Website expires 12-26-08

Ok, you've convinced me to leave it up for a bit longer. I didn't really think it was worth it, but back by popular demand....

I'll leave the site up until it expires....feel free to copy whatever you want from it, and feel free to mirror or redistribute later however you feel fit.

I consider the data public information, it's not mine, it's everyone's.

Sorry for the hassle, but I'll leave it up until the domain finally expires on 12/26. I'm not planning to do anymore testing, and the site will close, so if you like something, please grab a copy.

Hope this helps:

http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/

Happy Halloween!

Make sure you take the kids out and fill them full of candy..cheers:toast2:

Update 11-03-08. Special thanks to the following folks for making some mirrors and files available. Bookmark these for future reference...thanks!!

MIRROR SITES:
D749 - http://www.thedigitalfoundry.com/MartinsLiquidLab/
skinnee - http://www.skinneelabs.com/MartinsLiquidLab/
Bobly - http://www.bobly.info/MartinsLiquidLab/
W1zzard - http://www.techpowerup.com/MartinsLiquidLab/
eva2000 - http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com/
cian1500ww - http://www.martinsliquidlab.co.nr/
Clunk - http://www.clunk.org.uk/martins-liquid-lab-articles/
Petra - http://martinsliquidlab.petrastech.com/

FILES: Special thanks to eva2000 for optimizing and cleaning up so the banner returns home properly. If you want a local copy you can grab that here:
http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com...id-fullopt.zip

Maybe a donation to keep the domain up? There's too much good info contained on this site. If we don't keep it maintained, can XS mirror it?

:up:

Have a good Halloween weekend:D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mstrmold

Maybe a donation to keep the domain up? There's too much good info contained on this site. If we don't keep it maintained, can XS mirror it?

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I don't want the hassle of the site anymore, I want to shut it down. But anyone that wants to mirror it, or redistribute, feel free to do so.

It will stay up until it expires, so it's up to you guys. I'm considering it public information at this point.:up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RealRedRaider

Change of heart... That was quick...

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The biggest part of shutting the site down that bothered me was people that sent me loaner parts to test. They gained nothing from sharing the parts with me other than producing the test data.

Naekuh especially has sent me a ton of stuff to test. I just didn't feel right to do that to him or the others that contributed.

Anyhow, it's yours to do whatever you want. It's still only one test, under one set of conditions, but if you want it for reference...there you go.

I'll pipe up and say thanks too, Martin. you've done the community a great service these past months!
:up:

How about you send me all the sources and I'll upload them into my server? So that people can still access to all valuable information.

I'll make a .zip file of it, it'll be a little bit though.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martinm210

I'll make a .zip file of it, it'll be a little bit though.

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Send it to royal at royalsrealm dot net. Can you transfer your domain to me?

I don't think I can send a file this big. I'm not really interested in transferring the domain, I had a bad experience trying to do that many years ago. It'll be available when it expires on 12/26 though, so you could grab it then.

Here is the .zip file of the whole site:

http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/img/...sLiquidLab.zip

Grab it before I exceed my bandwidth. I was already on the largest plan my host provides, so when I hit the bandwidth limit it'll probably go down as well.

Have a good evening..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martinm210

I don't think I can send a file this big. I'm not really interested in transferring the domain, I had a bad experience trying to do that many years ago. It'll be available when it expires on 12/26 though, so you could grab it then.
Here is the .zip file of the whole site:

http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/img/...sLiquidLab.zip

Grab it before I exceed my bandwidth. I was already on the largest plan my host provides, so when I hit the bandwidth limit it'll probably go down as well.

Have a good evening..

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That's only assuming one of the many domain resellers doesn't gobble it up before a real user gets to it.

No, all you need to do is just approve my request via e-mail and give me the authorization code. My service will then pull your domain off of your service.

I'm glad you decided to leave the information available.

The fact of the matter is, nobody has tested as many parts under the same conditions, using the same test equipment. It is a truly invaluable resource.

Happy Halloween and Thank You.

i got several domains i can host it on, if martin is willing to lend me the html files. yeah, it wont be h20testing.com or something similar, but htere could be a replica of it online for a minimum of 2 more years

I too would like to thank you Martin for leaving it up for this bit longer as a new guy coming into the hobby your site has helped me alot with trying to understand and deciding on my components I too understand that things get old and the hopping from hobby to hobby I'm starting the watercooling now leaving behind my R/C Racing. But thanks again.

Martin, you've done great things for the community (I know I'm a relative n00b around here, but I've benefited a lot from your information).

You didn't have to do this, but the fact that you did just shows your class.

Thanks again.

There's some great work there Martin. I threw up a mirror on my domain.

http://www.thedigitalfoundry.com/MartinsLiquidLab/

skinneelabs.com will also be mirroring Martins Liquid Lab, upload is in progress.

URL: http://www.skinneelabs.com/MartinsLiquidLab or http://martin.skinneelabs.com

Happy Halloween Martin! Your CPU waterblock tests are really useful. At least for upcoming future liquid cooler enthusiasts. :p:

Thank Martin for all your work you are an invaluable source to XS and us WC nubs

Amazing work Martin.

Thank you for allowing everyone to share your amazing amount of testing!
I have been constantly reading your reviews and it has helped me numerous times!
Great Work! :up:

Martin,

You're testing has been invaluable but it also had to be exhausting. Taking so much time from your real job and your family has to take a toll on you. Please do not feel guilty about stopping your testing. What you have contributed to the community will always be appreciated.

You are one hell of a great guy and I salute you. :toast:

Thank You.

BTW, did you ever finish those cabinets?

wow this really sucks man, but I understand. Thanks for all the testing you've done your tests will be missed by most.

I have a copy of the zip if over time anyone needs the actual files. There are enough mirrors of the original work about, I'm just a backup.

Best Wishes Martin!

Thanks Martin your site helped me allot in my understanding of the WC hobby

-sponge

Thanks martin for all the work over the years. I would hate to see the domain fall into a resellers hands. If you want to offer it up for transfer, I'm sure myself or nearly onyone here would gladly take it over. I for one would rather it point to the WC section here at XS than watch it go to a reseller out to make a quick buck.

Good call Martin :up:

Cheers.

Thanks Martin! :toast:

Martin, I understand your desire to not continue the reviews or funding the website. I understand it more than is apparent. (If you would like to hear my reasoning feel free to pm) Anyone that is willing to pay the hosting fees feel free to pm me for donations.

Thanks guys!

I think I'm just going to park the domain 12/26 to a simple linking page. I'll be a blank page with links to Skinnee's site, the forums, mirrors of the data, and some thank you links to the past sponsors...nothing fancy though.

I think that should take care of the domain issue, and if you start you're own testing site, I'll link to that too...:up:

Sad to hear this day has come, but we all knew it would. Martin, is it ok to take down the test site you set up on my server?

Once again thanks for your dedicated work!

Thank you Martin for all your work and imput for XS.
It's the guys like you that make this a special place.:up:

You're not going to stop watercooling, are you?

Your work has been invaluable to us all. Thanks for everything.

May the sun be always at your back.

:( :( :( so sad! :(

:bows: :bows: :bows: :bows: :bows: :bows: :bows: :bows: :bows: :bows:
:toast:

thank u for all ur time, effort & input!
YGPM

Thank you for your excellent contribution to the community. Helped me understand a few things i had blurry in my mind :up:

Sad to see it go... :shrug:

Thanks Martin :up: This is community spirit :)

Martin thanks for all those Liquid Cooling Info that you've passed to us.
thank you also for that inspiring work on your kitchen cabinets.

thank you Martin.
your work was a big help when i researching on wc

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martinm210

Thanks guys!

I think I'm just going to park the domain 12/26 to a simple linking page. I'll be a blank page with links to Skinnee's site, the forums, mirrors of the data, and some thank you links to the past sponsors...nothing fancy though.

I think that should take care of the domain issue, and if you start you're own testing site, I'll link to that too...:up:

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:up:

If you want to transfer the domain out let me know, I'll take it over and forward it to the WC section here at XS. It won't cost you a dime.

I have an odd 8GB w/ 800GB monthly transfer of which I use about 0,01% if you need a mirror.
I'll upload it there anyway, would be good to have a list of mirrors to make sure it stays up ^^

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bobly

I have an odd 8GB w/ 800GB monthly transfer of which I use about 0,01% if you need a mirror.
I'll upload it there anyway, would be good to have a list of mirrors to make sure it stays up ^^

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I grabbed a copy of the zip file just incase as well, this shouldn't be lost in any circumstances :) Not that I can host it, but I can keep it and give it to someone to host if need arrises :up:

Grapped zip file, and putting up to my host :)

Thanks martin from nice reviews :)

And another mirror to add to the list :P:
http://www.bobly.info/MartinsLiquidLab/

Grabbed the zip file as well. I won't host a mirror since there is already a lot so I'll just keep it on my file server as backup and for my own reference if the need arise.

added a permanent mirror:

http://www.techpowerup.com/MartinsLiquidLab/

if anyone wants to point martin's domain to it, feel free to do so.

martin, should you ever be looking for a reviewer position (or similar) in the hardware media scene, let me know any time.

thanks for doing such a great service to the community

Can someone post a mirror of the zip file, I want to grab a copy as well, but I don't want to hammer Martins bandwidth which is probably already a bit on the low side from everyone already downloading the zip.

And Martin, thanks for all your great contributions, you're one of the top reasons I hang out on here and I consider you to be one of the most knowledgeable people I've ever met when it comes to liquid cooling. :up:

I hope that you'll still be hanging around on here and posting from time to time even if you aren't doing testing anymore. :toast:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martinm210

Ok, you've convinced me to leave it up for a bit longer. I didn't really think it was worth it, but back by popular demand....

I'll leave the site up until it expires....feel free to copy whatever you want from it, and feel free to mirror or redistribute later however you feel fit.

I consider the data public information, it's not mine, it's everyone's.

Sorry for the hassle, but I'll leave it up until the domain finally expires on 12/26. I'm not planning to do anymore testing, and the site will close, so if you like something, please grab a copy.

Hope this helps:

http://www.martinsliquidlab.com/

Happy Halloween!

Make sure you take the kids out and fill them full of candy..cheers:toast2:

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Sad to hear Martin - I enjoyed your testing and it would be a shame to see such valuable information disappear so thank's for allowing us to put up mirrors :)

Was the cost (and time) the reason you decided to end the site/domain ?

When looking through your site files i noticed they were pretty bloated with white space so I ran your files through tidy.exe and reduced each file to 40-50% of their original size as well as optimised header image file so running with these files you should save 40-50% bandwidth consumption and even 90% bandwidth reduction if you have mod_deflate/gzip enabled web server. So if you decide to continue with the site or leave it till it expires, uploading the optimised files will save you bandwidth costs anyway :)

Also made header url link a relative url so no matter which domain hosts the file (mirrors), it will click and lead to right home page rather than hardcoded domain name.

so for orclev, Martin and others here's the files

original Martin set
http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com...b_original.zip

optimised file/header set for 50+% bandwidth reduction
http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com...id-fullopt.zip

Here's my mirror serving the optimised file/header set with server side gzip compression enabled for a further 25% reduction i.e. front page 40kb original vs 9.5kb optimised :)

http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com/

Only just setup subdomain so if it ain't resolving properly wait another 24-48hrs :)



.

Thank you martin I was dreading why I only bookmark your site and how I wish I saved some of the Data in my HD but now I have a chance to do it
again Thank you very much.

Thanks for all your hard work Martin, I loved your flow rate estimator !!!

One more mirror to add to the list: http://www.martinsliquidlab.co.nr

Best of luck with your new hobby !!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eva2000

Was the cost (and time) the reason you decided to end the site/domain ?

optimised file/header set for 50+% bandwidth reduction
http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com...id-fullopt.zip

http://martinsliquidlab.i4memory.com/

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Thanks!

Cost was not the reason, just time and interest. Testing and reviewing takes a tremendous effort if done in detail.

Something like a simple radiator can take as much time as something like this:

-Radiator test bench setup time 1 HR
-Benching 15-45minute warm up per data point and 30 minutes per point at equilibrium to ensure good data. 10 hours total if all is perfect, likely going to foul up a point or two, so 12 hours total.
-Pressure drop setup and testing 1-2 Hrs
-Photography and writing of the review 8 Hrs.

So a single triple radiator can total over 20-24 hours for one radiator. So even if it was a really expensive $150 radiator, you're still making less than minimum wage and that doesn't even cover the electricity for the testing, the testing equipment, or materials used.

That's fine when you're doing it for enjoyment, but over time the recreation in it will go away if you try and push yourself too hard to keep doing it. Then there is the pressure from the sample providers. I've always held firm that I'm going to post or not post (I test it once and that's it unless I've blatantly messed up somehow). I've also always tried to test in the order of stuff I've received. Unfortunately, you'll still get sponsors that pressure you to test their product first. They are holding out on production until you test, or they are going to tweak the design after you're done testing, or whatever reason they can come up with. Then you will get some that won't respond to your emails when you send them less than favorable results, or they will simply question some specific part of your testing method. Some will even question something as simple as a linear caliper measurement you've provided. In context it all just adds to the frustration and confusion on your mission of recreation.

Then there is the fact that nobody and not any one test is perfect. It's very possible to go through all that effort and something simply went wrong. There are things you can do to check your work, but there's always a number of different conditions or methods that may or may not make a difference. All you can do is capture one moment in time, under one set of conditions. The best you can do is noting the testing methods.

I've also done alot of this behind the scenes prototype testing and you really begin asking yourself why you're doing it. Sure it may be helping them produce a better product that the end user will get to benefit from, but is making less than minimum wage to produce unusable data (for the public) really worth it. In the end they are the ones getting financial gain out of your work...you're voluntary work. Again it's one of those short term "feel goods". Wow this is pretty cool, I'm actually making some sort of impact on the product...but again that's short lived. Soon it becomes a "Hey they want me to work for free....yet again!"

For me it was all alot of fun at first. Mainly because I was so curious how things worked. Unfortunately after several dozen CPU block tests, radiators tests, pump tests, and pressure drop tests...that curiosity was gone. Nothing against anyone, it simply isn't interesting for me to do any longer and there's simply no incentive to continue.

I agree with what IanY said about testing in many respects. I don't know that there is really any sort of solution to the problem. It's the internet and we all expect things for free, but it's also life and we do things out of either incentives, or morals. The testing incentive of learning, interest, and enjoyment in sharing information was something that simply faded for me over time. Then it was work, and for all practical purposes a donation. Maybe if we all are willing to come together and each donate a little time, the answer really lies in getting more people to test. Sure there will always be that issue of not being able to compare one result with another, but if everyone donated just one 20 hour test result, we'd have alot of good data to discuss and that would be very positive.

The manufacturers can and should provide performance data on their sites, unfortunately that data will always be questioned regardless and they generally stay away from it.

I was at that point of being sick of it several months ago. I only continued because I still had a huge backlog of work lined up. Eventually I simply got to a point where it became something I didn't want anything to do with.

Pulling the site down was my poor way of dealing with my inability to say no. We'll I've finally said no more, but I don't want to take away anything either. So...I've changed my mind and came to a more reasonable means to transition out of the testing hobby and handing off the data that was produced. The information is now public freeware, and I'll shut the site down as things move along down the road. We're very fortunate to have a large number of excellent testers here in these forums and I'd encourage everyone to try and contribute what they can no matter what level of effort or detail.

There's really no "Right" way to test as far as I'm concerned. Any little bit of experience or test result you can share with the community is a contribution, and that is always good and probably the best way to go about this testing thing. Anyone with some time and willing to buy a $10 aquarium thermometer can do some sort of testing.:up:

Anyhow, sorry for being so winded, to keep it simple...this hobby is supposed to be fun, so have fun with it and do what you need to do to ensure that continues..:up:

I'm going to continue water cooling and visiting the forums on occasion, glad I could help, and I look forward to seeing other folks doing more of it in the future...

Thanks!
Martin

Martin I understand where you're coming from but maybe keep the domain for your own future projects ? Or when that interest/enjoyment should rise again :)

Hate to see it expire and get nabbed by a cyber squatter serving full page of text/ad links !

Quote:

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Originally Posted by eva2000

Martin I understand where you're coming from but maybe keep the domain for your own future projects ? Or when that interest/enjoyment should rise again :)

Hate to see it expire and get nabbed by a cyber squatter serving full page of text/ad links !

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I will do that, but I'm going to reduce it to more of a domain parking page with links to deserving testing sites like these forums. This will allow me to give up maintaining the web space, but still provide a means to provide some links.:up:

i can only say :clap:respect:clap: to all your effort put in it :up:

Martin, this saddens me to see you let it go like this, but I know how you feel. :up:

You've been a GREAT help to this community and have helped me especially in the past with WC.
With all do respect! I and all of us will miss your testing greatly!! :)

Edit:
@W1zzard, sweet! Glad theres a mirror to refer to, that site/info/reviews would be a great loss to all of us.
Thanks for doing that man. :up:

Nice speech :up:

In the end, the best way for everyone to get whatever they wish to know and to compare is to teach everyone how to do testing. It's like the saying : "Give someone a fish, he will eat it. Teach him how to fish, he will be able to eat for life".

I bet Martinm210 will disappear and come back with a new name and website testing Aircoolers :p: :D

I've started adding all the articles here too.

http://www.clunk.org.uk/martins-liquid-lab-articles/

Might take me a few days because the articles are in a slightly different format to my others :)

I've linked it to the lower menu on the front page here.

http://MartinsLiquidLab.PetrasTech.com will also be acting as a mirror.

Thank you for all of your hard work, Martin. :)

This is great news. :clap:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Martinm210

Thanks!

Something like a simple radiator can take as much time as something like this:

-Radiator test bench setup time 1 HR
-Benching 15-45minute warm up per data point and 30 minutes per point at equilibrium to ensure good data. 10 hours total if all is perfect, likely going to foul up a point or two, so 12 hours total.
-Pressure drop setup and testing 1-2 Hrs
-Photography and writing of the review 8 Hrs.

So a single triple radiator can total over 20-24 hours for one radiator. So even if it was a really expensive $150 radiator, you're still making less than minimum wage and that doesn't even cover the electricity for the testing, the testing equipment, or materials used.
Martin

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This is why people take you seriously, and other people with a grain of salt tho pal.

:up:

one more pat on the back and a big thank you from me Martin

Martin-
Just wanted to say thanks as well. I just started my foray into the world of water-cooling and my good friend JDrom17 over at PCStats forum, had sent me a link to your site. I read feverishly, trying to soak up as much as I could. I am glad for what you did and I can understand the desire to move on. What's more, I am glad that many have decided to keep your info up. Thank you all!!

Thanks guys! I appreciate the mirrors, file links, and the support in this.

I've updated the OP with the mirror links and file links to make bookmarking easier.

Hopefully it's useful information for a while and if nothing else might be a worthwhile reference to use for folks figuring out testing methods.
Thanks!!
Martin

As a relative newcomer/lurker to the watercooling forums, I would also like to thank you Martin for your extremely impartial testing and great advice. You are an will continue to be an invaluable resource to water coolers everywhere and you should be proud of your contribution to the watercooling community.

thanks for all of your testing martin... youve made parts choices much easier for me

Sorry to chime in late to this thread, but i've been really busy. I have to say i'm gutted that we'll be loosing your expertise Martin, your testing will be greatly missed :(

However i too will be hosting ur site, it was very kind of you to let us have continuing access to all ur info, thanks mate :up:

Oh yeah link.... http://www.limited-edition-computers...tinsLiquidLab/

Hi Martin,

Thanks for sharing all your knowledge and tests. I'm sorry to hear that you wan't to leave this hobbie :(

Here you have a portuguese mirror: http://www.martinsliquidlab.lilireviews.com/

kind regards :up:

Thanks again, Martin!

Thanks for all your work, you helped a water cooling noob learn more

Yes thank you, your knowledge of this category was astonishing and your work has brought only positives to our community. Thanks again Martin!

The last day. :(

<S> <---Salute

Taps is playing in the background. :(

We're working on a local rehost for here on XS :). Should have a direct link from right here in the WC section :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vapor

We're working on a local rehost for here on XS :). Should have a direct link from right here in the WC section :)

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It would be great, Vapor! Good job :up:

Thanks guys.

I decided the easiest thing to do was to do nothing at all and let the domain expire. Carry on with the good work in the forums, plenty of mirrors have the info.thanks!:up:

Been on vacation myself, busy with some garage projects like modifying my son's four wheeler and I also bought a Stihl 066 parts chainsaw I've been tearing down and rebuilding. (Had an itch for a engine building project I guess) I've also been on a little "Get my but back into shape" venture, hitting the weights and stair-master on a regular basis...cheers for good health again:up: My older brother who is only 8 years older than I am (early 40's) just had a major heart attack not long ago and he's not someone you would call your typical overweight, so I'm working to set myself on a good path once again as well.:)

I finally got around to cleaning my office up this week and finally sorting through what parts I had accumulating here. I still owe a couple of you guys some parts I never got around to testing and I didn't forget about that...I plan to mail off all the parts I had untested to a few folks and then put the rest of the samples I'm not keeping on ebay.

Hope you are all having some great holidays!
We've been getting tons of snow around here, twas a very white Christmas..:clap: No new x-mas PC or WC goods, but the wife did buy me a small wire feed welder, so now it's time to get that garage cleaned up..:eek:

Cheers:toast2:
Martin

Glad to hear you're doing well Martin! Sorry to hear about your brother, but its those little scares that get us all back on the straight and narrow. Keep spending time with the kids, thats far more important.

Ohh...garage toys! :up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by skinnee

Glad to hear you're doing well Martin! Sorry to hear about your brother, but its those little scares that get us all back on the straight and narrow. Keep spending time with the kids, thats far more important.

Ohh...garage toys! :up:

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Thanks!

He's doing well, but it was a good eye opener for me to get my own act together. It's an hour a day lost going to the gym, but time invested in a healthy future.:yepp:

Cheers to toys..never have enough!:up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vapor

We're working on a local rehost for here on XS :). Should have a direct link from right here in the WC section :)

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Great news.