2.7ghz at that voltage I would be very happy:)
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2.7ghz at that voltage I would be very happy:)
I might go back to that setting and burn it in some more, depends on how much voltage is needed to go up to 2.8ghz from 2.75. I personally just like having the really fast nb.
Actually I just went back to the setting and just started the auto clock in aod to see what it can do.
Yeah thats a downside - but for me its good to do since my CPU spends nearly all the time idling. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by justapost
It means its either buggy with your OS/BIOS or you have instability problems since it loads CPU/MEM a lot.Quote:
I tried it twice first at 2.8/2.2. AOD always sets 1.25V vcore, 1.3V VID's and 1.8V for the mem. The system started counting up ref HT and froze at ~207MHz without increasing the cpu multi.
Next time i started at 2.5/2.0 and increased vcore to 1.3 and mem voltage to 2.1V. It froze at ~13x203.
After that and the freeze after over night prime95 during sandra latency test at 2.9/2.2 1.4/1.35V i decided to take a break for today. :mad:
It did not work with my 96BE so it might be just incompatibility with your system. :shrug:
Hmm... voltage at 1.4v won't have that affect on an IC if its cooled and capable of it but the reverse is true. Chip designers test this way to look at power difference at one MHz but different Vdd at the pins very regularly. I have been benching all rigs like this for a while, I have them at those volts [1.384] because I was dropping and increasing multi from 9x to 16x very regularly.Quote:
I'd agree with oldguy 1.4v is unreasonable high for 2.3GHz. The freezes seem to be more higher voltage/temp related that clock speed related.
Yes that's how I understand it too, register needing modification would be F3x68[StcPstateEn]=1.Quote:
What register do you mean? I understand STC like that. If the temps exceed an given point the cpu generates an special interupt. Special software is needed to do the proper action (example: switch to a lower p-state or increase the fan speed).
:eek:Quote:
Hmm just one 4pin 12V connector, did not expect that. Tried a phenom in the GBT780G yet? Watch the voltages in CPU-Z! I gave the cpu an +0.025V voltage plus and had voltages from ~1.29V (idle) 1.49V (load) at 2.8/2.2GHz. :).
Kinda crazy that. I have just thrown 1.72v on my 9850 to try and bench 3.2G and avoid massive vDroop to 1.503v - ran single threaded fine, multi-threaded shutdown system through overload protection.
GBT780G never booted my Phenom. Thanks for the advice there!
P0J doesn't have a patch applied b default but with a choice and all BIOSes have gone worse by the day in perf. and 113 is one of the earliest and hence, one of the best performers ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by d412k5t412
Clocked higher with higher CPU/NB/MEM, scores should be higher than mine. At 3G I've cracked 2476KB/s with a fairly low NB so I'm looking at your MEM size here. Weird though, very..Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony
Well, we need to be careful or we'll start getting these again :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Oldguy932My issue is that my cpu does 2.7 stable at 1.1875v, but it takes 1.325 for 2.75 to be stable. There's got to be something else going on to cause the cpu to need that much more voltage. And I actually do get 6.6ns at either 2.5 or 2.75 nb with the cpu at 2.75, my mistake. But the L3 does get faster with increased memory speed, I think I meant to say that the difference between the 400 and the 533 mem dividers gave me the difference in latency rather than the nb speed.Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyI'm hitting 6.2ns at 2.5ghz Nb easy, you have issues there oldguys 2.6GHZ NB brings me sub 6ns with the CPU around 3.5ghzQuote:
Originally Posted by Oldguy932
You can easily disprove false/buggy clocks with a Sandra/EVE run, like the above was when I ran EVEREST here. Look at the cache b/w as well at different clocks.
Format: HT*CPU multi*NB muti*MEM multi
I get around 6.5-6.2ns on the 9600BE at 2.5-2.58G NB, not high CPU/MEM clocks. This was one on the 9600BE
http://img86.imageshack.us/img86/8459/9585bwtr7.png
This is a standard air run by Sami back sometime near late November IIRC:
http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7...em261g2bv2.png
Which clock affects most=>
This is what 2.85CPU/2.19NB/876MEM gets [9850]:
http://img381.imageshack.us/img381/3320/2847876ei5.png
Again, higher up NB but lower CPU/MEM clocks, 232*12*11*2, look at ALL bw numbers [9600]:
http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/8837/9585bwpr1.png
Now clocks are higher than above, 236*12*11*2, compare [9600]:
http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/8...0010000ww9.jpg
Lastly, NB/CPU clocks are lower than above but MEM clock much higher in 1066 mode despite the higher latencies, 235*11.5*11*2.66, [9600]:
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/6715/6269789pr1.jpg
You can see all bw/latency figures depend highly on NB Clock->1066 mode clock->CPU clock->latencies. Tighter latency is not better for Phenom, higher MEM clock is. 1250 5-5-5-15 is better than 450 3-3-3-3 1T or 500 4-4-4-4 1T in overall bws but slightly higher latency.
2.3G CPU/2.4G NB gets around 7.5ns. Haven't checked it out for 9850 properly yet.
Depends how long and which methods it takes you to verify stability. Will it last partner? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau
Anyway, one of the OSes I'm going to try these days is µ-velOSity Real-Time... real-time in MEM as it says. Anyone tried it yet? :confused:
Check this report out BTW: Intel, AMD multi-core processing approach doomed - UK multi-processing experts
Damn you make some frigging long ass posts:D You on speed or something Tye:rofl:
It's just the pics that make it long man :D
But its all technical info needed.
Next time I'll post cryptic one liners :lol2:
TYVM KTE I can make my order sooner instead of later now thanks man :D...
LMK if there is a better bios then 1.13 or along the same lines as the POJ IYO
Well 2.7 was stable at that voltage on small fft's for 9 hours straight, not bothering to do wise testing because I want to know why there is such a voltage jump, I just started it at 271x10 and am going to se the difference every 10 mhz.
Edit: I think the board may be at fault here. 2710 was perfect with the same voltages as 2700. 2720 boots with the same voltage, but one core fails prime in about 10 minutes. I bumped vcore up one notch to 1.2v and windows would not even boot. It's just extremely odd and I don't like it.
That's what been happening to me, when tried to go 3200/2400, it booted at vcore=1.45; NBv=1.325, system frozed after couple minutes, so whent back and up NBv=1.350, sytem lockup at Welcome screen, set NBv=1.325 and booted again to Windows.:shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldguy932
you know KTE i think L3 responds better to low ram latencies over overall ram speed. I will have to play more this coming week, 3x790FX DFI's on the way so i can test all 3 and pic the best to stay with me ;)
I will also back down to 2x1GB microns to see if I can push the ram latencies lower to see the effect on the L3 and winrar.
On a side note the DFI is quite a bit faster in 3d06 than the MSI is, 13700ish with the MSI Vs 13800+ with the DFI, so Oskar, Jarry and the boys did get something right ;)
more soon...weekend DIY duties end soon :)
Also 9750 on the way along with an X3, so should be able to run 2 boards simultaneously now.
Finally got around it. I set the voltage in AOD for it to be stable and primed for an hour and a half. It seems that's all it wanted cause it booted fine just now, so its on to 273 now...
Edit: Nevermind, seems that it was the other nb voltage. I have processor nb voltage(vNB) and then I have NB Core/PCIE voltage. It needed a little more juice in the latter probably because I'm running 1T on such a high htt, but it booted now so that what matters.
Who loves ya Baby?:p:Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
Don't worry Tye I like your style very thorough and detailed a man of my own traits:up:
HTT vCore vNB Speed Mem Idle Max Notes
250 1.15v 1.25v 2500mhz 666mhz -16C -7C
255 1.15v 1.25v 2550mhz 680mhz -15C -6C
260 1.175v 1.25v 2600mhz 692mhz -14C -5C
265 1.175v 1.25v 2650mhz 707mhz -13C -5C
270 1.1825v 1.275v 2700mhz 720mhz -13C -4C HT multi dropped to 9x
250 1.325v 1.325v 2750mhz 666mhz -11C 0C HT multi increased to 10x, CPU and NB multis increased to 11x
CPU and NB at 10x multi
HTT vCore vNB Speed Mem Idle Max Notes
270 1.1825v 1.325v 2700mhz 720mhz -13C -3C
271 1.1825v 1.325v 2710mhz 723mhz -13C -3C
272 1.2v 1.325v 2720mhz 725mhz -13C -3C HT multi dropped to 9x, NB Core/PCIE voltage 1.2v, set vCore with AOD
273 1.2v 1.3375v 2730mhz 728mhz -12C -3C NB Core/PCIE voltage 1.3v, Command Rate 2T
274 1.2125v 1.35v 2740mhz 731mhz -12C -2C
275 1.2125v 1.35v 2750mhz 733mhz -11C -2C NB Core/PCIE voltage 1.4v
NB will not go any higher and be stable
CPU 11x multi NB 10x multi
HTT vCore vNB Speed Mem Idle Max Notes
250 1.2125v 1.25v 2750mhz 666mhz -13C -3C
251 2761mhz
252 2772mhz
253 2783mhz
254 2794mhz
255 2805mhz
So this is what I've been doing with my 9850 currently. The first table was what I was initially doing for testing, and then what happened for 2.75 made me start another test. The second test was the same thing only increasing the htt in 1mhz increments. The NB seemed to max out at 2.75 so I started the third table which will allow me to overclock the cpu a tad more. Doing this testing made me realize something about the causes of errors though. All the freezing I got was due to the NB not having enough voltage, that's why 2.75 on both the first time took so much vCore, it was lost and kind've used by the NB, which makes no sense but its what I'm going to think until it gets explained to me otherwise. I really wish I had the money to get another 9850 to do more testing on...
Edit: And sorry for the way the tables are posted, didn't know how to do it so I just copied and pasted from excel.
Tony, I tried checking out low RAM (+500 CSL4/3 etc) but I had no boot, forgot BIOS mappings and wrongly set NB FID [14x] and CPU FID [15x] at 1.2/1.2 Vcore and was stuck with no boot for hours - had to do the dreaded clear CMOS and yep, now its totally no POST, same C1 error :mad:
It's not dead but I've no idea when it will boot now, if ever. 3 days so far so can't check anything out.
Have you tried any 500-540 CAS4 Sandra [multi-threaded] runs and compared them with CAS5 600-630 runs?
Yeah, that's what I found too, L3 latency being RAM timings dependent.
Looking forward to your 9750/X3 testing, some of them seem to be on very cheap around UK too ;)
Oldguy932, 275HT stable... stable as in you ran it daily, or Prime95? You had vNB 1.35 but what was the NB multi?
Have you tried 1.3v 200HT/2800CPU stability testing? Maybe if you jump up a notch, you can work your way down.
aGeoM, if system is having hard time booting a setting, or even if its low volts, it is always wise to try a few reboots at those settings to test stability. I do this all the time before thinking anything is stable. If its unstable, it might boot 2/5, 3/5 but no where near consistent. :yepp:
Similar thing happens with my 3G 1.35v boots, but I don't bother wasting time over it since I know it's unstable.
Camp, thanks man :D
Looking at Phenom... AMD seems to have improved quite a bit in terms of clocking from their usual improvement cycles since 2003. And still, quite obviously, no Phenom yet is of top speed bin, but casual high volume bins from the same 2.2GHz silicon in a new step, hence the price being lower. Looking at the clocks, 2.8GHz bin for FX CPU is well within reach with these models by just speed binning the same 9850BE silicon, but even that wouldn't be low volume highest bin so can't be classified FX and carry that price tag. However, TDP is what will bolt them down to ≤2.8GHz at most as it did and does to all CPU MFGs including Intel. The industry does not accept ridiculous TDPs, PressHOT is what they will scream all over again. I still see them focusing for 45nm rather than any FX CPU now. Many AMD interviews around talking about clock/energy/IPC improvement in K10.5.
AMD speed improvement cycles =>
K8: Q4 2003 2.2 GHz to Q3 2007 3.2GHz: 45.5% clockspeed increase in 15 quarters
K10: Q4 2007 2.2GHz to Q1 2008 2.5GHz: 13.6% clockspeed increase in 1 quarter
Clockspeed improvement per quarter =>
K8: 3%
K10: 13.6%
So instead of sticking to this arch for too long like they did with K8, they are moving ahead immediately with a 15% reduction in power mentioned at the same clock speed as K10 for 45nm. By those official figures, looks like 3GHz will still be around 140W TDP. :shrug:
MSI referred me to reseller for a better BIOS now :(
Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
WTH is MSI not all there?
SUPER UPDATE :
I went ahead and got my gskill ram (2x2048@1066)
and had to set the timings manually 5-5-5-15 (and devider 1:2.66)
was working well, was looking up info on raid cards (don't think the speed of onboard is doing my raptors justice)
and, found that MSI posted new drivers for the Promise PDC42819
and new bios 1.4 final.
so i said, what the heck, lets format..... and i did some testing too...
SOFTWARE USED :
HD TACH version 3.0.4.0
WINRAR V3.71 benchmark
TLB shutoff with SAM's Tool Version 1.05
I wish i had screenshots of it all, might reflash and try again, but the results are this :
BIOS 1.3B3 -
WINRAR - ~1,100
HDTACH - Long bench (32M) ~96MB/s Sequential Read Speed
BIOS 1.40 - (flashed, booted, VISTA installed new promise devices/reinstalled devices, whatever, required reboot)
WINRAR - ~1,450
HDTACH - Long Bench (32M) ~150MB/s Sequential Read Speed (have picture)
Both HDTACH graphs had pretty much the same ramping, just differnt values at the keys.
Now, not very great on my testing, cause i didn't expect anything,
and it was just for my own, so i can located a better raid card (any suggestions? (remember, I am a army man (read:tight funds)))
can anyone test themselves? and see if i just found a fluke?
The top two tables the cpu and the nb were the same speed, the third table cpu was 11x and nb was 10x. It just didn't want to clock at all past 2.75, pain to even try. I just put my 9600 back in because it runs faster on much less power than the 9850.
@oldguy: Above ~2.8GHz my system is more stable with an 11xnb multi than with an 10x multi. Seems it's a good idea to have max 500-600MHz difference between CPU and NB frequency. Also ram works best in 800 mode, 667 can not reach high ref HT's here. Have you played with the cpu on air also?
Anyway, thank you for the effort you put into this. The results keeping me back from investing another few hundred euros into a water cooling system. :)
Keeping the cpu at around 20C-30C would probably yield the best overclock. I didn't use it on air at all because I'm not sure if the new crosshair bios supports it and I don't have the patience to remove the vapo from the M3A32 board. I did notice something different though. Having my 9600 regular at 255x11.5 with memory on the 533 divider and the nb at 9x only got me 7.7ns in everest, but the slowest I ever got on the 9850 ever was 7.2 ns and that was with the cpu and nb at 10x250. And changing the nb multi probably wouldn't help, although 11x250 was a bit more stable than 10x275, but I thought that was just cause I was maxing out the htt to get that speed running. Too late now, I just put the 9600 back in and I keep my cpu's in for at least a week at a time, not to mention it runs much more stable.
Yeah, after a totally :censored: day it really :censored: the :censored: out of me to hear the same :censored: :cussing:Quote:
Originally Posted by jonspd
They basically still don't have a better BIOS is what they said.
Which set, what's the P/N?Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_drache
Budget?Quote:
was looking up info on raid cards (don't think the speed of onboard is doing my raptors justice)
Great, here's the link to the new Promise drivers he's mentioning. Can we have some testers please?Quote:
and, found that MSI posted new drivers for the Promise PDC42819
and new bios 1.4 final.
Release: 2008-04-10
Version:
Win 2k/XP Ver.: 1.1.1030.27
Vista 32/64 Ver.: 1.1.1030.47
2k/XP: http://global.msi.com.tw/index.php?f...e&dno=6266&i=0
Vista 32b/64b: http://global.msi.com.tw/index.php?f...e&dno=6266&i=1
There were also new Ethernet and SB600 RAID drivers released that day as mentioned earlier: http://global.msi.com.tw/index.php?f...=&prod_no=1332
Thanks for the info.. hmm, that's a very big bandwidth difference between BIOSes, are you on Vista?Quote:
so i said, what the heck, lets format..... and i did some testing too...
SOFTWARE USED :
HD TACH version 3.0.4.0
WINRAR V3.71 benchmark
TLB shutoff with SAM's Tool Version 1.05
I wish i had screenshots of it all, might reflash and try again, but the results are this :
BIOS 1.3B3 -
WINRAR - ~1,100
HDTACH - Long bench (32M) ~96MB/s Sequential Read Speed
BIOS 1.40 - (flashed, booted, VISTA installed new promise devices/reinstalled devices, whatever, required reboot)
WINRAR - ~1,450
HDTACH - Long Bench (32M) ~150MB/s Sequential Read Speed (have picture)
Your WinRAR is one like from Vista SP1 ;)
This might apply to Vista mainly if that be the case. It can't b XP, memory perf. is to low for it.
Hehe I thought you guys just get everything free and 200k GI's :p:Quote:
Now, not very great on my testing, cause i didn't expect anything,
and it was just for my own, so i can located a better raid card (any suggestions? (remember, I am a army man (read:tight funds)))
Yeah I think these are MB/BIOS issues rather than Phenom since I've not seen this happen on the MSI since the beginning :shrug:Quote:
Originally Posted by justapost
So far, that's what I found with all Phenoms strangely. :yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by Oldguy932
Yeah to test NB you really don't need Prime95 [etc] as long as you can bench it using Sandra sort of benchmarks. NB error shows up in uptime stability i.e. you'll have a freeze or crash within 15 hours of booting and general use if its unstable.Quote:
Having my 9600 regular at 255x11.5 with memory on the 533 divider and the nb at 9x only got me 7.7ns in everest, but the slowest I ever got on the 9850 ever was 7.2 ns and that was with the cpu and nb at 10x250. And changing the nb multi probably wouldn't help, although 11x250 was a bit more stable than 10x275, but I thought that was just cause I was maxing out the htt to get that speed running. Too late now, I just put the 9600 back in and I keep my cpu's in for at least a week at a time, not to mention it runs much more stable.
I tested NB 2400 1.25VID early on and managed it F@H and P95 stable and thought it was fine but it wasn't when I used the setting. I think I'm about to change boards any day now once again since I still have no boot, been 3 days.
@KTE,
sorry i didn't link everything, i was tired and had a long day, figured the info was enough for the time being.
OS is VISTA sp1 x64
RAM : NEWEGG LINK
can't locate box currently...
the original timings were something like 7-7-7-24
was thinking it was voltage now i'm thinking about it, on account it asks for 2.0-2.1 and the board still seems to only get me vdimm of 1.8
RAID CARD : buget, not looking to spend over say $140ish for a decent host based, bit more (not much) if a lower end hardware one shows up. will take used... lol (if possable, sata, only need 2 ports, and pci-e/pci (whatever will work best)
ohh about the pay, pay is decent, if i was with my family, but due to ingerys i am having a forced seperation, with her and my kid 800 miles away, so it gets tight at times running 2 households, and the GI bill (college) is only like 37K, maybe a bit more at times.
BIOS 151 upped at the MSI ftp site.
Here's the latest 151 BETA BIOS: http://www.yourfilehost.com/media.ph...98A7376AMS.zip
I am definitely expecting something in it. Any takers?
Thanks to bgbdbstrd for the alert. :)
Excellent RAM there, 2.0v should get you 5-5-5-15 533 stable :yepp:Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_drache
How do you know what the vDIMM after boot is?
You can check the SPD in SPD Tool or CPUZ and set the timings as rated in there.
I'm not really an expert at that price point, mainly server hardware for work which tops that price range by quite a lot :(Quote:
RAID CARD : buget, not looking to spend over say $140ish for a decent host based, bit more (not much) if a lower end hardware one shows up. will take used... lol (if possable, sata, only need 2 ports, and pci-e/pci (whatever will work best)
Ahh sorry to hear that, hope things improve soon :)Quote:
ohh about the pay, pay is decent, if i was with my family, but due to ingerys i am having a forced seperation, with her and my kid 800 miles away, so it gets tight at times running 2 households, and the GI bill (college) is only like 37K, maybe a bit more at times.
give me a few hours, i'll give it a shotQuote:
Originally Posted by KTE
Thanks to bgbdbstrd for the alert. :)
i used HWMonitor 1.08 (64-bit) for my voltages/tempsQuote:
Originally Posted by KTE
screenie on my system, which you can see seems to read the dram at 2.21
it was 1.8-1.9 at bios 1.3B3 this is my first run of it on 1.40:
http://i25.tinypic.com/qyfpkk.jpg
also CPUZ SPD tab :
http://i30.tinypic.com/2lncy3c.jpg
i will try to go back in and enable EPP profiling (mistake, eather i can't find it, or it was a differnt motherboard i am thinking of) in the BIOS, after a 1.51 flash.
you know, i feel that what i want to spend on raid, is way low, but at the same time, i have the promise chip on-board, so i don't HAVE to have one, and it's only for striped, no mirroring at all (do a self backup of everything i might want to ever keep, DVDs/Online) so, if i find one, sweet if not, blah.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
EDIT :
did the 151 flash MORE INFOS :
Version V1.5B1 04/10/2008
changes seen in BIOS : TLB FIX DISABLE - added to cell menu
Ram timings : when set all on auto and Ratio set on 1:2.66 (for my 1066)
which then i manually set to 5-5-5-15
http://i28.tinypic.com/2089qf4.jpg
no other notable changes in WINRAR or HDTACH (all changes seen were within a few %, inside a standard varation default)
Thanks for the info :toast:
Is there no NB FID options in this BIOS? :(
Look around carefully for some AM2+ P-State menus.
DRAM voltage can't be accessed by any tool on this MB but for AOD, that value is just the 12V rail reading divided by around 5.5, which is how its being output [a confusion].
EPP is Intel CPU boards ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_drache
With this you just have to choose the 1066 mode and set timings yourself.
Usually, onboard ATI RAID is not much different to low end PCIe RAID cards in performance. No where near vital unless the tiny perf. is critical ;)Quote:
you know, i feel that what i want to spend on raid, is way low, but at the same time, i have the promise chip on-board, so i don't HAVE to have one, and it's only for striped, no mirroring at all (do a self backup of everything i might want to ever keep, DVDs/Online) so, if i find one, sweet if not, blah.
Values are quite low there, you can set them manually to your rated specs of 5-5-5-15 48 tRC and 105ns tRFC both [105ns is minmum].Quote:
did the 151 flash MORE INFOS :
Version V1.5B1 04/10/2008
changes seen in BIOS : TLB FIX DISABLE - added to cell menu
Ram timings : when set all on auto and Ratio set on 1:2.66 (for my 1066)
which then i manually set to 5-5-5-15
http://i28.tinypic.com/2089qf4.jpg
no other notable changes in WINRAR or HDTACH (all changes seen were within a few %, inside a standard varation default)
TLB Fix Disable was in BIOS before that too, P0J, no changes it seems. :shakes: