Celoron M(dothan)-

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02-15-2006, 01:09 PM
Flash53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uschi M.

Hello all.

I'm new here, too. Sorry for my English, I'm from Germany.

The Celeron-M 360J gets 1.294-1.314 V on my P4GPL-X. sSpec-No. SL8ML.

But I have the problem with fixed Vcore, too. Same as lawrywild. No way to adjust a higher voltage. Tested with 2 brandnew boards, both the same. So my C-M is a poor overclocker and at 150 MHz FSB it hits the wall. And without the chance to give it any more voltage this is very disappointing.

I tested the boards with a P4 Northwood and it gets 1.58-1.60 V instead of 1.5 V default. Quite a bit overvolting. With this CPU I can increase Vcore. But not decrease...
Very weird. Both boards show the same behavior.

Is it possible that ASUS assembled a series of faulty P4GPL-X? Maybe some components are out of tolerance.

Greetings,
Uschi.

Hi Uschi.
I´m from Germany also. Will send you PM.
02-15-2006, 01:20 PM
Spajky

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawrywild

couldn't really find anything much on this, would you care to point me in the right direction?

thanks :)

You need to open/short some those Vid pins on MoBo´s back or on socket from pinhole to pinhole with tiny tiny copper wire taking care not to short something else & not to miss pins! Take much much care!!! This way you trick the MoBo´s onboard voltage regulator chip, that the default Vcore is higher, bios than allows going even higher, do it in small steps!

Celeron-M datasheet-apr2k5
30311004.pdf (search developer.intel.com site)
chapter 3 table 3.1 (p.16)
chapter 4 table 4.7 (p.36)
Vid pins left upper corner
NOTES:
0 = Processor pin connected to VSS. and 1 = Open on processor

hope it helps ... :)
02-16-2006, 05:36 AM
Uschi M.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flash53

Hi Uschi.
I´m from Germany also. Will send you PM.

Do it. You're welcome.

Right, default Vcore for C-M is 1.26 V. But mine is a SL8ML with OVID.

Please look at CPU-World: SL8ML. This sSpec-No does not appear on Intel sSpec Finder sites and there is no RJ- or RH-No. Seems to be just an OEM CPU, produced for IBM.

So my P4GPL-X correctly hits the maximum core voltage of 1.292 V.

I don't want to do any mods with my mobo so far, because adjusting vcore MUST work. I'm looking for a solution and can't believe ASUS 'til I have a proof, that OEM CPUs do not properly work.
02-16-2006, 11:37 AM
lawrywild

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spajky

You need to open/short some those Vid pins on MoBo´s back or on socket from pinhole to pinhole with tiny tiny copper wire taking care not to short something else & not to miss pins! Take much much care!!! This way you trick the MoBo´s onboard voltage regulator chip, that the default Vcore is higher, bios than allows going even higher, do it in small steps!

Celeron-M datasheet-apr2k5
30311004.pdf (search developer.intel.com site)
chapter 3 table 3.1 (p.16)
chapter 4 table 4.7 (p.36)
Vid pins left upper corner
NOTES:
0 = Processor pin connected to VSS. and 1 = Open on processor

hope it helps ... :)

if you mean the 1.55v "uwire" mod, I've already done that, or is this something else, like tricking the motherboard into thinking its a retail proc?
02-16-2006, 12:07 PM
Spajky

Quote:

Originally Posted by lawrywild

if you mean the 1.55v "uwire" mod, I've already done that, or is this something else, like tricking the motherboard into thinking its a retail proc?

If you have done the wire trick on adapters socket, thats it ...
02-16-2006, 12:22 PM
Spajky

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uschi M.

default Vcore for C-M is 1.26 V. But mine is a SL8ML ... Seems to be just an OEM CPU, produced for IBM....I don't want to do any mods with my mobo so far, because adjusting vcore MUST work. I'm looking for a solution and can't believe ASUS 'til I have a proof, that OEM CPUs do not properly work.

your problem is that your CPU is screaming: "I am crippled, I have a pin less than most of my brothers". Probably is missing some Vid pin; you will have to check comparing datasheets, check for that Intels site! It has nothing to do with Asus hardware & do not aspect any further official Bios update ... probably you will have to do same wire trick to achieve higher Vcore as I adviced to lawrywild ...
02-16-2006, 01:29 PM
Uschi M.

OK.
Is that why one P-M is called 479-pin and another 478-pin? Both of them have 478 pins, but something is different or/and missing?

But why can vcore be adjusted on a P4P800-SE and NOT on a P4GPL-X with the SAME CPU?

I'm still looking into a black hole...:confused:
02-16-2006, 02:56 PM
Spajky

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uschi M.

OK.
Is that why one P-M is called 479-pin and another 478-pin? Both of them have 478 pins, but something is different or/and missing?

But why can vcore be adjusted on a P4P800-SE and NOT on a P4GPL-X with the SAME CPU?

probably some connection for some Vid pin on 2nd MoBo different; who knows ...
02-18-2006, 03:55 PM
Johnny Bravo

:D

360 + VCCA mod + TEC = :toast:

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/7240/sub295sl.jpg

The chips still hasn't reached it's limits, had it at 3114.6MHz before it crashed. These speeds are SPi 32M stable too ;) Currently running @ 3.1v on the VCCA, seems the chip is buring in, first run unstable then 2-3 runs later SPi 1M stable, 4-5 runs later SPi32M stable. Look forward to pushing it further :p:
02-18-2006, 04:17 PM
Fixxxer

:woot:

How cold are you running this little 360?
02-19-2006, 02:48 AM
cirthix

HOLY CRAP jhonny bravo, that's insane

bravo :P
02-19-2006, 09:47 AM
ewitte

Just tested clockgen on an HP s7320n and it works great. Its an ultra small SFF pc with normal 200GB hard drive and dvd burner. But it is FSB locked so it never goes over 2345Mhz. At that my SP1m is 37.186 seconds. Not horribly great but ok seeing it gets 55 seconds stock.
02-19-2006, 09:53 AM
ewitte

Here is a PIC

http://s150233688.onlinehome.us/spi1m2.JPG
02-19-2006, 11:05 AM
Spajky

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo

:D
360 + VCCA mod + TEC = :toast:
The chips still hasn't reached it's limits.....runs later SPi32M stable. Look forward to pushing it further :p:

DON'T !!! (we do not need anymore dead heroes!) Isn't 120% OC enough ??? :cool:

your Vcore is more than 30% higher than default, tragedy aproaching every second closer ... at your place, I would stop @ 3G sharp TL stable with lower all voltages & very slowly burning-in it thru time /few weeks!/ from defaults up again with patience & no hurry !!!

C-M 360 = 13W TDP! Thats Intel data; but ... Real (not Intel´s TDP) thermal dissipation is around 35% more at real full load (as for example AMD mesures it!)

With so overvolted & OC-ed your max.real heat dissipation /real full load/ is more than 60W !!! "Thermoelectric migration" is probably slowly killing your CPU right now! Can easily happen, that after a time, you won´t be able to run it neither @ 3GHz totally stable anymore !!! Think about it before is too late !!!

What kind a TEC you have ? (nominal voltage/watt-age) With how much voltage you are running it ?
02-19-2006, 01:52 PM
Pongi

Hey Johnny, what resistor values you using to push 3.1V VCCA? Actually I'm more interested in the 2.5-2.7 range if you know.
02-19-2006, 02:26 PM
BlueWonder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spajky

DON'T !!! (we do not need anymore dead heroes!) Isn't 120% OC enough ??? :cool:

your Vcore is more than 30% higher than default, tragedy aproaching every second closer ... at your place, I would stop @ 3G sharp TL stable with lower all voltages & very slowly burning-in it thru time /few weeks!/ from defaults up again with patience & no hurry !!!

C-M 360 = 13W TDP! Thats Intel data; but ... Real (not Intel´s TDP) thermal dissipation is around 35% more at real full load (as for example AMD mesures it!)

With so overvolted & OC-ed your max.real heat dissipation /real full load/ is more than 60W !!! "Thermoelectric migration" is probably slowly killing your CPU right now! Can easily happen, that after a time, you won´t be able to run it neither @ 3GHz totally stable anymore !!! Think about it before is too late !!!

What kind a TEC you have ? (nominal voltage/watt-age) With how much voltage you are running it ?

Rather dramatic.
I believe in you Johnny.
C'mon push it further... you know you want to. :devil:
02-19-2006, 05:27 PM
Johnny Bravo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spajky

DON'T !!! (we do not need anymore dead heroes!) Isn't 120% OC enough ??? :cool:

:D enough ? I don't think many people round here understand the word "enough" :stick: Just Kidding man :toast:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spajky

your Vcore is more than 30% higher than default, tragedy aproaching every second closer ... at your place, I would stop @ 3G sharp TL stable with lower all voltages & very slowly burning-in it thru time /few weeks!/ from defaults up again with patience & no hurry !!!

Yes this is true, currently I have the voltage back down to 1.43 volts but as I explained earlier in this thread (I think) THe P4GD1 is quite awkward for vcore, undervolting then suddly overvolting at ~1.5volts therefore decided to give the chip a little juice to help it on its way :p:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spajky

C-M 360 = 13W TDP! Thats Intel data; but ... Real (not Intel´s TDP) thermal dissipation is around 35% more at real full load (as for example AMD mesures it!)

With so overvolted & OC-ed your max.real heat dissipation /real full load/ is more than 60W !!! "Thermoelectric migration" is probably slowly killing your CPU right now! Can easily happen, that after a time, you won´t be able to run it neither @ 3GHz totally stable anymore !!! Think about it before is too late !!!

What kind a TEC you have ? (nominal voltage/watt-age) With how much voltage you are running it ?

The TEC I'm using is complete overkill for its application 266W model running at 13.2 volts :eek: so temps under load are usually ~-19oC or so. In these circumstances the effect of thermoelectric migration is signifigantly retarded.

I will also say this, the C-M chip cost me £10 and in fairness I won't be crying if it was to die, it's had a good run so far and I hope to have a little more fun with SuperPI times as soon as I've my P4C800 setup :fact:

However I fuly understand and respect your concerns Spajky as there may be those out there with more expensive chips wanting to do the same thing. Your are right to stress the upper limit of the VCCA mod, that's an easy way to loose a perfectly good chip :slap: We'll let the chip burn in for awhile now and see what it does next :rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pongi

Hey Johnny, what resistor values you using to push 3.1V VCCA? Actually I'm more interested in the 2.5-2.7 range if you know.

Pongi, will a resistance value measured directly from the board as in not the actual value of the resistor but what it appears to be attached suffice? I believe that the onboard resistance is something like 1.2kohm but dont quote me on that, check Georges (Hipro5) post on the subject in the mods section for the adaptor for exact values. I'll get you a number tomorrow nite at the soonest :toast:
02-19-2006, 06:36 PM
Pongi

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo

Pongi, will a resistance value measured directly from the board as in not the actual value of the resistor but what it appears to be attached suffice? I believe that the onboard resistance is something like 1.2kohm but dont quote me on that, check Georges (Hipro5) post on the subject in the mods section for the adaptor for exact values. I'll get you a number tomorrow nite at the soonest :toast:

Thanks, the total resistence across the conjuction would suffice.
02-19-2006, 07:49 PM
Spajky

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo

The TEC I'm using is complete overkill for its application 266W model running at 13.2 volts ....
I will also say this, the C-M chip cost me £10 and in fairness I won't be crying if it was to die ...

huh, TEC does still 200W effectivelly; yeah, its more than enough :p: with waterCooling ; but an excelent chip is shame to waste even if it costed almost nothing :rolleyes:
02-20-2006, 03:40 AM
Johnny Bravo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spajky

huh, TEC does still 200W effectivelly; yeah, its more than enough :p: with waterCooling ; but an excelent chip is shame to waste even if it costed almost nothing :rolleyes:

True, but I dont view it as a waste, I view it as a trailblazer :D
02-20-2006, 03:56 AM
BlueWonder

Quote:

Originally Posted by Johnny Bravo

True, but I dont view it as a waste, I view it as a trailblazer :D

Lol, I have to agree. When you have a chip as cheap as that, you can afford to run it into the ground. It's all in good fun. Try and approach it from an XS perspective.. Would it be xtreme if he didn't?
02-21-2006, 05:11 AM
ewitte

Hmm. I guess I was not at a FSB limit. After laying it on top of my window AC unit I got another 40Mhz or so. No more yet because it looks like the onboard video is tied to FSB. I video artifacts and lock shortly after that. Not bad for an HP SFF. BTW its 915 but this program works slightly better than clockgen.

http://s150233688.onlinehome.us/spi1m3.jpg
02-21-2006, 09:41 AM
caater

ewitte, that's an odd celeron M, with 8x multiplier and capable of 297MHz FSB..
02-21-2006, 11:02 AM
ewitte

Quote:

Originally Posted by caater

ewitte, that's an odd celeron M, with 8x multiplier and capable of 297MHz FSB..

Don't pay too much attention to the numbers. If you look at it in clockgen with the correct chipset/timer it says about 148-149FSB. I can't change the multiplier or voltage :( I'm seriously looking into popping a 745 in there.
02-21-2006, 11:53 AM
Johnny Bravo

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pongi

Thanks, the total resistence across the conjuction would suffice.

For ~2.5volts I measure the onboard resistance to be 720ohms

Have fun :toast:

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