That is a SICK color coordinated setup man, love it. :D
Printable View
That is a SICK color coordinated setup man, love it. :D
My computer...specs in sig
sorry the pics suck
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&d=1152154617
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&d=1152154617
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&d=1152154617
Looks great man :D. Nice case too.
Nick
Great looking computer mate. Super sexy case too, nothing like the appeal of a clean, professional Lian Li to put the cherry on top :)
Thanks, I am enjoying it. They just never seem to be done. Always waiting to put something else in it.
Well, my turn to get show things...!
After some new hardware, some new photos and some "cable management" (the better i could in this case)
http://imagedump.no.sapo.pt/GXS700/DSC00939.jpg
http://imagedump.no.sapo.pt/GXS700/DSC00944.jpg
http://imagedump.no.sapo.pt/GXS700/DSC00962.jpg
http://imagedump.no.sapo.pt/GXS700/DSC00955.jpg
http://imagedump.no.sapo.pt/GXS700/DSC00956.jpg
http://imagedump.no.sapo.pt/GXS700/DSC00998.jpg
AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Venice @ 290HTT*9 - 1.47v
DFI Lanparty UT nF4 Ultra-D
Geil One S DDR400 @ DDR580 - 2.7v
Sapphire X800GTO2 @ X850XT
2X Hitachi 80GB (RAID 0) - Hitachi 160GB IDE
Audigy 2 ZS
NEC 3520A
Floppy
Hardcano 12
2 x 120mm
1 x 80mm
Zalman VF700 & 7000B Al-CU
OCZ GameXstream 700W
That's right adamant. It's just not right to think a mod is ever really finished.
There is always something more you can do!!
WZ
Quote:
Originally Posted by apex32
uh the cartridge for the n64 and the donkey kong n64 bundle
Nice cable management Gak. I plan on doing better with mine when I buy my next psu. I may get the silencer 610 instead of the 1 kilowatt I have listed on my wish list in my sig. Either that or hope that zippy starts shipping the G1 series of psu's to North America.
http://img56.imageshack.us/img56/7972/p70601876vg.jpg
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/8455/p70601881ac.jpg
http://img132.imageshack.us/img132/152/p70601860df.jpg
http://img56.imageshack.us/img56/9677/p70501776ln.jpg
http://img56.imageshack.us/img56/7011/p70501796jj.jpg
http://img56.imageshack.us/img56/9763/p7050114g4up.jpg
http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/7245/p70601987fh.jpg
:cool:
Your Ultra-D is different from mine...
:confused:
My new setup:
conroe E6600
Asus P5W DH Deluxe
Corsair TWIN2X2048-6400C4
PoV Geforce 7950GX2
Tt Tai-Chi
http://www.conman.se/data6.JPG
http://www.conman.se/data2.JPG
http://www.conman.se/data1.JPG
Why is different?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gak
Nevermind.... I was sleppy when i said that... Sorry!Quote:
Originally Posted by cole2109
:slap:
Why do you use the orange slots?
I don't use orange slots!
Are u still sleepy? LOL
Seems so...Quote:
Originally Posted by cole2109
:slapass: :slapass: :slapass: :slapass:
It was intended to be a don't whereas is the do.
Are you getting better results with the yellow slots?
Yellow slots are for BH5!
Didn't know that Geil Ultra were BH5. Always learning.Quote:
Originally Posted by cole2109
As matter of fact i'm going to try the yellow slots... Never know...
Im having strange issues with 9x multi... Worth a try...
Sorry for my mistakes!
:toast:
wait a minute, yellow slots on a ultra-D are for BH5 RAM?
Yes... They are for BH5!
yes, i realiase that too,Quote:
Originally Posted by Gak
his Ultra-D is different from mine too,
take a look at the capacitors in between the RAM slot, (near the ATX power there )
mine one only have 1capacitor, that one got 2capacitors... :rolleyes:
http://img6.picsplace.to/img6/23/oldnew.JPG
Difference between the early and late rev boards. I think ACO might have been first with the change.Quote:
Originally Posted by ahpaul82
Yes i have new bord rev. ADO i think...
had to make a new suitcase mod for pc.....a little higher lower part made this almost perfect
http://www.tweak.dk/newtweak/img/cas..._big_thumb.jpg
http://www.tweak.dk/newtweak/img/cas..._big_thumb.jpg
http://www.tweak.dk/newtweak/img/cas..._big_thumb.jpg
http://www.tweak.dk/newtweak/img/cas..._big_thumb.jpg
http://www.tweak.dk/newtweak/img/cas..._big_thumb.jpg
powered by Coca Cola ducting :woot: :D Nice work!
well proud of being a nerd :)
Beautiful rig man, looks awesome. :D
Great wire management too.
what UV cathodes are those? I have some and they aren't that bright.Quote:
Originally Posted by OV3RCLOCK3R
anyone modded a tt soprano? i have one and im looking for some ideas and inspiration so if u do; please hook a brother up ; i was poring thru this thread earlier today, some very nice looking rigs btw!
What do u want to do?
nothing in particular; im already softcore modding with some uv lights and changing coolers + adding/cutting fans; i just wanna see what other people have going on with their sopranos (its not a very customisable case)Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeBar
NickS - Thanks man. Glad you like it :D
CRXican - Hiper Dual 12" UV cathods :)
havoxz - Post pics of your case so we can help :)
do u feel like doing some more serious modding?Quote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
first of all
ditch the acrylic side panel and use some honeycomb mesh instead
you can totally change it looks by painting the interior black
the exterior would look nice in an orange (metallic maybe) paintjob...
add a set of wheels and two billet handles (the Mnpctech ones are excellent)
make two 120mm holes and you've got yourself a dual rad fixation on the top (for future upgrades)
with an ACryan dual grill for the looks
and a pair of Akasa Amber 120mm fans
and you're good to go...
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...L/tsunami1.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...L/tsunami2.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...L/tsunami3.jpg
here's 2 pics of my old emachines etower533i which houses a 533mhz celeron socket a,96mb of pc100sdram,8gb seagate ide hdd,56kmodem,120 watt powersupply.Found some christmas lights so i decided to screww off the case cover panel and am trying to untangle them so i can proportion them over the system and do some other modding with cardboard.took 1 pic with all lights off and then with the kitchen light on.http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a3...s/Picture7.jpg
http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a3...s/Picture8.jpg
THAT LOOKS AWESOME! wow did u draw that up urself?Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
something like that is definitely an idea! wow; just one thing; putting the double fans at the top :S
1 fan is free to suck air up whilst another will be situated directly above the psu or dvd drive >< :p some nice ideas tho; ill consider it
How on earth would you fit a psu in that case?
yea i measured mine there is only room for one 120mm fan with the dvd drive and psu there is like barely no room left inbetween the 2Quote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
i love the idea of 2 at the top with that double fan grill; very coolQuote:
Originally Posted by whoodiestyle
if you can spare the two top 5,25 bays
you can use a dual rad,
as long as you'll use 3/8'' tubes
in order to be able to make the necessary routing
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...amiracing4.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...amiracing5.jpg
if you don't plan to use more than two hdd's
you could also remove the hdd rack and reserve the space for a pump
while adding the rad and fans on the bottom
and moving your disks in two spare 5,25 bays
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...amiracing6.jpg
ppl please keep in mind that those are just rough sketches
and not some sort of Tsunami modding guide...
Havoxz asked for some ideas and i thought it would be better to present some images ...
I'm pretty sure I've not posted this, my case of 2+years :)
Before:
http://news.equk.co.uk/images/mainpcold.jpg
After:
http://news.equk.co.uk/casemod/images/window2.jpg
Project Log
and uve posted some very very nice ideas and images :DQuote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
how did u draw them up? looks fantastic
edit:
looking at the above picture did u design or intend for the front fan to be intake, the air blows across then is blow up the gfx and blow across over the HDDs and exhausted thru the top?Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
if it were done like that all but the double fans at the top would be intake
would something like that work?
AND equilibrium; nice job u've done, i took a look at ur project log :D
I'm glad you liked it havoxzQuote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
i'm using Sketchup,Illustrator and Photoshop for the sketches...
the orientation of the fans in the previous sketch was not intentedQuote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
i just threw the fans...in the case :p:
i think that the optimal airflow could be achieved with a layout similar to the one below
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...acing7copy.jpg
which project log?Quote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
i don't remember posting something here in XS :confused:
looks very nice ! the illustration of airflowQuote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
as for the project log i was referring to equilbriums :p
Will the bottom rad not be getting hot?Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
Blowing hot air in from the bottom? :confused:
Will that not lead to more hot air in the case rather than cooling things down?
thx :)Quote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
silly me...Quote:
Originally Posted by havoxz
i thought you were talking about the intake-exhaust air volume equilibrium
:eek:
a dual rad does not warm that easily...Quote:
Originally Posted by equilibrium
not even with a D955 on it
(provided you have a decent flow and an adequate pump for your setup)
so the air coming through it will not affect the system temp as much as you think
also, as you probably already know,
the air from the lower level (floor level) is always cooler and by warming it up
you force it to move upwards towards the exhaust fans...
i ve used this particular configuration in more than 15 cases the past few months
(most of them Stacker 830's without the side fan panel)
and the results were excellent despite the Greek summer temps :p:
the only thing you should do, is add two fan filters to the bottom fans because floor-level air intake tends to collect all the underlying dust
and reduces the rad's effectiveness really quick
http://img310.imageshack.us/img310/6...0023do6.th.jpg
http://img433.imageshack.us/img433/6...00271yw.th.jpg
I will post more when I get some good night shots. They don't seem to be turning out very well, along with some pictures of the case with the window on and such..
I like the design of the airflow (without the bottom rad).Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
I just don't see the reasoning for 2 rads in 1 system unless you have 2 seperate watercooling setups in the same case, which would mean 2 pumps, 2 res's etc etc.
Doesn't adding another radiator change the flow of the water aswell, especially with the flow going from the top of the case to the bottom (and then having to go back up to the components).
But maybe I'm not thinking about this correctly :confused:
Be interesting if you could post the 15 cases you've built with this design to see exactly how it's all setup/working etc :)
when i say dual rad i mean 240> 2x120fan single radiatorQuote:
Originally Posted by equilibrium
not dual as in 2 seperate radiators...
i must have gave the wrong impression
please excuse my English ...
i think that now you can see that the airflow configuration illustrated before
involves only 1 radiator
the one placed at the bottom......
as for the prementioned WC cases
i don't keep worklogs for all the mods i do..
nor do i keep logs of temps and settings...
could you imagine doing that for every single customer???
i only take some pics for the most interesting ones...
i hope you'll recognize the configuration we are talking about
in the following cases
(sorry for double posting the same pics within two days but...)
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27.../INTELDEMO.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...rXL/AMDEMO.jpg
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y27...XL/4Cards4.jpg
cool :)Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
Soz I was mis-understanding, I looked at the pictures on the above post with the rad on the top of the case which I really like as it means the hot air from the rad leaves the case instantly. (but I wrongly put the two ideas together)
Cool paint jobs on those cases hehe :)
I still don't get the idea of putting a rad at the bottom of the case when there's room at the top hehe :p: , altho I do see it would be easier in a stacker as there is room from the secondary psu spot. Still means there's hot/warm air going into the case.
lol soft modded my tt saprano 120mm top blow hole and intake on the side first time dremel used on the blowhole and holesaw on the side went a little crazy lol as you can i dont care really just gonna put the rig in my sig in there and give it to my little brother when my conroe rig is done also u can still see the pencil marks i made on the top for where it needs to go
http://img46.imageshack.us/img46/2628/pic00001wu6.jpg
http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/813/pic00002kf7.jpg
Here's mine:
http://www.overclock3d.net/thumb.php?id=1400
http://www.overclock3d.net/thumb.php?id=1413
Still isn't fully finished but I've been busy :stick:
Mebbe more pics later, but for now here's the project log: clickee
A bit dirty now (needs a good scrub up) but here's the etching and the res with UV water :)
http://www.overclock3d.net/thumb.php?id=2134
i have some ideas and stuff...but need something like the mesh on last page drawings....where to buy...perhaps a little tighter/smaller holes...i live en DK, so any hints of where to look for that ?
Modders mesh at MNPCTECH.com
sells 1X1 and 1X2' sheets. It is steel so it has to be primed and painted after you get it how you want it.
the mesh isn't as see thru as proposed ? looks AWESOME in the drawn picture however, looks as tho one can see barely anything thru it (ie neons etc)Quote:
Originally Posted by phelan1777
edit: my bad; i was looking at the ACRYAN website at their mesh; the mnpctech ones are a lot different however; wouldn't the larger holed mesh let more noise come out of the pc?
edit2: just noticed MNPCTECH is american? anyone know mod shops or places i can grab some of this stuff from in australia? (besides bunnings for paint/primer etc)
Thought i'd post up a couple of pics. I got around to tidying cables in my case.
This was with cables a little tidied
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...z/case1hdd.jpg
This was with some cutting and routing
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v3...tandmodded.jpg
Still trying to work out what i can do with the molex and floppy rail that plugs into board.
I'm working on my own case mod here, once it is done I'll post the before and after pics in this thread :cool: It is my first attempt at some serious case modding so don't laugh too hard when it is finished ;)
I'll post my case sometime all of your cases are kick a$$.:slapass:
yo slacker!!
you sell those badboys or what? im looking for a new case... kinda sold on a silverstone Temjin... but your cases look balla!! let me know if you make cases for sale or such.
trip.
damsxx, what case is that? Thats a really nice case. (except the wiring mess).
Looks like a pc 70plus with modded front and side pannels. Am I right???Quote:
Originally Posted by moddolicous
Excellent work on the sketches, would you be willing to share the "modules"?:)Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
With modules I mean the separate drawings/models for drives, rad, PSU, MB, wheels and so on...
I use UG, Pro engineer, CATIA and a few others and would love to have those modules for usage in my upcoming projects. It would not be too hard to convert them, I guess you have made them with proper measurements and so on..?
thanks :)Quote:
Originally Posted by moddolicous
lian li pc-7SE
with modded side panel
http://pc-cooling.de/fr/WATERCOOLING...+Radiator.html
http://pc-cooling.de/fr/WATERCOOLING...adiatoren.html
i'm glad you liked itQuote:
Originally Posted by Clint
Here you can find a variety of sketchup computer related models
If you need something thats not there just pm me
i just might already have it
Ahhhh, very very nice!:clap:Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
I've been looking for that kind of site.
Thank you very much!:D
good guess titanium. Wheres the pics of your case.Quote:
Originally Posted by drtitanium0
Here they are:Quote:
Originally Posted by moddolicous
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/339...lery061zs4.jpg
http://img62.imageshack.us/img62/295...lery057eo9.jpg
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/4...lery041fm8.jpg
http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/7...lery036zd0.jpg
I seriously have to do some wire mangement.
few pics of my case today. got fan in the way of my scweet cable management. oh well. its summer and im clockin!
http://revo21.com/revo+pc_cleanup/im...0806%20003.jpg
-
http://revo21.com/revo+pc_cleanup/im...0806%20006.jpg
-
http://revo21.com/revo+pc_cleanup/im...0806%20015.jpg
-
http://revo21.com/revo+pc_cleanup/im...0806%20017.jpg
Looks great!! ....tho I hate small cases=)
Just got my silencer 750 in. E6400 arrives tuesday, hoping for 3.2 ghz. Specs in sig.
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&d=1155515706
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...1&d=1155515706
deleted
Got my rig finished today! :banana: :banana: :banana: :woot:
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86151.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86150.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86149.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86148.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86147.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86146.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86145.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86144.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86143.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86142.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86141.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86140.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86139.jpg
http://images.people.overclockers.ru/preview/86138.jpg
Thats a nice looking rig ^^ :)
i concur. well done!
My rig, crowded, but gets the job done:
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ffJoens008.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ffJoens007.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ffJoens006.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ffJoens005.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ffJoens009.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...ams1/Joens.jpg
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h1...s1/Biff001.jpg
Yeah, I love the keyboard. Readings for each core :)
-Satan
Those fans are either strategically positioned or you have just lobbed them in there.
GFX, Ram and maybe pwmic
http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/2313/img0517ic0.jpg
One storage PC in chenbro RM414 chassis.
Spec is
Pentium D940
some 2gb ram
4 300gb HDDs plus one 80gb OS hdd.
The right one is my current main rig in Lian-li PC-626 case.
Its spec is in my signature.
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/4602/img0519rq3.jpg
My trusty firewall appliance.
http://img246.imageshack.us/img246/7619/img0520tz0.jpg
And my backup internet connection. I plan to completely change its routers later on. But for now, those will work.
I only have a top pic of my case :)
http://corner.thuvienhoahoc.info/topX.JPG
islash that is a nice looking rig , great job . i was wondering if that case can hold dual psu , i ask cause i see yours is kinda sideways . thanks
heydo6
The PSU simply stands vertical. It isn't possible to but 2 PSUs... maybe only if you remake the case.=)
There is a downside.. Dust, hair and other particles normally build up on the floor. They will be sucked up and will eventually clog the Rad. Which means a weekly/montlhy cleaning will be needed.Quote:
Originally Posted by SlackerXL
Anyways.. when I built up my case I opted for something different. What caught my eye was a VERY old Compaq Proliant 1500 server case. It housed a Pentium 100MHz with 128MB of ECC EDO memory and a total of 20GB of HD space in 5 seperate drives.. so yes.. quite old. It was also beige and disgusting looking.
http://www.ci.ru/inform2_97/p30_pic2.jpg
So I opted to try and turn it into a newish rig. Wasn't easy.. damn case was some oddity.. wasn't following any known specifications (not ATX, AT, baby ATX etc).
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...e/DSC01976.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...e/DSC01982.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...e/DSC01987.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...023_resize.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...022_resize.jpg
ElMoIsEviL
Wow... massive thing. Big work ;)
I think the first 15 or so pages where every single image is broken needs to be deleted or a new case gallery started. ;)
my comp will be up on this in about 30 days.
My baby @ Sask Place quite some time ago, figured I might as well post them, nothing has changed on it since then, it's the comp in my sig. custom phase change and a modified CM stacker.
http://www.seocc.net/Images/pics/show1.JPG
http://www.seocc.net/Images/pics/show2.JPG
http://www.seocc.net/Images/pics/show3.JPG
it's nothing special, but much cuting behind front and from right side :)
all air cooled and not planing to switch on water (maybe air+pelt later).
Its from page 29 but there was a disscustion about the orange vs yellow slots on the DFI Ultra-D.
Yellow slots "can" be fore BH-5 looks like the focus on which slots to use are totally dependant on your bios, there are many diffrent revisions for each bios and each one has a diffrent focus on ram.
I have the stock bios on my mobo and use the yellow slots and it works perfect with my setup, had my OCZ Platinum 1:1 DDR600 stable with tight timings on my opteron 146, and I currently run my Mushkin DDR500 at DDR515 totally stable both were in the yellow slots.
I never updated to a newer bios as the saying goes "if it aint broke dont fix it"
I have more pictures on my home PC of my rig, but now that I am at work I can only share some of the ones I had uploaded in the past.
Bear with the bad photo quality, my camera died on me.
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new1p-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new3p-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new2p-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new5p-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/Vcio...frontnew-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/Vcio.../sidenew-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new4p-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new6p-T.jpg
http://www.photodump.com/direct/VciousXUSMC/new7p-T.jpg
Some of the Mods:
installing a 120mm fan in the front, yes that was cut with a dremel /bow
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a1...MC/thehole.jpg
fans in
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a1...C/frontfan.jpg
moded that mesh front into this cool dragon
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a1...C/frontbez.jpg
final product: this cool turbine looking fan behind a dragon, at a later time I may actualy get a turbine fan off xoxide.com with the led's in it wich will bring it out even more.
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a1...nanddragon.jpg
More may be uploaded later inluding the 120mm fan on the top of the case that I moded in. I didnt take any pictures of when I had to mod the case for my psu as I was in a hurry to get it up and running and it was the last thing on my mind.
You can kinda see the many phases the computer went thru when I swiched out the psu and things, I dont even have a photo of the final product when I had got all the wires put away, you dont see any wires now except the fan I have near the pwm ic's and the black lights. All the psu wires are behind the hdd cage and hidden away looks nice and neat.
Just recently added the x-fi in there and its offically a FULL case the pump barly fits at an angle between the sound card and the hdd cage, while the video card is just above it. I love the case to death with its price and options but next time I may get somthing bigger.
I am very happy to say the case is finally done. The only thing left to do is prop it up off the ground, maybe put it on wheels, not sure yet.
but here it is !!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...e/P8291051.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...e/P8291049.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...e/P8271045.jpg
My start up switch.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...e/P8271046.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v6...e/P8291047.jpg
I havent gotten a chance to mount my start up switch yet but, itll be done soon enough.
Also need to do more cable management.. but thats for another day.
what do you guys think?
P.S. This thing is HEAVY!!!
^^ that case must weigh 100 lbs, but it looks awesome.
I agree with you, a lot more cable management needs to be done but it looks like you have put a TON of work into it.
bravo dude
cable managment will do great
Yea nice rig man!
Brought my rad from outside of my case into it, and heres how it looks now.
http://upload.nickfire.com//files/1/...0003_thumb.jpg
http://upload.nickfire.com//files/1/...0004_thumb.jpg
Looks really nice. Loved the color scheme.Quote:
Originally Posted by NickS
Question: Does that fan cover/filter thingy restrict air flow? If not, where can I get those?
thanks