8RDA and GF4 dying solution within...

A little awareness guys. Thats all.

Take a look at your board. Now take a look at the clearance between dimm slot 1's clip and the card. Thats right, about 0.2mms. Now look at whats missing off your GF4.....

Because of the length of the GF4 and the proximity of the dimm socket clip theres a tiny transistor that gets knocked off if you install the card straight. What you have to do is bend the back of the card slightly away from the dimm slot when you put it in so the edge of the dimm clip clears the transistor on the GF4.

The 8RDA isnt killing boards - but the design leaves a lot to be desired. Its kind of hard to explain without my camera handy to take a picture and sho you all, but I had the same thing happen to my friend yesterday. Perfectly working card, installed in the 8RDA+ and it was dead. Tried another board - dead. Examined the card against a known working Ti4600 after I noticed how close it was to the dimm clips and sure enough the transistor had been knocked off it.

Spread this knowledge around please lads or a lot of people are going to be VERY upset over christmas.

Ill say again, all you HAVE to do when installing a GF4 is to bend the back part of the GF4 slightly away from the dimm clips (about 1mm if that) when you plug it in. When its in the transistor is below the dimm clip and not being touched at all. Remember to do the same if you take the card out too btw ;).

Take care all and have a good christmas.

PiLsY.

Thank You VERY much Pilsy. I don't have a geforce4, but have read alot of this killing crap........
I'll spread the word.

:toast:

Excellent observation PiLsY:toast:

So much for the mystery of blowing out AGP cards:D

OPP

Too bad another gf4 had to die because of this oversight on Epox's part though. I am wondering if they changed the design of the dimm clip or moved something ( they may have seen this AFTER a ton of boards were made, and revised it quickly ). hence the 1.1 revision??

Interesting. Hopefully those who've lost their cards can verify this. Thanks for the heads-up PiLsY :)

That would also somehow explain why none of the ATI cards have been dying in the 8rda+ :)

--fibo

i have a question dont the 4200 have this problem too the reason that i say this is that the 4200 is a shorter card than the 4400 and the 4600 i have a 4200 and my 8dra is getting opened up tomaro night and i hope your right about this but how can this be the awnser for two different lenghts of cards?

Thank you for clearing that up, pilsy! :toast:


@doyt: my suspicion is that all who have a dead GF4 ti4200 due to an epox 8rda+, have an enhanced version of a Ti4200. A 10 layer pcb design with a cheap ti4200 on it (eg. Albatron Ti4200P?) would have the same problem as a ti4400/4600.

Quote:

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Originally posted by doyt
i have a question dont the 4200 have this problem too the reason that i say this is that the 4200 is a shorter card than the 4400 and the 4600 i have a 4200 and my 8dra is getting opened up tomaro night and i hope your right about this but how can this be the awnser for two different lenghts of cards?

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There are a few TI4200's out there that have the same size characteristics than a TI4400 or TI4600 (i.e. Albatron TI4200 Turbo)

--fibo

i noticed this when i installed my 4600, i also was careful to avoid hitting that transistor...Just bent it back a tid and pushed it in...not problems so far except that this Mb can not do above 190 FSB stable...

I´v had one card dying on me.
Visiontek GF4 Ti4600.

RMA`d it already but have dropped a mail to the shop where I bought it.
Hopefully they can check out if the transistor is missing.

Happy Holiday´s!

oh yea, and its not enough to make me return it for a rev1.1 board....

I think they difference ont eh rev1.1 board is that they moved the Memory slots up a little or lowered something else...Not positive though but acording to aoa nazis the difference was only cosmetic.

very good observation there...i was a bit hesitant buying this board (even though i have the 9700 pro), but may reconsider it...

I can't acknowledge this theory ... I'm have somewhat older pics of my Leadtek A250TD (GF4Ti4400) ... and some pics which were made directly before dispatch to Leadtek ... I compared this pics ... I can't see missing components within the questionable area ... and if components had so obviously been missing, Leadtek wouldn't have exchanged the card within 48 hours!

@PiLsY:

IMHO a nice attempt of explanation, but doesn't look like this is the true reason for all the smoked GF4!

There dosen't seem to be any difference in the spacing between the v1.0 and v1.1 boards. I have both, dimm seems to be in the same place on both boards.

ahh... thanx *very* much...
I just got my Albatron GF4 Ti4200P Turbo & am waiting for my 8RDA+...

I'm not really sure about "bending" the geforce4.. as maybe if i move my computer around (as i do), the card wi ll bend back and hit the clip?

Anyways -- i know this sound stupid, but can i possibly get a hacksaw and saw off the protruding bit off the DIMM clip?
sounds a bit idiotic :rolleyes: , but it may do the job... any suggestions?

thanx!

Stanley - the transistor in question is about 1mm x 2mm square. I very much doubt youd even notice if it was missing unless you were looking directly at the spot where it was supposed to be.

SYNer - just bend the card m8. It wont hurt it, infact you probably wouldnt even notice but they bend anyway - designed to.

The other alterantive is pulling the dimm clip out of its mounting. Easy enough to do, but means you wont be able to use slot 1. I certainly wouldnt take a hacksaw to your motherboard - warranty void, and one slip and its all over.

PiLsY.

Found a picture...

Good find PiLsY

I was one of the few who lost a g4 4600.
My transistor is missing. :brick:

ok thanx a heap PiLsY :D

Looks like thats confirmation then...

kuzma - I'll try and find out exactly what that transistor is and get a part number. The card is not damaged in the least apart from that. Solder a new one on and itll be as good as new :).

PiLsY.

Thanks PiLsy, if there is some way of fixing the card, that would be great.:) It was a Visiontek card, so rma was very unlikely.

Kuzma : Nah, Visiontek is back, and they are honouring their RMA's, there are confirmed reports of this. So just RMA it, you will get a new card.

/Damir

well i have just hoked up my 8rda+ rev 1.1 and 4200 not turbo
and no problems here the card dosent even come close to the dimms so that helps to further prove the transistor theory:)

Just checked against the lists over at AOA and OCUK, and all the cards reported dead are the full length PCB versions.

Although weve had no confirmation from Epox, Kuzma's report seems to acknowledge that there is at least a problem here. Combined with only full length PCB cards having been reported dead so far id stake my reputation on it (although having said that I bet I come to regret it ;)).

PiLsY.

As soon as I know if my Visiontek also is missing the transistor I will let ya know.
If it´s missing, it should mean your theory is right :)

I´m glad I was so stubborn to update the list of dead GF4 on AOA even though most users said there is not any fault with 8RDA+/GF4 combination.

Quote:

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Originally posted by doyt
well i have just hoked up my 8rda+ rev 1.1 and 4200 not turbo
and no problems here the card dosent even come close to the dimms so that helps to further prove the transistor theory:)

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Yep, I think the transistor theory is fact by now :p

Did you discover this yourself, PiLsY?

EPoX coulda given ya a little credit ;)

http://www.epox.com/html/support-art...0I3O2n1Oz03Z3K

Hmm wouldve been nice. Infact even a proper response to the email I sent them wouldve been nice.

That picture, however, is in no way representative of the problem. The board they have pictured there either has smaller dimm clips or is a different board to the one I have been working on. On the board I have the dimm clips and card actually overlap. They are not merely close, they are crossing each other.

PiLsY.

So is this another 8kha+ in that they didn't follow Jedec spec again like on the 8kha+. IMO they should be responsible for replacing all these video cards that got ruined by this board. Funny how they were denying all resposibility in the beginning and it comes out to be bad board design once again by Epox.

My v1.1 seems like it could still obstruct a long card. I have a r9700 so it doesn't even come close. I think PiLsY is right as there were no probs with my or any other ati's or short boards.

Good work

Quote:

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Originally posted by PiLsY
What you have to do is bend the back of the card slightly away from the dimm slot when you put it in so the edge of the dim clip clears the transistor on the GF4.

PiLsY.

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Well that is exactly what killed my fisrt GF4 card, bending it out of the way slightly, not scraping it.

Damned if you do, damned if you dont.....

GJ Epox :rolleyes:.

PiLsY.

Maybe I should RMA my Ti200 and see what I get from them..?

The damn thing smoked the whole inside of my case a while back.. 8-(

Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn,

Spent 2 hours installing my 8rda yesterday, and guess what - popped the ti4600 in and crackle crackle. Its dead. If only I had seen the reason why they are dying 2 days ago !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And yes on closer observation the tiny component has been scraped off and there is slight burn scoring in the area where the card fried.

Oh Bugger.

This will be the 2nd time ive RMA'd my 4600 - Overclockers.co.uk are going to h8 me :(

Thanks for the solution anyway. Just a shame I didnt see it earlier.

Brett

im new to this forum because i was intrigued by this thread
couldnt we just put thermal tape over the component, like the tape that comes with chipset heatsinks and cpu probes etc... ?

:toast: :banana:

The problem is not heat (and if it was, then thermal tape would not help, as it does not remove heat, it is only an interface material.. like Arctic Silver/Nanotherm). The problem is a device being physically removed from the PCB of the video card when it is installed. One of the ram clips presses against the device and will knock it off if you are not careful when installing the video card..

I wasn't talking about heat.
the tape could cover the part that gets removed from the PCB.

thermal tape was what i was suggesting since it isnt conductive

I joined the blow out the GF4 Ti4600 club today! The chip shown by PiLsY is still there though. Happened on the v1.0 board and was running fine on the v1.1 board 5 minutes before and went down while entering Windows 2K. Oh well, time to RMA the Ti4600. :p

Putting some clear silicon epoxy-like stuff over that transistor would alos work..

well that would prevent anything from scraping it off i would imagine

ah, my bad..

the tape still wouldnt work too well, as it could pile up in front of the transistor...

the epoxy/glue idea sounds good, though.

Quote:

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Originally posted by Brett
Damn, Damn, Damn, Damn,

Spent 2 hours installing my 8rda yesterday, and guess what - popped the ti4600 in and crackle crackle. Its dead. If only I had seen the reason why they are dying 2 days ago !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And yes on closer observation the tiny component has been scraped off and there is slight burn scoring in the area where the card fried.

Oh Bugger.

This will be the 2nd time ive RMA'd my 4600 - Overclockers.co.uk are going to h8 me :(

Thanks for the solution anyway. Just a shame I didnt see it earlier.

Brett

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I have RMA'ed 3 times now so dont feel too ad, first 2 were defective, 3rd one burned out on my 8k3a+ (no physical damage) nothing you could see with the naked eye, it jsut decided it did not want to play battlefield anymore and it just died int eh middle of a game after months of use...strangest thing i have ever really had happen on a system...Now my card is at risk again, i have already installe dit about 5 times into my 8rda+, still working so far though (the vid card the MB still has problems)...

Bloody hell. Now i've got a dead Ti4400. If only I'd read this thread before I installed my board. I realise this is an old thread, so sorry for digging it up, but this has just happened to me (only got the 8RDA+ 1.1 yesterday).

Once you've knocked the little transistor off is it possible to reconnect it? What I mean is, has my card fried without it? Mine was only knocked partially off, so it was able to be bent back to its proper spot. I did this, but still no boot. Has anyone recovered their card?

Thanks,
dojobi

I lost my Albatron Ti4200 to this. I knew about it at the time but i simply forgot. :(

Did you still have the transistor, or did yours fall off totally? I've rigged mine back up so that it is back in its original spot, but it still doesn't work. I was thinking that maybe the card REALLY doesn't like not having it, and the card dies.

WOW lucky I've been lazy the last couple days, got my 8rda+ on sat and a tbred1700+ a few days earlier was about put everything together and take my ti4400 from my other system. Lucky I didn;t make a move yet. Thanks Pilsy :banana: