Deneb just around the corner?

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11-08-2008, 09:52 AM
justapost

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazzman

NDA be damned!! Found this on an AMD message board. I know, hearsay, BS, etc, etc. SOURCE

Also he answered

Quote:

You don't believe its 20-30% faster than barcelona. The chip has 30% higher clock, 300% more L3 cache and some IPC improvements over Barcelona.

BTW, Barcelona scales better than Intel Harpertown when you run on all cores.

So his comparison is not clock by clock.
11-08-2008, 10:21 AM
Jazzman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eson

Interesting is that Intel seems to go for flexible core cache(L1) and stricter system cache(L3) while AMD goes for stricter core cache(L1) and flexible system cache(L3).

I wonder if AMD has learned a few things from their years of experience with an integrated memory controller. Also, thinking out loud, I wonder if Nehalem's reported stablity problems relate to their IMC-CPU approach and the "new DDR3 mobo"/"new cpu" learning curve? Not that I have heard this is a showstopper, only a few hiccups. :shrug:
11-08-2008, 10:35 AM
demonkevy666

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nedjo

they are lower than the same clocked Barcelonas!

PROOF ?
11-08-2008, 10:48 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by justapost

Also he answered

So his comparison is not clock by clock.

Actually he is wrong since Shanghai doesn't run at 30% higher clock.. It's 2.7Ghz versus 2.5Ghz,top clocks for Shan. and Barc.Difference is mere 8%.It has been already said,numerous times by AMD officials,that in various server workloads top clock Shanghai will outperform top clock Barcelona by 15-35%,which translates into IPC boost between 6 and 25%.They said on average it will be closer to the later figure(25%).
11-08-2008, 10:50 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by demonkevy666

PROOF ?

You already could have seen the preliminary pricing at 2 sites.
http://news.softpedia.com/news/AMD-0...rs-96862.shtml

Quote:

The new AMD processors have not been officially introduced by the manufacturer, but they are expected to be launched on November 13th, according to industry sources. The chips that got listed at retailers are the Opteron 837X and 838X series, and it seems that they are not cheap at all. The Opteron QC (quad-core) 8384 is listed on two sites, PC Connection and Buy, at $2,509 and $2,240, respectively. The chip is supposed to feature a core speed of 2.7GHz and comes with 75 watts power consumption.

Another new AMD server processor listed is 8385, which has the same core frequency but a faster system bus. PC Connection offers it for $2,509. The site also lists the 8382 (2.6GHz), 8380 (2.5GHz), and 8378 (2.4GHz) CPUs, priced $2,177, $1,768, and $1,360, respectively. The prices will differ for sure from the official AMD pricing. Also listed are chips from the Shanghai Opteron 230X series, namely the 2382 (2.6GHz) and 2380 (2.5GHz), priced at $1,019 and $814 respectively.

For reference ,here's the top Barcelona 8xxx series price today:
Quad-Core
AMD Opteron Model 8360 SE $2,149
11-08-2008, 11:13 AM
m411b

Well lets hope Deneb is no where near those prices!
11-08-2008, 11:19 AM
informal

Yeah these are Shanghai parts.
For desktop i'd expect a 250-300$ range for two models-2.8 and 3Ghz.
11-08-2008, 11:38 AM
Jazzman

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

Yeah these are Shanghai parts.
For desktop i'd expect a 250-300$ range for two models-2.8 and 3Ghz.

Of course, the FX-82 Deneb at 4.4 Ghz will cost a little more.... :D SOURCE
11-08-2008, 11:50 AM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazzman

Of course, the FX-82 Deneb at 4.4 Ghz will cost a little more.... :D SOURCE

That Deneb FX part at 4+Ghz is a pipe dream :).
On the other hand,the upcoming 3Ghz BE version should be able to hit 4Ghz with good air or WC,so that one will be a kicker :D
11-08-2008, 11:51 AM
Titan7171

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazzman

Of course, the FX-82 Deneb at 4.4 Ghz will cost a little more.... :D SOURCE

Interesting..........very interesting.

I feel like alot of people that dont run AMD setups are lurking:p:
11-08-2008, 12:03 PM
Jazzman

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

That Deneb FX part at 4+Ghz is a pipe dream :).
On the other hand,the upcoming 3Ghz BE version should be able to hit 4Ghz with good air or WC,so that one will be a kicker :D

You mean like this:

http://i37.tinypic.com/309rm8m.jpg
11-08-2008, 12:12 PM
justapost

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

Actually he is wrong since Shanghai doesn't run at 30% higher clock.. It's 2.7Ghz versus 2.5Ghz,top clocks for Shan. and Barc.Difference is mere 8%.It has been already said,numerous times by AMD officials,that in various server workloads top clock Shanghai will outperform top clock Barcelona by 15-35%,which translates into IPC boost between 6 and 25%.They said on average it will be closer to the later figure(25%).

Hmm maybe he meant 3GHz vs 2.5GHz.

25% * 3GHz / 2.5GHz = 30% :)
11-08-2008, 12:52 PM
Jazzman

Metal Gates for Deneb FX??

Someone posted on this thread but I can't find it that if the FX line used metal gates in transistor design they could get a significant FX-type boost from phenom architecture. Thereby getting Deneb FXs in the 4+ Ghz range.(Which is my "pipedream".)

Quote:

According to Intel the new technology provides for 30% less switching power, 20% faster switching speed and ten times less current leakage in comparison to previously used materials.

http://i35.tinypic.com/2z3ngrd.jpg
11-08-2008, 12:52 PM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by justapost

Hmm maybe he meant 3GHz vs 2.5GHz.

25% * 3GHz / 2.5GHz = 30% :)

Nope,there will be *no* server parts that will be running at 3Ghz,not until Q2 at least.He is speaking about server parts,i think this was pretty much clear.The highest speed bin for Shanghai will be SE part in February and it will work at 2.8Ghz.

The official was speaking about top clock available Shanghai part(2.7Ghz) versus top clock Barcelona part we have on the market today(2.5Ghz).
11-08-2008, 01:12 PM
Chris_redfield

As a complete noob to the opteron series what is the difference between the 23xx series and the 83xx series that results in such a huge price chasm between the two?

If you type in Opteron and then the CPU numbers into google there are a load of places online already taking pre-orders and the prices are inline with what has been stated above. But no one has listed a decent product specification yet so I was wondering what the differences between the models are other than just clockspeed.
11-08-2008, 01:25 PM
informal

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris_redfield

As a complete noob to the opteron series what is the difference between the 23xx series and the 83xx series that results in such a huge price chasm between the two?

If you type in Opteron and then the CPU numbers into google there are a load of places online already taking pre-orders and the prices are inline with what has been stated above. But no one has listed a decent product specification yet so I was wondering what the differences between the models are other than just clockspeed.

2xxx is two sockets only.
11-08-2008, 01:28 PM
knopflerbruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris_redfield

As a complete noob to the opteron series what is the difference between the 23xx series and the 83xx series that results in such a huge price chasm between the two?

If you type in Opteron and then the CPU numbers into google there are a load of places online already taking pre-orders and the prices are inline with what has been stated above. But no one has listed a decent product specification yet so I was wondering what the differences between the models are other than just clockspeed.

2xxx = 2-way support
8xxx = 8-way support

I can't give a good explanation why 8'way parts are that expensive, but I guess AMD has no competition there or something;)
11-08-2008, 01:49 PM
RiverRicer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jazzman

Someone posted on this thread but I can't find it that if the FX line used metal gates in transistor design they could get a significant FX-type boost from phenom architecture. Thereby getting Deneb FXs in the 4+ Ghz range.(Which is my "pipedream".)

This was my thought, exactly, after hearing the rumors about FX. AMD indicated months ago that the first Denebs will use immersion litho and silicon germanium gates with advanced strain techniques, but chips further down the roadmap may use ultra-low K dialectric interconnects and high-K metal gates........possibly FX?:shrug:

http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/cont..._Press_Q-A.pdf
11-08-2008, 01:56 PM
possessed

Quote:

Originally Posted by informal

On the other hand,the upcoming 3Ghz BE version should be able to hit 4Ghz with good air or WC,so that one will be a kicker :D

I'm happy with a 3G BE cpu (hope they'll exist), and if it hits 3.5 I'll be happy already.:up:
11-08-2008, 02:00 PM
Chris_redfield

Ah right so if you wanted to use one of the four socket F motherboards you would have to use the 8xxx series CPU's.
11-08-2008, 02:02 PM
roofsniper

Quote:

Originally Posted by possessed

I'm happy with a 3G BE cpu (hope they'll exist), and if it hits 3.5 I'll be happy already.:up:

i have a feeling that both the 2.8ghz and the 3.0ghz am2+ cpus are gonna be BEs. if not then that is a huge mistake since these might be the last am2+ quad cores and the first of the new series. amd can't come into this silently they gotta come in with a huge bang and get everyone's attention. which could be why they are not saying anything right now so no one knows what to expect. but we have seen cpuz screens of the cpus and they all have unlocked multipliers.
11-08-2008, 02:39 PM
knopflerbruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris_redfield

Ah right so if you wanted to use one of the four socket F motherboards you would have to use the 8xxx series CPU's.

That's right.:)
11-08-2008, 02:53 PM
GenTarkin

Are these numbers any reason to be concerned? =(
http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...ghai-benchmark

I sure hope the above isnt a real representation of the shanghai otherwise AMD really needs to get their crap together, and I love AMD and Im saddened...lol someone say its not true!
11-08-2008, 03:48 PM
roofsniper

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenTarkin

Are these numbers any reason to be concerned? =(
http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...ghai-benchmark

I sure hope the above isnt a real representation of the shanghai otherwise AMD really needs to get their crap together, and I love AMD and Im saddened...lol someone say its not true!

you can't trust them. besides everyone already knows that barcelona is already doing fine in the server market. they are saying that intel is dominating them there which is not true. i wouldn't believe it at all until i see a credible source. then they go on to say amd is using 8 sticks of ram instead of 4 then going on and saying with 4 the performance would be better. well maybe it would be better but not by much.
11-08-2008, 03:52 PM
charged3800z24

Quote:

Originally Posted by GenTarkin

Are these numbers any reason to be concerned? =(
http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...ghai-benchmark

I sure hope the above isnt a real representation of the shanghai otherwise AMD really needs to get their crap together, and I love AMD and Im saddened...lol someone say its not true!

I am not worried about that report....And not just cause it is the enquire...

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