"402 XTREME" in action! Take One: Breaking 3GHz barrier!

Starring:

"402 XTREME" built by Chilly1
DFI NF4 Ultra-D
A64 3200+ Winchester
2x256MB Kingston HyperX PC3200 BH-5

This is a story of at least couple "firsts"... My First attempt on phase change and most likely one of the First (or maybe 2nd) units from "Chilly1's production line". So bear with me and if you notice anything I should correct, let me know, OK?

So let's start, shall we? Pics and photos are worth more than thousand words...

1. Unit just after I opened the box. Very well protected.
2. First steps. Unloaded it goes down to -53C. After couple minutes it stabilizes at -47C
3. Nice looking, engraved logo of XS.
4. CPU socket area just moments before getting it dressed.
5. My first attempt on insulating my mainboard. Thank to Reggie for tips on that :thumbsup:

Now it's time to assemble and insulate the backplate.

1. Unit's backplate with two layers of foam insulation tape. I did not have one nig piece of foam, so it doesn't look that professional.
2. After pushing rods through.
3. Mainboard's and unit's backplates together with rods.
4. Same as above, but viewed from the bottom.
5. Backside of the mainboard almost ready...

Let's take a look at front side of the mainboard and "mounting mechanism"

1. Insulated, CPU in and ready for head to be mounted.
2. View at the contact that gasket makes with the insulation on the mainboard. #1
3. #2
4. #3
5. This photo shows something important. Memory sticks without heatspreaders have enough breathing room. Unfortunately, it was not enough for my LvL II, that still have them on. I'm gonna trim the plate later a bit to accomodate my "best" sticks.

There are few more photos taken from all sides of the CPU socket to show how the head is mounted to the mainboard.

1. #1
2. #2
3. #3
4. Temperature shown is under LOAD @ 1.85v. At stock 1.4v LOAD'ed temerature is -45C

After initial problems with getting my Winchester to work under sub-zero conditions, it was tiume for some benchmarking :cool:

A note about "cold-bug". It seems that my chip has some symptoms of it. What helps a lot is setting high Startup Vcore, e.g. 1.55v. If I cannot boot at full, lowest temperature, I have to turn off the cooler, wait unitl temp raises to -20C and start up my rig. Then it boots just fine. Few second later I start up the cooler again and voila.

So... Benchmarks. Chip doesn't seem to be the best kid on the block, but it's not that bad either. It did 2.76GHz on air, fully benchable and 2.67GHz Prime95 stable.

Now...

1. RenderBench & CineBench @ 3050MHz
2. CPUMark2 and Polish benchmark @ 3050MHz
3. SuperPi 1M & Pifast 1M @ 3012MHz
4. SandraMem & EverestRead @ 3004MHz
5. EverestWrite @ 3004MHz

Currently I do not have any PCI-e video card so I'm forced to play with some PoS R7000 PCI with no Hardware 3D acceleration. So don't laugh at me too hard, OK? :lol:

1. 3DMark2001, PCMark02 and PCMark04 @ 3004MHz
2. SuperPi 16M @ 2898MHz
3. SuperPi 32M @ 2875MHz
4. Prime95 Blend only 2hrs hours (it was just too late and i didn't want to leave the unit cooling overnight just yet :)
5. Sandra CPU benches @ 2951MHz. For Sandra junkies: I also did same becnes @ 3050MHz but forgot to transfer them to this PC. So I will post them later if anyone wants...

NOW... There's something xtra I did. It's a 5min video (20MB) showing how fast this unit cools down from +19C to -53C. Go easy on bandwidth, please :)

Right-click and "Save Target As..." - From +19C to -53C


Thanks a lot to Chilly1 for such a nice unit! :thumbsup: I'm totally satisfied. As soon as I get a better chip (Venice or Diego) I hope I could break 3.2-3.3GHz with it, fully benchable :toast:

Oh man! :banana::banana::banana::banana:o isnt allowed at this forum read rules! ;) That's so nice! Hope you will get some nice results with it too! Great work from Chilly1 also!

excellente

lol at the reserved.

looks like one hell of a cpu cooler.

One question though. Cold bug??? or are you use ur cpu doenst have hte cold bug?

-38ºC at 1.85v load wohaaa that's nice!! Now its time to make some benchies :banana:

OOOHHHhhhh :eek2: NICE!!!

Gotta love the way these Phase Change Units are made... Pity I'm too far away & freight would cost a couple of livers...

hey, is that a world record for a PCI 7000?? :D :D :D

If not that must be very, very close to the world record... :p: (jk)

Good going, now whack an X850XT PE in there & make some serious points...

Another member (if not the member that started the whole trend) of doing a full suite of tests to verify that their OC is 110% fully stable at a certain MHz...

Congrats on the 3Ghz barrier for a Winnie with problems...

Cheers,
Minnyboy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

Currently I do not have any PCI-e video card so I'm forced to play with some PoS R7000 PCI with no Hardware 3D acceleration. So don't laugh at me too hard, OK? :lol:

1. 3DMark2001, PCMark02 and PCMark04 @ 3004MHz
2. SuperPi 16M @ 2898MHz
3. SuperPi 32M @ 2875MHz
4. Prime95 Blend only 2hrs hours (it was just too late and i didn't want to leave the unit cooling overnight just yet :)
5. Sandra CPU benches @ 2951MHz. For Sandra junkies: I also did same becnes @ 3050MHz but forgot to transfer them to this PC. So I will post them later if anyone wants...

NOW... There's something xtra I did. It's a 5min video (20MB) showing how fast this unit cools down from +19C to -53C. Go easy on bandwidth, please :)

Right-click and "Save Target As..." - From +19C to -53C


Thanks a lot to Chilly1 for such a nice unit! :thumbsup: I'm totally satisfied. As soon as I get a better chip (Venice or Diego) I hope I could break 3.2-3.3GHz with it, fully benchable :toast:

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:D Nice machine bachus - now wait a bit and go for FX-57 / 3,6 GHz........... :slobber:


:toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

There are few more photos taken from all sides of the CPU socket to show how the head is mounted to the mainboard.

1. #1
2. #2
3. #3
4. Temperature shown is under LOAD @ 1.85v. At stock 1.4v LOAD'ed temerature is -45C

---

nice but http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...chmentid=28702 you have bare ram lying on carpet :eek: :)

I've just downloaded the video. Is it as noiser as it seems to be? dB?

amazing quality+nice temps!

Chilly1 whats the material used for the evap hold down, and under DFIs backplate?
(seems to be the same used in the front of the case around the condeser)

well done Chilly1
you too bachus

wow i remember seeing 402 being built and wondered whow as gettng it!
that is tuned very well i hope mine turns out that good!
and good on ya man for running 3d benches i hate when people use the crappy vidcard excuse :toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eva2000

nice but http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...chmentid=28702 you have bare ram lying on carpet :eek: :)

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Maybe its an antistatic carpet? :eek:


Shame on you bachus. Thats no way to handle helpless RAM :nono: :D

Nice cooler you have got there. Chilly knows his stuff. Even makes them look awsome. GL hunting high clocks.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Formann

Maybe its an antistatic carpet? :eek:


Shame on you bachus. Thats no way to handle helpless RAM :nono: :D

Nice cooler you have got there. Chilly knows his stuff. Even makes them look awsome. GL hunting high clocks.

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:confused: Why? Better than fixing it on the wall with some bubble gum........... :rofl:

:toast:

i want one of those... :( but i live too far from usa :'(

you can use it 24/7? or just for benchs? any kind of maintenance?

nice OC go and buy a nice pci e card and a venice....

nice report, looks like you're having a lot of fun :toast: :woot:

If i'd have one of those i think i would just grab something and freeze it, would be to funny ;)

Keep us updated :)

nice to see chilly1's normal amazing attention to detail

That's a seriously nice system you got there... :D
A word of advice though - I'd recommend insulating your board all the way to the first mem slot. On my first DFI SLI-D, I insulated to around the same point as you have in your pics. I ended up blowing the middle cap right in front of the slot from condensation with "only" a mach2 :p:
Congrats, and welcome to the craziness of sub-zero cooling

Man that unit is be-a-u-tiful. Nice pics too m8, good job to show whole installation progress :)

stepping of your 3200+?

CBBID I presume :)

Great work on the guide of setting it all up. That has actually helped me on insulation and stuff.

Fantastic unit chilly... top stuff :thumbsup:

The most important stuff... the benchies and it looks like you have a good winnie there my friend :)

Makes me want one even more :toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bennah

Great work on the guide of setting it all up. That has actually helped me on insulation and stuff.

Fantastic unit chilly... top stuff :thumbsup:

The most important stuff... the benchies and it looks like you have a good winnie there my friend :)

Makes me want one even more :toast:

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Now why would you want a winnie when you've got my 3800+ Venice :p:

Not the winnie... a single phase unit ;)

great!
way to go!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bennah

Not the winnie... a single phase unit ;)

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I know ;)

:p: alright.... ;)

I wondered what you were doing selling all your folding rigs... :lol2:
Looks nice, now for a GPU......

Thanks guys... I'm just making my first steps into phase change, small ones it seems :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MaxxxRacer

One question though. Cold bug??? or are you use ur cpu doenst have hte cold bug?

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Well, my Winchester works under certain conditions only. From my experience of getting it to work right is, that I need certain combination of START-UP VCORE and special VID as well as certain CPU speed :confused: E.g. I can almost never start my PC when cooler is at it's max lowest temp. Then I turn it off and let it go up to -20C. Then I start the system and it boots to Windows just fine. As soon as I see Windows loading, I turn back on the cooler. But many times, after hours of playing in Windows, when I try to Restart the system - it would just die. Three LEDs ON, but no boot... :( But few times I mangaed to restart it couple times and it booted :confused:
To boot system at stock speed/voltage I need to wait until evap temp on the cooler warms up to -10C. Then turn it on.
It's a pain and I already blew one fuse doing ONs and OFFs :( That's another reason I need a different Winnie ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Minnyboy

hey, is that a world record for a PCI 7000?? :D :D :D

If not that must be very, very close to the world record... :p: (jk)

Good going, now whack an X850XT PE in there & make some serious points...

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I don't know... :lol: With that card I can run 3DMark2001 at 2.9 and 3.0GHz and still result will be within 5 points of eachother. It limits the cpu/memory big time here. But I wanted to show 3D anyway ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Minnyboy

Another member (if not the member that started the whole trend) of doing a full suite of tests to verify that their OC is 110% fully stable at a certain MHz...

Congrats on the 3Ghz barrier for a Winnie with problems...

Cheers,
Minnyboy

---

I see more and more folks doing that, with eva2000 trying to ask for more benches whenever he can :lol: I wish everyone was like that ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by HARDCORECLOCKER

:D Nice machine bachus - now wait a bit and go for FX-57 / 3,6 GHz........... :slobber:


:toast:

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Thanks bud... I've been waiting for this moment a long time... I hope to take a better advantage of it very soon ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eva2000

nice but http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...chmentid=28702 you have bare ram lying on carpet :eek: :)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Formann

Maybe its an antistatic carpet? :eek:


Shame on you bachus. Thats no way to handle helpless RAM :nono: :D

Nice cooler you have got there. Chilly knows his stuff. Even makes them look awsome. GL hunting high clocks.

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It was a mess when I was taking photos :slapass: They are nice and packed now. Safe and secure :) Iwould hate anything to happened to any of them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by krampak

I've just downloaded the video. Is it as noiser as it seems to be? dB?

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I put a bit of weight on tom of the unit later, after making that video. The majority of noise it was making before was due to some vibrations. Now it hums along, much quieter but still just a bit, bit noiser that average fridge. It's 1/3 HP compressor, though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by reject

and good on ya man for running 3d benches i hate when people use the crappy vidcard excuse :toast:

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I just tried to do what necessary, even if it made me a laughing stock for all of you :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by s7e9h3n

That's a seriously nice system you got there... :D
A word of advice though - I'd recommend insulating your board all the way to the first mem slot. On my first DFI SLI-D, I insulated to around the same point as you have in your pics. I ended up blowing the middle cap right in front of the slot from condensation with "only" a mach2 :p:
Congrats, and welcome to the craziness of sub-zero cooling

---

I will do that, sir! Thanks for a good advice. I'm still a "phase change noob" :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by twilius_basic

Man that unit is be-a-u-tiful. Nice pics too m8, good job to show whole installation progress :)

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Yeah... I was a bit worried about steps I need to make to insulate it right. Reggie helped me a lot on that :thumbsup:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cpulloverclock

stepping of your 3200+?

CBBID I presume :)

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CBBFD 0441 UPCW... It's not that bad, but needs a lot of volts to run "high". It did 2.67GHz Prime95 stable @ 1.7v on air... So this is an improvement. But I've seen my buddie's Winnie 3000 that does 2800MHz @ 1.75 on 20C water. He gets guite close to what I get on phase change... So, yes :) I need a better chip. That's next step :toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bennah

Great work on the guide of setting it all up. That has actually helped me on insulation and stuff.
Fantastic unit chilly... top stuff :thumbsup:
The most important stuff... the benchies and it looks like you have a good winnie there my friend :)
Makes me want one even more :toast:

---

Thanks man! I wish I had your 3800+ Venice here :) You're gonna have a lot of fun once you slap phase change on it...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by isp

I wondered what you were doing selling all your folding rigs... :lol2:
Looks nice, now for a GPU......

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Not really the reason for selling the rigs :) But the sale helped me allocate some money for a new CPU, though. Also, the unit eats about 300W every hour. If I had a farm running plus that unit, then my girlfriend would kill on the spot for electricity bill :lol:

That was one long $#% post :)

How about some pics of the smart guardian temprature monitor at load ?
really curious about r402

Quote:

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Originally Posted by esdee

How about some pics of the smart guardian temprature monitor at load ?
really curious about r402

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Look at the screenie with Prime95... It's 0C to +2C @ 1.85v

EDIT: I always wondered if this is about right? Does anyone have any screenies to compare with phase change on DFI NF4 ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

Look at the screenie with Prime95... It's 0C to +2C @ 1.85v

EDIT: I always wondered if this is about right? Does anyone have any screenies to compare with phase change on DFI NF4 ?

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ooops my bad!
I get +5 with 1.85V @ 3003Ghz (11x273) with my DIY r404 phase...
so r402 is about the same with r404 (i take the 3C diff as chilly1s skills;) )

keep up!

very sweet cant wait till i get mine from chilly1

wow, really nice bachus.

Now this is how its suppossed to be done! Very thorough and well explained:) I enjoyed reading this thread very much!
Glad to see you are happy B.A., and of course nice unit from Chilly1 (no surprises there). I imagine after the cost of that you might be scrounging for pennies in the couch for that video card now. That pic of Chilly's assembly line is dancing in my head now...
And of course I want one too.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

Look at the screenie with Prime95... It's 0C to +2C @ 1.85v

EDIT: I always wondered if this is about right? Does anyone have any screenies to compare with phase change on DFI NF4 ?

---

your temp under load is good bachus_anonym
I have -3° to 0°c with my phase change under load with my winnie 3200+ @ 2900 @ 1.70v.
My compressor is smaller than yours I think (danfoss nl7f 134w..) but filled with r404a.
Your temp is normal and GOOD, don't worry ;)

have a nice oc time with that awsome phase change unit :)

excellent thread bachus! always nice to see "stable" results and not just suicide screenies.

props to chilly1 as well on the great unit. :toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ashe

nice report, looks like you're having a lot of fun :toast: :woot:

If i'd have one of those i think i would just grab something and freeze it, would be to funny ;)

Keep us updated :)

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I would grab my sisters cat.........
very nice bachus! now go get some pci E card and get some WR. hell a x700pro is only $110 refurb at newegg lol.

Very nice single phase Michal and a well done post :up: I'm sure you'll enjoy the toy :D Just don't stick your tongue to the evap bro :p:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by drcrawn

Now this is how its suppossed to be done! Very thorough and well explained:) I enjoyed reading this thread very much!
Glad to see you are happy B.A., and of course nice unit from Chilly1 (no surprises there). I imagine after the cost of that you might be scrounging for pennies in the couch for that video card now. That pic of Chilly's assembly line is dancing in my head now...
And of course I want one too.

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Thanks a bunch for a good word, sir! I'm glad you really liked it :)
I sold some of my rigs and, when my plan of living on water and crackers only for two weeks goes well, I will be able to afford something better in that department ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EMC2

Very nice single phase Michal and a well done post :up: I'm sure you'll enjoy the toy :D Just don't stick your tongue to the evap bro :p:

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Thanks a lot, Daniel :toast: I touched it only with a finger @ -53C :) I think I will refrain myself from using my tongue - reminds me of "Dumb and Dumber" :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eviLRuLeZ

your temp under load is good bachus_anonym
I have -3° to 0°c with my phase change under load with my winnie 3200+ @ 2900 @ 1.70v.
My compressor is smaller than yours I think (danfoss nl7f 134w..) but filled with r404a.
Your temp is normal and GOOD, don't worry ;)

have a nice oc time with that awsome phase change unit :)

---

Cool... Thanks a lot for info, bro :toast: I feel much better now. I'm sure I will have a blast playing with it!


For anyone else there, still interested in more results, here's something more.
I waited until late night, ambient temps dropped a bit ;) Then flashed with Oscar WU's newest BIOS (414.3) from Onepagebook. I also raised vchipset and vldt a bit, but I'm not really sure if it helps at all...

Slight change in our cast:

"402 XTREME" built by Chilly1
DFI NF4 Ultra-D
A64 3200+ Winchester
2x256MB Mushkin LvL II PC3200 BH-5

1. I somehow managed to squeeze in my Mushkins (best BH-5 I got). Don't try this at home, though. It doesn't look pretty :) It really tells me, that to be on a safe side, I will have to "modify" that hold-down plate a bit.
2. SuperPi 1M @ 3050MHz DDR554 6-2-2-2.0-1T I finally saw 27s, yeeehaaaa!!!
3. My best SuperPi 16M so far - 3004Mhz! This is just sweet for that chip!
4. SuperPi 32M @ 2921MHz. I think I will go for 2950MHz tonight. I keep my fingers crossed for it :)

EDIT: 5. I took some BIOS shots that give more info on how I have set most important options - Genie BIOS Setting, DRAM Configuration and PC Health Status ;) Due to Winnie's weird cold-releated behaviour, I always have to boot @ 2800MHz. Otherwise, when cooler reaches it's MAX, Windows freezes :(

where can i buy those 402 XTREME?

Are you 100% sure the evaporator is correctly touching the CPU ? Did you do a burn in ? With a good burn in you can steal a few C's for free

PM Chilly1 for a price quote.

Oh and one more thing, did you play with the adjustment screw already ? I think you can go a little colder!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by berkut

Oh and one more thing, did you play with the adjustment screw already ? I think you can go a little colder!

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hey berkut ;) what screw? If you do not now yet, I'm a total noob in phase change...:)

That might be the question I need to ask Reggie about :)

Very entertaining thread. First exposure to phase change and you go with a 402 XTREME? Thats sort of like having your first car be a Ferrari. Must be nice. :rolleyes: I'm wondering if other members have to do the start routine (boot at -20c) for their Winnies as well. Hopefully San Diego doesn't have the same problem, just in case I'm luck enough to go "XTREME" at Xmas. Are you listening Santa you fat bastard?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

hey berkut ;) what screw?
That might be the question I need to ask Reggie about :)

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Frrom pics of Chilly's units, he tends to use an adjustable TXV, the screw in question allows you to adjust the superheat ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gundamit

Very entertaining thread. First exposure to phase change and you go with a 402 XTREME?

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:hm: Glad I did not d/l that video now :p:

Looks very nice man! :)

zBacks great insulating, See you got the fins straightened...

hello

you can use "speed fan" for read subzero temp with the dfi

--- Michal ---

If you don't mind, could you pull a DiffMark benchie please?

Peace :toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by chilly1

zBacks great insulating, See you got the fins straightened...

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Yes... It was not that difficult as I thought it would be :) Fins are looking good now :thumbsup:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EMC2

--- Michal ---

If you don't mind, could you pull a DiffMark benchie please?

Peace :toast:

---

No problemo! Thanks to you Daniel and also Perkam for help finding stuff :)

So, more screenies :toast:

1. DiffMark2.5 @ 3080Mhz
2. DiffMark2.7 @ 3080MHz
3. SuperPi 32M @ 2936MHz
4. My personal Sandra BW record @ 3080MHz DDR560 6-2-2-2.0-1T :woot:
(I don't really "compete" here, but some folks might gonna like it :)
5. My "bestest" SuperPi 16M @ 3012MHz

Great job, mate :up:

And chilly's unit is da cream! :D

i loooove the logo on the side of the unit! :up: :D

nice results michal! is 3ghz the max for that winnie?

Thanks Michal :D The cat liked it :up:

BTW, you find out if you have "the screw"? Oh, and for comparison, what was your max on the Winnie with air?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EMC2

Thanks Michal :D The cat liked it :up:

BTW, you find out if you have "the screw"? Oh, and for comparison, what was your max on the Winnie with air?

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Glad I could be of help :)

As far as gain from phase-change...
In 13C ambient (there's my other thread about it somewhere - DDR552 on Neo2 or sth like that) 2760MHz was Max as far as Spi 16M went and all benchmarks. Then 2650MHz was Prime95 stable.
On phase change, max SPi 16M is @ 3012MHz and Prime95 stability requires backing down to 2860MHz.

So not bad at all - 210MHz more in Prime95 and about 250MHz for benches.

Considering this is not the best Winchester around ;) One of my buddies has a Winchester 3000+ that is Prime95 stable at less volts, on 12C water at 2800MHz :brick:
We'll see how it goes when I hunt down a good clocking Venice (San Diego prefereably) :)

EDIT: The screw... :lol: That "screw" that berkut was looking at, on the back of the unit, next to a switch, is where fuse is at :) I know, because I blew couple of them already :lol: Then I talked to Reggie and he said that my unit doesn't have PEV and there's no regulation. Cap tube is tuned for 200W load. I have no idea how much heat Winnie @ 3000MHz 1.85v generates (I knew that about AXP chips but I cannot find any calculator for A64) but it looks like temps are pretty good considering such high voltage.

Very nice Bachus. Looks like you're moving up the ladder VERY fast, always good to see :up: . 3ghz at 2-2-2 is no small accomplishment, hope u reach 3.1ghz bench stable ;)

Next time round, maybe you vs OPB wont be a foregone conclusion :D

Perkam

Very nice pictures, crisp and sharp and well thought out.. glad you're happy with your beast as well :toast:

Regards

Andy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ashe

nice report, looks like you're having a lot of fun :toast: :woot:

If i'd have one of those i think i would just grab something and freeze it, would be to funny ;)

Keep us updated :)

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Tis a bad idea that ;) i remember using my finger to see just how cold my regassed mach 2 got :nono:

way da go marv :slapass:

NICE unit btw, and besure, my first encounter with cooling of a different sort then air will ALSO be a chilly1 cooler like this? If I have a good report card in july (I graduate then (normally :p:)) I'm buying me one so ... :)

Nice rig and S~to chilly for the nice looking unit :eek:

just a quick (stupid) question, how much does one of those chilly units run you?

PM him for pricing info, no one can answer you its not the forsale section

Great system Bachus, could you do me a favor? donwload speedfan http://www.majorgeeks.com/download337.html and run a 32mb super pi, I need to see proc temps while running, I'm setting my system right now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

Great system Bachus, could you do me a favor? donwload speedfan http://www.majorgeeks.com/download337.html and run a 32mb super pi, I need to see proc temps while running, I'm setting my system right now.

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Here you, go... With MBM, as we agreed :)

1. This is evap temp IDLE, before I started SPI 32M.
2. Screenie with 18mins into SPi 32M, with MBM High/Low Log for temp tracking. I lowered HTT by 1MHz with Clockgen, just to be sure that Spi32M passes. That's why CPU-Z says 3004MHz and MBM says 3014MHz ;)
4. Evap temp, but 20mins into SuperPi 32M run.
5. For xtra info. This is Prime95 I run few days ago, 3hrs into testing. In that case evap temp dropped to -37C

There you go :) Hope that's what you're looking for ;)

nice setup you got there

Quote:

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Originally Posted by odb

nice setup you got there

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Thanks a lot, bro! Reggie did just excellent job on this one!

You'll be very happy with yours too :toast:

Michal

yea, nice job bachus. Go for 3.1 ghz SPI 1m. That would be cool.

Sorry to say that, but -37c in evap and 0 or +5c in proc is not what I thought.
I'd been :brick: for days looking for deltas, because everyone post only evap temps but nobody post deltas proc/evap, my current unfinished single stage is running ATM at -37c running a spi of 32mb at 3ghz 1,7 and speddfan is reporting -6c in proc, I know that what a mobo senses is bs, but I need any kind of parameter. BTW, my proc is a NC 754 a64 3000 in a dfi ut 250.
At idle I'm running at -44c in evap and -25c in speed fan (processor)
My system is awfully set righ now, not for the temps I got, but for the pressures that is given.
And, I think both (you and I) dont have good contact betwin procesors and evap, did you mounted yours, then unmounted and saw the imprinted ihs in the evap? I do, and ATM I have not the best, I will unmount agian later to see if I get a good one.

wow that chilly is nice. I think I want one now. :D

I have mounted and unmounted several times since I got the cooler. Always getting same temps.... So, I don't think there's any problem with contact.
Also, keep in mind that I'm pumping 1.85v thru that little poor Winnie :) With 1.72v and 2.90GHz I haven't even seen 0C during my testing with SuperPi 32M. Idle as you see (just looked at DFI again) I got -23C as we speak @ 1.85v 3GHz.

EDIT: When I unmounted last time I even got stepping code imprinted on a block :) This time, I made 100% sure that hold-down plate is absolutely parallel to mobo and both screews are tighted rigth, equal pressure on both sides.

About your screenshot

not 0c, but +5c
And you said that you have an evap temp of -39c, my question is not for you, I'm not trying to be an :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::b anana:, I'm trying to understand why a 42c delta T is ok, I want at least 20.
Your are running your winchie at 2.9ghz 1.8v mine is NC at 3ghz @1.7v so we have prety much the same watts.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

About your screenshot

not 0c, but +5c
And you said that you have an evap temp of -39c, my question is not for you, I'm not trying to be an :banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::b anana:, I'm trying to understand why a 42c delta T is ok, I want at least 20.
Your are running your winchie at 2.9ghz 1.8v mine is NC at 3ghz @1.7v so we have prety much the same watts.

---

Check this out... I know one thing for sure - on that board delta on air (IDLE CPU - LOAD CPU, not AMBIENT - CPU LOAD) was A LOT smaller than it is with sub-zero (EVAP - CPU). I was also shocked when I saw it first time: from -22C to even +9C for split second. That's 31C. On air I had like from 38C IDLE to 48C LOAD.... Never more than 10-15C

That's why I've been mounting this cooler several times to make sure it's correctly mounted. I don't know if that is onboard sensors or anything else. Everytime I removed the block I had really nice imprint on it...

I know deltas in WC or Air are totally different.

Thank you very much for your kindness bachus, I will update when I get my system finally tunned.

do you know where I can buy one DT200 Thermometre like yours please? :)

Very nice unit that you have here bachus :)
I'll probably buy one on July. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

I know deltas in WC or Air are totally different.

Thank you very much for your kindness bachus, I will update when I get my system finally tunned.

---

No problem... I'll be following how your cooperation with Chilly1 turns out ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eviLRuLeZ

do you know where I can buy one DT200 Thermometre like yours please? :)

Very nice unit that you have here bachus :)
I'll probably buy one on July. :)

---

I got mine from Chilly1 (PM him for pricing when interested). You can alos find some good deal on Ebay sometimes, like the one HERE :) Also, I believe you can find it online in other stores. That's as far as shopping in US is concerned ;)

I think It'd be better to order directly one single phase change unit to chilly1 :D
Thanks a lot bachus anonym again :)

have a nice day

Your unit is a beauty bro :toast:

Yea nice write up!

The very first pic is great, especially after all the damaged unit's we've seen lately.

@ k|ngp|n, GoodOmens and G H Z

Thanks a lot guys :toast: I'm really glad you like that cooler.

--------------------------------

You all probably thought that would be all about the cooler, right? WROOOONG!!! :lol:

Chilly1 asked me If I could perform a test, measuring temperatures using temp probes instead of software (MBM, in that case). After some brainstorming (mostly Chilly1 threw in ideas :D) I tried to do my best mounting two additional temp probes that I had, totaling three measuring points:

(a) first probe, that Chilly1 put inside the block, about 1/2 inch up from the bottom of the block (that is where he puts temp probe as a standard),

(b) second probe, I mounted on IHS of my Winchester,

(c) third one, was attached to the side of the block, just below "O ring" as far on the bottom as I could safely do it.

Then I measured IDLE temps and LOAD temps, running Prime95 SmallFFT (for maximum heat) for slightly longer than 60mins @ my max Prime95 stable clocks/volts - 2860MHz / 1.84v. The results are as follows ;)

Legend, going in ascending order of photos attached

1. This is how I managed to attach temp probe to the IHS. As I know this is not perfect placement, this is the best I could do, as block doesn't leave much space on the IHS after it's mounted. So placing it in the corner was as good as it gets, without any problems leveling the block during mounting.

2. Here's how I did temp probe for bottom of the block. Same as above, If I could I would have mounted it directly to the bottom of the block (not it's side) but it's impossible. So this is how I did it :D

3. This is the photo showing how I punctured the gasket to allow the "Block" probe inside.

4. And that shows same, but for "CPU" probe :D

Probes were mounted on oposite sides.

5. This photo shows IDLE temps: TEMP1 is CPU and TEMP2 is BLOCK.

1. This is a screenshot I made at the same time when I took photo of IDLE temps.

2. This one, shows LOAD temps (during Prime95 SmallFFT, after 60mins, still going): TEMP1 is CPU and TEMP2 is BLOCK

3. Next, I swapped probe (TEMP1) and put Chilly1's probe, to measure evap temp at LOAD: TEMP1 is EVAP and TEMP2 is BLOCK

4. This is a screenshot of made at the same time when I took photo of LOAD temps (during Prime95 SmallFFT, after 60mins, still going).

Don't ask me why HIGHEST temp for CPU is 22C. I have absolutely no idea, might have been some odd reading at some point :shrug:

5. Last picture shows IDLE temps, again. But this time I wanted to show EVAP temp while IDLE: TEMP1 is EVAP and TEMP2 is BLOCK

----------------------

SUMMARY

2860MHz @ 1.84v

IDLE - EVAP -43.1C / BLOCK -34.1C / CPU IHS -32.4C
LOAD -EVAP -38.8C / BLOCK -23.4C / CPU IHS -23.6C

IDLE-LOAD DELTA (CPU IHS) ~ 8.8C
IDLE-LOAD DELTA (BLOCK) ~ 10.7C
IDLE-LOAD DELTA (EVAP) ~ 4.3C

----------------------

I understand that results may not be 100% accurate, considering placement of probes. It's just very difficult to do it any other way, without removing IHS altogether. Then also, IHS temperature is not CPU's core temperature. I'm trying to understand what temps would I get If I could place the probe closer to the center of the IHS. It might be possible that it would be even lower by 2-3C. But that test should give at least some info regarding DELTA values.
I might remove IHS of that CPU, but that will have to be done later. Then placement of CPU probe would be almost perfect and I'm pretty sure it would shave a bit of Cs off, too :)

I'm very happy with performance that this cooler gives me. 3027MHz benchable in SPi16M, 32M and all other benchmarks, including 3D + 3034MHz in Pifast and 3065MHz in SPi 1M is really good for my "not-the-best" Winchester.

Any feedback (comments or ideas how to improve the method) will be VERY appreciated.

If you ever saw an ihs out of a proc, you know that at that point is thicker than the center and the a64 ihs is is overall thicker than the ihs in p4, you can not take any real proc temp from the ihs.
How your delta pressures betwin idle and load?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

If you ever saw an ihs out of a proc, you know that at that point is thicker than the center and the a64 ihs is is overall thicker than the ihs in p4, you can not take any real proc temp from the ihs.
How your delta pressures betwin idle and load?

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Hehe... That I know even too well. That's why I was not trying to say that -24C LOAD is CPU temp, but CPU IHS temp. And still, not the best measurement there is as It's impossible to get it attached closer to the middle of the IHS, where actual core is. If you have better idea how to get as close as possible to real CPU die temp measurement, then let me know :D Without removing a heatspreader, that is ;)
I still believe that even after the IHS is removed, temps would be much lower than what MBM or Speedfan are showing. I just can't imagine that there would be -24C on IHS and +5C on a DIE. It just looks way to much of a difference.

What exactly you're asking me about?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

How your delta pressures betwin idle and load?

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I just figured what you asked me about... :D Well, I can't measure that. I'm just a OCer, unfortunately I have no skills/tools/gases/instruments to built my own phase change. So I'm not able to answer that question for ya :(

EDIT: Can you run EXACTLY same test, with same method at your MAX Prime95 SmallFFT stable config?

EDIT: I'm leaving in few minutes, so I can answer to any other questions later today...

I'm asking about heat transfer, any changes in heat load will be reflected in presures I think.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

I'm asking about heat transfer, any changes in heat load will be reflected in presures I think.

---

I edited my post above... In other words, I'm not able to give you any answer to that question. I have absolutely nothing to do with building phase change units. I just use 'em :lol:

I cant run the test you need to see, cause I dont have my unit here, it's in the cosmetologist :D (Profesional case, G-froster X integration, etc)
But I can give you an idle and load screenshot, running at 3ghz with superpi 32mb running.

Cool!
It would be so nice if more people were trying to test their single stage cooling same way, skipping software and just going straight for probing CPU temps ( if possible, without IHS :D ). That would give builders some nice, useful info about real-life, real-load testing without wondering if onboard sensors are showing right temps and behave normally. Also, not only going by evap temps but cpu temps, measured with probes.

Anyway, this whole test made be wanna remove IHS and try again without it. Maybe that Winnie would get a bit higher ;) 3.1GHz SuperPi 16M/32M would be awesome :D

Dude! Either show better pic or sth, because that totally doesn't look like -6C to me! It more like +6C. I zoooooooomed in and compared both, and it seems like "-" sign is missing on that LOAD pic :confused:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

Dude! Either show better pic or sth, because that totally doesn't look like -6C to me! It more like +6C. I zoooooooomed in and compared both, and it seems like "-" sign is missing on that LOAD pic :confused:

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Dude! IT IS +6c PIC!!
That's why I'm interested to see where is the prob, when my other systems do -11c full load at 3100mhz or more and with the same motherboard and micro..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

Dude! IT IS +6c PIC!!
That's why I'm interested to see where is the prob, when my other systems do -11c full load at 3100mhz or more and with the same motherboard and micro..

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Ooohhhh! I thought that you said (you did in that one post above) that you got -6C. And I was like "Damn, something must be horribly wrong" :lol:

I even just took a screenie with SpeedFan @-8C and -26C to compare with yours :lol:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

Sorry to say that, but -37c in evap and 0 or +5c in proc is not what I thought.
I'd been :brick: for days looking for deltas, because everyone post only evap temps but nobody post deltas proc/evap, my current unfinished single stage is running ATM at -37c running a spi of 32mb at 3ghz 1,7 and speddfan is reporting -6c in proc, I know that what a mobo senses is bs, but I need any kind of parameter. BTW, my proc is a NC 754 a64 3000 in a dfi ut 250.
At idle I'm running at -44c in evap and -25c in speed fan (processor)
My system is awfully set righ now, not for the temps I got, but for the pressures that is given.
And, I think both (you and I) dont have good contact betwin procesors and evap, did you mounted yours, then unmounted and saw the imprinted ihs in the evap? I do, and ATM I have not the best, I will unmount agian later to see if I get a good one.

---

That was what I went with :) Something is wrong then... At -39C you got +6 CPU temp on that system you showed pic of above. And then u say that on other system (I assumed, you mean different one) you do -37C and get -11C on CPU. Doesn't seem right, might be some error.

speedfan is not accurate guys
the best is a thermo probe on cpu ihs, you did it isn't it?

bachus_anonym

Here is a comparison with my FX-55 with a MachII 404a moded by "Doctor" Ricky, running prime at around 3.350mhz with core at around 1.8V.

http://pedrorocha.planetaclix.pt/Prime3350.jpg

So, as you can see, DFI Cpu sensor (read by MBM, speedfan..) is not very trustable or accurate.

To check the good contact, better go to Bios and check the CPU temp - with the FX-55 at 1.8v I see around -11ºC with this MachII-404a.

Also note:
- The FX-55 at 1.8v produces a LOT more of heat than the A64 3000+ Winnie, thats why he only feels good at "Doctor" Ricky cascade running at 4.000Mhz :)
- Even runnig the fans at very low speed (almost no noise for 24/7) the MachII evap temp readings are very optimistic;), with digital thermometer should be more like -50ºC idle and -40ºC load ..

So here it is my advise : enjoy your new 402 XTREME, as usual Chilly1 have done a very very good work, after all he is a XTreme Legend of Cooling ;)

:toast:

I will have access to a Test board , similar to the one used in overclockers with wb,etc, two dataloggers, calibrated thermal resistance and 4 pt100, in a matter of weeks.
Then, I will test diferent evaps in the same system and we will have a better picture of reality.
Pedro, I think the heat load generated in bios setup is diferent than the heat load generated with prime 95 in windows, am I wrong?
Forget about crappy MachII probe :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ssilencer

.
Pedro, I think the heat load generated in bios setup is diferent than the heat load generated with prime 95 in windows, am I wrong?

---

Of course it is!!
You missunderstand me - check the temp in Bios it s only a good way to quick check the good contact with evaporator afer mounting and also it is a rasonable way to compare phase-change sys performace ..just that :cool:

And now, we agree :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bachus_anonym

I just can't imagine that there would be -24C on IHS and +5C on a DIE. It just looks way to much of a difference.

---

Actually... that isn't out of the realm of reality... with your Vcore and Mhz used I figure something on the order of a 0.21 C/W thermal impedance... considering that your measurement is on the corner of the IHS and not at the center, it is actually lower. That said, those IHSs and the paste between them and the die stink ;)

What surprises me to a degree [ pun intended :p: ] is the difference from the embedded probe ("evap") to the side of the block... I might suggest that you do two things... get yourself some copper tape to mount the probes with and put some very good paste on your probe to help get better contact.

I guess I need to take a closer look at Chilly1's blocks...

Peace :toast:

Ok, this is gonna be the last one, I promise :lol: I just thought that since I'm on it I will show you some more testing I've done tonight :)

I wanted to see, what difference is between temps shown in BIOS / Hardware Monitor in comparison to temps I got from all 3 probes. Sitting in BIOS gives CPU a little bit of excercise. Then I run same LOAD test in Windows, as I did last time: PRime95 SmallFFT.

1.This is what BIOS shows for temps.

2. Then we see temps from probes: TEMP1=CPU IHS TEMP and TEMP2 is BLOCK TEMP

3. The I switched probes to show evap temp: TEMP1=EVAP IHS TEMP and TEMP2 is BLOCK TEMP

4. This is sitting IDLE in Windows: TEMP1=EVAP IHS TEMP and TEMP2 is BLOCK TEMP

5. Again, with probes switched: TEMP1=CPU IHS TEMP and TEMP2 is BLOCK TEMP