Now it's my Turn (MCP655/Storm Rev.2/Maze4/BIX Single) @ 7/16 Tubing

Well Guys,

Wish me luck.... here is my first WC Loop after many years of customized air cooling.

The Package, Thanks Petra, excellent service I even got a pen :D

http://img358.imageshack.us/img358/4...package9aj.jpg

A closer view of the Black Ice Extreme 120mm Radiator from Petra's. I love the rad it's very nice.. striking nice. I will proceed doing some Scrubbing Bubble cleaning as I did notice was dirty inside with white dust.

http://img290.imageshack.us/img290/7...profile5ov.jpg

Here something that got me a little worried about how hard will this radiator ask for airflow... so far it seems like any 120mm fan will do just fine. See by yourself.. I tried to take a picture where you could see through the rad.

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/9...through4da.jpg

More to come... now time to do some cleanup and put this baby together also need to do some modding... I have to make a 120mm blow hole on top of the case.. I'm planning on putting a fan inside the case on top pulling fresh air from outside.

Well I'm a little bit out of space and decided will do it inside case.. so I'm biting the bullet with the single extreme radiator which have been told will perform same or better than a double BIP ;)

Next time I'll buy a better case for WC.

>>> Update <<<

Breaking news...! Scrubbing Bubbles is 7/16 compatible
:D

I decided to use some tubing pieces to flush the rad with regular water and saw lot of white stuff coming out.. then proceeded to use 7/16 Scrubbing Bubbles until foam come out from one barb to the other one ... LOL I know I'm crazy...
http://img356.imageshack.us/img356/4...hingrad3ql.jpg

LMAO..! Well guys I wish I had a snake camera but the rad looks darn nice clean and shiny inside all copper... no more white dusty dust.. :p

Good... somehow I didn't want to go the vinegar way ... this is not a salad well... my cables right now look like that :eek:

Now this is scary ;)

Words from a nOOb... I can really tell now what restriction is... as I was holding the one side of the hose to push water through from the water tap I could not feel any pressure or resistance while flushing the Maze 4 block but when I flushed the Storm rev2 block I could notice right away a world of difference ... water was leaking all over the sink :D as I was trying to plug all the leaks from my hand and the water tap :D

http://img436.imageshack.us/img436/7...shingm41sn.jpg

Oh Right... I wanted the 120mm Blow Hole on top of the case for the rad and here I have it.

The case is an Antec TX1050B

Dremel time...
http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/2...meltime5mh.jpg

Easier than what I thought
http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/788/blowhole9aw.jpg

Here I know it's not a fancy grill but I found it in a local store for $4 with a filter which it comes handy for dust.

http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/4154/fandone4rp.jpg

And here is the rad finally mounted...
http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/8341/montrad7tg.jpg

looks nice... tell me if the temps are so much better than a nice air cooling... im steel not sure if it's realy worth the extra buck...

cya

get yourself 38mm thick fan for BIX Radiator

You need a strong fan for a BIX to work well. As SDKEVIN suggested, get a 38mm one, preferably a sanyo denki or delta.

Thanks for the tips guys... I'll check results with what I have so far the radiator fan is the one that came with the case it's a 3 speed Antec 120mm fan... I'll place the Yateloon one on the back of the case... obviously need the stronger one at the rad. I just ran over the budget so I have to work with the parts I have... but I'll keep in mind the recommendations ... Thanks

How much scrubbing bubbles was needed to flush the rad? (fraction of a can?)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shpoon

How much scrubbing bubbles was needed to flush the rad? (fraction of a can?)

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Just very little, around 6 inches of tubing.. I filled up the tubing and stopped when I saw foam for about 6 inches long then some water.

nice....looking forward to seeing more pics...:woot: :toast: :clap:

Thanks guys...

Here is where I am.... it got too late as I had to deal with real life responsibilities I worked most of the night getting the loop ready but got very late 3:00 AM :D

I will continue trying to figure out where to place the pump and the Swiftech Micro Reservoir... I should go the T-Line option but it's too late and believe it or not the reservoir it's what's holding me down. The case looks like it has lot of room right now but there will be 2 hard drives and DVD burners on the right side so I'm really trying to figure out how to place the reservoir as it has to be placed on vertical position..

http://img77.imageshack.us/img77/12/...rtubing5lr.jpg

Am I the only guy that still leak tests a complete loop outside the case? :P

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Torin

Am I the only guy that still leak tests a complete loop outside the case? :P

---

Maybe you have the looping skills to figure out the tubing length but for a nOOb like me there is no way I can tell how much tubing I will need until I have the parts in place.. plus you can always cover most of the electronic components with some plastic film and some workshop paper while running the leak test with pure distilled water... also I assume leaks can't be that big if you do it right :D

I leak tested with everything in place but only powering the loop ..computer was off..I used an old psu...this way if there are leaks things can get a little wet but not fired, I hope...I start leak test early in the day....check every hour or so..then after overnight I check again..and I always(HAHA twice) check for 24hrs(only have done 2 loops.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by nealh

I leak tested with everything in place but only powering the loop ..computer was off..I used an old psu...this way if there are leaks things can get a little wet but not fired, I hope...I start leak test early in the day....check every hour or so..then after overnight I check again..and I always(HAHA twice) check for 24hrs(only have done 2 loops.)

---

That's exactly what I had in mind... I won't even use my beautiful PSU. I'm going to grab an old PSU I have in my bone yard (My basement) and let the leaks begin :D

I leak tested my first loop outside of the case. I'm on my second loop now and leak tested inside the case because I added a GPU block and such. I jumpped the main PSU with a paper clip.

As for leaks, you have to be doing something terribly wrong to get leaks with 7/16 tubing on 1/2 fittings. I guess the barbs could leak from where they meet the blocks though. Hasn't happened to me yet and I only hand tightened with no teflon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CRXican

I leak tested my first loop outside of the case. I'm on my second loop now and leak tested inside the case because I added a GPU block and such. I jumpped the main PSU with a paper clip.

As for leaks, you have to be doing something terribly wrong to get leaks with 7/16 tubing on 1/2 fittings. I guess the barbs could leak from where they meet the blocks though. Hasn't happened to me yet and I only hand tightened with no teflon.

---

Acrylic or plexi has always leaked for me without extreme tightening and lots of teflon tape. Delrin and brass never leak though even with just hand tightening and a little tape or o-ring barbs in my experience.

Btw, that poor little 120mm rad is gonna be struggling with a cpu block, gpu block, and D5 pump. Ouch.

Well guys... here is a little update... I wish I had more hours to work on my WC project but I had to be a father and husband until 10:00 PM :p

So here is where I'm at.. hopefully today my loop will meet WATER..! :D


Here is my approach:
Pump --> GPU --> CPU --> Rad --> Res --> Back to Pump

Now I think I got it darn good on the pump location and orientation as you can see the pump will have very little problem with the priming as by gravity the water will go in from the reservoir to the pump intake. Thanks for the tip "Marci" :D

My biggest problem was pump/reservoir location I really spent hours trying to figure the best choice. Also I ended up recycling a piece of metal from the case and using it as a reservoir bracket.

Note: I haven't finished with the connection so you get the idea with the little arrows.
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/7...ingflow0ia.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by EnJoY

Btw, that poor little 120mm rad is gonna be struggling with a cpu block, gpu block, and D5 pump. Ouch.

---

Will see :D what this little BI Extreme little rad can do...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by xXxDieselxXx

Will see :D what this little BI Extreme little rad can do...

---

It'll be good but your gonna need a really really powerful fan.

now I want to mount my pump like that

good thing I have 10 more feet of tubing on the way :)

Looking really nice so far, looking forward to more pics. This should be useful for my WC loop as well which should be ordered soon...

Usama aka Ferrari Freak

Nice heatercore selection, and I'm using the same case -- Dragan ;)

Dual Panaflos at 108CFM x 120mm allowed me to reach idle temps of 18c on a 700MHz overclock, before I replaced them :slobber:

It's an old pic;

http://nonphxn.net/Picture/my_machine/PICT0074.JPG

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CRXican

now I want to mount my pump like that

good thing I have 10 more feet of tubing on the way :)

---

LOL Pumps going belly up now... that's Marci's fault :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by xXxDieselxXx

LOL Pumps going belly up now... that's Marci's fault :D

---

yep, looks cool to and might save some floor space

my sticky pad thing is running out stick from being ripped off and moved around though

it's worth a shot, might end up with an even better looking loop :woot:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pH(x)

Nice heatercore selection, and I'm using the same case -- Dragan ;)

Dual Panaflos at 108CFM x 120mm allowed me to reach idle temps of 18c on a 700MHz overclock, before I replaced them :slobber:

It's an old pic;

http://nonphxn.net/Picture/my machine/PICT0074.JPG

---

Nice..! Can you show us a picture in day light? I would like to see it with more details.. if possible :p:

Yea grab dual fans for that BIX. Push Pull should help a lot I would think. Get 2 Delta's..

Leak test in progress... so far 4 hours of continuous pumping and not a single drop. However I got a little scare situation where I felt the radiator barbs somehow wet... I played a little bit with the O rubber rings or seals and wallah it worked.. but somehow I don't like the feeling of those seals.. it's like if you tight then by hand a little too much they will move out of place....

http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/7677/leaktest41gi.jpg

And here some pictures of my rig during leak test.. :D

BTW the pump feels cool by the touch.. I was expecting somehow warm... also it was a little noisy at first then after all the air was out basically very little noise.. it's close to the sound of a single 80mm fan.. in fact my Laptop next to the box was louder ;)

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/442/leaktest12kd.jpg
http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/4...aktest30if.jpg
http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/2...aktest24xw.jpg
http://img160.imageshack.us/img160/9...aktest54bd.jpg

Tygon, a i right :D ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ReD.SkY

Tygon, a i right :D ?

---

7/16 Masterkleer, great tubing I like the quality ... I wanted the Tygon but money was an issue.... I have no idea of how the Tygon is compared to the Masterkleer but so far very happy.

dang.... why does my brand new masterkleer tubing even look like SH*T ?

no matter what i buy it looks like sh*t

might as well call me pink.sh*t.sky

its probably karmic feedback for something, pinkboi =p

eh, whats so bad about pink, afraid of your feminine side ;) ?? oh, im sorry, i forgot, youre gothic

"if its black, make it blacker"

Just a little Q, Apogee costs a lot less than Storm, but who is really best?

d'pends on what youre doing with it and what you want from your loop.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by creidiki

d'pends on what youre doing with it and what you want from your loop.

---

ok, thanks ^^

Introducing Medusa..! The new RAM sink :D

Well guys what's the point of making your own loop if you can't customize here and there? :p

http://img53.imageshack.us/img53/118...saintro5aw.jpg

Here I ran into this issue. I'm guessing many of us have been there... as you might know there are 2 RAM chips right in front of the barbs for the 7800GT VGU. Well.... with the Maze4 high profile that was not a choice...2 RAM's went down when I placed the tubing and even after I could not fit the bad boys so I had to grab McGiver's Swiss Army knife and do some moding of my own to get enough clearance between the chip and the tubing.

http://img74.imageshack.us/img74/5889/missingram3mr.jpg

Here is how it looks:

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/6...lmedusa5kx.jpg

All done guys..! ToDaY it's "D" day..! Well "W" Day...

I'm running an extra leak test with all the components mounted and today will do some Benchies.. I will post later tonight... I already recorded my temps when I was aircooled with an AC Freezer 7 Pro :D

I tried to sort the cables as much as I could but room was an issue... next time I'll get a bigger case.. even tough this case has a nice size

Pretty excited here... :toast: :banana: :toast:

http://img107.imageshack.us/img107/3...mpleted4ao.jpg

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/1...pleted22ll.jpg :D

That is a great ramsink mod. I bet it cools better now, as well.

woot! temps temps temps! im planning on my first wc project. i want to use a single 120mm rad. cant wait... :toast:

very nice setup, indeed! temps would be interesting. the modded ramsink looks a lot better now:D

Sad Sad News for me guys... :confused:

My PC won't start at all.... there was not a single water drop during the whole process. The PSU is working fine took all the components out and just left the mobo and PSU and CPU connected and nothing...

I have an Asus A8N-SLI Premium, when I power up the PSU I can see a green led going on but that's all I see... I have been reading and seems like it happens very often with the mobo. Weird thing is it was working fine until I started my WC project :(

I tried wiring the PSU and fans and pump go on... so the PSU is fine also readings are good.

Tried resetting the CMOS... took battery out and reset jumper deal and nothing... sounds like new mobo for me :(

To top my bad luck I had to leave for one week camping so I will be eating my brain the whole trip trying to figure out what to do next.

Is there a chance the CPU block is creating a short or something?

I'll keep posting... when I come back.. :eek:

Take a cpu fan (or other small fan with a three pin mount) and hook it up to your "CPU FAN" port on the motherboard and then try it.

have had the same problem months ago with my a8n-sli, the solution SiGfever posted worked fine in my case. go ahead and try

Thanks guys.... I tried that last night and today after Sigfever's tip I tried with another fan just in case and nothing no juice no life :(

Sounds like new mobo for me.... the weird thing is I have this feeling the mobo it's fine... back in that past I was able to get around by just resetting the CMOS taking the battery out and the reset jumper deal... man after so many days of dedication I can't see my baby run :(

How much and what thermal paste did you use? Is there a chance that some conductive paste squeezed out onto the socket?

I LOVE the colour...I'm really going to have to find that stuff form somewhere in Canada :/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SiGfever

How much and what thermal paste did you use? Is there a chance that some conductive paste squeezed out onto the socket?

---

I used for the CPU AS5, and applied just like I have done in the past.. a single BB size drop in the middle.. however it's one possibility I was also thinking you never know.. I will find out sooner or later as If I don't make this work I will have to remove the CPU anyway... :(

I will let you know.. but I will try other approaches before taking everything apart... man.. what a let down I would be Ok if I knew something broke but I have no idea what happened... the sad part is I love to see the loop running even my wife told me it looked cool in the kitchen as anti-stress she also liked the blue color.... :banana:

Sweet setup you got there xXxDieselxXx. It looks really good.

-k0nsl

You will get it my friend. The job you did looks great and you should be very happy with it. If the temps become an issue you could always use a radbox on the back at your 120mm fan opening and install a dual rad and use the existing hole as a blow hole.

Nice loop there, I have the same motherboard and I had the same issue about a month ago except I was getting no signal to my monitor although everything powered up fine. I think it was a blown cap but I sent it away for RMA and all is well now. They replaced the board. I also have a water loop and I thought I would have to drain the whole thing just to remove the mobo but I didnt have to. I just removed the blocks from the mobo and GPU and let them just sort of sit there while I carefully removed the mobo. Saved me alot of time and trouble, the only issue I had was getting teh GPU block back onto my 7900gt when it was time to resurect the rig. I eventually got it though, but why not try RMAing the board? You have said more then once "looks like its time for a new motherboarD" Not sure if you meant buy a new one, or just get it replaced but I would definetely try the RMA route first. There looks to be no physical damage so RMA should go fine. Anyway, good luck! I like the blue color of the water, looks sweet!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Shpoon

I LOVE the colour...I'm really going to have to find that stuff form somewhere in Canada :/

---

Have you tried calling VW dealers? Lemme know, I'm in TO too!

Diesel, you might have knocked off a transistor or something handling the motherboard. Or one of the waterblocks might have bumped against something during install... I've had that happen before. Hope it's all good man, nice work regardless :(

make sure you use clamps, i learned that the hard way when a tube popped off and i had a heart attack...

my mobo, ram, $70 keyboard, and psu were filled with alot of water :(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ReD.SkY

make sure you use clamps, i learned that the hard way when a tube popped off and i had a heart attack...

my mobo, ram, $70 keyboard, and psu were filled with alot of water :(

---

what happened after that? did your stuff survive?

its drying now
will try tonight

I know I'm new and all but I have the same motherboard and had the same type of problem...did a bunch of upgrades to the system including removing my IHS, re-connected everything and turned on the power but no music.

The bottom of my stomach felt like it was falling away. :)

My problem turned out to be very simple. I had forgotten to re-connect the 4 pin power cable to the upper left MB connector. Reading in the manual, it says the bad boy won't fire up without it.

Anyways, just for good measure...check to make sure you have that particular power cable secured well. Without it connected, the computer looks like it powers up properly but in fact it doesn't even POST.

Hope you get it figured out soon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by D0nut

Have you tried calling VW dealers? Lemme know, I'm in TO too!

Diesel, you might have knocked off a transistor or something handling the motherboard. Or one of the waterblocks might have bumped against something during install... I've had that happen before. Hope it's all good man, nice work regardless :(

---

Alright, I'll try to look around. What am I lookng for? G11 is the standard in Germany, no? Not really sure what to ask for.

Edit: Found some, nearby. You can pick it up locally :p (I live in Whitby though :/)

Code:

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PRECISION TUNING MOTORSPORTS
2901 Steeles Ave. West Unit 30
M3J-3A5
Toronto, Ontario

Hours of operation:

Monday - Friday    9:30-7:00
Saturday                10:30-6:00
Sunday                  Closed

Phone: 416.514.0284

---

Red and Blue: http://www.precisiontuning.ca/catalo...p?cPath=43_151

What's the difference other than colour?

Edit #2: And to those out west.

Red: http://www.concept1.ca/fluids.htm
Blue: http://www.concept1.ca/OE%20Cooling.htm

(Scroll down, call to order).

Edit #3:

Quote:

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Hi everyone, Sorry I have not had time to contribute much lately but
the holiday season is upon us and time is at a premium. I found some
good info on the coolant problems. See it below. Also check out our
new Holiday page http://www.newdimensions.com/Holspecl.htm
Well have a nice Thanksgiving ! and I hope to chip in more soon.

Unlike the previous coolant, this newly developed product permits a
cooling system fill that lasts the service life of the engine and
was designed with all-aluminum engines in mind.

Advantages over previous coolant:
Improved corrosion protection
Improve thermal stability
Improved heat transfer/control
Improved hard water tolerance
Improved environmental protection
CAUTION!G 012 A8D A1 must NEVER be mixed with any other coolant.
Engine damage will result !
G 012 A8D A1 is red in color.The mixture of G 012 A8D A1 and other
colored coolants is immediately identifiable by discoloration (brown,
purple etc.). If this mixture is used in an engine, a foamy deposit
will appear in the expansion tank/radiator.This mixture is to be
drained immediately and the cooling system flushed as described
below.

---

That's in use for cars. Think it'd make a difference in WC loops? I much prefer the blue over the red :p Wait, screw the G12, no matter the advantage. Once mixed with water it'd be pink. I'm not in touch with my feminie side enough for a bright pink WC loop! :p

Diesel, I couldn't/didn't search for your last thread, what mix did you use? 10% Pentosin, 90% distilled? And with the Scrubbing Bubbles, you put some in the tube, let sit, then flushed with water I assume? So it's some heavily corrosive stuff?

Quote:

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Q: What about these numerous reports of corrosion?

A: At PDI, the tech generally tops off the car with straight G11.
He claims that this could very well lead to corrosion.
You should never use more than 60% G11 and 40% water. He showed
me Audi service documentation on the subject. Likewise, you
should never have less than 40% G11 in your radiator.
The mixture is what provides the best heat transfer, and too
much or too little really hurts.

---

Interesting what turns up. (The 40%...though I realize it's for cars)

Quote:

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Q: Why did VW develop G12, if there was nothing wrong with G11???

A: VW changed the head gaskets mid-production in 1997, and G11
didn't agree too well with the new head gasket material.
The new head gaskets are all metal. G12 is only in the cars
with the new head gasket.

---

I don't get that, I thought G11 was completely non-corrosive. Reading further it seems the corrosiveness of G11 is debated as heavily as the overclockability of Retail Conroes ;).

Code:

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Shipping to CA : 7 lb(s)          $10.50CAD

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Ouch...donut, I may need to paypal you 7 bucks, and you send me a half bottle :p Or, can I paypal you $15 and you just Canada post it to me? That $10 shipping seems outragous.

I'm gonna measure a 2L bottle in a bit, and see what shiping would be from say...Hamilton...to me.

Hmm, providing you had a box that was 13" x 6" x 6" (roughly what would fit a 2L bottle) and the thing weighed ~2KG (1.5L, give or take a bunch, I rounded up), regular parcel mail from TO to me would cost $9 anyways....I might as well just order it lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ReD.SkY

its drying now
will try tonight

---

so? hows it goin?

clamps a must have...

diesel come back soon, blue is a nice color...

Sorry guys I'm back from a painful camping vacation as I was eating my brain trying to figure out what was going on.. guys thanks for your replies and Yes, I tried everything I took everything out and got down to the motherboard.... so I'm going to order a new mobo as soon as I can. I think I probably killed the mobo by handling without ground protection.. that's the only thing I think of and no leaks were found.

Man .. what a let down... even by pulling all the stuff out my loop looks strong.. no leaks at all .. I was worried about playing with the hoses pulling parts out but no leaks all waiting for a new mobo... I might have to buy a similar mobo Asus A8N SLI Premium or Deluxe if I don't want to redo the loop again.. meaning will have to buy tubing again and some clamps.... I'm scared of getting the same motherboard I was thinking on switching to a LAN Party one but I really don't want to destroy the loop I already have ...

did you try mobo before you WC it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by septim

did you try mobo before you WC it?

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Yes, it was working during aircooling solution for many months :D

However and I'm proud to say not a single drop of water was spotted during leak test and final assembly :p:

shees. thats why i have that anti static gloves. it looks gay but i'll rather be gay than damage my equip.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by xXxDieselxXx

Yes, it was working during aircooling solution for many months :D

However and I'm proud to say not a single drop of water was spotted during leak test and final assembly :p:

---

You have a PM

Dang! I was hoping that it would just be the power cable like when I had the similar problem.

I use a grounded anti-static mat to keep those ESD evils at bay and have never had a prob. It has a cable that runs to the center electric cover screw for grounding and a wrist strap attached to the mat itself.

I hope you get up and running soon!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by InTheFlow

Dang! I was hoping that it would just be the power cable like when I had the similar problem.

I use a grounded anti-static mat to keep those ESD evils at bay and have never had a prob. It has a cable that runs to the center electric cover screw for grounding and a wrist strap attached to the mat itself.

I hope you get up and running soon!

---

hey. when youre using those anti-static straps attached to a metal case. will it be ok if the case isnt grounded? or does it have to be grounded too.

im confused. the instruction said that the psu should be plugged in a wall socket so the case is grounded. :confused:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by rhkenji

hey. when youre using those anti-static straps attached to a metal case. will it be ok if the case isnt grounded? or does it have to be grounded too.

im confused. the instruction said that the psu should be plugged in a wall socket so the case is grounded. :confused:

---

Personally, if all I'm using is an anti-static strap, yes I keep the case plugged in to keep it grounded.

However, with an anti-static mat, this is not necessary provided that some of the metal part of the case is touching the mat.

That's why I went the mat/strap route...pain in the rear to do the 'keep it plugged in' thing. ;)

Wow I've built my rig several times, was too lazy to go out and buy anti-static stuffies, nothing happened to me. All I did was put my case on the kitchen counter and grounded myself by touching the case lol. Everything works perfect. Hope to see good news from your next post Diesel.

Usama aka Ferrari Freak

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ferrari_freak

Wow I've built my rig several times, was too lazy to go out and buy anti-static stuffies, nothing happened to me. All I did was put my case on the kitchen counter and grounded myself by touching the case lol. Everything works perfect. Hope to see good news from your next post Diesel.

Usama aka Ferrari Freak

---

I have always done just the same defeating that rule ;) never thought it will ever happen to me I even used to build 14 PC's per day back in my college days while I was working on the side never ever had problems with that.. I'm still skeptical it was static charge but I can't think of anything else.... other than I have read that mobo has that issue but I'm sure it wouldn't happened if I didn't touch it.. my biggest fear was a leak and never saw that at all... I can be proud I did a heck of the job... but it just looked pretty ... never worked lol. Now I'm stuck trying to convince my wife to allow me to buy a new mobo... she thinks I killed the mobo with water lol. I feel like a little kid asking for permission but that's how we work things out in our relation... we both make decisions based on mutual agreement. :banana: I know I'll get the go in few days ... it always works.. .she knows it's my big hobby plus just came from a camping trip where I had to compromise :woot:

Here you go... sorry for the late reply...

One thing I find weird is when I plug a very old 130W PSU which doesn't have the CPU fan or 4 pin power connector the mobo will boot On. It seems like the mobo won't send the signal to the smart 500W PSU .

Somehow I get green light from the mobo but won't boot at all
http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/9318/greenlightyj9.jpg

Here all connected
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/3615/moboconzc9.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/9898/mobozoomjq3.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by xXxDieselxXx

Here you go... sorry for the late reply...

One thing I find weird is when I plug a very old 130W PSU which doesn't have the CPU fan or 4 pin power connector the mobo will boot On. It seems like the mobo won't send the signal to the smart 500W PSU .

Somehow I get green light from the mobo but won't boot at all
http://img54.imageshack.us/img54/9318/greenlightyj9.jpg

Here all connected
http://img57.imageshack.us/img57/3615/moboconzc9.jpg
http://img332.imageshack.us/img332/9898/mobozoomjq3.jpg

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i had something very similar but what i found out was that my ram was damaged the board didn´t do anything till i removed both rams then the leds counted up (the 4 red ones) and showed that the ram wasn´t installed.

so with damaged or not installed ram you don´t get an boot screen only this dumb leds counting up or this green lan wake up led . maybe you´ll trie it with another ram?

Breaking News..!

It's a miracle..! :toast: Playing with the multimeter I was checking voltages and decided to see if the power switch jumpers were in short.... to my surprise when I turned the multimeter knob to the "Buzz" setting then I proceeded to test to check the 2 jumper pins a little spark along with the buzz when off and wallah..! the CPU fan started to work.... it seems like the Buzz setting emitted a little charge that woke up what i believe it is a relay that send the signal to power On/Off... man I'm excited... I think the static charge probably created a short on the power switch jumpers.... so far I have tried unplugging and plugging back the PSU and it seems to be working now.. Well... time for me to put all together to see if I can boot to windows ;)

Will let you know later... My Multimeter.... fixed my mobo I can't believe this lol :banana:

<<< Update >>>

If I unplug the PSU for some time it will not respond again... I have to actually use the Multimeter to do the same.. lol I feel like using battery jumpers.... if the PSU is not disconnected it will work every time...

Lol, ghost in the machine...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by creidiki

Lol, ghost in the machine...

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Lol No kidding... well as long as I can boot to Windows and do the normal activities I'll be fine with that ... from time to time will have to use the jumper cables... but I can survive until my next upgrade :D

..still.. jumpstarting your mobo, thats just lol :lol2:

try replacing the whole PSU
had one like that, turned ON for a while then OFF itself and dont wanna ON again
after a while(unplugging replugging) it repeats going OFF after booting up to windows...

replaced PSU and it boots up properly...

How long have you had that power supply? They come with a three year warranty.

Quote:

"Antec Quality 3 Year Limited Warranty

Antec, Inc. warrants its new products to be free from defects resulting from faulty manufacture or faulty components under the following terms and conditions:

I. Warranty Length
Antec iLuminate LED light products receive a 1 year warranty. Products sold as "B" stock or Refurbished stock have their own warranty; please click the link above. For all other new Antec products, parts and labor are warranted for three (3) years from the date of purchase. Replacement products will be warranted for the remainder of the warranty period or thirty days, whichever is longer.

II. Who Is Protected
This warranty is enforceable only by the original consumer purchaser. Proof of purchase is required for warranty service.

III. What Is And Is Not Covered
Note that our warranty is not an unconditional guarantee for the length of the 3-year length of the warranty. Antec products are made under our exacting manufacturing standards. But, like any other product, they are not indestructible. Therefore, our warranty does not cover product damage that may result from abuse or mishandling of the products, nor does it cover incidental or consequential damage.

The following are not covered by the warranty:

1. Any product which has been modified without permission from Antec, or on which the serial number or warranty sticker has been defaced, modified, or removed.

2. Normal wear and tear.

3. Damage, deterioration or malfunction resulting from:

* Accident, abuse, misuse, neglect, fire, water, lightning, or other acts of nature, unauthorized product modification or failure to follow instructions included with the product
* Repair or attempted repair by anyone not authorized by Antec, Inc.
* Shipping or transport damage (claims must be made with the carrier)
* Any other cause which does not relate to a product defect.

4. Cartons, cases, batteries, cabinets, tapes, accessories or other consumables used with this product.

5. Antec, Inc. does not warrant that this product will meet your requirements. It is your responsibility to determine the suitability of this product for your purpose.

6. Removal or installation charges.

7. Shipping charges.

8. Any incidental charges.

IV. Exclusion Of Damages
Antec's sole obligation and liability under this warranty is limited to the repair or replacement of a defective product at our option. Antec shall not, in any event, be liable for any incidental or consequential damage, including but not limited to damages resulting from interruption of service and loss of business, or for liability in tort relating to this product or resulting from its use or possession.

V. Limitations Of Implied Warranties
There are no other warranties, expressed or implied, including but not limited to those of merchantability or fitness for a particular purpose. The duration of implied warranties is limited to the warranty length specified in Paragraph I.

VI. Local Law And Your Warranty
This warranty gives you specific legal rights. You may also have other rights granted under local law. These rights may vary.

VII. To Obtain Technical Support.
Please see your product owner’s manual or visit the Online Support section at www.antec.com for details and contact information.

VIII. For Warranty Service.
In the event that warranty repair or replacement is required, Antec will request and you must provide proof of purchase (store receipt or invoice) in order to receive warranty service.

Outside North America and Europe: If your product needs to be returned within the warranty period, please do so through the retailer or distributor from whom you purchased the product.

In North America: Within the first 60 days after purchase, please return your product (or for power supplies installed within our enclosures, just the failed power supply) to your dealer or reseller for a replacement. If the product is still within warranty and you can no longer return it to your dealer, please contact Antec Customer Support (see above) for assistance and instructions. Antec will not accept returns without prior approval and an RMA number."

Thanks for all the advices but actually the PSU seems fine.. tested it with my wife's mobo and worked just fine ... somehow the darn mobo won't send the signal. Using the jumper cables will work :D just fine and will only need to be used when the PSU is unplugged so I can turn the PC On and Off any time w/o jumper cables :P as long as I don't unplug the power line.

Well I finished last night putting all back together and I'm ready to test today.. I wanted to test it last night but got too late and knowing how I am I won't go to bed until seeing all working right ;) Plus Middle East crisis is keeping me stuck to the TV :)

What an odd problem...glad you figured it out though! :clap:

Good luck on the testing.

My PC is Alive..!

Working great guys here are the benchies I got so far :D

Keep in mind I migrated from AC Freezer 64 Pro Air solution which served me very well also I'm guessing I could get even better temps if I add an extra rad to the loop ;) Future project :D

One thing for sure "Water Cooling" worth every penny... I can't believe I can just hear my PSU and hard drives :)

The biggest performance hit was the VGU 17C degrees lower on full load

On Air clocked at 2.6 on Water clocked at 2.7
Room Temp was 87F/30C
http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/5...resultsjt3.jpg

Lessons Learned

1- The most important one.. if you have questions ask. If you don't have questions ask anyway or read and read.. I think I saved my skin many times by reading catching some details I thought got it figured out. For instance I forgot to add RAM sinks to the VGU and I already ordered the parts. Petra's was kind enough to reopen the already sealed package and add the part.
2- For blow holes a holesaw seems cleaner and easier than Dremel.
3- The bigger the case the better it is. I have a nice mid size case and I kind struggled getting things connected avoiding touching the tubing.
4- Scrubbing Bubbles works great if you don't want to wait days with the vinegar process.
5- T-Line might be better approach if space is an issue.
6- Always Always use protective anti-static equipment :D
7- 7/16 Tubing for 1/2" barbs works great...you get that sense of security that having tubing very tight leaks will not be a problem. Hot water a must.
8- When tightening the barbs watch for the rubber "O" ring to not get out of place... if it goes out of place you are tightening too hard.. I saw some leaks when I was flushing the loop before leak test. I was worried about defective barbs but once I loosed the barbs a little bit the rubber ring got back to a circle shape and leak stopped. This is very important for those like me that have the submarine syndrome where we want everything very very tight.
9- Save money and flush the loop with water tap by placing one side of the tube on the tap and the other to a drain or sink... make pressure with hand and let the water go and flush for few minutes. You can also have a sense of your loop restrictions. Then grab a jug of distilled water and try to flush it with the pump On and the other side draining out to a sink.. right after that try to empty the loop, connect all together and proceed filling the loop with your favorite fluid.
10- For nOObs like me 12' of Tubing made it right. I had like 2 or 3 feet left. I used part of the tubing to do the Scrubbing Bubble flush.
11- Pump orientation. I like this one very much .. .Thanks Marcy, Best performance is achieved with inlet pointing at the ceiling, and outlet parallel to floor. Avoid running a D4 / D5 or DDC with inlet pointing at the floor and outlet parallel to floor. This will help to prime the pump by gravity.
12- VGU RAM Sinks with few drops of super glue is a must.

Thats pretty good temps for a single rad.

Just an fyi about upgrade, adding a second rad doesent give remotely the same performance boost as upgrading to a bigger rad. For many people it gives none... there are a number of factors which contribute to this, which I wont go into right now, but you might want to keep that in mind for the future.

To give you an idea, when I had my naked FX-53 I loaded @ your idle temps (39c) with 23c ambient, and that was with 2x 45CFM Yates and an X1900XTX in the loop. X1900XTX loaded @ 39c also.

Congrats Diesel! :clap:

What were your ambient temps while testing?

in the event you deside to get new rad get a triple (PA120.3)
this incase you get 2 7800 pci-e cards.
also keep in mind to change PSU to a higher one.

congrats on your pc Coming back to life...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by InTheFlow

Congrats Diesel! :clap:

What were your ambient temps while testing?

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Actually forgot to add that but ambient temp was pretty hot for my area "Michigan" the room temp was 87F/30C so I'm sure will get better temps in few months :D

Also when I got the aircooling temps the room temp was lower below 80F that I remember. So WC solution definitely was a step forward for me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by septim

in the event you deside to get new rad get a triple (PA120.3)
this incase you get 2 7800 pci-e cards.
also keep in mind to change PSU to a higher one.

congrats on your pc Coming back to life...

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I will for sure do that move.. but next time I will buy a bigger case then no doubt I will use a triple Rad. Just wanted to keep my rig very low profile all enclosed this time.

Thanks for the advice.. taking notes here :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by creidiki

Thats pretty good temps for a single rad.

Just an fyi about upgrade, adding a second rad doesent give remotely the same performance boost as upgrading to a bigger rad. For many people it gives none... there are a number of factors which contribute to this, which I wont go into right now, but you might want to keep that in mind for the future.

To give you an idea, when I had my naked FX-53 I loaded @ your idle temps (39c) with 23c ambient, and that was with 2x 45CFM Yates and an X1900XTX in the loop. X1900XTX loaded @ 39c also.

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Interesting thanks for the tip.. you will think having an extra rad and extra fluid will lower some numbers... scratching head :)

extra fluid does nothing for temperatues, just takes a little longer (minutes, unless you add many many gallons) for temps to reach stability.

the problems with extra rads, and the reason why they dont perform as well as bigger, single rads are:

- restriction scales geometrically instead of linearly. with a bigger rad compared to a smaller rad of the same model, the restriction from barbs & tanks is the same, and you only have the added restriction of the extra internal tubing.

so say, a triple will have (made up numbers here) 30cm pressure drop @ 1gpm, double will have 35cm, and triple will have 40cm.

with multiple rads, you'd have have 30cm for one, and 60cm for 2.

the end result is a measurable loss in flow loop-wide, with related loss of efficiency for components.

- on top of that, heat transfer efficiency is directly related to temperature delta, but it doesent scale linearly. with rads one after the other, the 2nd one will be far less effective, even if theyre both breathing cool air from outside the case.

if you put them in different places around the loop, they will both have smaller deltas and lose efficiency.

the 2 together mean that unless youre using TECs, multiple rad's advantages will balance out their disadvantages and you end up with the same temperatures as before.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by creidiki

extra fluid does nothing for temperatues, just takes a little longer (minutes, unless you add many many gallons) for temps to reach stability.

the problems with extra rads, and the reason why they dont perform as well as bigger, single rads are:

- restriction scales geometrically instead of linearly. with a bigger rad compared to a smaller rad of the same model, the restriction from barbs & tanks is the same, and you only have the added restriction of the extra internal tubing.

so say, a triple will have (made up numbers here) 30cm pressure drop @ 1gpm, double will have 35cm, and triple will have 40cm.

with multiple rads, you'd have have 30cm for one, and 60cm for 2.

the end result is a measurable loss in flow loop-wide, with related loss of efficiency for components.

- on top of that, heat transfer efficiency is directly related to temperature delta, but it doesent scale linearly. with rads one after the other, the 2nd one will be far less effective, even if theyre both breathing cool air from outside the case.

if you put them in different places around the loop, they will both have smaller deltas and lose efficiency.

the 2 together mean that unless youre using TECs, multiple rad's advantages will balance out their disadvantages and you end up with the same temperatures as before.

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Awesome explanation.. and makes sense... I see you know your business... so basically I'll stick with what I have until a new uprade ;)

Today I even got better temps... this time at room temp @ 79F we turned the AC ON and it seems to make some difference. Also I'm hoping to get some better temps after the thermal paste (AS5) settle down.

The VGU temp it's what looks sexy 7800GT clocked at 470Mhz/1.10Ghz

Here a screenie in Idle:

http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/8...ayat79frp9.jpg

lolz, try putting your pc in front of the AC, am sure you wont complain about temps. around 5C to 10C diff with AC on.

were you using regular tap water when you cleaned your blocks and radiator?

im all ready for my lcs. all the stuffs that i needed (except the water blocks) are arriving tomorrow. i think i can clean those on regular tap water but still hesitant cuz of corrosion?

regular tap water for stronger pressure getting dirt off
then vinegar bath for 1 or 2 or 3 soaking till vinegar is clean looking
then wash with distilled water

read maxxracerr's stickies pls...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by septim

regular tap water for stronger pressure getting dirt off
then vinegar bath for 1 or 2 or 3 soaking till vinegar is clean looking
then wash with distilled water

read maxxracerr's stickies pls...

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I did exactly the same as Septim indicated except vinegar.. I used Scrubbing Bubbles and I will again every time.... it worked like a charm.. either way will work.. but Yes, tap water was key as you can flush out all the little dirties out without wasting distilled water.... just keep on the side 2 long pieces of tubing one to hook it up to the water tap (I held the tube by hand trying to avoid leaks through
my fingers :D ) then the other tube to drain into the sink.

Then when done flushing everything out.. do a final rinse with distilled water to flush tap water out.. then apply your selected cooling fluid.

BTW: The long pieces of tubing I did not place them 100% on the barbs I semi connected them (half way through the barbs) just for the temporary flush.. that way I could easilly un-hook them up and re-use for the real loop. For 7/16 tubing will be a pain in the neck to disconnect.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by septim

regular tap water for stronger pressure getting dirt off
then vinegar bath for 1 or 2 or 3 soaking till vinegar is clean looking
then wash with distilled water

read maxxracerr's stickies pls...

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I sprayed some scrubbing bubbles in the rad, shook it around like a nutjob, then garden hose'd it. Next I flushed with distilled water, and followed Maxxx's guide as the vinegar didn't come out all clear the first go-around.

unfortunately here i don't have scrubbing bubbles
only have nice strong detergent and lots of vinegar...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thunderstruck!

I sprayed some scrubbing bubbles in the rad, shook it around like a nutjob, then garden hose'd it. Next I flushed with distilled water, and followed Maxxx's guide as the vinegar didn't come out all clear the first go-around.

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I read somewhere that on the back of the can it says "Do not use on brass", is that true?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SiGfever

I read somewhere that on the back of the can it says "Do not use on brass", is that true?

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People use that product to actually clean the bath tubs and all the stuff around including brass devices and they actually look shiny right after. I'm guessing and based in my experience will not hurt if you don't use it in a prolonged period... 5 mins it's more than enough. IMO

I jumped on the wagon and did it.... and loved the results.. I checked the blocks and radiator with a little flashlight and looked very nice and shiny inside.

Again that's just me ;)

And getting better.... this time I rotated the back 120mm fan to actually push air into the case and droppped some more degrees :D

Now the motherboard temp lowered almost 10C I was not happy with the northbridge temp.. I was always in the 30's when aircooling and with WC was hovering around 43C. Now it's back to the 30's also the CPU temps dropped few degrees as well.

BTW: I'm using this little temp monitor app called "Everest" pretty nice.... me like it... you can customize the display of many temp readings and they are very accurate. I compared the temps with other apps.

Room Temp: 87F/30C.
Top picture @ Full Load. Bottom Picture on Idle
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/2410/backfaninde2.jpg

Its still reading off the (uncalibrated) mobo sensor, so its just as accurate. Or not, as the case may be. Just different offsets, is all. Dont trust any of them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by creidiki

Its still reading off the (uncalibrated) mobo sensor, so its just as accurate. Or not, as the case may be. Just different offsets, is all. Dont trust any of them.

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Right I understand those readings perhaps are not even close to reality but one thing it's for sure I used the same monitoring app before and after and saw the temps going down.. just to make sure I kept rotating that fan back and forth to confirm my results and indeed temps looked lower somehow :D