A/\/\/\C SS Build LOG

Hi Guys I thought id let the dust settle and as promised i will do a few build logs starting with a single stage im doing at the moment and have been in my workshop building this weekend hope you like the pics so far

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/parts.jpg

Some of the parts and my cases.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/cases.jpg

Cases.

Here,s a pic of the desuper heater i made wrapped around a map gas bottle for shaping then positoned
behind the condenser to catch some airflow,
this is after brazing and cleaning.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/desup.jpg

And almost there i,l post some more pics next few days of me making the Evap and stuff hope you guys like the build so far.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...ide%20shot.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/rear.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/frontside.jpg

looking good :)

Man that's a ton of room in that case. :up:

Looking pretty sharp there. Hope business is well :)

Thanks killer miller ive got a few orders
and il keep you posted im hoping to get some nice stuff up and posted for you guys
ive got plans for a autocascade and a ss in one case that feed one evap but with seperate gas chambers it should hold some nice temps :) il keep you posted on this build atm until its finished

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [XC] 2long4u

Man that's a ton of room in that case. :up:

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The case Dimensions are W=8" H=10" L=20" so they are pretty much the exact size to sit a pc case on top :up:

Howdy A/\/\/\C! I'm sorry things started out so rough back at your first arrival at the forums. I seems the whole "bad apple" cliché bears some truth. Anyway, Welcome!! :welcome:

It’s clear you have your act together. I’m sure many of us could learn a great deal from observation of your work and techniques. Thanks for the pictures…I’ll watch this closely for more as they come. Keep up the great work. :up:

Great! huge desup!

loads of work for one weekend, cases are incredible...do you have any pics of your workshop? will you be making evap on a lathe or mill?

keep it up!

evaps are almost ready made il show you them over the next few days no milling or lathing
ive an easier evap than that with result as good as a chilly1 as i bought one to test, and my evaps are just as good if not better, also in this build il be showing you some cool easy to build load testers that are very high watt capable, in fact they can get so hot its necesary to control the voltage to them, more to come over the next few days and il take pics of tools workshop etc.

awsome thanks!

cap in cap evap? I see an amazing enclosure in the first pic is that something you made?

regards

I look forward to seeing those load testers. I'm about to construct one. Cheers.

Looking great... When you get a chance can you post some more pics? I would love to see how the enclosure looks all buttoned up with the sides and LCD in place.

Very nice AC :up: It's good to see you posting. :D

Why the push instead of the pull on the condenser fan?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by teyber

awsome thanks!

cap in cap evap? I see an amazing enclosure in the first pic is that something you made?

regards

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Yeah i made the enclosure for the evap its made from 2 peices of 10mm fomalux, it was modeled of a thermaltake water blocks steel bracket as a template.
So it fits all cpu,s just like the thermaltake bracket did then after ive assembled the 2 peices of fomalux i plastic primer it then 2pack polyurethane coat it with a hardener so they set pretty solid and are easy to make :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by runmc

Why the push instead of the pull on the condenser fan?

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the reason for the push is colder air from the front and a nice airflow through the case you dont want to be pulling warm air from inside the cooler of the compressor and desup onto the condenser.
Fans are always colder when blowing onto a surface rather than pulling air, most good air cpu coolers blow onto the heatsink not draw heat away, also the air blows through condenser then past desuperheater to give that some cool air and because ive got a fan pulling at the rear of the case
i get nice airflow past the compressor to remove any excess warm air.
So the 2 fans setup works well ive tried it other ways and found this works best.
Also any warm air exits at the rear just like on a pc so when you sit a pc on top all your warm air goes out the back from both the cooler and the pc,s psu.

Hello

Does this compressor is designed for R600a or I'm wrong ? ;)

Aren't You afraid that this compressor will be too weak for modern SS :) ?

Clean work :yepp:.

thanks
best regards
Peter

No peter it used r134a but this compressor will be used with r290 and r407c with a little ethane and i have had good result with these compressors before
Thanks

Im hoping to get time tomorrow to show you guys a nice load tester thats easy and cheap to build with excellent results

Ok here,s a little update with The Evap Im using on this unit its very simple to make requires some skilled drilling and brazing which i will cover tommorow
and for teybor some pics of my garage which is full of tools as its also my vehicle workshop at home ok evaps first i did say they were easy to make

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/Evap2.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...#37;20fans.jpg

yup you guessed it its a good old intel sckt 775 cooler
and the copper cores from these things cool just as well as a chilly1 evap theres a pic of a chilly evap next to the intel one later on.
Ok heres the copper core taken out of the intel aluminum enclosure
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...extraction.jpg

quite a nice peice of copper already milled and with a litte modification these make excellent evap heads

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...0its%20own.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/pliers.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...losure%201.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...enclosure3.jpg

here,s the intel evap next to an old chilly evap

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...chilly%201.jpg

Ok time for some refrigeration tools and workshop pics

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/cupboard.jpg


http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...%20benders.jpg
Some nice hydrolic pipe benders

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/cutters.jpg

My cutters note the 3.5/8" Cutter used on Refigeration
plants and large Hvac equip something i needed for Work

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/expanders.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...are%20tool.jpg

Tube Expanders and flaring tool.

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/gauges.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/welder.jpg
My snap on welder 13yrs old with a nice bottle of C02 :)
Whatch You dont fall down the Vehicle Pit

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/tools.jpg

My Brazing Torch and Map gas Torch Ive a few Different Brazing guns :)

Well that raps it up for today il post some more tommorow as im going to finish the evap and get this unit nearer to being finished.
Hope you like the pics.

Ron runs to closet to look for Intel HSF - :D

Lol

How much do you pay for those intel coolers? all i find on ebay is like 10$ and 8$ to ship.

I love the vehicle pit :P amazing pipe benders and expander... Do you use the expander instead of a swag?

regards

i have a m8 who owns a pc shop i get all his intel coolers when he,s doing a newbuild and they want a fan upgrade there is other ones you can use newer version check ebay for copper core coolers, and a swager is a pipe expander only without the clamping and hitting it makes lite work of jointing pipes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by A/\/\/\C

i have a m8 who owns a pc shop i get all his intel coolers when he,s doing a newbuild and they want a fan upgrade there is other ones you can use newer version check ebay for copper core coolers, and a swager is a pipe expander only without the clamping and hitting it makes lite work of jointing pipes

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i don't think so, i have an expensive swag that you clamp down and its like a flaring tool but with changeable heads for different sizes, in addition to a flaring head... pipe expanders are around 200$ if im correct:eek:

K, not trying to thread jack but was curious about the price because in my situation it would be cheaper to buy the copper and mill it however i want. But if you have cheap access then thats pretty awsome:clap:

Nice tools. Are you in the refrigeration business or is this just a side hobby?

copper cost, time milling outways the cost for me if i mill one from copper which ive got loads of it bears no difference in cooling or cost to using a ready made evap or one of these intels u can pick these up for 4.99 on ebay

Quote:

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Originally Posted by teyber

i don't think so, i have an expensive swag that you clamp down and its like a flaring tool but with changeable heads for different sizes, in addition to a flaring head... pipe expanders are around 200$ if im correct:eek:

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The meaning of swage is to expand, ive always called my expanders swagers, here is a clipet from a google search

"Swaging is a process that is used to reduce or increase the diameter of tubes and/or rods."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swage

all i meant was that an expander is a lot quicker than an old style swager that you clamp down and easier.
Ive also got a tool like yours that you clamp with changeable heads but in the field if i was to use it i would loose time on an install.
when your doing a 200metre pipe run on 5 AC units and 50+ joins you dont want to be using a compression swager or hammer swager up in a ceiling space so thats where the expander/swager is more usefull :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Polizei

Nice tools. Are you in the refrigeration business or is this just a side hobby?

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I was in the business for around 15 years mainly commercial refrigeration plants also lots of air conditioning installs, but i gave up refrigeration to raise my son :)
These are my tools from when i was working i do other things for work now so in my spare time i still like to mess around with refrigeration

How to you make the sections and how to do do the horizontal passage?

i made for my first try avaporators by intel copper cores , very great result (i think so the intel copper core is 100% pure copper )

How do you get that enclosure off ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boshuter

How do you get that enclosure off ?

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Bend Back the fins or snap them off enough to be able to hacksaw down the side leaving 1mm of aluminum left then score it with a stanly knife or dremmel then press out the core very easy after that

Quote:

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Originally Posted by killermiller

How to you make the sections and how to do do the horizontal passage?

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what i do is drill right through the bottom to make the gas pasage then braze back up the ends when im done i think the bases of them are around 3/4 inch thick so they absorb a lot of heat when you put the channels inside
the base il draw a diagram for you and as for the sections i use copper plates 2mm thick cut into circles then drill a tiny hole in the centre for the captube then a larger whole to the side for suction i make around 4 of these then braze them in place one after another.

Here,s a diagram to help you
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/evap22.jpg

Here,s a little update some pics of the finished intel evap after drilled gas tubes inside it are finished and the sections have been brazed in as shown in the diagram above, and its been polished and mounted and fitted to the ss unit

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/fin1evap.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/fin2evap.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/lineset1.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/lineset2.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/lineset3.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/lineset4.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...ont%20view.jpg

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...top%20view.jpg

Not much left to finish now, a little wiring and the controller to build, switch and small 12v Power supply.
Then Temp display, Gas it up leak test and see what she can do Il update some more hopefully tomorrow
and i wont finish this thread without adding my load testers in.
Hope you like the pics :up:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by A/\/\/\C

Bend Back the fins or snap them off enough to be able to hacksaw down the side leaving 1mm of aluminum left then score it with a stanly knife or dremmel then press out the core very easy after that

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LOL...... no, I know how to get the copper out of the Intel hs; I'm asking how you get the evap enclosure you made off after you braze the suction line all up? It looks like it's one piece and there is no snap ring on the evap.

why would i need to take it off ? it fits every kind of cpu and mobo thats out there.
But if i did want to remove it all i would do is flat two sides of the lip then make the same shape in the enclose and a simple turn of 90 degrees would remove the enclosure like so

So there would,nt need to be a snap ring simple twist and remove

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...3/untitled.JPG

Well you might want to take it off so you wouldn't have to cut a hole it would fit through in a pc case.

I tried that method to make one removable a long time ago, it works.... sort of. You may run into issues though, I tried it with 2 flat sides like your drawing, and another with 4 flats, neither was acceptable, IMO.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boshuter

I tried that method to make one removable a long time ago, it works.... sort of. You may run into issues though, I tried it with 2 flat sides like your drawing, and another with 4 flats, neither was acceptable, IMO.

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i make a recess in the enclosure that it sits snug into that way it is acceptable if its done correctly its more than exceptable its actualy perfect
because once it sits into the 2mm shaped recess it can not turn so it does not come out !

But i dont need to remove it, also you could still fit it through a whole cut in the bottom of a pc case in a u shape ive installed before into cases without needing to remove it using a small whole cut next to the edge of the case like a cut out

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts...y%203/base.JPG

So either way you can get the job done either by making the enclosure come off or by doing it this way its all down to personel preference.

And the end result is it cools ur pc wether it has a snap ring o ring case cut removable or not it works either way :)

Looks pretty sharp. Where did you get that idea?

Hi killermiller :) i thought of it when i thought of enclosure design i didnt like the circlip idea also i wanted something simple and a cheap evap design i could use without major cost.
But i suppose the main result were all after is to phase cool the pc.
Whatever way we do it
If it works why not :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by A/\/\/\C

Bend Back the fins or snap them off enough to be able to hacksaw down the side leaving 1mm of aluminum left then score it with a stanly knife or dremmel then press out the core very easy after that




what i do is drill right through the bottom to make the gas pasage then braze back up the ends when im done i think the bases of them are around 3/4 inch thick so they absorb a lot of heat when you put the channels inside
the base il draw a diagram for you and as for the sections i use copper plates 2mm thick cut into circles then drill a tiny hole in the centre for the captube then a larger whole to the side for suction i make around 4 of these then braze them in place one after another.

Here,s a diagram to help you
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/XS/evap22.jpg

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how do you purge while brazing the circle plates there ? :rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dr.rafi

how do you purge while brazing the circle plates there ? :rolleyes:

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I braze a small 6 inch tube a little larger than the cap tube into the base purging with nitrogen then that tube stays in for purging it gets brazed in place then later when all the sections are done i braze the suction in place then swap the nitrogen line onto the suction line then cut down and insert the cap tube down to the bottom of the centre tube i started with and braze the cap tube in place, i didnt draw it in the diagram but the cap tube is inside a tube that runs through the centre and is sealed at each section.
I find this works perfectly and keeps the entire process clean hope this helps you :)

PS be sure to not let the cap tube touch the base in case there is any braze thats made it too the very bottom or u could end up blocking ur cap tube and ruining the whole process

Quote:

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Originally Posted by A/\/\/\C

I braze a small 6 inch tube a little larger than the cap tube into the base purging with nitrogen then that tube stays in for purging it gets brazed in place then later when all the sections are done i braze the suction in place then swap the nitrogen line onto the suction line then cut down and insert the cap tube down to the bottom of the centre tube i started with and braze the cap tube in place, i didnt draw it in the diagram but the cap tube is inside a tube that runs through the centre and is sealed at each section.
I find this works perfectly and keeps the entire process clean hope this helps you :)

PS be sure to not let the cap tube touch the base in case there is any braze thats made it too the very bottom or u could end up blocking ur cap tube and ruining the whole process

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i understand this method but wat i mean wen u put the first plate (for example ) and brazing , the lower part will be purged with nitro but the upper part inside will become oxidized if i think ?:confused:

a simple sandblast between layers stops oxidization
using my shotblast gun cheers

hey mate any updates on temps?

regards

yeah il post some pics of other stuff too but temps wise the units finished and holding -39 at 4.8 gig 1.76v
on my qx9770 not bad for a small ss the gas mix is the trick i found just the right amout of 407c and r290 gives me a greater load and lower temps at the load,
Ps i changed the enclosure for this one but its not my final design il post that probably tomorrow ive got a cool way that ive been doing enclosures nice too ive just been real busy few units too build and also just Mot,d my clio as ive sold it, so been snowed under with work

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/roberts0n/ebay/unit3.jpg

To bad your not in USA, we are lacking good phase change with interesting (down to earth) prices...

:up: great work btw. :up:

Thanks :)

Could you give us loaded results? :)

loaded on all four cores using hot cpu -18 -22 its only a small r134a compressor
:)

That's decent temperatures for that kind of compressor :)

What is its ref? I can't see it clearly on the pics (TL serie of course but I don't know if I see a 5 or sth else :p:)

congratulation with your project A/\/\/\C,
very well buit, but how thickness is you flex hose insulation ?
dont you have condensation issues ?
regards

i never have condensation issues well made sealed and when i run my own unit at home i run it from morning till night my qx9770 has been turned on at 4.8ghz since 9.30am yesterday at -40 and its now 03.58am thats 18 hours striaght phase cooled, ive just finished playing Bf2 but no if lagged correctly air tight condensation should never be a problem.

When i was working many off the airconditiong systems and blast chillers we installed were situated in shops office area,s we couldnt afford leaks of condensation as it ruins ceiling tiles and or clothing in a superstore so sealing and preventing condensation was something we had to get correct not good for company image if the cooler system your company has installed drips condensation all over important paperwork or food produce or consumables. :)

You should consider useing the fan after the condenser. I know it looks good to have it in front but it will perform better if it is behind it. Or better yet use 2, one in fron and one behind.

you would certantly make better use of your great dsh's/slhx's by doing that

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [XC] 2long4u

You should consider useing the fan after the condenser. I know it looks good to have it in front but it will perform better if it is behind it. Or better yet use 2, one in fron and one behind.

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Agreed..... with the fan in front and the way the shroud is designed on the condenser, you lose a good portion of the condenser area with fan in front, and like 2long pointed out, the fan will perform better pulling air through the condenser than it will pushing. Maybe then you could get rid of about 3/4 of that DSH. ;)

BTW, what is the length of that case? It's either very long, or thats a tiny compressor, I've never seen so much room in a normal sized SS case, that has to make it very easy to work in.

Not how it turned out in tests the air is not as cold through the condenser when its pulling
why do you suppose all air cpu coolers push air onto the cpu heatsink and not pull it away ?
and belive it or not the DSH stays nice and cool of the airflow and condenser doesn,t get warm at all but it definatly achieves more than a cool enough temprature for refigerant to condense and beacause there is a fan at the rear of the case pulling it gives nice airflow through the case and cools the compressor but as i say ive tried it the other way around when this was the final design and i found it worked better on pushing instead of pulling IMO for some its personel preference
but out of interest someone try it both ways stick a temp probe on the condenser and tell me whats coldest pushing or pulling :)

And regarding the shroud restriction air actualy speeds up when travelling through a smaller orifice as its compression ratio changes concentratiing colder air onto the DSH if the shroud was removed the air flow would be slower thus cooler leaving the rear of the condenser, also i wouldnt want to loose any of the DSH it acts partialy as a pre condenser but everyone to there own methods i do what works for me.

And for the temps cooling a qaud using a small r134a compressor i,d say the proof is in the pudding.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boshuter

BTW, what is the length of that case? It's either very long, or thats a tiny compressor, I've never seen so much room in a normal sized SS case, that has to make it very easy to work in.

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Its exactly the same size as a PC case
i did post the dimensions on page 1 of this thread :up:

i think its just a tiny compressor... was it 8" tall? or 10" tall? either way quite compact. my guess is 10" widex 20" long(or 22)x 10" tall... how close am i mate?

case is 10 high 8 wide 20 long
one of the reasons is they will take most types of commpressor,s saving need to have different sized cases built

yup. the compressor your using is so small, it looks like a very inefficient case but that is a very normal sized case...

regards

Are you saying the air is cooler coming out with the fan in front?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by A/\/\/\C

Not how it turned out in tests the air is not as cold through the condenser when its pulling
why do you suppose all air cpu coolers push air onto the cpu heatsink and not pull it away ?
and belive it or not the DSH stays nice and cool of the airflow and condenser doesn,t get warm at all but it definatly achieves more than a cool enough temprature for refigerant to condense and beacause there is a fan at the rear of the case pulling it gives nice airflow through the case and cools the compressor but as i say ive tried it the other way around when this was the final design and i found it worked better on pushing instead of pulling IMO for some its personel preference
but out of interest someone try it both ways stick a temp probe on the condenser and tell me whats coldest pushing or pulling :)

And regarding the shroud restriction air actualy speeds up when travelling through a smaller orifice as its compression ratio changes concentratiing colder air onto the DSH if the shroud was removed the air flow would be slower thus cooler leaving the rear of the condenser, also i wouldnt want to loose any of the DSH it acts partialy as a pre condenser but everyone to there own methods i do what works for me.

And for the temps cooling a qaud using a small r134a compressor i,d say the proof is in the pudding.




Its exactly the same size as a PC case
i did post the dimensions on page 1 of this thread :up:

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Just try it then come back to us:yepp:

Putting it in front will pull MORE air through condenser, and also a lot more CFM's over your nice dsh and your compressor. If your pushing through, the air flow will not be as strong through the condenser, then you kinda wasted a lot of $ on copper int he dsh.

just try it and tell us temp difference at load/ discharge pressures

regards

if you READ i did try it and in this particular setup this works best the fans are set on a controller and are slow and quite take it from me ive tried it both way and on THIS setup it is best as it is.

On my autocascade with commercial condenser and compressor the fan has the capacity to pull and is set to "PULL" and cools the compressor as well sheesh ive "tested" it and it works better for this particular setup and dont see a problem
Normally i would set it up to pull but as the line above states the fans spin quite

Quote:

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Originally Posted by [XC] 2long4u

Are you saying the air is cooler coming out with the fan in front?

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and yes any fan is cooler when pushing the ONLY reason airconditiong setups have a pull fan is to cool the compressor as well other wise the air would be warm off a very hot uncooled compressor and it would pass through the condenser warm blowing outwards but on a whole do you think every CPU fan manufacture sets the fans to blow onto the heatsink because it is worse ?
the answer is NO if a system needs the air to pass the compressor with great force then a pull setup is needed and used and i know that in the case of this particular setup it isnt thats why it has 2 fans front and rear unlike most SS setups........

A fan sucking air doesn,t fully cool the air until it hits the fan when air hits a fan blade it becomes compressed this compression of air cools the air greater leaving the fan than entering the fan, on a hot day do you stand behind a fan in its Airflow to get cool ?? or do you stand in the way of the compressed air coming out of the fan blade to get cool ?? ask yourself that very question i think most people stand in front of a fan to catch the compressed cooled air! with greater air force, as i say and i will repeat it the only reason commercial setup,s have a pull fan is to use that very cool compressed air to cool the compressor
as the condenser itself doesn,t need to be massivly cooled as the refrigerant will still condense unless it is a low stage refrigerant
So because the fans in this unit are extremely slow it needs to be air pushed on the condenser and compressor cooled because of the 2 fans airflow through the case.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by teyber

Just try it then come back to us:yepp:

Putting it in front will pull MORE air through condenser, and also a lot more CFM's over your nice dsh and your compressor. If your pushing through, the air flow will not be as strong through the condenser, then you kinda wasted a lot of $ on copper int he dsh.

just try it and tell us temp difference at load/ discharge pressures

regards

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I think you are wasting your breath tyber ;) He has a right to put the fan on the wrong side of the condenser if he wants. :shrug:

If it works, it works. This is his build and I for one don't really care where he puts his fan. He made a very nice unit and it cools his quad, so what difference does it make. Dont fix it if it isnt broken.

$0.02

Quote:

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Originally Posted by boshuter

I think you are wasting your breath tyber ;) He has a right to put the fan on the wrong side of the condenser if he wants. :shrug:

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LOL its only on the wrong side if i needed it to directly cool the compressor but as i stated any fan is colder when pushing, Boshuter stick your hand behind a fan then stick it in front, THEN tell me which is colder ? if you say its colder behind i will :rofl:

As i said refigeration units only pull air because the compressed fan air helps cool the compressor this is a two fan setup the rear fan is pulling the heat from the compressor the front fan is applying cold air on a push basis to the condenser and DSH it would only be the wrong side if i wanted the front fan to cool the compressor direct however i dont i want airflow from case throughput to do that
Anyway dont forget to stick your hand in front of a fan then behind and let me know whats colder, and yes i have got a right to put the fan whatever way gives be the best results and this way in this setup did so i dont look at it as being the WRONG way around.

Its clearly down to personel preference how things are done you have your ways i have mine :)

Also as stated above on my autocascade the fan is pulling "the correct way around as you put it" but thats because the fan has the capacity to do so, and only has one fan and it cools the compressor directly anyway seems an awfull waste a whole page topic on what way a fan should be when it works it works its relay that simple.

and teybers not wasting his time he was commenting but the fan isnt the wrong way around in THIS PARTICULAR CASE as it works BETTER

In an ideal setup a compressor would be in a seperate case cooled by its own fan and pushing air through a condenser would be cooler than pulling it you seem to miss the point that a fan on a condenser only pulls air because the colder air exiting the rear is used to cool a compressor,
and thats on a one fan setup

As i said thats why every CPU cooler manufacturer on the planet blows air at the heatsink because they have all got it wrong, they spend thousands designing heatpipe and copper coolers only to put the fans the wrong way round :rofl:

But please do stick your hand in front of a fan then tell me its colder at the rear of the fan.

Quote:

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A fan sucking air doesn,t fully cool the air until it hits the fan when air hits a fan blade it becomes compressed this compression of air cools the air greater leaving the fan than entering the fan

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Fans don't cool air - honest to god i couldn't find a smiley to go with this, it's awesome beyond words he he

Moving air feels colder because forced convection heat transfer rises the faster the fluid you're transfering into is moving. It probably feels colder on the exhaust of the fan because the air is impacting your hand instead of being drawn around it.

Fans move air by creating a pressure drop between the front and the back. Fans are usually used to pull air but for this i don't see it making much difference.

And anyway, if you compressed air its temperature should rise. This is why super/turbo charged cars have intercoolers after the compressor, it is to cool the hot discharge gas to increase the density before it goes into the engine.

Tom

actualy super turbo charged cars only have intercoolers because the turbine is propelled by exhaust gases that are extremely hot omg i cant belive you dont know exactly why a turbine on a car is intercooled ,its also cooled as there is more oxygen in cold air than warm air.

BUT SEEN AS THE EXHAUST is a few hundred degrees and the turbine is atached directly to the exhaust manifold then it gets extremly hot needing an intercooler thats why they cool it not because it becomes superheated by compression like your saying because it simply does not it will rise a little but not the way your explaining it, as if it needs an intercooler because of compresson from the turbine Lmao.

they use water sprays inline the turbo compression tube to cool as well but only because of the exhaust heating the air as it passes the aluminium side of the turbo heated by the cast iron side atached directly to manifold downpipe i happen to own a turbo vehicle atm and have fitted and moded quite a few in the past check earlier in the thread you will see the vehicle pit i happen to work on cars dont insult my inteligence on why a turbo is intercooled, your saying it as if it needs an intercooler because it becomes a few hundred degrees leaving the turbo by mere compression alone, somehow i think not !!!!

where did i say fans cooled air ? i missed that or missworded it but the air blown onto something cools it same as it does if its drawn through
but il say this again WHY DO CPU MANUFACTURES PUT FANS ON COOLER BLOWING AND NOT PULLING ??????? cant anyone answer that maybe you can soddemFX with your skills on heat convection and temprature transfer

@ soddemFX It probably feels colder when its blowing on your hand instead of being drawn around it, you said ??? So your the kind of guy that stands behind a fan on a hot day because its cooler at the back of the fan than in front where the airs blowing to Lololololol
Whatever

and compressed air in a cylinder may rise but were not talking in an air cylinder were talking in open air
from a fan the way your describing the whole things is like fans do nothing, so why use them ? ummm

Anyway dont bother to reply i wont be posting anymore about this ppl seem to have different veiws the thread wasnt about airodynimcs but it got threadjacked into an airodynamics thread but the build is finished and it works and its clean and does the job thats what it was about so frankly i dont care what fans do apart from spin and go round and round last post on the matter

I guess this case is closed :D