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07-15-2008, 12:53 AM
CedricFP

Wait, why is it unfair to compare a 1xgpu to a 2xgpu solution (ala 280 / 4870x2)?

What about when dual cores first came out? Were they not compared to (and favoured to) their single core predecessors?
07-15-2008, 01:01 AM
Warboy

Quote:

Originally Posted by CedricFP

Wait, why is it unfair to compare a 1xgpu to a 2xgpu solution (ala 280 / 4870x2)?

What about when dual cores first came out? Were they not compared to (and favoured to) their single core predecessors?

not the same comparison, I gave a better example in my previous post.
07-15-2008, 01:02 AM
Chickenfeed

Quote:

Originally Posted by annihilat0r

Which is the best card, then, can change from person to person but I doubt I'll see another person in the next 150 years claiming GTX 280 is a better buy than R700.

To be fair though if the GTX 280 were droped to lets say... $399, that is $150 less than the projected 4870X 2GB price. Yes the 4870x2 will often be faster but with that much of a gap in price you may be surprised at how many people may opt for the 280 instead ( those who can't afford a $549 gpu, which in reality is alot of people ) Yes performance wise the 4870x2 would be the better buy but the fact remains you NEED that money to take advantage of that better buy.

Unless AMD soon drop 4800 prices the 4870 1GB will only be $40-50 less than a 280 if they drop to $399 ( I'd be surprised though ) I'd predict a drop to 249 for the 512 and 299 for the 1GB would result from a $399 280. At current prices I wouldn't still consider the 4870 512 competitive if the 280 reach that point.

Considering Nvidia now no longer have a more expensive high end solution like they've been accustomed too (88GTX, ULT, 98GX2 etc ), I'd assume the 55nm refresh / X2 counter will surely reclaim that top price point ( at least in profits, remains to be seen on performance )
07-15-2008, 01:03 AM
CedricFP

Quote:

Originally Posted by [cTx]Warboy

I'm not talking about cored Solutions, I gave a better example in my previous post.

I wasn't necessarily referring to your posts ;)
07-15-2008, 01:14 AM
Warboy

Quote:

Originally Posted by CedricFP

I wasn't necessarily referring to your posts ;)

I was just saying, But not important :p:
07-15-2008, 01:53 AM
Solus Corvus

I'm curious about the Hynix memory on these instead of the Qimonda on the 4870. I wonder how they OC. I am cautiously optimistic. :smoke:
07-15-2008, 02:51 AM
tiro_uspsss

Quote:

Originally Posted by [cTx]Warboy

GTX 280 wins in Single-GPU Solutions. Hands down.
HD 4870x2 wins in Single-Card Solution. But is not impressive by my book.

so going by that, ahhh, 'logic' (if u can call it that) k|ngp|ins / fuggers etc 3DM & vantage scores dont impress u - or @ least shouldnt, cause they used multiple cards *&* multiple GPUs on those cards at that!
tsk tsk tsk how un-impressive of them to obtain such high scores using so many cards/gpus!
its just as un-impressive as using a 4870X2 to obtain more fps in a game! oh the shame!

touche on the usefulness - u were more useful checking out Win7 - stick to that!

psssst!: 4870X2 > GTX280 EOD
07-15-2008, 04:04 AM
cegras

Quote:

Originally Posted by [cTx]Warboy

I don't have to defend my choice or justify it. This isn't about that, I got what I preferred nothing more. Obviously you just want to make problems. Saying your not biased is funny with your FTL Edition comments. Your example is horrible too. Because GPUs have cores, aka cylinders. A more accuracy example would be comparing 2 Hydrogen cars to a Indy Car. If you understand that concept good, Then you might see my point. Other then that, It seems everyone has became unreasonable to basic understanding and realism.

The post that worries me the most if tiro_uspsss's, Just because he completely missed the point.

I'll put this in fanboy terms since everyone lost their understanding.

GTX 280 wins in Single-GPU Solutions. Hands down.
HD 4870x2 wins in Single-Card Solution. But is not impressive by my book.

Can you leave this thread already? I hate to engage in ad-hominem, but all you're doing right now is violently defending your early [now regrettable] waste of money on your GTX280.

AMD has already redefined their high end solution as one that uses two chips on one PCB. It takes up two slots, just like the GTX280. No one cares if the GTX280 core is the better one.

At this point in time, for anyone looking to buy a single, two slot video card, the recommendation is the R700.

End of discussion.
07-15-2008, 04:14 AM
Motiv

This sounds like the old AtthlonX2 argument vs 2p4s on a MCM argument.

Doesn't matter how many cores or GPUs are on the PCB. If one beats the other and is the same price, then that is probably the better card.

BTW, is there a 4850x2 coming out?
07-15-2008, 04:20 AM
annihilat0r

Yes, scheduled in September.
07-15-2008, 04:23 AM
Junos

According to rumours Hd4850X2 is coming out in ~midSeptember. No one knows the exact date but around then, I think. What partners/how much cards will be coming out is unknown.
07-15-2008, 04:39 AM
Clairvoyant129

Quote:

Originally Posted by [cTx]Warboy
GTX 280 wins in Single-GPU Solutions. Hands down.
HD 4870x2 wins in Single-Card Solution. But is not impressive by my book.

Yea, it's not impressive, thats why Nvidia decided to drop GTX 280 price by $200 (and it's been out for like 2.5 weeks) and probably more in the future. :rolleyes:

You know what I think is not impressive? A $650-$700 card (oops, $500 now!) that couldn't outperform a $300 card by a wide margin. What was it again? The HD4870 has 80-90% of GTX 280 performance?
07-15-2008, 04:45 AM
Macadamia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Junos

According to rumours Hd4850X2 is coming out in ~midSeptember. Knowone knows the exact date but around then, I think. What partners/how much cards will be coming out is unknown.

If this gets over the 280 with proper drivers. :rofl:
07-15-2008, 04:52 AM
Clairvoyant129

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macadamia

If this gets over the 280 with proper drivers. :rofl:

And it probably will.
07-15-2008, 04:58 AM
BobyTT

And NVIDIA never going to release another driver?
07-15-2008, 04:59 AM
Motiv

Going off the reviews of a 4850 in cf, it will. The question is at what price will they put it!
07-15-2008, 05:01 AM
Warboy

Quote:

Originally Posted by cegras

Can you leave this thread already? I hate to engage in ad-hominem, but all you're doing right now is violently defending your early [now regrettable] waste of money on your GTX280.

AMD has already redefined their high end solution as one that uses two chips on one PCB. It takes up two slots, just like the GTX280. No one cares if the GTX280 core is the better one.

At this point in time, for anyone looking to buy a single, two slot video card, the recommendation is the R700.

End of discussion.

How about you silence your waste of lip, I don't have to leave the thread. I have as much right as you to be here. I've said it before, I'm not here to justify me buying my video card. Because It's my personal choice. I haven't bought anything up saying about what I bought or what I paid for it, So before you make claims against me. I'm also allowed to voice my opinion as long as I stay on topic and go by the forums rules. So you don't like it, Too bad.
07-15-2008, 05:01 AM
Clairvoyant129

Quote:

Originally Posted by Motiv

Going off the reviews of a 4850 in cf, it will. The question is at what price will they put it!

Don't worry, it will be cheaper than a single GTX 280. :ROTF:
07-15-2008, 05:03 AM
Motiv

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clairvoyant129

Don't worry, it will be cheaper than a single GTX 280. :ROTF:

maybe :)

I'm more concerned about the price to the 4870. Could provide AMD with some 'nice' troubles :)
07-15-2008, 05:05 AM
y2kbos

Quote:

Originally Posted by CedricFP

Wait, why is it unfair to compare a 1xgpu to a 2xgpu solution (ala 280 / 4870x2)?

What about when dual cores first came out? Were they not compared to (and favoured to) their single core predecessors?

Micro stuttering is why.

Even if its gone, you will still think you saw or felt something.

Single gpu kinda eleminates that.
07-15-2008, 05:08 AM
Clairvoyant129

Quote:

Originally Posted by y2kbos

Micro stuttering is why.

Even if its gone, you will still think you saw or felt something.

Single gpu kinda eleminates that.

If it's gone, why would you think that you saw something? Are you paranoid?
07-15-2008, 05:14 AM
Macadamia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clairvoyant129

If it's gone, why would you think that you saw something? Are you paranoid?

People who bought (not gonna buy) GTX200s tend to say that.

Then go SLI a few months after. Oh the hypocrisy.
07-15-2008, 05:15 AM
Motiv

Probably the wrong thread or forum even to ask this but it is sort of related :)

I'm hoping to upgrade from my 2900xt in time for CoD5 coming out in November. While the 2900 was a joke for it's price, it hasn't let me down in the CoD series of games (what I play predominatly).

So the question is what would be the better choice between 4870, 4850x2 or the 280gtx.

Each has their own strengths but I would love the 4850x2 if the price is right. what concerns me is not the microstuttering as such but does rendering in CF affect responses times in game (multiplayer remember). I've no doubt all the cards will make a solid 100-125 FPS with a gaming config turning graphics down, so FPS isn't the issue, just response on CF.

So, I suppose will CF affect gameplay resonse times and if so, the 4870 or 280GTX would be better choice come Sept/Oct time?
07-15-2008, 06:04 AM
tiro_uspsss

Quote:

Originally Posted by [cTx]Warboy

and go by the forums rules.

actually u arent - ur trolling.. u keep harping on that the GTX280 > 4870X2, when its the exact opposite, courtesy all the reviews
07-15-2008, 06:40 AM
mascaras

Quote:

Super Mega Analysis :

Benchmark from Various site

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3354&p=4

Anandtech's Benchamrk

Age of Conan 2560x1600 4xAA/16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 44.8
$499 GT280 : 22.7

Crysis 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 39.1
$499 GT280 : 34.3

Oblivion 2560x1600 4xAA 16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 50.3
$499 GT280 : 36.8

Grid 2560x1600 4xAA
$499 4870 X2 : 84.2
$499 GT280 : 40.6

========================================

http://techreport.com/articles.x/15105/3

Techreport's Benchmark

Half life 2 episode 2 2560x1600 4xAA/16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 84.6
$499 GT280 : 65.5

Quake War 2560x1600 4xAA/16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 100.2
$499 GT280 : 74.2 /

Crysis 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 24.8 average /17 min
$499 GT280 : 20.3 average /17 min

Race Driver 4xAA 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 111.9 average / 77.0 min
$499 GT280 : 67.6 average / 56.0 min

========================================

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews....d=588&pageid=1

Driver Heaven's Benchmark

Call of Duty 4 - 2560x1200 4xAA 16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 90 average / 49 min
$499 XFX GT280 XXX : 65 average / 33 min

World in conflict - 2560x1200 4xAA 16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 61 average / 47 min
$499 XFX GT280 XXX : 44 average / 38 min

HL 2 Episode 2 2560x1600 8xAA
$499 4870 X2 : 110 average / 30 min
$499 XFX GT280 XXX : 69 average / 29 min

Minimum FPS

R700 mini fps very impressive.

http://techreport.com/articles.x/15105/3

Crysis 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 24.8 average /17 min
$499 GT280 : 20.3 average /17 min

Race Driver 4xAA 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 111.9 average / 77.0 min
$499 GT280 : 67.6 average / 56.0 min

http://www.driverheaven.net/reviews....d=588&pageid=1

Call of Duty 4 - 2560x1200 4xAA 16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 90 average / 49 min
$499 XFX GT280 XXX : 65 average / 33 min

Call of Duty 4 - 2560x1200 4xAA 16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 61 average / 47 min
$499 XFX GT280 XXX : 44 average / 38 min

HL 2 Episode 2 2560x1600 8xAA
$499 4870 X2 : 110 average / 30 min
$499 XFX GT280 XXX : 69 average / 29 min

Last Gen Multigpu vs latest round multi-gpu

http://techreport.com/articles.x/151...cles.x/15105/3

Techreport's Benchmark

Half life 2 episode 2 2560x1600 4xAA/16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 84.6
$499 GT280 : 65.5
9800GTX SLI : 75.4
9800GX2 : 66.4

Quake War 2560x1600 4xAA/16xAF
$499 4870 X2 : 100.2
$499 GT280 : 74.2
9800GTX SLI : 82.3
9800GX2 : 69.6

Crysis 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 24.8 average /17 min
$499 GT280 : 20.3 average /17 min
9800GTX SLI : 28.1 average /21 min
9800GX2 : 24.7 average /21 min

Race Driver 4xAA 1920x1200
$499 4870 X2 : 111.9 average / 77.0 min
$499 GT280 : 67.6 average / 56.0 min
9800GTX SLI : 88.2 average /48 min
9800GX2 : 85.5 average /72 min

4870X2 vs GTX280 scale

Age of conan : Twice as fast as GTX280
Crysis : equal
Oblivion : 37%
Grid : Twice as fast
HL2 episode 2 : 30% faster
Quake War : 25% faster
COD 4 : 40% faster
World in conflict : 38% faster

Power consumption
Power consumption taken from techpowerup

4870 : 274
GTX280 : 318
4870X2 : 436
GTX280 SLI : 564

Now , IF anyone was buying a powersupply for a GTX280 SLI , they really would need a really good 750W + PSU. A Crosair 750W which comes with 4x 8pin PCIE connector is really good for $110.

Micro stutter

Well according to some result microstuttering problem has been solved but i need to look at more result before i will go with that line.

Overclocking
Driver Heaven used a 670Mhz core clocked GTX280 and it couldn't beat a 4870X2. As for 4870X2 ocing , i still have to see more result.

CF ISSUE Known game

Stalker : amazing Crossfire scaling has been solved in this game : http://www.legitreviews.com/article/745/5/
The Witcher : unknown
World in conflict : solved , look at driver heaven result
Clive Barker's Jericho : unknown

Can member give more list of games that have CF issue.

More update coming as more preview start rolling out.

Source >>> http://forum.beyond3d.com/showpost.p...6&postcount=27

regards

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