The Importances of Standoff's on FC blocks.

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10-17-2008, 04:32 PM
NaeKuh

The Importances of Standoff's on FC blocks.

Okey sorry, i was gonna use photoshop to add text, but i dont seem i can find the time.

Standoffs, what are they and why are they so important?
Standoff's are elevated parts on the block that allow you to screw something into the them.

Why are they important?
To accurately see why they help we need to look at 2 blocks.
The first block has no standoff's as shown:
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0067.jpg

As you can see if you tighten this screw, the card will warp gaurentee'd:
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0071.jpg

As you overtighten a series of them the entire card becomes warp because now you got more then 1 torque point in which the card bends:
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0072.jpg

How does standoff's save you card?
By preventing you from overtightening your card. The standoff's limit the amount you can clamp your card onto the block.

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0068.jpg

When you have a lot of them, they do there job, here i tightened my screws to the point where they wouldnt move, and look NO WARPING:

http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p...a/IMG_0070.jpg

So in short, Standoffs on FC blocks = FTW! :up:

I'll add text tomorrow as i free up sometime.
10-17-2008, 04:36 PM
MomijiTMO

Do they come with them? You do need to get the right height or you'll have crappy contact with the core and other parts.

You can't exactly use washers or you'll be using like 5 per screw. Definitely need to do something like this OR watch carefully when tightening the screws and stop at the first sign of resistance.
10-17-2008, 04:37 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealRedRaider

I can hear the sheep coming now...:ROTF:

i left out vendors names for ya personally :D

But we all know what they are. :X

Quote:

Originally Posted by MomijiTMO

Do they come with them? You do need to get the right height or you'll have crappy contact with the core and other parts.

there part of the block momi, as are all the new blocks that are FC.
10-17-2008, 04:39 PM
MomijiTMO

Ohh ok so some companies don't have them?
10-17-2008, 04:42 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealRedRaider

Let me guess....

2 letters vs. 8 letters

Former Eastern Block vs. SK

WC PrOn vs. Rusted Plugs

Copper vs. Aluminum

keep going there, and i can say this.

DEAD CARD vs WORKING. :rofl:
10-17-2008, 04:43 PM
MomijiTMO

Thanks for hint RRR.

Well let's be honest. Less than half of the people who buy stuff read the instructions and would promptly tighten down the screws so it is a big issue. This of course assumes that it gets a mention in the instructions . . . do they come with instructions? lol
10-17-2008, 04:44 PM
SNiiPE_DoGG

I'm using washers on my EK FC 4800 if it bends.... no good :shakes:

seriously though, shouldn't the entire block be milled with steps measured from the start point of the PCB= X-Y plane; this seems like lazy/improper design IMO.
Give me the measurements of a card and I will CAD it up correctly :up:
10-17-2008, 04:47 PM
NaeKuh

im hoping that this will tell vendors that we know whats good. So keep on bringing them.

:up:

Future standoff's on all FC blocks. FTW!
10-17-2008, 04:49 PM
MomijiTMO

Quote:

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

im hoping that this will tell vendors that we know whats good. So keep on bringing them.

Well considering what has happened with threads here and reps randomly appearing out of no where, I hope they consider this. If YOU killed your card, I imagine there are a hell of a lot more people with paper weights.
10-17-2008, 04:51 PM
SNiiPE_DoGG

XSPC can do it right for 99$ .... why?, Eddy, why? :shakes: I am seriously considering sending back my nickel FC's right now :( and I really REALLY don't want to have to :(

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7...870szf1.th.jpg http://img263.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif
10-17-2008, 04:54 PM
dengyong

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

XSPC can do it right for 99$ .... why?, Eddy, why? :shakes: I am seriously considering sending back my nickel FC's right now :( and I really REALLY don't want to have to :(

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7...870szf1.th.jpg http://img263.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif

:up: send a message.
10-17-2008, 04:59 PM
tayto_-

I take it that's the Koolance block that doesn't warp then ? What block is that ? It's not the VID-487X2 by any chance? doesn't look like it :shrug:
10-17-2008, 05:00 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToiletDuck

I take it that's the Koolance block that doesn't warp then ? What block is that ? It's not the VID-487X2 by any chance? doesn't look like it :shrug:

nah, thats my 9800GX2 block. DD was too expensive for that card, and its my backup system anyhow.

Koolance was the next contender so i bit.

I would of gotten the DD tho, as i like there stuff a little bit more.
10-17-2008, 05:04 PM
IanY

How much does 20 stand off cost in terms of material costs? $2?
10-17-2008, 05:13 PM
coolmiester

Quote:

Originally Posted by IanY

How much does 20 stand off cost in terms of material costs? $2?

Surely that would depend on what material was used.

I would much rather see nylon or anodised aluminium standoffs so there was no chance of shorting tbh

Having said that, this problem could easily have been avoided all together in the design stage with added standoff milled in the beginning :shrug:
10-17-2008, 05:27 PM
dengyong

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealRedRaider

Nylon stand-offs would be soooooooo easy to make it's pitiful they were left out in the first place.

Come on, give us some stand-offs or I'll switch over to the 8 letter company...:slapass:

What's wrong with the four letter company, shouldn't their higher quality and lower price be rewarded ?
10-17-2008, 05:32 PM
skinnee

Thanks for raising another highly important issue NaeKuh! :up:
10-17-2008, 05:42 PM
tayto_-

8 letter company....4 letter company :hm: :shrug:

Oh what the hell.. Is there any reason why i shouldn't buy this block .....
http://img.ncix.com/images/33158_l.jpg

Sorry i know it's slightly off topic :sofa:
10-17-2008, 05:46 PM
nikhsub1

Ok, call me crazy but... I see the significance of standoffs but can't you just mount a block WITHOUT standoffs and just not tighten it so tight that it warps? In any case, I'm sure I have some nylon standoffs to do the job perfectly for my 'non standoffish block' :D
10-17-2008, 05:47 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolmiester

Having said that, this problem could easily have been avoided all together in the design stage with added standoff milled in the beginning :shrug:

Yup, like so:

http://www.dangerden.com/store/image...?1224294400173

:D
10-17-2008, 05:48 PM
MomijiTMO

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikhsub1

and just not tighten it so tight that it warps?

Yeah that's how I was thinking but I mean I can only imagine how many people have stuffed their cards tightening the screws all the way down.
10-17-2008, 05:52 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikhsub1

Ok, call me crazy but... I see the significance of standoffs but can't you just mount a block WITHOUT standoffs and just not tighten it so tight that it warps? In any case, I'm sure I have some nylon standoffs to do the job perfectly for my 'non standoffish block' :D

Scott, problem is blown on XS.
Almost 1 a week. :T

I told ya you would be okey, but not many of us here have as much experience as you. :rofl:

Oh and the bending is always from the Mosfet/vreg cooler. Almost impossible to excape this one.

Watch. :D
10-17-2008, 05:56 PM
coolmiester

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikhsub1

Ok, call me crazy but... I see the significance of standoffs but can't you just mount a block WITHOUT standoffs and just not tighten it so tight that it warps? In any case, I'm sure I have some nylon standoffs to do the job perfectly for my 'non standoffish block' :D

For sure, you pays your money, you takes your chances!

Quote:

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Yup, like so:

http://www.dangerden.com/store/image...?1224294400173

:D

Precisely :up:
10-17-2008, 06:11 PM
jtf2

bowing of the blocks has always weirded me out,and i have made sure to not overtighten.
i think i will try and use some thicker small rubber washers-they will have a little give,but still be a stop for the screws.

i will try it out on a spare 8800 gts with an ek fc block
10-17-2008, 06:38 PM
Demthios

jtf2 let me know how that goes I'm currently looking for a block for the 8800GTS and was wondering this my self.
10-17-2008, 06:53 PM
Makubex_GB

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

XSPC can do it right for 99$ .... why?, Eddy, why? :shakes: I am seriously considering sending back my nickel FC's right now :( and I really REALLY don't want to have to :(

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7...870szf1.th.jpg http://img263.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif

Don't let yourself be fooled. I had one of these blocks and the standoffs are way too small. Your card will very easily warp with this FC block.

Kudos on making this thread, NaeKuh. All FC blocks MUST have standoffs of accurate length! :cussing:
10-17-2008, 07:21 PM
DeathWalking

Call me crazy, but wouldn't this sorta matter with motherboards, too? Like, MOSFET blocks, because they're at the edge of the board? I'd think really tightening down a NB block wouldn't be great, but it's in the center and stuff.
10-17-2008, 07:23 PM
jtf2

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeathWalking

Call me crazy, but wouldn't this sorta matter with motherboards, too? Like, MOSFET blocks, because they're at the edge of the board? I'd think really tightening down a NB block wouldn't be great, but it's in the center and stuff.

unlike most? vidcard blocks,nb,mosfet blocks are mounted with springs,nuts, and bolts,usually,and have a back plate also,which minimizes bending
10-17-2008, 07:26 PM
jc99

So dangerden is the only company that has the standoffs nailed down correctly?
10-17-2008, 07:35 PM
jtf2

Quote:

Originally Posted by RealRedRaider

Only ASUS blocks have backplates...

i stand corrected on that point:)
10-17-2008, 08:16 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by jc99

So dangerden is the only company that has the standoffs nailed down correctly?

koolance and evga have got them done correctly as well.

Cant speak for XSPC as i dont have any blocks from them. YET.
10-17-2008, 08:19 PM
Demthios

Anyone know if AquagraFX got it right??
10-17-2008, 09:33 PM
SNiiPE_DoGG

I have just sent this message to eddy:

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

try number 2 (accidentally sent the first message >.<)

Hi Eddy,

I am the owner of 2 EK-FC4870 CF High Performance Water Blocks and there is an issue that has recently come to my attention regarding the design of these blocks. They are not milled including standoffs in order to prevent bowing when tightening the screws properly, thus causing a bend in the card. In concurrence with this thread on XS (http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=205033) I request that you find nylon spacers of the appropriate size and send them out to every owner who requests a set for their waterblock(s). I assume from looking at you block designs that the standoff's would be of a uniform size, so it should be fairly easy to implement.

In the future it seems appropriate that your block designs use the PCB as the X-Y plane in the cad design; that way when the block is milled you can mill relative to the PCB and include the standoff spacing in the design.

I have told all XS members who own the block to send you a message saying "I would like a set of standoffs for <vgacardname>" they have seen a copy of the message I sent you and they all agree they would like a waterblock that doesn't warp their cards.

I request of EVERY XtremeSystems member who owns an EK Fullcover Waterblock to send the message

Code:

I would like a set of standoffs for <vgacardname>

to the contact us email system: here

thank you to all for all the people who do this, I hope we can make our waterblocks viable again. :yepp:
10-17-2008, 09:40 PM
AndrewZorn

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

seriously though, shouldn't the entire block be milled with steps measured from the start point of the PCB= X-Y plane; this seems like lazy/improper design IMO.
Give me the measurements of a card and I will CAD it up correctly :up:

REALLY

I've never used a full cover block, and after seeing all this card-bending stupidity I decided I'd never want one.

I could see it happening on some sort of universal full cover... and then adapting and including spacers... but if you are going to charge $100+ for a specialty part, that's only good for one card, why can't it be measured correctly?

Quote:

Originally Posted by nikhsub1

nylon standoffs

are my favorite thing. Maybe it's just because it's the only thing of significance I can find locally, without ordering online.
10-17-2008, 09:43 PM
twwen2

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

I have just sent this message to eddy:
...

Very good Snipe, i'm on it!
10-17-2008, 10:02 PM
bigslappy

$750 dollar question = what size is that stand-off as in HOW friggin' thick is needed >> Damn i'll make my own !
says the guy about to mount a $150 block on a $600 plus Vid card >>> DD on a 4870X2
10-18-2008, 01:04 AM
tgm_of_xxl

Requested 2 sets of standofs for 8800GTS
10-18-2008, 01:34 AM
TI66ER

I am using an xspc razor full cover block on my 4850,and it is not warped.

sorry i have not got a better pic.

http://img.techpowerup.org/081018/loop.jpg
10-18-2008, 01:34 AM
Jiangxue

Eddy is SO going to be flooded! :rofl:
10-18-2008, 01:43 AM
Eddy_EK

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

XSPC can do it right for 99$ .... why?, Eddy, why? :shakes: I am seriously considering sending back my nickel FC's right now :( and I really REALLY don't want to have to :(

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7...870szf1.th.jpg http://img263.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif

Hi there,

I'll be honest with you. There are few reasons why we don't use standoffs.
1. I have mounted many blocks on cards and found no need for this as I can find optimal pressure for the block quickly.
2. for standoffs we need at lease 1,2mm more copper material (which is about 15% more material and this is $$$)
3. more machining which costs from 25€-35€ per hour.

XSPC makes blocks in Asia which significantly drops the production costs. Many other brands are also making blocks in Asia... But we are determinate to keep the quality control in our hands as that is very hard to achieve in Asia.

I know we have to be better, to make it better, so the less experienced users can mount the block without any problem. We are already using standoffs for Alu parts at 4870 and 4850 blocks.

I promise you we will start seriously to find solution to this, to provide you the standoffs for et least next coming water blocks if not for the present ones.
Options are:
- plastic standoffs that are additionally glued to the copper
- metal standoffs that are additionally glued to the copper
- full copper one-piece standoffs like XSPC and some others have it

Anything else, feel free to contact me on our e-mails info@ek.....

Eddy
10-18-2008, 01:45 AM
MomijiTMO

And we know all to well about XSPC QC issues ;)
10-18-2008, 01:53 AM
Waterlogged

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy_EK

Hi there,

I'll be honest with you. There are few reasons why we don't use standoffs.
1. I have mounted many blocks on cards and found no need for this as I can find optimal pressure for the block quickly.
2. for standoffs we need at lease 1,2mm more copper material (which is about 15% more material and this is $$$)
3. more machining which costs from 25€-35€ per hour.

XSPC makes blocks in Asia which significantly drops the production costs. Many other brands are also making blocks in Asia... But we are determinate to keep the quality control in our hands as that is very hard to achieve in Asia.

I know we have to be better, to make it better, so the less experienced users can mount the block without any problem. We are already using standoffs for Alu parts at 4870 and 4850 blocks.

I promise you we will start seriously to find solution to this, to provide you the standoffs for et least next coming water blocks if not for the present ones.
Options are:
- plastic standoffs that are additionally glued to the copper
- metal standoffs that are additionally glued to the copper
- full copper one-piece standoffs like XSPC and some others have it

Anything else, feel free to contact me on our e-mails info@ek.....

Eddy

Danger Den machines their standoffs on their current blocks and I'd be more than willing to bet that their machining costs are very similar to yours Eddy.

There are plenty of ppl that have had problems mounting non standoff blocks lately and some of them are very experienced ppl. It's gone beyond the newb looking stupid for no reason and that's not a good thing.
10-18-2008, 01:56 AM
TI66ER

I do like the ek 4850 block,the only reason i did not buy that one was price,in the uk the ek is about £10 more than the xspc.Upto now this block has been fine so i will see on the qc factor when its been on a while.Considering the blocks are basically a machined block of copper with a machined piece of acetal on the top,how hard can it be to make it leak proof.

As far as the no stand offs go,if it has no stand offs on the block,surely you just dont screw the screws in a too tight.As long as the blocks metal is touching the part to be cooled,does it need to be really tightly screwed down?

Sorry if i sound like i dont know what i'am on about,feel free to call me ignorant.:rolleyes:
10-18-2008, 01:58 AM
Movieman

Suggestion from an old fart?:D
What about a simple round holed plastic insert sized properly and dropped in the parts bag with a simple diagram on where they go for the uninformed.
That should keep your end down and satisfy the crazed folks here..
Yes? No? Go back and crawl in my hole?:D
10-18-2008, 02:00 AM
Hondacity

what if the standoffs are .1mm - .5mm too tall???
10-18-2008, 02:10 AM
Movieman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hondacity

what if the standoffs are .1mm - .5mm too tall???

If they are plastic then you get out your hammer and make adjustments!:D
10-18-2008, 05:59 AM
septim

haha, cool idea, i have lots of faucet aid washers of different thickness to try out once my fc gtx arrives next week...
10-18-2008, 06:35 AM
IanY

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy_EK

XSPC makes blocks in Asia which significantly drops the production costs. Many other brands are also making blocks in Asia... But we are determinate to keep the quality control in our hands as that is very hard to achieve in Asia.

Woah!! Take it easy on the Asia stereotyping and outright bashing there. That's about as sweeping a generalization as I have ever seen. Are you insinuating that there's poor quality in all Asian made products? Or that its impossible to ensure quality consistency if products are manufactured in Asia?

Where you choose to manufacture your blocks obviously has direct bearing on labour and production costs. Its your own decision where to manufacture.

I won't go further than that, although I can write a whole novel in response. That can be construed as highly offensive. This xenophobia and hatred is not smart. Remember that you have a lot of Asian customers.

RRR will whip out some Vincent blocks and we can take it from there.
10-18-2008, 07:10 AM
jollyjoker

I didnt see any stereotyping or bashing in what he said. He just wants to be able to oversee the products he is selling.
10-18-2008, 07:21 AM
RADCOM

So warp is only a good thing in Star trek :) Has anyone received any standoffs? Is it possible for anyone to get a batch made up? Would the .5mm be significant? All these questions and more will be answered on next weeks episode of soap....sorry it's the cider lol Seriously what size standoffs do I need?
10-18-2008, 07:41 AM
IanY

Quote:

Originally Posted by jollyjoker

I didnt see any stereotyping or bashing in what he said. He just wants to be able to oversee the products he is selling.

I can name any number of companies with foreign sourced manufacturing, invariably in Asia, that have both high product quality and quality consistency. With a few exceptions,those companies bring great products to market and yet maintain price leadership. Its a sustainable source of competitive advantage, and if someone doesn't seize on opportunity, its his loss.

Over 90% of the content in your computer is either Asian manufactured, Asian EMS sourced, or manufactured by companies headquartered in Western countries under Asian management.
10-18-2008, 07:53 AM
jollyjoker

No one said anything about Asia not producing quality products.
10-18-2008, 07:54 AM
ward0

the EK 9800X2 bended my XFX 9800GX2 had to rma it :( i followed the instructions etc. still it was bending... If you look at the card it has some spacers at the outer sides of the card near the power plugs, you should concider making somthing like that? Because ATI is easy 2 cores on 1 side but nvidia has 1 core on eatch side so the card will auto bend at little at start.
10-18-2008, 08:04 AM
Eddie3dfx

I am not sure I follow.
Aren't blocks specifically designed that they can't be overtightened and crush the gpu?
If you install a standoff, wouldn't the gpu not be touching the block?
10-18-2008, 08:06 AM
AndrewZorn

It's more like trying to get the 'lowest points' of the block to be the right height. If they are too short, fully tightening the screws will bow the block. If they are too long, then yes, tightening will mean poor GPU contact.
10-18-2008, 08:07 AM
coolmiester

Quote:

Originally Posted by ward0

the EK 9800X2 bended my XFX 9800GX2 had to rma it :( i followed the instructions etc. still it was bending... If you look at the card it has some spacers at the outer sides of the card near the power plugs, you should concider making somthing like that? Because ATI is easy 2 cores on 1 side but nvidia has 1 core on eatch side so the card will auto bend at little at start.

Exactly the reason i made some spacers for that end of the cards to ensure the two cards remain parallel :up:

Taken from this post

http://www.coolercases.co.uk/skull/skull_125.jpg
10-18-2008, 08:24 AM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by coolmiester

Exactly the reason i made some spacers for that end of the cards to ensure the two cards remain parallel :up:

Taken from this post

Another reason why i picked koolance is because they have a THICK arylic back support:

http://www.koolance.com/water-coolin...-398gx2_p1.jpg

Remember CM when they were designing it and we were all asking vendors to make that middle an extended thick arcylic. :rofl:

Kinda funny how koolance listened to us, yet no one gave them credit.

Also, CM you really need to try that block out if your bored. It comes with 4 LED's that plug directly into your video card fan header (a koolance First) , so you can keep the wiring internal if your customer is wanting that LED bling! :up:
10-18-2008, 08:29 AM
Eddie3dfx

Would an ek g92 block need one and any recommendations on standoff sizes?
So far I'm just seeing the gx2 ones that need them.
10-18-2008, 08:35 AM
IanY

Quote:

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Another reason why i picked koolance is because they have a THICK arylic back support:

Remember CM when they were designing it and we were all asking vendors to make that middle a thick arcylic. :rofl:

Kinda funny how koolance listened to us, yet no one gave them credit.

Also, CM you really need to try that block out if your bored. It comes with 4 LED's that plug directly into your video card fan header (a koolance First) , so you can keep the wiring internal if your customer is wanting that LED bling! :up:

Naekuh,

Come on now. You are starting to sound like you're on the payroll, and I know that you're not.

Let's be enthusiastic about brands and products, but let's have some restraint :)
10-18-2008, 08:38 AM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by IanY

Naekuh,

Come on now. You are starting to sound like you're on the payroll, and I know that you're not.

Let's be enthusiastic about brands and products, but let's have some restraint :)

ahahhahaha..

well he was talking about the rear supports, and when i was block shopping, i actually put that into consideration. :rofl:
10-18-2008, 08:39 AM
Eddy_EK

Quote:

Originally Posted by IanY

Woah!! Take it easy on the Asia stereotyping and outright bashing there. That's about as sweeping a generalization as I have ever seen. Are you insinuating that there's poor quality in all Asian made products? Or that its impossible to ensure quality consistency if products are manufactured in Asia?

Where you choose to manufacture your blocks obviously has direct bearing on labour and production costs. Its your own decision where to manufacture.

I won't go further than that, although I can write a whole novel in response. That can be construed as highly offensive. This xenophobia and hatred is not smart. Remember that you have a lot of Asian customers.

RRR will whip out some Vincent blocks and we can take it from there.

I did not say it is impossible but it is hard... Don't go so hard on me ;)
10-18-2008, 08:50 AM
LeeH

Quote:

Originally Posted by Movieman

Suggestion from an old fart?:D
What about a simple round holed plastic insert sized properly and dropped in the parts bag with a simple diagram on where they go for the uninformed.
That should keep your end down and satisfy the crazed folks here..
Yes? No? Go back and crawl in my hole?:D

I went down to my local True Value Hardware and picked up a bunch of nylon parts to use as standoffs when I was having trouble getting screws the right length to attach fans to my radiator with a shroud. Works great and real cheap. I don't have any holes in my radiator.

It is true that the FC blocks should cover that issue and no block should have that problem. However, the type of experimenters we are should see the issue, advise the manufacturer and then find our own work around solution. Is this any different than the nylon standoffs provided with a RadBox?

Cordially,

Another old fart.
10-18-2008, 09:04 AM
Manicdan

Im with EK that there are many good reasons for not having built in standoffs

the DD full coverage block i bought for my 2900 had them machined on, and i wasnt happy with the pressure being put on the core. so i dremeled them down about .5mm and applied pressure as i saw fit.

for the 4 screws near the core i wouldnt recommend using standoffs, theres not enough of a gap to really control a .1mm difference, and there should be enough support so that you really cant overtighten unless you think a powerdrill is how you install a block. for the rest of the screws the standoffs shown in the koolance pic a few posts back are pretty simple, and if they were shipped with two sizes and people could swap them out as needed, it should be plenty.

end of lesson is that its the owners job to know how much pressure it should take to keep it on. if anything they should send those tiny screwdrivers for fixing glasses with the block, and say in the instructions "if u cant make it any tighter with this, then its tight enough"
10-18-2008, 09:29 AM
AndrewZorn

I agree, especially with the increased cost, built-in may not be a good idea. But include nylons, which are so cheap there's hardly a reason to not.
10-18-2008, 10:36 AM
SNiiPE_DoGG

Quote:

Originally Posted by AndrewZorn

I agree, especially with the increased cost, built-in may not be a good idea. But include nylons, which are so cheap there's hardly a reason to not.

:yepp:

as I said in my email to eddy, I would prefer nylon standoffs fro their ability to keep a uniform plane on the PCB and still allow variable pressure...

also I just thought of the possibility of using springs on longer mounting screws. This could create a viable, non-card warping, system for mounting.
10-18-2008, 11:23 AM
IanY

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy_EK

I did not say it is impossible but it is hard... Don't go so hard on me ;)

OK. I apologize to you :)
10-18-2008, 11:37 AM
shabranigdo

Quote:

Originally Posted by NaeKuh

Another reason why i picked koolance is because they have a THICK arylic back support:

http://www.koolance.com/water-coolin...-398gx2_p1.jpg

Remember CM when they were designing it and we were all asking vendors to make that middle an extended thick arcylic. :rofl:

Kinda funny how koolance listened to us, yet no one gave them credit.

Also, CM you really need to try that block out if your bored. It comes with 4 LED's that plug directly into your video card fan header (a koolance First) , so you can keep the wiring internal if your customer is wanting that LED bling! :up:

I have to say I think this was the best use of that big space left in the x2 by removing the fan. I did not even think of the benefit of keeping the cards in line. I think this is a good topic showing what some consumers want as part of a full cover block for gpu's. Look at how well the included GTZ mounting hardware and backplate were received. It took the guesswork out of is it too tight or tight enough. It also allowed consistent mounts to be easily reproduced. And in the end it cost them very little for all the positives they got out of it. And as consumer we get a product that takes out the concerns out of getting it just right.
10-20-2008, 12:48 AM
tgm_of_xxl

I've got an email from Eddy:
"Hi!

I understand there is a thread on xsys forums.
We dont have any standoffs prepared for the current cards.
I am sure there is no need for your blocks the standoffs.
Some other cards dont have such optimal mounting holes positions and it
bends the card more.

Eddy"

I know it's hard to make some stand offs and send them to all the people who bought FC blocks from EK, but my cards are already warped, and i didn't tighten the screws hard... so ...

I will come back with pictures
10-20-2008, 02:31 AM
septim

just grab a few rubber washers, stack em or trim em to height...
10-25-2008, 05:04 PM
SkOrPn

I ordered M3 Nylon washers from mcmaster, part# 95610A130. You get a 100 pack for $2.61

Seems like they would work great if you use several at a time as standoffs. But not sure as I have not tried it yet. I am also ordering some MUCH higher quality zinc-plated M3x8mm screws for this block as well since the 6mm ones barely grab the threads with these Nylon washers (some didn't grab at all). I just need to figure out the thread pitch first, but not sure how yet.

Be nice if EK would give us the metric dimensions between the block and pcb so us Enthusiasts could make our own standoffs. I'm sure they have that info somewhere. It's probably programed into the machine that cut the blocks, I would think.

EDIT: I just realized this thread is not about EK FC blocks only, just FC blocks in general. My bad.
11-02-2008, 12:43 PM
Eddy_EK

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNiiPE_DoGG

XSPC can do it right for 99$ .... why?, Eddy, why? :shakes: I am seriously considering sending back my nickel FC's right now :( and I really REALLY don't want to have to :(

http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/7...870szf1.th.jpg http://img263.imageshack.us/images/thpix.gif

Hi!

I have just realized the XSPC does not have standoffs.
It just looks like but in fact they are just in the plane of the RAM coolers.
This is just for your information.
This does not anyhow change my mind that we will have them with our next block.
And this might be very soon :up:
11-02-2008, 02:09 PM
Broken

I can understand why standoff's are a good thing, but why all of the sudden is it OMG this suxors, or 3p1c fa17!!!!!? None of the earlier blocks had standoffs, my EK 8800GTX blocks caused a little bending, same with my Alphacool OTC Flat 8800GTX. Cards worked just fine. Am I missing something or is it just time for another witch hunt?
11-02-2008, 02:22 PM
Eddy_EK

The watercooling community is spreading also amongst newbies, unexperienced users, and can easily break the cards when overtightening.
This will prevent overtighting and breaking the cards.
I am for the standoffs that can be used, or removed, as experienced users can achieve better temps and contact without the standoffs.
11-02-2008, 02:27 PM
SNiiPE_DoGG

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy_EK

The watercooling community is spreading also amongst newbies, unexperienced users, and can easily break the cards when overtightening.
This will prevent overtighting and breaking the cards.
I am for the standoffs that can be used, or removed, as experienced users can achieve better temps and contact without the standoffs.

agreed, I think a flexible standoff will maybe make both possible? either way everyone should be happy :)
11-03-2008, 12:17 PM
zuess

I have a Ek full cover block on order and after reading this thread i sent Eddy an email.

He responded this morning, he stated that the accurate thickness for the standoff's
would be 4mm.

Thanks for that link SNiiPE_DoGG
11-03-2008, 12:25 PM
NaeKuh

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eddy_EK

I am for the standoffs that can be used, or removed, as experienced users can achieve better temps and contact without the standoffs.

Glad to see you stepping up and going out of the way for us eddie.

:up:
11-03-2008, 04:40 PM
Waxking1

He went a little further than that for me and said he will send me standoffs.

My question is which screws do you use the standoffs on? Seems to me like the six around the GPU would be snugged down first. Can you bend the card with only the six screws around the GPU without using a lot of force with a jewelers screwdriver? There are two screws on the Video I/O side and three on the VReg side which I would guess these 5 are the ones you would use the standoffs on?

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