DDR3 mobos will ship in mid 2007

Hello Guys,


i just got info from supertalent that DDR3 motherboard will start shipping in mid 2007, that DDR3 wont be pin compatible with DDR2.

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/9104/ddr3cpuc9.jpg

Also they already have finished prototypes of DDR3 they are testing the in several mobos now.

All this info will be public tomorrow when ST releases their newsletter, if you want to sign up in supertalents newsletter, check their home page and you have to look at the right side


Update, pic of DDR3 modules:


http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/3807/ddr31cf3.jpg
http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/5953/ddr32cz2.jpg
http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/903/ddr33gs7.jpg

Source: Chilehardware

That is a good news! :woot:

Sweet :woot:

What improvements will DDR3 have over DDR2?

And when will DDR3 become as widespread as DDR2 that it's price point is as low as DDR2 right now?

Oh ya, first post :)

Cool, hope the prices will be decent and/or will have quick cuts in the near future.

I'm excited to see what kind of performance increases we can get!

K, that's very good news. I have a couple of questions, though:

I remember reading that "Bearlake" was supposed to support DDR3 (thanks to metro.cl for the insider info), but AMD had said that the first boards to support DDR3 would be the AM3-type boards. I was under the impression that AM3 would not be shipping until 2008. Does this mean that DDR3 is only going to be available for Intel platforms when it is first released? I guess it's not that suprising...

Also, do we have any information about who's manufacturing chips for the DDR3 DIMM's? Like, can we be expecting Micron D10's or something equally cool? Sorry, but I'm a little new to more advanced DDR topics...

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Originally Posted by thenrz

I'm excited to see what kind of performance increases we can get!

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hey nn_step

hope you can help out with this question.. :)

So Samsung and Winbond were the DDR champions and Micron came out as the DDR2 king. Who will dominate the DDR3 realm, I wonder...

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Originally Posted by erwinz

hey nn_step

hope you can help out with this question.. :)

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it depends entirely on your CPU, Chipset, and the Memory modules.
Bandwidth hungry CPUs will benefit nicely from the extra bandwidth
Latency sensitive CPUs will benefit greatly from the lower Latency
Servers will greatly appreciate the extra capacity and lower power usage.
And some brands perform better than others

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Originally Posted by nn_step

Sweet :woot:

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NN so they changed it after all

the pin compatibility that is

this thread will help me keep my system and not to update to C2D

Damned,this sucks big time....i'm already postponing buying a new pc since last year september...First it was waiting for the 8800 video-cards,then waiting for new ATI R600 cards+pricecut for intel C2D,and now it's waiting for ddr3??At this rate i'll never get a new pc:-(

Yey, the ideal time for Upgrade! ;)

I wonder about the latencies? Cas 6 or 7 at launch of DDR3?

All the reading I've done on the new chipset Intel Motherboards says they will take DDR2 or DDR3; that the pins are compatible. Any comment? Maybe they'll have both sockets, though this doesn't seem likely.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nn_step

it depends entirely on your CPU, Chipset, and the Memory modules.
Bandwidth hungry CPUs will benefit nicely from the extra bandwidth
Latency sensitive CPUs will benefit greatly from the lower Latency
Servers will greatly appreciate the extra capacity and lower power usage.
And some brands perform better than others

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tnxs.. :)

so an E6600 (9x400) with a good mem (ddr2 1100)and maybe 975 chipset is not far off to an E6600 with DDR3 as memmory??

hehehe just speculation.. :) I know its too early to tell :)

tnxs again for the inputs.. :) hope there are many ddr3 module marker.. so that the prices is stable.. :D

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Originally Posted by SaFrOuT

this thread will help me keep my system and not to update to C2D

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bingo, same here.

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Originally Posted by cantankerous

bingo, same here.

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Your just being cantancerous :-)

Is there any verified reports of performance increase?

All I've found is stuff like this, and to be honest it's not world beating.

http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/attachment....1&noupdate=yes

DDR2 at 800mhz with cas 6? That's not hard to beat.

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Originally Posted by falqon

Is there any verified reports of performance increase?

All I've found is stuff like this, and to be honest it's not world beating.

http://www.hkepc.com/bbs/attachment....1&noupdate=yes

DDR2 at 800mhz with cas 6? That's not hard to beat.

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not even close DDR3 is much better thatn DDR2. :woot:

There are going to be boards with both ddr2 and ddr3 you'll just be limited to 2 slots per memory type. Oh and you might also be limited to a via chipset.

We need DDR3 sticks that can match DDR2 clocks first before getting worried about Mobos that support it

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Originally Posted by kemo6600

We need DDR3 sticks that can match DDR2 clocks first before getting worried about Mobos that support it

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Last I checked Micron and Samsung have chips that exceed the performance of any D9 Period

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Originally Posted by nn_step

Last I checked Micron and Samsung have chips that exceed the performance of any D9 Period

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So tell me xxxMHZ with x-x-x-x @ x.xV for 2X1GB kit as a start :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kemo6600

We need DDR3 sticks that can match DDR2 clocks first before getting worried about Mobos that support it

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I don't know why you say this... DDR3 Sticks are expected to start @ DDR3 800 (1600 mhz) so even the very first kits, will beat everything that is out now on DDR2 by far...

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Originally Posted by kemo6600

So tell me xxxMHZ with x-x-x-x @ x.xV for 2X1GB kit as a start :D

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they will probably start @ 1600mhz 7-x-x-x @ 1.5v or something close to that

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Originally Posted by Sesto Sento

I don't know why you say this... DDR3 Sticks are expected to start @ DDR3 800 (1600 mhz) so even the very first kits, will beat everything that is out now on DDR2 by far...

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DDR3 is good but not that good; it's 400MHz (DDR-800) not 800MHz (DDR-1600).
JEDEC specs are DDR800, 1066 and 1333.

Btw, those chips in the modules of the pictures in the first post are rated for 533MHz @ CL8.

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Originally Posted by largon

DDR3 is good but not that good; it's 400MHz (DDR-800) not 800MHz (DDR-1600).
JEDEC specs are DDR800, 1066 and 1333.

Btw, those chips in the modules of the pictures in the first post are rated for 533MHz @ CL8.

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yeah and BH-5 was rated to 166-200mhz @ 2.5-3-3 :fact:
and guess what, they did a heck of alot more than that ;)

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Originally Posted by SaFrOuT

this thread will help me keep my system and not to update to C2D

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Yeah for real I am on the edge and SoOOOOOOOOOOOOOO want to move, just so I can get way better Mark scores.

What's the reasoning behind not making DDR3 and DDR2 pin compatible?

cometh already, for crying out loud!

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Originally Posted by KingThot

What's the reasoning behind not making DDR3 and DDR2 pin compatible?

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more profit :stick:

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Originally Posted by KingThot

What's the reasoning behind not making DDR3 and DDR2 pin compatible?

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There is no point in your question.
Companies want profit they aren't charity organizations they are blood sucking vampires :p:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by KingThot

What's the reasoning behind not making DDR3 and DDR2 pin compatible?

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AMD's IMC is compatible with DDR3 and DDR2, however all Intel chipsets that support DDR2 will not support DDR3. Intel in attempt to prevent confusion for their customers, forced Jedec to accept a different pinout, even though the pins are the same and the difference for voltage is small enough for Bios based correction

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Originally Posted by nn_step

AMD's IMC is compatible with DDR3 and DDR2, however all Intel chipsets that support DDR2 will not support DDR3. Intel in attempt to prevent confusion for their customers, forced Jedec to accept a different pinout, even though the pins are the same and the difference for voltage is small enough for Bios based correction

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that is so sad.. tsk tsk I ont like intel when they do that.. :(

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Originally Posted by nn_step

AMD's IMC is compatible with DDR3 and DDR2, however all Intel chipsets that support DDR2 will not support DDR3. Intel in attempt to prevent confusion for their customers, forced Jedec to accept a different pinout, even though the pins are the same and the difference for voltage is small enough for Bios based correction

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DDR3 MC's may be backward compatible, but the current ddr2 mc's certainly aren't ddr3 compatible - so there won't be any am2 ddr3 boards (which would be possible if what you said was true).

The dimm slots were always going to be different .Although if ddr2 and 3 signalling was so closely related and the ddr3 mc's would be able to work with either ddr2 or 3, I always though they could make the ddr3 dimms pin compatable but slightly longer, so that ddr2 could fit into a ddr3 board, but not the other way around. Alas this was not the case, probably at the behest of the memory manufacturers not intel - as I'm sure they'd like to sell some new ram for these new cpu's and motherboards people will be upgrading to in order to recoup their development costs.

1. Will AM2+ mobos be able to use DDR3?

2. What price can we expect for the first shipment of DDR3 modules to cost?

Any insight here guys?

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Originally Posted by EternityZX9

1. Will AM2+ mobos be able to use DDR3?

2. What price can we expect for the first shipment of DDR3 modules to cost?

Any insight here guys?

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AM2+ is going to support DDR2 and HTT3.0
DDR3 is going to cost a good deal more than DDR2 at first

You never wait to upgrade... Never.... If you want to upgrade, do it..

~Mike

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bloodbanger

Damned,this sucks big time....i'm already postponing buying a new pc since last year september...First it was waiting for the 8800 video-cards,then waiting for new ATI R600 cards+pricecut for intel C2D,and now it's waiting for ddr3??At this rate i'll never get a new pc:-(

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nice. :)

when ddr3 amd mobos ?

8x8 ddr3 ?

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Originally Posted by NapalmV5

when ddr3 amd mobos ?

8x8 ddr3 ?

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amd has no use for DDR3 ATM, ddr2 already is overkill for K8 architecture, sure things will change with K10, but DDR2 doubled bandwidth for K8 cpus, but there is nearly no performance increase when going from 939 to am2 so there has to be enough unused bandwidth to feed 4 cores... (hope so :) )

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Originally Posted by generics_user

amd has no use for DDR3 ATM, ddr2 already is overkill for K8 architecture, sure things will change with K10, but DDR2 doubled bandwidth for K8 cpus, but there is nearly no performance increase when going from 939 to am2 so there has to be enough unused bandwidth to feed 4 cores... (hope so :) )

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it works out like this, a single channel DDR-400 has sufficient bandwidth for a single core AMD.
Dual channel DDR-400 has enough bandwidth for dual core AMD
DDR2-800 is double the bandwidth of DDR-400
Thus Dual channel DDR2-800 should be enough bandwidth for Quad core AMD

DDR2-800 is double than DDR-400.
But only when we're talking about theoretical b/w.

Considering the throughput on Rev.H parts has been seriously bumped I wouldn't be surprised if AMDs QCs would really like any available bandwidth.
In addition, the new IMC configuration on QCs might accelerate the hunger even further; 32bits/clk/core is a stretch.

I'm not buying anymore DDR2 untill I see credible test results of this DDR3 tech.

are we talking mobo's here?cause the pics in the TS are memory?Or aren't there any pics from DDR3 mobo's yet?

im not impressed yet. yeah the frequencies are friggen awesome, but CAS 7? come on guy. thats like putting a diesel into ferrari. sure its fast, but it takes forever to get going :stick:

bt_medic04,
Think about what happens to the length of a clock cycle when frequency climbs.

It gets shorter...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bt_medic04

im not impressed yet. yeah the frequencies are friggen awesome, but CAS 7? come on guy. thats like putting a diesel into ferrari. sure its fast, but it takes forever to get going :stick:

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lets just think about it in terms of latency.
If it takes 8 clock cycles @ 800Mhz
or 4 Clock cycles @ 400Mhz
or 2 Clock cycles @ 200Mhz
or 1 Clock cycles @ 100Mhz
it would take the exact same amount of time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bt_medic04

im not impressed yet. yeah the frequencies are friggen awesome, but CAS 7? come on guy. thats like putting a diesel into ferrari. sure its fast, but it takes forever to get going :stick:

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Actually, Diesel engines put out more power per amount of space then a gasoline engine. So with the same size/weight engine, you could go fast, and get their fast:cool:

yeah but were talking about DDR3 @ 800mhz with cas 7. heck lets even look at DDR3 1000 cas 7. theres DDR2 that does those speeds with lower cas latencies. there will be a slight performance hit until the speeds start to scale. like i said, im not impressed with it yet, however once the speeds start getting ramped up then its not problem (hence why i left out DDR3 1333 since DDR2 cant run that without high timings or lots of voltages)

i have heard there will be a bearlake variant that supports ddr2....it was in an article i read a few days ago...this would be good i think at first as ddr2 is so prevalent now.

The thing you miss here is that DDR2 1000 doesn't equal DDR3 1000. DDR2 1000 is 500MHz base, 1000MHz effective. Based on what nn is saying, DDR3 is 1000 base, 2GHz Effective.

2000/7 is better than 1000/4, right?

ah well thats what i wasnt getting. i was reading it as DDR3 1000 was actually running at 500mhz x 2 and not at an actual 1000mhz :oops:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by bt_medic04

yeah but were talking about DDR3 @ 800mhz with cas 7. heck lets even look at DDR3 1000 cas 7. theres DDR2 that does those speeds with lower cas latencies. there will be a slight performance hit until the speeds start to scale. like i said, im not impressed with it yet, however once the speeds start getting ramped up then its not problem (hence why i left out DDR3 1333 since DDR2 cant run that without high timings or lots of voltages)

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DDR3 800 with cas 7 == 1600 my friend which no DDR2 can do now at any timings

DDR31000 == 2000 whihc no ddr2 can dream about

You can't expect new technology to immediately outpace settled and mature technology. Remember when DDR2 was first coming out and having trouble running above DDR2-533 with decent timings? Look where we are now with D9 modules capable of doing DDR2-1300 with the same timings those old DDR2-533 sticks had (5-5-5-15). Give DDR3 time to mature and let the manufacturers start producing higher quality ICs and we will easily see DDR3 outstrip even the highest binned GKX that's leave the factories now. I don't think we will see the problems that DDR2 had with it offering less performance for a higher price than DDR2, DDR3 should kick the crap out of DDR2 once there is a market for it. Now I can't wait for the day when my memory is running faster than my processor.. *drool*

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Originally Posted by Tulatin

DDR2 1000 is 500MHz base, 1000MHz effective. Based on what nn is saying, DDR3 is 1000 base, 2GHz Effective.

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No, DDR2-1000 = 500MHz = DDR3-1000

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Originally Posted by SaFrOuT

DDR3 800 with cas 7 == 1600 my friend which no DDR2 can do now at any timings

DDR31000 == 2000 whihc no ddr2 can dream about

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Wrong again, DDR3-800 = 400MHz.
DDR3-1000 = 500MHz

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Originally Posted by bt_medic04

i was reading it as DDR3 1000 was actually running at 500mhz x 2 and not at an actual 1000mhz

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You read it right.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by largon

No, DDR2-1000 = 500MHz = DDR3-1000
Wrong again, DDR3-800 = 400MHz.
DDR3-1000 = 500MHzYou read it right.

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oh wait.. thats just like the other two DDR's. People dont seem to understand that DDR means double data rate.. simple..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by largon

No, DDR2-1000 = 500MHz = DDR3-1000
Wrong again, DDR3-800 = 400MHz.
DDR3-1000 = 500MHzYou read it right.

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no DDR2-1000 = 500mhz
while
DDR3 will start @ 1600 which means 800mhz which is much faster than any current ddr2 in the market now

I guess it's difficult for some people to see the frequency advantage of DDR3 because we're is used to DDR2 OC'ed to DDR1000+. The point is these first few specs are the "extreme-low-end" of what DDR3 can do.

DDR1 launched at 100MHz (DDR200), max OCs topped at ~350MHz (DDR700)
= max OC @ 3½ times the launch freq
@ 256Mbits/IC

DDR2 launched at 200MHz (DDR300), max OCs topped at ~700MHz (DDR1400)
= max OC @ 3½ times the launch freq
@ 512Mbits/IC

DDR3 will launch at 400MHz (DDR800)
3½ times the launch freq would be :nuts: 1400MHz (DDR2800):nuts:
@ 1Gbits/IC :slobber:

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Originally Posted by SaFrOuT

no DDR2-1000 = 500mhz

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Isn't that exactly what I posted?

Quote:

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DDR3 will start @ 1600 which means 800mhz which is much faster than any current ddr2 in the market now

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Errr...
No.
Bottom of the barrel DDR3 are rated for 2.5ns' = 400MHz (DDR800).

wonder what the latency is for low level DDR3, it would be cool if it beats DDR2 right out of the gate, though i doubt it will./

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i just got info from supertalent that DDR3 motherboard will start shipping in mid 2007, that DDR3 wont be pin compatible with DDR2.

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this sucks:slapass: :slapass:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Revv23

wonder what the latency is for low level DDR3, it would be cool if it beats DDR2 right out of the gate, though i doubt it will./

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expect a 5-15% advantage in latency

Quote:

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Originally Posted by largon

I guess it's difficult for some people to see the frequency advantage of DDR3 because we're is used to DDR2 OC'ed to DDR1000+. The point is these first few specs are the "extreme-low-end" of what DDR3 can do.

DDR1 launched at 100MHz (DDR200), max OCs topped at ~350MHz (DDR700)
= max OC @ 3½ times the launch freq
@ 256Mbits/IC

DDR2 launched at 200MHz (DDR300), max OCs topped at ~700MHz (DDR1400)
= max OC @ 3½ times the launch freq
@ 512Mbits/IC

DDR3 will launch at 400MHz (DDR800)
3½ times the launch freq would be :nuts: 1400MHz (DDR2800):nuts:
@ 1Gbits/IC :slobber:


Isn't that exactly what I posted? Errr...
No.
Bottom of the barrel DDR3 are rated for 2.5ns' = 400MHz (DDR800).

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What about the prices per GB of base RAM at launch vs. high-end overclockable RAM at maturity?

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Originally Posted by nn_step

expect a 5-15% advantage in latency

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over what? 600mhz DDR2 4-4-4? :p: Thats what im hopiing for. :D

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Originally Posted by Revv23

over what? 600mhz DDR2 4-4-4? :p: Thats what im hopiing for. :D

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DDR2 at the same timings and the same clock speed