_17670022.html :)

Answered in the ATI News Thread: http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...=72799&page=32 .

Perkam

---

if you are loyal to nvidia they will give you video cards :p:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by situman

you honest think a x1600xt can keep up with future games with more intense requirements when it cant even outperform a last gen card from nvidia?

---

That's the whole point. X1600 in general is designed for the latest and upcoming games. Hence the huge number of pixel pipes compared to the tiny amount of ROPs, etc.

For proof, look at any graph of X1800XT vs 7800GTX performance. Now, take a look at which game was tested. In general, the later the game was released, the larger X1800XT's advantage. Why? Because R5xx cores in general are optimized for future game performance. Hence the large emphasis placed on dynamic branching, etc.

EDIT: For a far nastier example, look at FX5900 performance vs 9800. Again, ATI trumps at future-proofing!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shadowmage

That's the whole point. X1600 in general is designed for the latest and upcoming games. Hence the huge number of pixel pipes compared to the tiny amount of ROPs, etc.

For proof, look at any graph of X1800XT vs 7800GTX performance. Now, take a look at which game was tested. In general, the later the game was released, the larger X1800XT's advantage. Why? Because R5xx cores in general are optimized for future game performance. Hence the large emphasis placed on dynamic branching, etc.

EDIT: For a far nastier example, look at FX5900 performance vs 9800. Again, ATI trumps at future-proofing!

---

Shadow,....tell that to all X8X0 owners....LMFAO....ATi sucks in future proofing....SM3...ah gamers don't need that....* couple of months later* ooops we guess they do need it! :slap:

Shadowmage has a point. Check FiringSquad's latest CoD2 Mainstream card test...the X1600 came closer to the GS (1-2fps difference) than ever before, plus when the "fear1.exe" tweak is used for F.E.A.R., the x1600 ends up beating the GS. However, it still needs more driver-support. I do not know whether if it is the card's 128-bit Memory bus or something else that hands it a major blow in HL2, almost all reviews shows that the x1600 suffers in that engine (min FPS of 6 !!), but I'm hoping that'll improve as time goes on, which is something we know ATI has promised, at the very least.

SM3.0 is still hazy subject, ATI can never in the short term recognize its superiority over SM2.0b, it'll just state it has a better SM3.0 solution over Nvidia, but thats it. Remember its entire current Crossfire platform rests on SM2.0b hardware. ;) Shader Model tech was a factor in my decision, but it came with a tradeoff. Any 12 pipe GTO for $160 will beat an X1600 at 590/1380 because of the lack of pipelines, so it balances out, and up to the consumer to decide which is more important.

Perkam

For this consumer, the answer would be drivers. I've had my fill of ATI crapitude so no hardware solution from them is good enough. I wish them ill in their search for more suckers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shadowmage

EDIT: For a far nastier example, look at FX5900 performance vs 9800. Again, ATI trumps at future-proofing!

---

you can't possibly use that as an example to help your argument about THIS generation.

modern game performance? what about FEAR?

http://hardocp.com/article.html?art=ODgyLDQ=

This thread was never made to justify either an XT or a GS purchase ;) It's on the availability of the XT, which is nil atm.

The link you have in your post, Cybercat isn't updated. Driverheaven used the name change tweak in FEAR to find no difference whatsoever between XT and GS performance.

The only XT w/ GDDR3 i can find is on ebay...the reference card :( , which I'm not about to put money on unless it comes with 4 games and all the accessories :p

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tim

Shadow,....tell that to all X8X0 owners....LMFAO....ATi sucks in future proofing....SM3...ah gamers don't need that....* couple of months later* ooops we guess they do need it! :slap:

---

OK then, lets try a different approach. People aren't getting the point.

X800 lineup is the exception, just like 7800 lineup. What do they have in common? Both are derivatives of an older chip: the 9800 and the 6800, respectively. What else do they have in common? Poor future-proofing.

However, its important to note that SM3.0 is STILL not used much at all, after a year out. ATI predictions came true, eh? No widespread SM3.0 at all... only in a few games, and there is not much benefit (no striking benefit) for going SM2.0-> SM3.0 (in terms of performance and image quality). What matters now is performance, more so than SM3.0 existance. I'm not too sure about which chip is doing better (x800 or 6800) or which one is gaining the advantage since I'm paying attention to the new generation now ;)


A review (or post, I forgot which) made a very good point: had X1800 been released in June as originally planned, it would not have been impressive at all. Look at which games X1800 is good at, and when those games were released.

Quote:

---

A review (or post, I forgot which) made a very good point: had X1800 been released in June as originally planned, it would not have been impressive at all. Look at which games X1800 is good at, and when those games were released.

---

Uh...Shadow, do try to find some links with those statements ;) You make quite a few of them, and backing them up, which I'm sure shouldn't be too hard, is the best way to get your point across.

Perkam

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2556&p=2

This isn't a good example though, since X1800XT wins against 7800GTX most of the time anyways, and Anandtech only tests latest games.

Better example: Xbitlabs

Examples of X1800 sucking it hard. Note all of them are older games.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_23.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_20.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_14.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_25.html

The RTS games in general are designed old-style. That's why Ages of Empires III does poorly as well: the engine is old tech compared to FEAR, etc.


Also X1600 was tested in FEAR without fear.exe renaming.

To say the 7800 series is poorly future proof is ridiculous. Especially from an architectural viewpoint.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shadowmage

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2556&p=2

This isn't a good example though, since X1800XT wins against 7800GTX most of the time anyways,.

---

No it doesnt. :stick:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cybercat

To say the 7800 series is poorly future proof is ridiculous. Especially from an architectural viewpoint.

---

I believe he means 7xxx series on 110-nm tech does not have much left in it, which is correct. However, Nvidia's 90nm tech is coming up sometime q1 06, so they are going head to head with every card ATI can come up with.

Still no X1600 :sniff: :(

Perkam

Noticed an X1600XT in uk in saveastore or something like that...so they're getting out...VERY SLOWLY. I need for them to be out in full swing by january at reasonable price levels w/ VIVO functions etc so i can make ze purchase :)

By then the cat 6.0s will be out too :D

Perkam

oddly enough every 6800GS on every site I looked at just went out of stock today. WTF?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Shadowmage

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2556&p=2

This isn't a good example though, since X1800XT wins against 7800GTX most of the time anyways, and Anandtech only tests latest games.

Better example: Xbitlabs

Examples of X1800 sucking it hard. Note all of them are older games.

http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_23.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_20.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_14.html
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/vid...gtx512_25.html

The RTS games in general are designed old-style. That's why Ages of Empires III does poorly as well: the engine is old tech compared to FEAR, etc.


Also X1600 was tested in FEAR without fear.exe renaming.

---

Maybe I remind you of the how badly the X1800XT got served in B&W2, which is *DEFINITELY* a newer game. It did *worse* than the x850xt, literally!
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/n...21121/9838.png
http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/n...21121/9839.png
Did I mention this game is sponsored by ATi? Irony, don't you think?

I don't quite understand how you could call the x1800xt more future-proof from an architectural stand-point. Both are capable of 64-bit HDR, both have a maximum of 128bit FPP, both have a form of Transparency AA... Meanwhile, out of the documented features, and only naming ones you CANNOT argue with, as to save us all time, the X1800XT lacks VTF.

The only feature the x1800xt has that the 7800 doesn't is HDR + AA, and I *DARE* you to find a SINGLE game besides far cry where HDR + AA is playable at 1280x1024 or higher on a x1800xt... Oh wait, that's right, there is none. Two prime examples being serious sam 2 and SC:CT were far too slow attempting HDR + AA to be considered close to playable(in serious sam 2 HDR isn't even playable on the x1800xt), and that'll only get worse as time goes on. NVidia was right, this cannot currently be done in a method that's playable, the memory bandwidth just isn't there.

Either way, I don't even feel like an arguement, I'm just poppin in for a second while waiting on some phone calls, so I thought I'd set this one straight...

I find it a bit sad that the moment ATI releases a new card, support for older cards gets promtly dropped....on the other hand, I got a massive boost in performance when I switched to the release 80 drivers on my 1,5 year old 6800GT!!!!! :cool:

@Tim
thats what i always say and is one of the reasons i wont pay alot of cash on a ATI grafix card anymore, a reasonable priced mid range gaming card is another thing :)

when the 9800XT came out i bought me a 9800pro.
When the x800 came the support kinda dissapeared for my 9800pro.
that i wouldnt see any real FPS boosts i was clear of that.

The problem was that when a new game came and there were serious performence issues or grafikal problems etc the x800 got them fixed in the next driver release and i with my old 9800 had to wait 3 driver releases (3 months).

:eek:

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merch...ricewatch&NR=1

:eleph: :eleph: :eleph:

Its a pre-order...and at a horrendous price :( But at least we now know that they're coming Dec 16th :D

Perkam

$200 horrendous? Isn't that what it's supposed to be?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merch...ricewatch&NR=1

:eleph: :eleph: :eleph:

Its a pre-order...and at a horrendous price :( But at least we now know that they're coming Dec 16th :D

Perkam

---

:sick:

But at least we now know that they're coming Dec 16th

ya ok!?

Wonder when prices will drop on it...shouldn't be too long I hope. Didn't take too long for prices on the X1800XL to drop and same for the X1300Pro...actually I don't remember ever seeing a X1300Pro at MSRP...always 50below it

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jjcom

Wonder when prices will drop on it...shouldn't be too long I hope. Didn't take too long for prices on the X1800XL to drop and same for the X1300Pro...actually I don't remember ever seeing a X1300Pro at MSRP...always 50below it

---

Same thing here, JJ. Original MSRP on this was $249, but we got an early jist that $40 more than the GS wouldn't be a good selling point :p:

The price is herrendous for that reason, and its just the memory thats the reason. As you'll also see, a x1600pro w/ the same core but with ddr1 is listed for $132 on monarch.

Perkam

Newegg has one for $179.99 :cool:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sabrewolf732

Newegg has one for $179.99 :cool:

---

link

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cybercat

link

---

Thx for the link...though reference cooler ??? :(

Perkam

my you are picky. :p:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Cybercat

my you are picky. :p:

---

Nah...I just wont be investing in one until i see 3dmark06 numbers with one ;) I wouldn't care if it was rumours...but I'm not buying a card that doesnt get a decent score in 3dmark06.

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Thx for the link...though reference cooler ??? :(

Perkam

---

Voltmod and upgrade the cooler..
Is that really so hard?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Nah...I just wont be investing in one until i see 3dmark06 numbers with one ;) I wouldn't care if it was rumours...but I'm not buying a card that doesnt get a decent score in 3dmark06.

Perkam

---

well that depends on your definition of decent. It should do a good job of bringing the highest end cards available right now to their knees, let alone mainstream cards. "Playable" performance may be a struggle for even a couple G71's clocked at 750MHz core in SLI. No telling.

You saying you may just buy an comparably-priced NVIDIA card (:eek: ) if the X1600XT doesn't perform as well in 3DMark06?

the x1600xt looks to be a decent card and it performs well in a few newer games. I'm betting new drivers should be able to get another 10% out of them too. I may pick one up simply because no one else has them :p:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Thx for the link...though reference cooler ??? :(

Perkam

---

Just pop on one of them nice Zalman ones :) Problem solved

To be honest I doubt it runs that hot.... it doesn't even require external power

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nn_step

Voltmod and upgrade the cooler..
Is that really so hard?

---

I was thinking the same

Anyone know how these clock? Will 700+ be feasible?

I wouldn't be surprised, ATI's 90nm chips so far clock very nice. 600mhz or so to start with...pop a nice cooler on there and I wouldn't be surprised to see 700mhz

you think getting one would be an ok idea? I mean the drivers seem to be really young, I wouldn't be surprised if there was a 10% increase in performance with a new driver realease

I'll answer the question on clocks and the reference cooler at the same time :D

The reference cooler is very limiting for the core...it will only allow a 650Mhz oc. The ram is retarded, it'll go 800 with ease and with no cooling on it whatsoever...meaning ~850 should be possible with ramsinks or ATI Silencer for X1600s.

I'll be looking to get these to run at 700/800 24/7 and 750/1700(850) foe benches, but all that still depends upon what it scores in 3dmark06. Unfortunately, the 128-bit mem interface looks like its going to be very limiting result wise...With only 4 ROPs, core OCs arent going to make that much effect either. Hopefully I can get this to 6k 05 at highest but I'm not hoping for anything near 7k even with the highest clocks, due to pipeline limitations.

This doesnt fare too well with the X800GTO2 which does 600/600 quite easily and with 7k runs on air not a problem with ATI Silencers already available. Plus, SM 3.0 will not be a requirements (as i've found out) for 3dmark06...it will be recommended and there will be tests specifically for SM 3.0, but from what I've gathered sm 2.0 hw will be able to run on the next 3dmark...however, with severe limitations on some tests with lack of features.

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

I'll answer the question on clocks and the reference cooler at the same time :D

The reference cooler is very limiting for the core...it will only allow a 650Mhz oc. The ram is retarded, it'll go 800 with ease and with no cooling on it whatsoever...meaning ~850 should be possible with ramsinks or ATI Silencer for X1600s.

I'll be looking to get these to run at 700/800 24/7 and 750/1700(850) foe benches, but all that still depends upon what it scores in 3dmark06. Unfortunately, the 128-bit mem interface looks like its going to be very limiting result wise...With only 4 ROPs, core OCs arent going to make that much effect either. Hopefully I can get this to 6k 05 at highest but I'm not hoping for anything near 7k even with the highest clocks, due to pipeline limitations.

Perkam

---

when's 06 coming out? To be honest I don't care about 06 lol. I just want one, all I play is ut04, css, Q4 and fear, this card is fast enough for all of them, and I like to be differant :p:

Quote:

---

To be honest I don't care about 06 lol. I just want one, all I play is ut04, css, Q4 and fear, this card is fast enough for all of them, and I like to be differant

---

Be sure to change the fear.exe to fear1.exe ...the x1600 ends up beating the GS in some reviews with that tweak ;)

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Be sure to change the fear.exe to fear1.exe ...the x1600 ends up beating the GS in some reviews with that tweak ;)

Perkam

---

Yep, sadly it gets its ass beat every where else :slap:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sabrewolf732

Yep, sadly it gets its ass beat every where else :slap:

---

Ha ha true :p: Though I hope the next 3dm can utllize its texture processing power...thats where it can really catch up.

Otherwise, I'm hoping they launch the X1700s to go against the 7600s (most likely) so that the price for these decrease by at least $50 and i can grab an XT for $150 :D

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Ha ha true :p: Though I hope the next 3dm can utllize its texture processing power...thats where it can really catch up.

Otherwise, I'm hoping they launch the X1700s to go against the 7600s (most likely) so that the price for these decrease by at least $50 and i can grab an XT for $150 :D

Perkam

---

yeah, I wonder when they'll be out. ATi has to do something quick

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814131317

Welz, that was posted on page 3 already ;) But thx for finding it...apparently, Newegg does not have the search term x1600 embedded in its engine..it doesnt show up on search. (need to go to video cards -> GPU -> X1600 to see it).

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Welz, that was posted on page 3 already ;) But thx for finding it...apparently, Newegg does not have the search term x1600 embedded in its engine..it doesnt show up on search. (need to go to video cards -> GPU -> X1600 to see it).

Perkam

---

hehe my bad, i also tried the search and it did not work, I suppose only reason you would get this over X800GTO or GTO2 would be for the SM3.0 support?

Yes :p: Plus Multimedia (Vivo, Avivo) features :)

Perkam

I'd just wait for the X1700, you only got a few months to go...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DilTech

I'd just wait for the X1700, you only got a few months to go...

---

what are the specs on the 1700?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

Though I hope the next 3dm can utllize its texture processing power...thats where it can really catch up.

---

you mean shader processing power, since it only has 4 texture units.

You're right :) I get confused at times between TMUs and ROPs... :p:

Perkam

More X1600XT's to look out for come Dec. 16th:

New one from Sapphire

http://img429.imageshack.us/img429/6...gesmall1kv.jpg


New one from Powercolor (current one on newegg has sucky cooler compared to this)

http://img429.imageshack.us/img429/5...gesmall8hk.jpg


An old one but a goody from HIS :)

http://img429.imageshack.us/img429/4...iceq5002pv.jpg

Looking pretty good...now let the prices slide !!!! :D

Perkam

Hey where can you buy HIS?

Neither of the three are available...the HIS design has just been finalized for a month whereas the others were finalized in the last week. Plan on getting the one which is cheapest...or the HIS one if its not $30 more than the other two above.

Perkam

Good looking out perkam

Thx...I will be looking to buy these cards for cheap when the x1700 comes out. As of the moment, the X1600PROs in canada are ~$200 and the X1600XTs are ~$250+Shipping. So i'll wait for them to fall below $170USD so that over here i can grab one with a good cooler for $200 CDN :)

Perkam

MSRP of X1600XT 256MB is now US$179 (was US$249)

MSRP of X1600PRO 256MB is now US$129 (was US$199)

Quote:

---

MARKHAM, Ontario, Dec 13, 2005 (BUSINESS WIRE) -- ATI Technologies Inc. (TSX:ATY)(NASDAQ:ATYT) has made holiday gift giving easier this year, with its feature-rich Radeon&#174; X1600 XT. Delivering outstanding digital entertainment, true-to-life Avivo™ visual quality and 3D graphics performance, Radeon X1600 XT with 256 MB of memory is available for an attractive $179 USD. The Radeon&#174; X1600 Pro with 256 MB of memory is available for $129 USD.

---

http://ir.ati.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=10...165&highlight=

I own 4 two weeks ago , an ati X1600XT gecube , the version with ddr2 ,

1.My half games have bugs ,
2.The Card rus with artifacts at default on Vietcong 2 .
3.For Overclock Suxx badly [tops +25mhz core and 20-25 mems]

I know that the ddr3 version is a little faster , , by the way
Thanx but No thanks . im switching back to nvidia with 6800gs...

6800gs,......you know you want to ;)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130202

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tim

6800gs,......you know you want to ;)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814130202

---

that's an agp 6800.... and athens drivers are still very immature compared to the old ass 6800 drivers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by sabrewolf732

that's an agp 6800.... and athens drivers are still very immature compared to the old ass 6800 drivers

---

I dont Care about Drivers my friend , , , i paid 180 euro [200+++$] and i Cant play without problems , and with poor speeds? [180 euro isnt mutch money but sometimes i compare it with my old 9700pro.... ] , :nono: :slapass: :fact:

Its to hard to say it , , but i think Ati is sleeping deeply at all , , :stick:

6800gs Costs 230~ euro and is far away , , , ,

I think Ati is stucked on the age of 9700 & 9800 pro with the polity of image Quality [lol]

2 late with x800xl [midrange] 2 late with Crosfire ... 2 late with X1k series , 2 late at all ,,,

The X1600PRO is now a very reasonable value mainstream card. Patience is a virtue when going for a new mainstream card. The better X1600XTs have not even begun to arrive, and you jumped for an early x1600pro ? I'll give you that its late, but the X1600 has many multimedia features to compensate.

Always read the reviews before buying something. I'm not expecting the card to start killing 6800GTs in games, because I've seen the benchmarks. Not only does its AVIVO capabilities trounce high end CPUs in encoding and decoding video formats, it hasmany other features which have yet to be unlocked through future drivers. Not to mention better drivers in the future will offer significant performance increases.

The X1600PRO is a good card for casual gaming at a low price but not full throttle mainstream gaming. That's why it has DDR2 to cut costs. The DDR3 on the X1600XT alone costs ~$90 for 256MB and will cost even more for the 512MB GDDR3 versions.

I wouldn't bash the X800XL, it will pwn both a 6800GS and a 6800GT, not to mention most GTOs out there with ease and is now available for under $200 with the new Powercolor GTO16. Making an uninformed decision has its consequences - an X1600PRO at $200 is a $70 Euro rip off the second you bought it. It will still be great for multimedia use. Might I suggest you wait until January for the X1700...which will be the true Next generation mainstream card, going against the Nvidia 7600.

Perkam

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by perkam

The X1600PRO is now a very reasonable value mainstream card. Patience is a virtue when going for a new mainstream card. The better X1600XTs have not even begun to arrive, and you jumped for an early x1600pro ? I'll give you that its late, but the X1600 has many multimedia features to compensate.

Always read the reviews before buying something. I'm not expecting the card to start killing 6800GTs in games, because I've seen the benchmarks. Not only does its AVIVO capabilities trounce high end CPUs in encoding and decoding video formats, it hasmany other features which have yet to be unlocked through future drivers. Not to mention better drivers in the future will offer significant performance increases.

The X1600PRO is a good card for casual gaming at a low price but not full throttle mainstream gaming. That's why it has DDR2 to cut costs. The DDR3 on the X1600XT alone costs ~$90 for 256MB and will cost even more for the 512MB GDDR3 versions.

I wouldn't bash the X800XL, it will pwn both a 6800GS and a 6800GT, not to mention most GTOs out there with ease and is now available for under $200 with the new Powercolor GTO16. Making an uninformed decision has its consequences - an X1600PRO at $200 is a $70 Euro rip off the second you bought it. It will still be great for multimedia use. Might I suggest you wait until January for the X1700...which will be the true Next generation mainstream card, going against the Nvidia 7600.

Perkam

---

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/9781/ati0vw.jpg

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/1482/core6el7si.jpg

its an Xt With ddr2 , and im not expecting to kill my previous card [6800gt] , but here we talk about very bad support .

X800xl appear in the market 8 months later than 6800gt , and the gto2 at the sunset of x8XX series ... ;) . :D all this time 6600gt pwn x700 series and X800-X850 have not a model between week pro [12pipe] and Xt [too expensive] .

Anyway i have nothing 2 say more.

but what do you expect from the x1700, an 8x1-1-3 config? That would have more pixel processing power than a r520, even if it has half the tmu's and less vertex shaders. I doubt Ati would push this even with the r580 avaliable - they would have to clear out their r520's somewhat first.

I would expect if the above configuration would be used, it would not be avaliable before the middle of next year, once r520 stocks have cleared out after it being moved down into the upper midrange. So I doubt an x1700 will be avaliable anytime soon.

Theres a greater chance of ati releasing x1800 gt's with an 8x1-1-1 or 12x1-1-1 configuration to fill the gap between x1600 and x1800, and to help in clearing out r520 stocks after the intrduction of the x1900 or whatever ati may call the r580, then releasing an 8x1-1-3 card as the x1700 once all r520 stock is cleared out.

Quote:

---

its an Xt With ddr2 , and im not expecting to kill my previous card [6800gt] , but here we talk about very bad support .

---

My apologies if this comes has harsh, but you pay the price of being ill informed. ALL X1600PROs are XTs with DDR2. There is no difference between the X1600PRO and the X1600XT other than the memory. If ATI put 1.6ns memory, the X1600XT would be priced at $149 and no 6600GT or GS would come close to its performance/price ratio.

Try running 3dmark05 and see what you get. I'm pretty sure you'll hit 650/1000 clocks with it ... which is not uncommon with the mmeory/core combo. Otherwise, I would recommend you sell the card fast if you dont like it, as it wont even sell for $100 Euros come January.

I'd recommend keeping the card as you'll suffer a very big loss after purchasing it if you sell it now.

Perkam

No Problem :) .

As i said the ddr2 ver x1600xt has 180e [in Greece], the ddr3 ver i think dropted around 220e ,,, with the 6800gs in the price of 230e [in Greece again] the Xt have no Future ....

The gs is all around better card.. powerfull , clockable , pci ex connector 256bit bus [read and write instead of xt have only 256 read and 128 write] .
and the most importand a very good and tested Nf4 [sli ;)]

The same on Newegg as i saw x1600xt costs 180$ and Gs 200$ .

Ati as always :D pay more getting less , and the image quality of course. :hehe: .

And with my Card... i take it back on the store and change it with a gs with some money++ of course.

[the card have 600core and 400ddr2[800mem] , core tops at 620 and mems at 890~] 4.5k 05~ & 22k 01 @ venice 2.65~giga utt 240~ 2-2-2-8]