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Once Conroe releases... Everyone will have Conroe, I know many many AMD users will be switching to Intel, and everyone will be getting conroe. Everybody is gonna have it... EVERYBODY!!! Its not gonna be Intel vs Amd, its gonna be Conroe vs Conroe... Hmmm, AMD better get something out fast or its gonna get boring quick... :(
I wont be bored when I get mine:nono:
I'm quite sure this belongs in the "Chat" section ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by comrad
Yes, it does. Can a mod move this please?Quote:
Originally Posted by rick_fx
Why does everyone keep saying that AMD is going to be pwned by Conroe?
Have they no understanding of what is going to happen?
Lemmings.... Look, there, it's a cliff... Just one more step... Wheeeeeeeee!Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
uh, because they will, at LEAST, VERY LEAST, until Q1 2007.Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
The ES hype had me believing that AMD were going to be KO'd in round 1. The retail experience so far has me believing that there's still an Intel = heat equation and Intel are going to take a few rounds with performance, but AMD will get up off the canvas and land a few blows. We could be looking at a slugfest here, which is all good for us, the consumers.
Ding ding! Seconds out.
Until amd can pull a dual core to 4ghz on air, and not have to develop dual cpu technologies, I think intel is going to run with round' with the kinds crown.
well there are quite a few people that are sticking with amd
and awaiting the price cuts dont really know why maybe am2 cpu and mobo will be had for cheaper than e6300 plus mobo, I mean its at least $250 for a mobo that does cf and dont think we know about sli boards yet
you should be able to get a kick ass am2 combo for cheap
not that its gonna kick core 2 duo's ass but a great sytem none the less, amd will get a spankin this time around and who knows maybe next time too, but i will not say they're out definitley down though, remember we need competition in order for huge leaps in products with great prices like this
ams just milked ther spot on top with no real preformance increase
Moved it to Computer Related Open Discussion.
Errr... that's exactly why they're saying it, dude. Because they do know what is going to happen. AMD is totally pwnt for at least a year. We're back to the K6-2 vs P3 days. Next up will be Kentsfield, then AMD's 65nm shrink, followed by K8L and then Intel's 45nm shrink and so on and so on...Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
I hope you didn't buy into the 80% faster 2x2, 50% faster RHTT or Brisbane = K8L hype and rumors. You'll be sadly disappointed if you did.
too bad everyone is all expecting retail conroes to perform like ES conroes. yet everytime you hear of retail conroe clocking its much lower than ES chips, and the heat issues seem to be worse.
its a good chip dont get me wrong, its just not where everyone thinks it is. which is good and bad for intel, since everyone will buy up retail conroes, but then they will be pissed when they cant clock them like the ES chips.
Thats only a matter of stepping it seems, not more of a binning higher for ES and reviews. I think the next stepping will probably be better.
You also gotta say its leveling out the playing field. You no longer need an AMD without a cold bug, and ln2 seems to get oyu only 400-500mhz more than phase! :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by n00b 0f l337
i wouldnt count on it. intel has a very hard time getting its fabs to quickly intergrate new tweaks to its production.
intels overclocking in the past has been pretty consistent through each stepping .
I don't buy bull:banana::banana::banana::banana: :fact:Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
But please remember I do know things
:ROTF:Quote:
Originally Posted by lv_dicedealer
As said before to me it looks like it's back to the old K7 and P4 478 days where the P4 was better but the K7 was much cheaper and proved successfull because some of us just simply can't afford anything above the sempron/ celery range. I'm going to sit back and watch these next few weeks before buying and see what the C2D can do and see how low AMD can go :toast:.
Quote:
Originally Posted by melymel2789
Ah yes. those were the days when i got my first rig. axp overclocking was so fun.
What's a typical air OC for a AMD dual core? 2.8-3.1GHz? It's not like you even have to OC Conroe to have a faster CPU. Any Conroe at 2.4-2.6GHz+ will match AMD's best. Anything more is just icing on the cake. I'll be happy if I can get 3.2GHz from a E6400. AMD won't match that for a year.Quote:
Originally Posted by WeStSiDePLaYa
I'm sure you do know lots of things but what could possibly make you think that Conroe won't pwn K8 for the next year? It can't be AMD's roadmaps with nothing but 2x2, low-clocked 65nm Brisbanes and Opteron K8Ls in 2007 and Athlon K8Ls in early 2008. Even if AMD can move dual core K8Ls forward to mid-2007 with their Opteron quad cores, that's still a year away and they will have to clock well over 3GHz to match Conroe and Kentsfield. At best, K8L might match C2D clock for clock. I don't see anything coming from AMD for at least 9 months that could possibly make them competitive with C2D.Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
given nn_step's track record with his knowings, i'm inclined to believe him this time 'round ;)
fred: what makes you say that K8L will "at best might match C2D clock for clock"? do you know anything about it? there is absolutely nothing out there on the actual performance of K8L, so your speculation is just that, blind speculation. unless, of course, you work for AMD. then it might not be so blind... ;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
remember, it used to take a pentium 4 at extreme mhz to match a low clocked AMD chip
who says the same thing can't happen again.
and btw, since its bothering me tonight, please quit saying the words "pwn" and "pwned".... for some reason, i never give the person that says those words much credibility.
Didn't nn_step claim that AM2 would support DDR3 and offer a significant performance boost over S939? IIRC, he also said that Q1-07 Brisbanes would be based on the K8L architecture and that the Intel IDF C2D benchmarks were rigged.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloody_Sorcerer
I don't claim to have any inside info on the real world performance of K8Ls that most likely don't even exist in working silicon form yet, but from the info that's available today concerning what architectural improvements K8L will feature, there is no reason to expect K8L to surpass C2D, except possibly in FP performance. Time will tell. The first shipping K8Ls are only a 9-12 months away...
That's a very simplistic view, dude.Quote:
Originally Posted by ex2cib
Whatever you want to call it, C2D is still a quantum leap ahead of K8.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
i never said it wasn't. im actually planning on getting one sooner or later.
but dont just expect because intel came out with an awesome chip (and i do mean that) that AMD wont be able to do the same thing
Fred_Pohl...if you don't like what nn_step has been saying, don't be a hipocrit and come out and say that K8L won't be something GREAT. We know so little about K8L at this point that unless you have one and benched it, there's little way to judge it.
All we really know at this point is that it'll make AMD more competitive than they are right now.
Damn you, now i have to play it. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by lv_dicedealer
I have been owned for so long with my 2600 +, so i'm numb. Whatever core i buy out there, will cost the half and do minimum the double, so i'm just a happy man.
PS (Rosetta insider)
Mine version is with levithan's jumping instead of lemmings, it's only available for turtles.
Now he jumps weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
I'm not writing AMD off by a long shot. I'm just saying that based on what is presently known about K8L, it doesn't appear to be capable of more than potentially matching C2D on a 'per MHz' basis (with the possible exception of FP). IMO it's quite a stretch to even imagine that K8L could equal C2D's ~25% per MHz advantage over K8, much less your K8 vs P4 performance per MHz analogy.Quote:
Originally Posted by ex2cib
http://www.realworldtech.com/page.cf...WT060206035626Quote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
http://www.realworldtech.com/page.cf...0906143144&p=1
When you finish those, I have more. :D
I'm sorry, but what do those prove? Yeah, they list architectural changes and describe ad nauseum about the new-fangeled guts of K8L....but where does it show us how fast a K8L is? We don't know IPC inprovement, we don't even know clockspeeds....how, based on some list of fairly unprecedented architectural changes, can you determine how it'll perform?
Are those two write-ups even definitive? Absolutely not!
Yes, we can see some of the (potential) changes, but we don't know what they do for us, we don't know what they will cost us, etc. A few months ago, if someone had listed Yonah vs. Conroe in these terms, would we know that it would severely alleviate the CPU bottleneck in multi-GPU configs? Did we know we'd see single-digit SPi times? We weren't even dreaming of it....
K8L is nothing more than a (partial) spec-sheet right now....don't be hipocritical and call out nn_step then just make a counter claim to what he's saying.
Honestly, the proof that the K8L is not anything at this point is because you haven't seen one. It's the simplest proof there is. Not an engineering sample, not one test that even hints at what it might do. Believe me with what AMD knows is about to happen with the advent of Conroe, if they had something to show, they'd have done it, if just to stop a portion of the tide.
Could AMD do better in 9 months or a year (an envelope where they would not necessarily have a sample currently)? Yes. But anything 6 months from now that doesn't have a sample to test is vapor. And with what they know the market is doing right now, there would be leaked tests galore IF they were available. And they aren't.
This lay of the land now doesn't change for at least a year, imo.
$.02
You're right. I forgot to mention the magic performance enhancing pixie dust that AMD has worked into their K8L sSOI formula. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Vapor
If it's too early to speculate about potential K8L performance based on what is known about it, is it not also too early to speculate about K8L performance based on speculation about undisclosed, undocumented, potential K8L core improvements?
When conore comes out many will get conore. Then AMD will come up with a counter attack then many will get AMD. The cycle goes on and on.
.02
It's a good kind of pain Thrilla :p
yes. it is too early to speculate.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
for all you know, K8L might not *need* to match C2D clock for clock. for all you know, K8L could run at 20 ghz. for all you know, K8L will be the best thing since sliced bread.
there is nothing truly known about K8L right now, so stop saying that it'll at best match C2D. for all we know, it'll utterly dominate C2D. for all we know, it may not.
WE KNOW NOTHING!
Not really thier design K8L for the most part has been done for a while and the main design team has moved on to the next main problem and the secondary design team is tweaking it for the retail marketQuote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
Speak for yourself. :slap:Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloody_Sorcerer
There's a lot of info available about K8L. You must be thinking of K10.
So K8L is on schedule for mid-2007 production, as AMD claims? If so, then we do know a lot about what K8L will bring to the table.Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
That is however highly inaccurate. AMD has gone to great pains to:Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
1) Hide the details of K8L
2) Spread false rumors to convince Intel that they have a huge lead
3) Allowed false speculation, inorder to catch the market off guard.
Considering that would be a year of serious losses on the books NN Step, on what basis would they do those things?
ROFL! That's funny!Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
You remind me of another AMD fanboy I've known for 8 years now. Every time AMD is behind, he starts talking about top secret AMD CPUs that are ready to go at a moment's notice. He's been saying the same thing for 8 years and he's never been right even once. :D
By any chance do you subscribe to his theory that 65nm K8L "Conroe Killers" are ready to launch any day but AMD is holding them back until they clear out their existing inventory?
Maybe AMD is cleverly keeping K8L top secret to get their stock price under $15? That will really help them with their acquisition of ATi... :confused:
If you knew anything about AMD's history of product releases you would realise that AMD release next to 0 information on new products not even any leaks as they are much stricter than Intel. I'm not saying it makes business sense in any way or that it is the case, I am simply saying this is standard AMD, we didn't know anything about AM2 performance until 1 week before release!! :toast:
P.S. watch the fanboy comments.
nn_step did say AM2 hasn'tr even began to show its true performence, s7eph3n(sp?) said it to, AM2 is a socket, not a processor, With K8L being able to work in AM2, id say AM2 has alot to show
Dude you call him a fanboy go ook in a mirror. You act like you are payed by intel. For all you know he is right. Mabye not mabye he is. I know one thing for sure EVENTUALLY AMD will beat intel again mabye in 1 month mabye in 2 years nobody knows.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fred_Pohl
Are you serious? Since when doesn't AMD release info about new products? I knew all about AM2's performance several months before it's release. It was all over the WWW for months. The first rumors of K8 appeared in 2000. K8 was even on AMD's roadmap in 2001 and supposed to ship in H2-02! AMD is very quick to release info when they have something good. It's only when they have nothing that they keep silent and the fanboy rumormill starts working overtime hyping things like vapor RHTT, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by melymel2789
http://firingsquad.com/hardware/cpur...1/images/1.jpg
Apparently you also believe in magic pixie dust and top secret AMD cpus that they are just waiting to spring on the unsuspecting evil empire of Intel when the time is right. Whatever, dude...Quote:
Originally Posted by tdunks
I'm still looking for the roadmap that AMD released in 2000 that shows K8 shipping in 2001. However I did find this one showing 1H-02. AMD started hyping K8 (Hammer) to the press in 2000, began releasing architectural details in 2001 and included it on their roadmaps for years before they finally sold one. So much for AMD new product secrecy, eh?
http://www.targetpc.com/hardware/cpu...processors.jpg
And we got how many days notice before Venice replaced Winchestor? :rolleyes:
Several months actually. Same as with X2 and AM2.Quote:
Originally Posted by nn_step
Here are some interesting links concerning AMD's new product secrecy:
http://www.geek.com/news/geeknews/20...0305018973.htm
http://www.tomshardware.com/2002/02/...amd/index.html
http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/V...53~751,00.html
Hey Fred, Do you like double and tripple posting?...Because I don't.:mad:
Am I not allowed to respond to posts directed to me if that means posting more than once before some one else adds their 2 cents?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lead Head
BTW, there is only one 'p' in 'triple'.
you can add more than 1 quote in a reply
i note that the intel section is about twice as busy at this time...
was the AMD section a lot busier 6-12 months ago?