MCR-QP Stackable Radiator Series Released

I hope my preferred vendor gets them in stock before I make a large order.

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Originally Posted by 3Z3VH

Hmmm... interesting... I figured when Gabe posted this that the diagram, not his text, was the correct number...


That diagram stated 18.4mm, while the SLI bridge is 18.0mm, expandable to 30.0mm.

I understand that the alignment may not be perfect, but that isn't as large a problem since I don't feel the "sandwich clips" for the fans are necessary if you use an external solution such as zip ties to hold the sandwich together. It would have been nice to see the "Stack Radiator" designed so the screws can simply pass all the way through the finned portion so you can just pass a screw through the entire rad and fans, and into the other rad.

Edit: Also, Gabe... would it be possible to have a "Serial Stack" radiator made ?

What I mean is... the regular MCR if you look directly at it, has a V-shape between the two barbs... if you simply designed the top of the Stacking radiator so one barb is moved to the center of that V, you could stack these in a serial configuration without worrying about fitting compatibility or clearance, or using special fan shrouds to gain enough spacing.

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Great info, thanks for that! If that post you referenced is correct, then the SLI fittings you linked to would work perfectly. I'd order them right now, but then I would have to take the whole thing apart, install the SLI fittings, then try and re-use the snap rivets. Shoot... if I had enough extra rivets I'd do it for sure. That is definitely a MUCH better solution to joining the rads together than tubing.

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Originally Posted by gabe

2/ with cost of labor being so high, we need to automate the process. It becomes a question of capital investment. We released the stackables following demand from XS members.. so it was a trial, and we made a small quantity to test the market. If the product takes off, then I'd would certainly be inclined to provide precut tubing.

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With all due respect to your business vision Gabe, IMHO, if the product does take off (and I really don't see a reason why it shouldn't... it is a really good idea) providing pre-cut tubing might not be the best option.

As you already provide with those stubby fittings (which do have a cost attached to them), and you've already said that you are not properly tooled to do so (which means, atm is a blank canvas), and considering that tubing is a perishable item, it might be worth looking into making something like the BitsPower D-Plugs.

I'm sure a designs that fits both 25 and 37 mm fan spacing is possible (Koolance does it with the RAM fittings, so does BitsPower with the D-Plugs, using a slightly different solution), it's a permanent fixture (only the O-Rings are perishable, and those are really easy/cheap to source), and a much more elegant solution.

And saves you the headache of researching the automated tube cutting tool and the investment on such contraption.

As I said, just a suggestion. There might be hidden obstacles that I fail to see.

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Originally Posted by MrToad

With all due respect to your business vision Gabe, IMHO, if the product does take off (and I really don't see a reason why it shouldn't... it is a really good idea) providing pre-cut tubing might not be the best option.

As you already provide with those stubby fittings (which do have a cost attached to them), and you've already said that you are not properly tooled to do so (which means, atm is a blank canvas), and considering that tubing is a perishable item, it might be worth looking into making something like the BitsPower D-Plugs.

I'm sure a designs that fits both 25 and 37 mm fan spacing is possible (Koolance does it with the RAM fittings, so does BitsPower with the D-Plugs, using a slightly different solution), it's a permanent fixture (only the O-Rings are perishable, and those are really easy/cheap to source), and a much more elegant solution.

And saves you the headache of researching the automated tube cutting tool and the investment on such contraption.

As I said, just a suggestion. There might be hidden obstacles that I fail to see.

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One of the obstacles is the QC on the rads themselves (as mentioned earlier in this thread) which would mean the fittings might not line up 100% if they were hard mounted as opposed to tubing.

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Originally Posted by zlojack

One of the obstacles is the QC on the rads themselves (as mentioned earlier in this thread) which would mean the fittings might not line up 100% if they were hard mounted as opposed to tubing.

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Hmmm... that's a bummer. I'm used to 1/10 mm tolerances. Sometimes I forget not everything is manufactured to that standard :(

Oh well, nvm

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Originally Posted by MrToad

...
I'm sure a designs that fits both 25 and 37 mm fan spacing is possible (Koolance does it with the RAM fittings, so does BitsPower with the D-Plugs, using a slightly different solution), it's a permanent fixture (only the O-Rings are perishable, and those are really easy/cheap to source), and a much more elegant solution.
...

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The SLI Bridge I posted looks like it would fit for both 25mm, and 37mm...

At its shortest (18.0mm), it barely fits for a 25mm fan (18.4mm spacing), and at its longest (30.0mm), it could theoretically fit a 37mm fan (30.4mm spacing) with only a .4mm washer on one side of the fitting.

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Originally Posted by zlojack

One of the obstacles is the QC on the rads themselves (as mentioned earlier in this thread) which would mean the fittings might not line up 100% if they were hard mounted as opposed to tubing.

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Sounds to me like there is a market for a flexible D-Plug design... If this is even truly an issue, then all it would take on Swiftech's part, is 'binning' their radiators for the "Premium Stack" model... make sure the radiators they sell in that kit meet the tolerances required to square up that connector.

One option would be to have the vendors selling the rad have a drop down box to add a short length of tubing below where they add fittings.

Can anyone suggest some decent 25mm open corner fans. I was planning on some medium Yates but they are closed corner.

Also, DD SLI fitting. Iwas thinking these would work as well. I have ordered a s of them. I will post the results when I get them.

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Originally Posted by 3Z3VH

The SLI Bridge I posted looks like it would fit for both 25mm, and 37mm...

At its shortest (18.0mm), it barely fits for a 25mm fan (18.4mm spacing), and at its longest (30.0mm), it could theoretically fit a 37mm fan (30.4mm spacing) with only a .4mm washer on one side of the fitting.



Sounds to me like there is a market for a flexible D-Plug design... If this is even truly an issue, then all it would take on Swiftech's part, is 'binning' their radiators for the "Premium Stack" model... make sure the radiators they sell in that kit meet the tolerances required to square up that connector.

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The problem with the "Premium Stock" is that it's going to raise costs because you're going to pay more for QC, which sort of defeats the purpose of having two lower-cost rads in a sandwich.

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Originally Posted by Metasheep

One option would be to have the vendors selling the rad have a drop down box to add a short length of tubing below where they add fittings.

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Is it really that hard to cut the tubing to the right length? I suppose I'll find out soon enough, but it seems to me that we're getting awfully nit-picky here. Something as simple as cutting the tubing to the right length and we're asking to be spoon fed!

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Originally Posted by zlojack

Is it really that hard to cut the tubing to the right length? I suppose I'll find out soon enough, but it seems to me that we're getting awfully nit-picky here. Something as simple as cutting the tubing to the right length and we're asking to be spoon fed!

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It's for people who don't already have 1/2"ID tubing. See pneubmatic's post about having to go to Home Depot to get the right size tubing for the barbs.

What place sells the radiator but doesn't also sell 1/2" tubing? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Vapor

What place sells the radiator but doesn't also sell 1/2" tubing? :confused:

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I would say that in addition, what watercooler doesn't keep spare tubing on hand, that is crazy talk.

That's the thing. Order a foot of tubing and you're good!

(That said, I wonder if I have any scraps of 1/2" ID lying around... I might have to take my own advice :D)

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Originally Posted by zlojack

Is it really that hard to cut the tubing to the right length? I suppose I'll find out soon enough, but it seems to me that we're getting awfully nit-picky here. Something as simple as cutting the tubing to the right length and we're asking to be spoon fed!

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zlo....welcome to my nightmare....:rolleyes:;)

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Originally Posted by zlojack

That's the thing. Order a foot of tubing and you're good!

(That said, I wonder if I have any scraps of 1/2" ID lying around... I might have to take my own advice :D)

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That's what I'm saying. Have a message saying that 1/2"id tubing is needed to connect the rads and have a drop down box with a foot of 1/2" tubing the vendor sells. Most stores already have a drop down box to add fittings, this is the same deal. It adds convenience and reduces the number of late night runs to Home Depot.

Im just glad no one is laughing at me anymore about this.
Then again i could care less what others think.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=204399

I didnt come up with the idea but was the first to put up a rough diagram
and google sketch up of it, or a decent sketch up.

Had people from other forums laughing at me for this.

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Originally Posted by sirheck

Im just glad no one is laughing at me anymore about this.
Then again i could care less what others think.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=204399

I didnt come up with the idea but was the first to put up a rough diagram
and google sketch up of it, or a decent sketch up.

Had people from other forums laughing at me for this.

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You certainly won't catch me laughing. It's saved me from having two loops instead of one. Very good idea and solution.

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Originally Posted by sirheck

Im just glad no one is laughing at me anymore about this.
Then again i could care less what others think.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...d.php?t=204399

I didnt come up with the idea but was the first to put up a rough diagram
and google sketch up of it, or a decent sketch up.

Had people from other forums laughing at me for this.

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what exactly do you mean by "this" the clear rad ends or the sandwiching?

I mean i think i was the first or the first in that thread to come up with a good diagram of what everybody was talking about regarding the sli rad concept.

In other words to put a picture of what everyone was trying to explain.
Seemed some didnt really understand.

I understood easy as ive seen it almost 30 years ago.

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Originally Posted by pneubmatic

You certainly won't catch me laughing. It's saved me from having two loops instead of one. Very good idea and solution.

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It wasnt my idea i just put it in pictures to make it easier for people
to understand what we were talking about.

And alot of people kept saying the heat from the first rad would heat the second and it was a waste of time.

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Originally Posted by sirheck

I agree, i had a lot of people telling me it wouldnt work and even run hotter:shakes:

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Okey there are 2 ways to get this working.

Theory, so if im wrong, i welcome a good debate in it.

The first problem is how there all connected with a 25mm or 38mm space in between. Remind you guys of the infamous paralell sli setup?

The problem with this setup will be in people who run high pressure. The reason for this is because if your spacing is wider, you'll bypass the first rad with high pressure.

The 2 ways i mentioned to compensate for this is to make the stacking smaller. Gabes idea and theory was to make a simple dual pass rad into a quadpass rad. Problem is in a normal rad these passes are connected very short. If you put a bridge or a passover your first rad wont get enough flow for it to be effective.

Second way is to lower your flow at the rad. This is why i want to see tests on this setup, to see possibly, your best pump might be a D5 at setting 3 in this setup.

Overall my original estimates is 33% low to 50% high performance gain @ a cost 125% more then a regular MCR320.

If your hoping for the 2x gain like you would in serial, keep dreaming.

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Originally Posted by sirheck

It wasnt my idea i just put it in pictures to make it easier for people
to understand what we were talking about.

And alot of people kept saying the heat from the first rad would heat the second and it was a waste of time.

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Ask any tester what the delta air in and out on a rad is. They will tell you its very small unless you got silenx fans.
So no stacking is a good idea, you just need the perfect paralell or you need a low flow going though gabe's paralell.

Oh F paralell would work in this setup too, but would require 2 stackable rads.

I too cant wait for more test results of this type of set-up.
And yes i cant see 100% gains but 30 to 40% or more would be great and probably will be in the ballpark.

There are many possible set-ups like.
1 a shroud in between the two rads with fans in a push/pull on the outsides of the rads.
2 simple and basic fans in between both rads.
3 Fan>shroud>rad>fan>shroud>fan>rad>shroud>fan:eek:
But that would be WAY thick and probably overkill.
It would be a wild set-up though.

I wonder if #3 could give almost a 100% gain?:shrug:

I would like to see these kinds of test

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Originally Posted by sirheck

I too cant wait for more test results of this type of set-up.
And yes i cant see 100% gains but 30 to 40% or more would be great and probably will be in the ballpark.

There are many possible set-ups like.
1 a shroud in between the two rads with fans in a push/pull on the outsides of the rads.
Would increase your spacing which means you neeed lower flow unless you got a sniper paralell going
2 simple and basic fans in between both rads.
You need fans that dominate in static, otherwise your air in and out on the first rad will be too high for a benifit
3 Fan>shroud>rad>fan>shroud>fan>rad>shroud>fan:eek:
But that would be WAY thick and probably overkill.
It would be a wild set-up though.
Once again your growing your spacing in between
I wonder if #3 could give almost a 100% gain?:shrug:

I would like to see these kinds of test

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Snipe paralell, or F paralell, have each rad get the same flow so you get a perfect 1/2 decrease at each end. You'll get 75-80% effiency off that second rad then.
MY ESTIMATES!! i may be grossly wrong.

Main thing im talking about with the shrouds/spacing is to eliminate the dead spots of a fan
directly against the fins of the rad.

Plus one could experiment with different/mixed rpm fans.

I cant wait to see all the different test/combos users are going to try.

A good test would be with a smoke machine for air flow.

Well i think everyone needs to remember, we got a full on 500lb pure musscle football defense lineman called AMBIENTS.

No matter how many rads you have, this thing called AMBIENTS is something one can never break using a conventional RAD.

A lot of you guys need to ask yourself the question, do you really need this cooling potential?
The close your get to ambients the harder it is for any gains or improvement.