DFI NF4 the UTT/VX/BH5 KILLER READ IF YOU HAVE DFI

Hi Guys, My 2 DFI boards have killed every stick of Ram I have put in slot 2 on the board! They have so far killed 2 sticks of Twinmos UTT, 4 Sticks of VX and one BH5. I have been using only 3.3 or 3.4 volts each time and each stick has worked for between one and three weeks before dying!! Once more my brother has killed 2 BH5 and 2 Sticks of VX again all of them plugged into slot 2 with the memory at above 3.2 volts i.e 3.4- 3.5

I am of the opinion that the DFI simply kills memory! I run my PC24/7 and memory in this board simply does not last and I am sick am RMA after RMA. Anyone else experienced dead memory in slot 2?

IF so post then DFI might want to do something about it!

Oh and I have used a 110 CMF fan on the Dimms and two 50 CMF fanson the fets if you r thinking it's cooling think again!!

dose it not work at all? Or can ya do the samething we all do. Boot with the good stick in an orange slot. after in windows. Shut down, Leave the power supply on. Shove the "bad" stick in the other slot. and try to post?

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...792#post843792

anyways.
Peace Nugz

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Originally Posted by pazza316

Hi Guys, My 2 DFI boards have killed every stick of Ram I have put in slot 2 on the board! They have so far killed 2 sticks of Twinmos UTT, 4 Sticks of VX and one BH5. I have been using only 3.3 or 3.4 volts each time and each stick has worked for between one and three weeks before dying!! Once more my brother has killed 2 BH5 and 2 Sticks of VX again all of them plugged into slot 2 with the memory at above 3.2 volts i.e 3.4- 3.5

I am of the opinion that the DFI simply kills memory! I run my PC24/7 and memory in this board simply does not last and I am sick am RMA after RMA. Anyone else experienced dead memory in slot 2?

IF so post then DFI might want to do something about it!

Oh and I have used a 110 CMF fan on the Dimms and two 50 CMF fanson the fets if you r thinking it's cooling think again!!

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condensation from not enough insulation from your phase changer? :confused:

Na guys its not condensation this board kills memory my bro does not use phase and the same thing happens

Well this kinda scares me abit, considering i was planning on upgrading to DFI :(

Dont bother! Till DFI sort the problem my mate who owns a shop has had many a RAM stick back fragged by the DFI!!

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Originally Posted by pazza316

Dont bother! Till DFI sort the problem my mate who owns a shop has had many a RAM stick back fragged by the DFI!!

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maybe its ur powerstream, i remember back when the dfi board first came out it had probs with zippy and ocz powerstream 520 psus. I mean, anandtech has been running their high voltage ram for a while with this mobo and not had a single one die or report of it dieing.

i have heard of this happening to one other person. tRTW was set too low in cmos reloaded, and it nabbed his sticks (TCCD and CH5). he verified in another board. after a CMOS clear, all was well.

i have never experienced it and have been runnin 3.4 since i got the board on these bh5 (approx. 3 months).

been running my BH5 in slot 2/4 with my PS520 at 3.2V for quite some time now. Maybe somehting with the 5V line your doing wrong?

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Originally Posted by pershoot

i have heard of this happening to one other person. tRTW was set too low in cmos reloaded, and it nabbed his sticks (TCCD and CH5). he verified in another board. after a CMOS clear, all was well.

i have never experienced it and have been runnin 3.4 since i got the board on these bh5 (approx. 3 months).

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does it still happen with the newer bioses? I have a few friends with a trtw of 1 and save to the cmos reloaded are they at any risk?

im sure it was an isolated incident. i wouldnt worry too much. just clear CMOS if you can't POST from a bad setting and youll be fine.

Apparently it is only a problem on the 5v line BUT it should work OK as the OCZ VX etc is warrantied to 3.5 and I have only used 3.4 - 3.45 their is a problem with the board! me thinks!

it happened while on +3 to my friend.

no sense in making a generalisation at this stage. these incidents dont pop up too often (if they did, then it would not be good, ha).

the wild and unpredictable world of oc'ing, hehe.

RMA the board, it appears to be faulty if that is happening.

Nope, It happened to my 4 sticks of Mushkin blue running around 3.4v as well. None of them will boot on any machine I have (thats 4 desktops I tried) with the memory after the incident. Could be the VRM on DFI NF4 using 5v jumper is what is causing it is my guess. Typical sympton before death of 4 sticks were cold boot issue (random became more frequent as memory started dying than became... impossible to boot).
I might try PSU direct voltage memory voltage method but for time being sticking to 3.2v setup and have had no issues for about 3 weeks so far. (but than the 4 blues died after about 2-3 months of usage)

I have a contact that says this is not a generalisation! Its the board!

I like conspiracy theories as much as the next guy...but c'mon, if I had a dollar for every time someone said "xxxxxx is a fact because *I have a contact*" well, I'd be rich...if this was a problem with more than a few people we'd see message boards lit up everywhere with these sort of problems...tons of people have been running BH-5/UTT in their DFI / NF4 mobos for a long time now without problems...and I find it hard to believe that DFI knows that their motherboard is killing RAM and not doing anything about it, especially given their close relationship to OCZ who is the primary purveyor of this type of memory through their VX line...I'm willing to believe that *your* motherboard kills this type of memory, I'm willing to believe that there may be a couple other people out there that have had memory killed by their DFI NF4 mobos...I do not believe that DFI just plain kills these high voltage IC's, and that everyone should panic...I've read about people having their TCCD ram killed by their NF4 board too...does that mean we should all stop using Winbond or Samsung IC RAMs and go buy something with Micron or Hynix in it? no...Sorry for you loss, but I really don't think there's cause to try inciting people, getting everyone worried, and claiming that some companies that have been good to us in product support are secretly scheming to ruin our computers...c'mon now

Just my .02, if you guys wanna panic then feel free, start a protest in front of DFI's headquarters demanding answers or something

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Originally Posted by jinu117

Nope, It happened to my 4 sticks of Mushkin blue running around 3.4v as well. None of them will boot on any machine I have (thats 4 desktops I tried) with the memory after the incident. Could be the VRM on DFI NF4 using 5v jumper is what is causing it is my guess. Typical sympton before death of 4 sticks were cold boot issue (random became more frequent as memory started dying than became... impossible to boot).

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I had the same symptoms, then 1 stick of my twinmoss died. Ran 24/7 for about 6 weeks 260, 2-2-2-6@ 3.4v. It was also the stick in the #2 slot. I don't think that this is random. I have been checking into it more, and just about any forum you go to, there is a thread about this. Really disappointed about this. I am switching to some tccd now. Hopefully this issue will not happen with it.

http://forums.extremeoverclocking.co...d.php?t=169487

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Originally Posted by Impaqt

I would recomend using ONE stick of expendable ram when you flash to a new bios ifyour using 4v setting on your DFI. I've seen THREE reports (Including me) of ram chips dying when optimized defaults were loaded after a Bios flash when the 4v jumper was on.....

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- quote from extremeoverclocking forums

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Originally Posted by Jester FPS

http://forums.extremeoverclocking.co...d.php?t=169487

- quote from extremeoverclocking forums

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ya see, i flash all the time on +5 feed, and always load optimised defaults, clear cmos, etc.. guess every ones situation/envmt. is diff..

Hmm... I am about to get a new DFI and some VX 4000. I am assuming this just happens on a few and isnt much of a problem? Lemme know if this aint a good idea.

I had 1 set of VX4000 die on me after trying to uprgade processors from my FX-55 to San Diego 4000+. That to was in slot 2/4. Since I have upgraded to the Mushkin Redline and bios 510-2, I changed to the 1/3 slots. They are supposeldy better for higher voltage rams... We'll see!

so if my friend flashed his bios to 510-2 b4 switching over to 5v rail he should be fine?

I agree with saiamne, making huge generalisations like this is not the way to go. DFI is the *best* motherboard producer, it terms of its contact and support with the overclocking community, a flaw so large would have been brought to its attention quite some time ago, if it existed. I dont doubt that your board has killed some ram....its a faulty board, RMA it, and for gods sake, stop putting more ram in it.

I also dont doubt that there are several board similar to this, but you have to get perspective, does every user that has no problems post about it? Do users that do? Irrespective of that, how many users on this forum use BH-5 & UTT based ram at high voltages, and have done so for months??

With respect, it would be better if you did not make alarmist statements that trigger this sort of response:

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AMD-me:
Well this kinda scares me abit, considering i was planning on upgrading to DFI :(

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pazza316:
Dont bother! Till DFI sort the problem my mate who owns a shop has had many a RAM stick back fragged by the DFI!!

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And as a side note, your from the UK, why are using words like this:

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bro

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Heheh, just kidding.

uscfan: I'm in the same boat with you... oh and Go Bears =)

I am very happy with my dfi board, but there are enough people reporting this kind of problem to make me wonder if there is some kind of issue with the board. Maybe it is just that the ram can't handle high volts for an extended period of time. When my ram died, I was not flashing bios. Everything was running fine. I was trying to find a better way to mount my 2 80mm fans than just the zip ties I was using. After plugging it back in again, could not get it to boot. Then I put in some old ram, flashed to 4/14-3, tried with my twinmoss, again no boot. Finally figured out that 1 stick just plain died. So, I don't think that it is only an issue when flashing. I also don't understand how everything can be fine, then after being shut down for 1/2 hour, 1 stick just dies :confused:

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Originally Posted by 4X4N

I am very happy with my dfi board, but there are enough people reporting this kind of problem to make me wonder if there is some kind of issue with the board. Maybe it is just that the ram can't handle high volts for an extended period of time. When my ram died, I was not flashing bios. Everything was running fine. I was trying to find a better way to mount my 2 80mm fans than just the zip ties I was using. After plugging it back in again, could not get it to boot. Then I put in some old ram, flashed to 4/14-3, tried with my twinmoss, again no boot. Finally figured out that 1 stick just plain died. So, I don't think that it is only an issue when flashing. I also don't understand how everything can be fine, then after being shut down for 1/2 hour, 1 stick just dies :confused:

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Are you sure it was the RAM?

I bet the stick in slott two died it has done that every time on my memory killed some great ram. The VRM's on this 4 volt mod don't seem stable to me and loads of people have reported this. DFI DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!

I agree something needs to be done about this. My sticks of VX aren't working properly either. :(

Have you gone back to low Vdimm, and slower speed and retested the "dead" ram. Let the ram sit on the table for a day, then recheck it.

I have a couple sticks that seem to have a SPD rom problem with high Vdimm... they "heal" after a day, but never get back to tolerating high Vdimm for long ever again. Once reborn, they work fine at 3.2Vdimm or below and never have a problem again. but applying 3.3V+ will get them to lock up again.... weird. And this was on NForce2 board, not DFI A64.

My sticks ran OK with OCZ booster in MSI and DFI NF3 boards at 3.5 and 3.6 previously when I get onto DFI nf4 they are killed!! No probs previously at all!

CPU dead or not ? From your post , it seems that your cpu is alive ~ Assume that the board will supply the improper DRAM voltage to cause the RAM to be killed , why the CPU DRAM controller survived ? As far as I know , the K8 DRAM controller is much more sensitive to improper DRAM voltage than the DRAM itslef ... :confused: :confused:

ohh no good news!
ehm slot 2+4 are the orange ones? i'll avoid using them ;)
and 1+3 are supposed to do better with high voltage so why the hell are you guys using 2+4?

mfg

Yellow slots will not clock full stop on my board! Thats why!

gotta hand it to you man. after losing a couple stix bh5 in slot 2, wouldnt let that stop you, feed in 4 or 5 more. nice work.


very truly yours,
politenessman

how 'bout the warning from Oskar Wu and OPB about possible hardware damage?

Are you shutting down the motherboard, removing power and discharging BEFORE changing/swapping/replacing sticks?? Are you following the similar guidelines for setting 5v jumper???

There have been warnings about these things, we must all heed them!

C

Yes all the warnings heeded just like evryone else with Killed RAM

too much inductance on the power rails to slot 2 are causing transient spikes! ;)

they need to fatten their traces and add a bigger cap

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gotta hand it to you man. after losing a couple stix bh5 in slot 2, wouldnt let that stop you, feed in 4 or 5 more. nice work.

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Hahahahaha, classic! :clap:

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Originally Posted by Quanticles

too much inductance on the power rails to slot 2 are causing transient spikes! ;)

they need to fatten their traces and add a bigger cap

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err so is everyone unsafe using the orange slots?

maybe its cause by this problem http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/show...2&postcount=34

a 20pin psu can kill your ram on a dfi4.

Anyone here who's ram died using a 20PIN PSU?
I myself ordered a DFI4 Ultra-D but i got a 20pin PSU from LC Power 550W, should I be worried?

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Originally Posted by 187(V)URD@

maybe its cause by this problem http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/show...2&postcount=34

a 20pin psu can kill your ram on a dfi4.

Anyone here who's ram died using a 20PIN PSU?
I myself ordered a DFI4 Ultra-D but i got a 20pin PSU from LC Power 550W, should I be worried?

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I've got a 24 Pin PSU and have the problems so I doubt that's the reason for these problems.

I've recently had 2 512MB sticks of G-SKILL LE TCCD die on me in my DFI SLI board and i never used the 4v jumper. I had them runing for a few months at 3.24v just uppin the 3.3v rail on my Zippy P/S. It was just like all of the sudded i could not post anymore everytime.. till it would'nt post at all after a few mins.. Tried everything.

Since got them replaced with 2 more sticks of the same with the lifetime warrenty and changed to a PCPC 850 WATT P/S thinking it was my power supply since i've had 3 sets of hard drives die on me.. I was thinkin it was a bad P/S or not enough power that killed them and the ram.. Now i'm thinkin different.

running TCCD @ 3.2V? isn't that not recommended?

Most ppl using 2.6v-2.9v with their TCCD, I don't think u can get more out of them with 3v+.....usually.

I also have had problems with the ram.

I have already tried to leave them several days on the table and this follows without working.

I always have followed the recommendations to use the 4V and the bios 413-X and even so one of my TMSP let work.

I have already proven to him in other machines and is the same.

Use 2 x 120mm Enermax on the ram and mosfets controlling 260@2-2-2-6 = 3.4V - 3.5V :D .

I believe that the DFI is an Excellent mobo, but without a doubt must there have a problem .

just posted on dfi forums http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/show...732#post112732

I have flashed 6 different bioses with 4 volt jumper and BH5..... No problems here.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...ad.php?t=59420

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Originally Posted by Onepagebook

Not posted on the DFI yet.

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Add support for AMD Venice , San Diego Core cpu Cool n quiet

prevent Jp 17 jumper problem cause vdimm still stay at over 3.3v when jp17 set back to 1-2.
DFI recommand cumstomer need to set to 3.3v AND clear CMOS before set the jp17 back to 1-2 default position.

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Might have something to do with it if you were running older BIOS'es and changing between TCCD/BH-5 type ram.

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Originally Posted by P_1

just posted on dfi forums http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/show...732#post112732

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The lovely moderator said there was a thread on the topic already, but failed to post which one it was. Very nice of him. Closed the thread too.

Although most of the RAM module maker gurantee their memory to be rated at 3.5V , I don't think it is correct for user to think that it's a safe and problem free behavior to work 7/24 under that voltage ... Most of the DDR SDRAM only gurantee 2.8V maximum absolutely rating working voltage ... Anything beyond that is an unknown status ... :fact:

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Originally Posted by wtz54321

Although most of the RAM module maker gurantee their memory to be rated at 3.5V , I don't think it is correct for user to think that it's a safe and problem free behavior to work 7/24 under that voltage ... Most of the DDR SDRAM only gurantee 2.8V maximum absolutely rating working voltage ... Anything beyond that is an unknown status ... :fact:

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Nor does any cpu manufacturer endorse extra 100mhz.... :stick:
This typical sympton of UTT, BH-5 dying in relatively short time with *low* voltage (by some standard :P) is something that hasn't happened as frequently before. It's gotta be something with that 5v VRM design DFI used in conjunction with rest of component... I can't say what it is specifically but after repeatedly running memory well around 3.5v on VX, BH-5, quite a few UTT for months at a time, and having first time of this issue on DFI NF-4 ultra makes me be wary of using it's 5v dip. Right now I am sticking to what Big Toe suggest for needed voltage. Let's see how well these 4 sticks last over months now...

Another possible reason is the heat under high voltage which will cause/accelerate the electron migration behavior in semiconductor and finally killed the dram , we all know that using 5V Jumper in DFI NF-4 will generate extremely high temperature compare to using directly 3.3V DRAM mod or by using OCZ DDR Booster ... And the hot spot area is very close to the DIMM1/DIMM2 ... If the DRAM is killed by improper voltage , K8 DRAM controller should be more sensitive to be damaged first ... Also why there is only one slot killed the DRAM ? :confused: :confused:

Applying high gate voltage will cause the semiconductor to be dead instantly by " Punch Through " effect , this is a immediately situation once the voltage is too high for the gate oxiode even it's in a very very short time period ... However the high voltage will not cause the electromigration behavior , only the heat followed by the high working voltage will cause this kind of semiconductor behavior which will last for a certain period until the semiconductor finally shotred caused by electromigration ... :fact:

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Originally Posted by wtz54321

Applying high gate voltage will cause the semiconductor to be dead instantly by " Punch Through " effect , this is a immediately situation once the voltage is too high for the gate oxiode even it's in a very very short time period ... However the high voltage will not cause the electromigration behavior , only the heat followed by the high working voltage will cause this kind of semiconductor behavior which will last for a certain period until the semiconductor finally shotred caused by electromigration ... :fact:

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Not even in consideration when memory is running cooler than "stock" setting at supposed stock voltage with no cooling due to good 2x60mm fan righ above it. I've had way too many memories that didn't have issues such as this at HIGHER voltage to think it is only issue with memory.
One thing that will kill memory other than extreme voltage or extreme heat is extreme fluctuation (rapid) of voltage supplied. (2-3 months of 24x7 isn't that long) To think all 4 sticks went out at same time is fault of memory alone is.... :stick:
Something happened that shouldn't have happened. Also, this issue happens when cold booting as I had them running well until I shut down and upon start... no boot...

:confused: Extreme fluctuation (rapid) of voltage supplied is the samething as extreme voltage when we are talking about the punch through effect of transistor . Even in a every short time period , once the voltage exceed the limit of that the gate oxide can handle , punch through will happened immediately .... If the memory is killed by the voltage not the heat after a certain time period , the only possible reason is that after 7/24 usage lasting for a long time , the VRM of the board start to become unstable as the beginning ~~~ This is the only possible reason that I can think about ...

Well, I must add that I had the exact same problem most folks experienced here too. 1 stick of my Twinmos SP (UTT) mysteriously died after running 260Mhz at 3.4vdimm for just a couple of days. Got the 3 LED lights indicating memory not detected. Cleared CMOS, reflashed BIOS and others did not help. Decided to try just the faulty stick in orange slot 2 and somehow manage to boot. Didn't work anymore though after that.

Had my BH6 sticks in there since the incident. Several people mentioned flashing to new BIOS's and using yellow dimm slots have helped revived the 'dead' stick. Hopefully my Twinmos sticks aren't dead :(

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Originally Posted by Quanticles

The lovely moderator said there was a thread on the topic already, but failed to post which one it was. Very nice of him. Closed the thread too.

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yea and I also pmed him as well, I got a read receipt but no response.
Also to all those that are having problems with their ram, what bioses are you guys using so we can narrow down what is causing this problem

i've tried every bios from 310 upwards.

no I mean with what bios did ur ram die on? I'm trying to see if anyones ram has died while using the new 414 or 510 bioses

My RAM was fine then I flashed to 414 and the sticks started having problems cold booting, but still I could get them booted if I rebooted a few times and swapped them around.

I flashed back to 310 and it was fine again until the cold boot problem came back and this time I had to boot using 1 stick. Now I've got 1 bad stick that doesn't want to boot at all on this mobo - no matter what BIOS I try. The other stick is still 100% fine.

so while on 414 there was cold boot issue but no ram killing correct?

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Originally Posted by P_1

so while on 414 there was cold boot issue but no ram killing correct?

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That's correct, I may have had the cold boot issue before I flashed to that BIOS - just that was when I first stumbled across the cold boot problem.

I have this happeneing to me too. 2 sticks of TwinMOS SpeedPremiums and 2 sticks of TwinMOS regulr (non-SP). They are not actually dead, I can boot into windows fine, but they are very unstable and once in a while cause BSOD even at 200 MHz and 2.5-3-3-x timings. They both used to be P95 stable for 20+ hours at 260-263 MHz, 3.4V, 2-2-2-5-1T.

First one, TMSP ones, went bad when i flashed from the stock (1/25) BIOS to the 310 BIOS. I don't really know what happened (I followed the instuctions for the flash down to the letter), but after the flash it the sticks became unstable in windows.

Second one, TMII ones, worked fine after the flash (after I switched from the TMSP sticks). I actually scaled it down to 252 MHz and 3.2V, since I read about these TwinMOS sticks die from several people, and everyone was suggesting not to use over 3.2V. In any case it was stable at that speed and I used it for about a month, until I decided to try and push my CPU higher (it was at 9x280 with 9:10 RAM devider). After a couple of unsuccessful rans of P95 I decided to check my stability at the speed I was running and to my surprise P95 failed. Tried it several times, with the same result. So I decided to run Memtest86 again, and it failed. Then I tested each stick separately and one of the sticks was still fine (could still do 252 with 2.3V or 263 with 3.4), but the other one was erroring like crazy. I was getting errors in the very first test, as soon as Memtest86 starts. Unfortunately i didn't note which stick was good and which one was bad (meaning which DIMM slot) so I can't confirm or deny some views expressed here about 2nd DIMM.

Right now I am using Patriot XBLK TCCD, but I am still on +5V line and I am using 414-3 BIOS (I flashed the bios after switching over to TCCD). And to be honest I don't know what I should do next. Should I switche back to +3.3V line? I am kidn of afraid to do that after reading that that might actually damage RAM. I also want to flash to one of the newer BIOS (510-1, 2, 3) but I am not sure which one to try.

I would really like to get some feedback from DFI people. Once again I am not here to trash DFI. I think it is a great company and I think it is a great board. No doubt the cater overclocking community. But there are a lot of people out there having these issues, and you can't simply discard it.

Does anyone have a link to the thread in dfi-street that the moderator was referring to? I couldn't find anything.

Thanks.

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Originally Posted by hovo73

Does anyone have a link to the thread in dfi-street that the moderator was referring to? I couldn't find anything.

Thanks.

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http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10822

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11963

http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/showthread.php?t=11107


There is a few. :toast:
Thinking its a desing issue and we might just have to deal with it. As what they going to do? refund everyone a new board or something. :D right

Peace Nugz

Have all you guys with dead RAM been on the 5 volt line? and not using the 3.3 volt mod? I say this because I was on the 5 volt when I killed all my RAM!
A friend of mine has had 23 sticks of UTT back out of a batch of 100 Killed by the 5 volt line and DFI with most people using 3.2, 3.3 or 3.4 (BUT ALL 5 VOLT LINE!) I am not here to slag DFI my 250UT Board did great as did my NF2 Ultra I just want an answer to this problem! All posters tell us if you used the 5 volt line when your RAM Broke!

I was on the 5v line too.

i could swear my multimemter reading jumped 5.34v on the vdimm when i was checking to see if it flucuates while booting and during memtest and i think it was after a bios flash.

Hi Wingz,

Where you using the 5 Volt line for memory when you got this jump? Or was it from the 3.3 volt line?

I was on the +5V too.

I started testing with +3.3V line. I got up to around 220 to 230 MHz with 3.2V then I switched to +5V line. When I did, something interesting happened. With still 3.2V but now from the +5V line rather than +3.3V one, it went up to about 250 - 255 MHz. At the time I hypothisized that this is because at 3.2V the voltage is not very clean coming from the 3.3 line because it is at the very edge.

In any case, yes I was using +5V line.


Nugz, thanks for the links. It could be a BIOS issues rather than a design issue, and that can be fixed through BIOS updates. People can also RMA their boards, I am sure DFI doesn't want to have 1000 RMAs, so they should be looking into this problem. I wander if they are.

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Originally Posted by pazza316

Hi Wingz,

Where you using the 5 Volt line for memory when you got this jump? Or was it from the 3.3 volt line?

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i been using the 5V.

I ask about the 5 volt because I tested with volt meter tonight and on boot got 5.2 going through the DIMMS these where old crappy ones for test purposes so didnt care if they got blasted but 5.2 the same! and this happened with both my DFI NF4 ULTRA D boards!!! I am on 3.3 volt rail form now on, well untill DFI have sorted the problem! :slapass: :slapass: :slapass:

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Originally Posted by pazza316

I ask about the 5 volt because I tested with volt meter tonight and on boot got 5.2 going through the DIMMS these where old crappy ones for test purposes so didnt care if they got blasted but 5.2 the same! and this happened with both my DFI NF4 ULTRA D boards!!! I am on 3.3 volt rail form now on, well untill DFI have sorted the problem! :slapass: :slapass: :slapass:

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What do you mean, "5.2 going through the DIMMS" ??? Where did you happen to measure that?

Just for more input to the thread, I was using 2/18 bios and the 5v line running 3.4v when my stick died. Only flashed to 4/14 bios after I couldn't get it to boot. I am not even going to try to run any more UTT until there are some answers to this issue. Currently have my OZC plat. rev 2 at 290 2.5-3-3-8@2.8v. I think I'll stick with this instead.

I have an opinion to give...
Since bios 316 or 310, oscar changed something in the bios, that made my bh.5 ram to stop working on slots 2 and 4.
After i flashed the new bios, i coulnd't get into windows no way.
And could only boot after a cmos flash if i booted with some utt first and changed cas to 2, cus as you know bh.5 doesn't work with 3.

This was strange and after a few hours, when i was about to turn to 2xx bios or whatever i had, i tried the yellow slots, and bam! everything was back on track.
If i plug them again on orange slots, it won't boot to windows not even at 200 with relaxed timings.

Try and post back.

I´m using a direct 3.3v from psu rail, only used 3.5v for testing like 1 hour.

any short/long term side effects of having the 3.3v line set to 3.6-3.7v on the psu?

Single as a Information.

I also used the rail of 5V and bios 414-3 when the ram died. Also I control my tccd now and I look for a solution to replace my UTT.

This has happened in some SLI or all the problems have been with Ultra-D?

Greetings

well, with all the knowledge that i have, and some other guys that are specialist in hardware, that includes ram memory.. i can pressume that if you want a high overclock for 24/7 use, you can't never reach your mems to more than 3.0 volts, cause even at 2.9v the ram its hitting almost the 50 centrigrades wall, that for what i know its like the temperature risk start that can cause fails and deaths on your sistem components, you named, cpu, chipset,ram.. etc

so getting a samsung tccd ram chipset..can give you an edge of a high overclock with low voltages, so i guesss that these ones are the real kings of overclock :banana: , cause al winbond chipset are made for overclock benchmarks and that's all..

so i agree that DFI is free of any responsability of memory deaths.. just because their line of nforce 4 mobos have an option of even 4.0 volts on ram,
its all on you and you are moving the rail at your risk.. thats why DFI block the voltage increase on 3.2 v ... to avoid this things guys

don't you think so?? :toast:

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Originally Posted by FiNcH64

so i agree that DFI is free of any responsability of memory deaths.. just because their line of nforce 4 mobos have an option of even 4.0 volts on ram,
its all on you and you are moving the rail at your risk.. thats why DFI block the voltage increase on 3.2 v ... to avoid this things guys

don't you think so?? :toast:

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I disagree. It is not a hack or a mod, it is a feature of the board and is advertised as such and I am sure a lot of people considered that when they bought the board. As such, if it doesn't work correctly, if for example the voltage fluctuates, or spikes to 5V (I would like to stress that we don't know that for sure yet, but if it does) I is a malfunction and I think DFI is liable.

My $0.02

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Originally Posted by hovo73

I disagree. It is not a hack or a mod, it is a feature of the board and is advertised as such and I am sure a lot of people considered that when they bought the board. As such, if it doesn't work correctly, if for example the voltage fluctuates, or spikes to 5V (I would like to stress that we don't know that for sure yet, but if it does) I is a malfunction and I think DFI is liable.

My $0.02

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Yeah I agree with this, although DFI gave minor warnings about using it, at the end of the day it's one of the boards selling points.

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Originally Posted by Wingz

any short/long term side effects of having the 3.3v line set to 3.6-3.7v on the psu?

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My PSU doesn't support adjustment to the rails, it's a 520w bequiet.
But running for 3 months on the 3.3v rail and had no problems. I've put a switch to turn the mod off, when i need to test with the 5v rail.
Don't think it will be a problem.
Maybe i'll make a mod to mine, cus my ram really likes volts, now its 255 with 3.3v, but with 3.5 it gives me 270.

Has anyone tried moving ram from slot?
I don't mean all are good, but some might be.

No the ram will not die by using more than 3v. Alot of my ram had already died if it was so. I've been using mine at 3.3v for more than a year in different mobos.

EDIT:

In my testing it seems that using 3.3v rail directly, the vtt isn't changed accordingly, cus i need to set volts to 3.2v to have full stability.
Using 3.3v from rail tough, allows me higher clocks than 3.2v. So regulating the 3.3v rail may not be the better option.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by hovo73

I disagree. It is not a hack or a mod, it is a feature of the board and is advertised as such and I am sure a lot of people considered that when they bought the board. As such, if it doesn't work correctly, if for example the voltage fluctuates, or spikes to 5V (I would like to stress that we don't know that for sure yet, but if it does) I is a malfunction and I think DFI is liable.

My $0.02

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Yes, I agree with this also. Having the option to run up to 4v vdmm was the #1 reason I bought this board, and if it turns out this doesn't work properly DFI needs to be held accountable.

Keep in mind that this is just the sort of reason that these companies use to NOT include these extra OC features and we better be carefull what we ask for because we may end up back at square one again.

FiNcH64...It's very interesting to see some members whose not fully well informed barging in and making this interesting "from expert" comments.
Fallacy of your logic.

1) OCZ VX and Mushkin Redline requires 3.2v. 10% margine is allowed per design as usual than it leaves us at tops 3.5v right away. This problem is not just limited to any UTT but the ones that are supposed to be used at 3.2v+, etc.

2) Regarding TCCD, have you actually had TCCD? Anyone having TCCD with 2.8-2.9v with over 290 2.5-3-3-7 without additional cooling is REALLY risking it. The darned thing is hotter than VX or UTT @ 3.2v 2-2-2-5 230mz.

3) You say over 50c cetigrade. Well, my memory is never above 3-4c + case temp (which is another 1-2c+ ambient) If you read through people with issue, none of them were slacking on cooling the memory. I don't expect their to be much higher than 35-40c if that high.

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so i agree that DFI is free of any responsability of memory deaths.. just because their line of nforce 4 mobos have an option of even 4.0 volts on ram,

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Yes and No. DFI put the incomplete feature in, than well, we have issue. What is point of putting feature in that actually DO fail component? If this is not an issue with DFI than there is gotta be some other reason. Maybe my OCZ 600W PSU, maybe... well, bottom line is, this is happening MUCH more frequently with DFI than any other board. (s939 iteration)
Last thing we need is blindly blaming users and defending company -_-; Did anyone here say I hate DFI or something to that nature? We just want to figure out what is killing it and why and if we know how to... get this issue resolved.

PS) I am crazy enough to run 3.4-3.5 vdimm 24x7 on few other mobo I had with vdimm cap mod. Never did any memory I had fail due to over voltage or heat issues. (that is about 7gig of BH-5, 4gig of VX, 2gigs of UTT) -> one of gig of UTT is actually failed one. Now there is nothing statiscal about this but I can tell you, when I say I never had this issues around voltage I mentioned I don't mean just another pair of UTT or something.

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Originally Posted by jinu117

PS) I am crazy enough to run 3.4-3.5 vdimm 24x7 on few other mobo I had with vdimm cap mod. Never did any memory I had fail due to over voltage or heat issues. (that is about 7gig of BH-5, 4gig of VX, 2gigs of UTT) -> one of gig of UTT is actually failed one. Now there is nothing statiscal about this but I can tell you, when I say I never had this issues around voltage I mentioned I don't mean just another pair of UTT or something.

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It seems that UTT(UnTesTed) from winbond is not able to handle extremely high voltage as old-good BH5 or CH5 ... It seems that UTT is not 100% the same as BH5 because BH5 can not boot in CAS=3 setting , but UTT can boot in CAS=3 setting , maybe there is something different from UTT and BH5 to cause that UTT not able to handle extremely high voltage :confused: :confused:

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Originally Posted by wtz54321

It seems that UTT(UnTesTed) from winbond is not able to handle extremely high voltage as old-good BH5 or CH5 ... It seems that UTT is not 100% the same as BH5 because BH5 can not boot in CAS=3 setting , but UTT can boot in CAS=3 setting , maybe there is something different from UTT and BH5 to cause that UTT not able to handle extremely high voltage :confused: :confused:

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UTT is made from older CH5 andf BH5 dies...it is the same as the old chips..its just untested by winbond....

Im running the jumper tweak with the 3.3line at 3.6v,I find it stable, cool and the ram clocks well.

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Originally Posted by bigtoe

UTT is made from older CH5 andf BH5 dies...it is the same as the old chips..its just untested by winbond....

Im running the jumper tweak with the 3.3line at 3.6v,I find it stable, cool and the ram clocks well.

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Is there a point for me to try this tweak if I can't change the +3.3V line on my PSU?

All your rams died in slot 2 or? no one killd ram in slot 1 and 3,4?

I also have problems although I'm not sure what is to blame. I'm trying to run a DFI SLI-D mobo, 4000+ sandy, 1GB OCZ PC3500 plat BH5, BFG 6800GT OC, PCP&C510 SLI etc etc

Originally I could only boot with one stick in orange slot 2 - this was the case on air and phase but now I can't boot at all whatever I memory I have (tried muskin lvII) and whatever slot. Its driving me nuts. :(

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Originally Posted by bigtoe

UTT is made from older CH5 andf BH5 dies...it is the same as the old chips..its just untested by winbond....

Im running the jumper tweak with the 3.3line at 3.6v,I find it stable, cool and the ram clocks well.

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But why BH5 fail to boot in CAS 3 setting but UTT is ok ?

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Originally Posted by wtz54321

But why BH5 fail to boot in CAS 3 setting but UTT is ok ?

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there are utt bh chips and utt ch chips afaik not even the ch utt chips can boot at cas 3

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Originally Posted by P_1

there are utt bh chips and utt ch chips afaik not even the ch utt chips can boot at cas 3

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Plain wrong! You wanna see some Winbond based RAM at CL3, no problemo. All my UTT based sticks can boot at CL3. Also had a stick of rebadged CH-5 RAM some month ago (was one of the first CH-5; week 14 2003) and even that one did CL3. The question if the RAM does CL3 or not is just a matter of SPD-programming. Nothing more and nothing less. ;)

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Originally Posted by celemine1Gig

Plain wrong! You wanna see some Winbond based RAM at CL3, no problemo. All my UTT based sticks can boot at CL3. Also had a stick of rebadged CH-5 RAM some month ago (was one of the first CH-5; week 14 2003) and even that one did CL3. The question if the RAM does CL3 or not is just a matter of SPD-programming. Nothing more and nothing less. ;)

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o :stick: my corsair sticks with ch5 wouldnt boot at cl3

Hey all. Just lost a second stick of VX yesterday. This happened to me about 5 months ago, and one again yesterday. This sucks. I was using 5v line but only 3.2vdimm. I had 2x80mm fans blowing directly onto the RAM. Both of them died in the orange slot closest to the CPU (slot 2 I presume).

I've read this entire post and will be doing the following to prevent anymore mystery murders ( :slap: )...

1-buy a true 24-pin native power supply
(http://www.dfi-street.com/forum/show...2&postcount=34)
2-go back to the 3.3v feed.
3-RMA my PC3200 Gold VX and get PC4000 Gold VX
4-update to a BIOS that lets me use slots 1&3 dual channel
5-Pray to Jebus

Hopfully this will work.

i also killed some ram with this board. at first i blamed the board but now i realize it was my fault. i was changing ram and didnt unplug the psu. i always did it this way on older mobos and it never harmed anything. now my ram is dead my fault.
i bet 5 bux that 90% of the ram "killed" by this board is a user error. unplug the psu from the wall and drain it with the power switch then open the case trust me on that!
________
Adelyn

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Originally Posted by P_1

o :stick: my corsair sticks with ch5 wouldnt boot at cl3

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You didn't get it, did ya? :) I also have Winbond based RAM that does NOT boot at CL3, but the reason why it behaves like that is just the programming of the SPD-ROM. That's all! If the SPD-ROM was programmed differently, this RAM could also run at CL3. ;)

ahhh so thats why some sticks with winbond ram do cl3 while others dont? hmmm
are you sure about this?

stay off the freakin 5V line. Do the 3.3V jumper trick run up to 3.5V Vdimm and be happy.( note 3.3V rail above 3.7V + SATA drives = nasty ugly bad )

I think that the 'spike' of 5v when booting could be a contributing factor to the death of all of the winbond based RAM.
On most boards, before the BIOS is loaded, the board will give out 2.8 to 2.9v Vdimm. Once the BIOS has been loaded, the voltage returns to whatever is set in BIOS. With the DFI NF4, the 'spike' of 5v at boot is probably being produced because there is no BIOS loaded to tell the Vdimm voltage regulator what voltage to give out. A spike of 5v being fed to RAM could kill it, even if it were only for a very short space of time.

Some boards will also supply voltage to the RAM from the 5v standby line from the PSU when there is no power on. If this is the case with the DFI NF4 board, you could be feeding RAM 3.3v+ even when the board is in 'standby'.

I'm not saying that this is definitely what is happening, or that DFI is in anyway responsible for this. This it is just a theory.

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Originally Posted by persivore

I think that the 'spike' of 5v when booting could be a contributing factor to the death of all of the winbond based RAM.
On most boards, before the BIOS is loaded, the board will give out 2.8 to 2.9v Vdimm. Once the BIOS has been loaded, the voltage returns to whatever is set in BIOS. With the DFI NF4, the 'spike' of 5v at boot is probably being produced because there is no BIOS loaded to tell the Vdimm voltage regulator what voltage to give out. A spike of 5v being fed to RAM could kill it, even if it were only for a very short space of time.

Some boards will also supply voltage to the RAM from the 5v standby line from the PSU when there is no power on. If this is the case with the DFI NF4 board, you could be feeding RAM 3.3v+ even when the board is in 'standby'.

I'm not saying that this is definitely what is happening, or that DFI is in anyway responsible for this. This it is just a theory.

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This sounds to me like a good explanation. Looks like I'll be RMAing my sticks next week and start using the 3.3v line from now on.

Well like i said before i had 2 sticks of G-Skill PC4400 LE TCCD 512MB in the system and i only use the 3.3 line for vdimm and they died on me shortly after flashing to the 310 beta bios.

Voltage was at 3.2v on the vdimm and it was getting 3.24v occording to the bios and the Zippy 700 watt P/S was treaked with 3.50v via the 3.3 pot.

Ran fine for months like that.