[Digital-info]NVIDIA，7800GTX Benchmark

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Originally Posted by OPPAINTER

It's odd to me that there arn't very many people impressed.
We have Macci's single card World record score of 9500 something which was done on LN2.
Now we have this G70 which looks to me that it could be pretty close to Macci's score, only the G70 can do it on stock air cooling, in the right hands.
That seems pretty good to me.

OPP

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you seem to be forgetting that the 7800 is nvidia's next-gen card....and the 9000pt ATI card is current gen. And i hear 7800's are still running FP16...that's crap. :fact: I kinda think that boltser's macci's point a bit back about how all ATI cards are performing better than the equivalent nViida card...microsoft used ATI card's for DX9 development why? Has nVidia not got the message?

comparing the current results for SLI and crossfire is apples and oranges. lol. the nvida card has an extra 8 pipelines..and only gets that much? sure it's nice an all, but if we want better looking games, we need much better hardware...and spending $1500 on videocards to get decent resolutions in HD is just not acceptable. If nvidia really wants to call themselves a player in the market, they need to be focusing more on a multi-media graphics card, rather than an game oriented one. I can plug my computer into my hometheater, for some awesome gaming....but where's the HD? It's not in the driver, that's for sure..... :fact: Racing for benchmark points, and convincing people to buy cards becasue of benchmarks... :rolleyes: Give me some real functionality outta the box, PLS!

they should be fighting with a price war, that would be nice i wouldnt care for lots of points or performance if i could buy a nice card (x850xt or 6800ultras) for $200

I dont have a good designer eye. But I'm almost sure the core is photoshoped, all G70 nVidia Reference Boards say Engineering Sample in the core.

Greets!

offtopic: What's the WR in 03 en 05 with a single ultra anyway? Maybe we should compare that to the scores of the 7800GTX

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Originally Posted by Mathias-K

Seriously, that BS. Remember the days of P4E Prescott 90nm vs Athlon64 Clawhammer 130nm? ;)

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ATI's 90nm is also low-k

EDIT: lol Saaya, I don't consider 500MHz+ as a low clockspeed. NVIDIA's just running it low probably to improve yields, and give ATI a false sense of contentment.

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Originally Posted by saaya

but the problem is yields... if the yields are bad at 90nm, and they seem to be, then 110nm will make more sence...

ati went for 90nm 32pipes right away, wich is giving them a hard time yield wise right now, but clockspeeds should be high and they can be the king of the hill with the few 32 working pipe cards right now, and will impove the 90nm yields over time and have a perfect chip for the next months.

nvidia went for a 110nm 24 pipe chip right now, wich is giving them much better yields, but worse clockspeeds. they can probably produce masses of g70 chips and produce them cheap, however they wont be the fastest chips around right now.

so basically it looks like nvidia went for high yields and the ability to sell loads of cheap chips and play it save, while ati went for a more risky route wich will most likely make them the king of the hill with their chip for at least the next few months. since they have more time tweaking 90nm and will already have a resfresh of r520 aka r580 when nvidia gets their first 32 pipe chip out, they should be able to beat nvidias 32 chip in a few months as well.

to me it looks like nvidia will lose more market share... but its a poker game and you never know what cards they are holding in their hands :D
and if ati should not be able to improve their yields and supply enough chips to the market nvidia will be there with cheap good performing chips and will be able to gain a lot of market share back.

id say ati is in advantage though at the current situation and within the next few months fom what i know atm.

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Alright, answer me this, how is having higher yields going to make NVIDIA lose market share? From a business standpoint, actually having cards out that people can buy in good quantity, while bringing it to the market earlier should give NVIDIA a major advantage in sales.

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Originally Posted by cadaveca

you seem to be forgetting that the 7800 is nvidia's next-gen card....and the 9000pt ATI card is current gen. And i hear 7800's are still running FP16...that's crap. I kinda think that boltser's macci's point a bit back about how all ATI cards are performing better than the equivalent nViida card...microsoft used ATI card's for DX9 development why? Has nVidia not got the message?

comparing the current results for SLI and crossfire is apples and oranges. lol. the nvida card has an extra 8 pipelines..and only gets that much? sure it's nice an all, but if we want better looking games, we need much better hardware...and spending $1500 on videocards to get decent resolutions in HD is just not acceptable. If nvidia really wants to call themselves a player in the market, they need to be focusing more on a multi-media graphics card, rather than an game oriented one. I can plug my computer into my hometheater, for some awesome gaming....but where's the HD? It's not in the driver, that's for sure..... Racing for benchmark points, and convincing people to buy cards becasue of benchmarks... Give me some real functionality outta the box, PLS!

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lol, your post is full of misunderstandings. First of all ATI's current gen cards are only able to score 9k in 3DMark05 under extreme cooling and hardware modifications. I'm sure if the 7800GTX were under the same circumstance, the X850XT PE wouldn't stand a chance.

Secondly, NVIDIA's current gen cards can run 16-bit FP precision, however the architecture is built in such a way as to be able to run 32-bit FP with little-to-no performance hit. As a result NVIDIA runs at 32-bit FP precision in almost all cases.

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/gra...e_6800-08.html
"Game developers were often forced to reduce the shader precision of their games to FP16 or FX12 to reach playable performance levels on NV35 / 38 hardware. This is now history with the advent of the NV40. Not unlike ATi's R360, which always calculates shaders at FP24 precision, NV40 delivers full shader performance in FP32. While FP16 shaders may still offer a slight performance advantage in some special cases, the performance delta will be much less pronounced than on NV35 / 38."

Next you said, "I kinda think that boltser's macci's point a bit back about how all ATI cards are performing better than the equivalent nViida card..."
A little one-sided with that comment?

"If nvidia really wants to call themselves a player in the market, they need to be focusing more on a multi-media graphics card, rather than an game oriented one."
They are. That's why they came up with the PureVideo tech.

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Originally Posted by saaya

they can probably produce masses of g70 chips and produce them cheap, however they wont be the fastest chips around right now.

[...]

to me it looks like nvidia will lose more market share...

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Well, that's the point.

ATI has lost a lot of market share in the last quarter and is on historically low margins. They even issued a profit warning.

Who will actually care about a few 3DMarks. Performance/$ matters for almost every customer on that planet, nothing else. If a $500 7800GTX scores 7.8k stock in 05 and a $850 (at least, I have read about that price) X900XT-PE scores 9k in 05 at stock - what are you going to buy (given that you wouldn't suffer from fanboyism)?

A low clocked 7800GTX with actually having a lot of overclocking headroom with stock cooler or a clocked-to-the-limit X900XT-PE that won't go any more than 10-15 MHz (core) on stock cooling?

Besides, the stock cooler on the 7800GTX images is really low and I guess it's quite silent. Since 430/1x00 are not a high clock, I suppose those cards won't heat up a lot. The X900XT-PE instead will easily reach 70-80°C (just like X850XT-PE) with massive and noisy heatsink.

The only ones who urgently need a Crossfire X900XT-PE setup (based on a first-gen board with worse I/O-performing ATI Crossfire chipset) are these guys going for the WR. I have no doubt that ATI will end up winning the 3DMarks with Crossfire by a little margin (after some 7800Ultra and X950XT-PE-Golden-Hyper-Edition battles). But that's only nice for marketing, you wont make any profit from those cards.

macci's 9k on X850-XT LN2 are really nice but I see a lot more 6800GT than X800XL out there.

If some fast-available and "cheap" G70 card will outperform in performance/price all that X900 Pro/XT/XT-PE stuff, it will be some more tough quarters for ATI.

Maybe 1% of the people "need" absolute performance, 99% want best-bang-for-the-buck (and maybe consider noise level and oc headroom). As long as yields on 90nm X900 cards are low and prices are high, ATI is behind the market.


Just my opinion.

1) I don't think we should get carried away with number of pipes, the "power" of cards is now starting to come more from the power of the shaders shading the pixels the pipes are supplying.

2) 3dmark05 is not the be all and end all, need to see how well the 7800 does across the board. It may not be representative.

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Originally Posted by Eversor

The thing is, G70 isn´t a big improvement over NV40, but, the time ati is taking to release R520, by the time it´s out, (maybe september?) nVidia should have something higher clocked around and it should be fine.
Unless R520 comes in like a month and can score 9-10k stock, i don´t see a problem for nvidia. Tough i agree G70 isn´t very advanced technologically.

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the last time i checked, the G70 supports new sm 4.0 instructions. that is definitely a step up from sm 3.0. to my point of view, that is advancement in technology.

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Originally Posted by Kanavit

the last time i checked, the G70 supports new sm 4.0 instructions. that is definitely a step up from sm 3.0. to my point of view, that is advancement in technology.

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Where did you hear that from?

Soo much confusion about this card. You ought to see what the idiots at AT are saying. People there are "claiming" to be under NDA and saying his information is wrong, while threatening to report him.

Sometimes I wonder why I post anywhere else but here. :nono:

Its kinda laughible in my opinion. sxs112 has a proven record at being a pre-release guru. I dont understand why people are having such a hard time believeing him

Hell he has pictures of the cards themselves.

with all these new cards coming out it makes me wonder if the x850xt i was about to order for $260 is worth it. Mabey ill just save for an r520

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Originally Posted by AMD Junkie83

with all these new cards coming out it makes me wonder if the x850xt i was about to order for $260 is worth it. Mabey ill just save for an r520

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Where are you getting a 850xt for 260 :confused: :slobber:

oh its an best buy employee accommodation plan through ati... its like 260 shipped. think its worth it?

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Originally Posted by Cybercat

Where did you hear that from?

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sorry Cybercat , i am mistaken. Not sm 4.0 , but this...

-Support SLI
-Support CineFX 4.0
-Support Intellisample 4.0
-Support Sharder Model 3.0
-Support PureVideo

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Originally Posted by Kanavit

sorry Cybercat , i am mistaken. Not sm 4.0 , but this...

-Support SLI
-Support CineFX 4.0
-Support Intellisample 4.0
-Support Sharder Model 3.0
-Support PureVideo

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I'm curious as to how the CineFX 4.0 differs from the 3.0 that the current cards use. Judging from the performance numbers there doesn't seem to be that significant of a change from the NV4x, but we won't know until for sure until June 21.

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Originally Posted by Troman

ofcourse it is :slap:

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I dunno. Perhaps AMD Junkie should wait until the R520 comes to that Employee Accomodation program. That WILL be worth it :slobber:

Perkam

I remember reading some where that nvidia is going to be selling sli mobos for as cheap as $80.

Where did you hear that?! :slobber:

Usama aka Ferrari Freak

Why is everyone so convinced that R520 is going to be a 32-pipeline chip rather then, say, a highly-clocked (upper 600s) 16-pipeline setup?

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Originally Posted by Alabama Man

Why is everyone so convinced that R520 is going to be a 32-pipeline chip rather then, say, a highly-clocked (upper 600s) 16-pipeline setup?

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at first ati probally wont release their 32 pipe card atleast thats what i think. i read somewhere that they have low yields with 32 pipes so its more of a back up. so probally 24 pipes out first if it gets beaten they will then release 32 pipe card.

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Originally Posted by alexio

http://www.digital-info.net/vbb/show...4839#post24839

7800 was at stock (430/1200)

9000 was at 500/1300

13000 was at stock in SLI

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Sorry.....but two 6800u in SLI makes 10000Points in Stock. 10000Points with a normal 2200Mhz-Winny?? Hello? Anybody out there??
:slapass:
I'm very disappointed from the "Next-Gen"!!
I will not buy this "Crap"! I wait for the R520.....and pray for really more performance!

greetings

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Originally Posted by Wiggy McShades

at first ati probally wont release their 32 pipe card atleast thats what i think. i read somewhere that they have low yields with 32 pipes so its more of a back up. so probally 24 pipes out first if it gets beaten they will then release 32 pipe card.

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I have a feeling that R520 is not a 24/32 pipeline part, and the delay is far more due need to get Crossfire established then anything esle.

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Originally Posted by perkam

:eek: Uh oh...I think I just found out what I'm saving my money for :eek:

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And the comment about the SLi.. you expect a full x 2 scaling from 1 GPU to a second? That's just unrealistic. You also base that the ATi card is better having not seen any performance results from it, and seem to already have made your choice regardless of whether the Nvidia bests the ATi.

Maybe just wait until a proper comparison of retail cards is released before making a decision?

In regard to the "new gen" being lame. The length of the 9xxx lifespan was for a good 2+ years, where this cycle has been around one year, so it's not very likely that the results would double it's predecessor like the current generation.

I think we're just too happy from getting Xtreme improvements from the last gen to the current gen and now expect it in every new gen of cards... How much do dual 6800 Ultra's do in SLI? Compare that with how much a single 7800 GTX or dual 7800 GTX. The 6800 Ultra was a dual slot solution, this is single slot. If it can do 9k in 3D Mark '05 with a single slot cooler, imagine the results with water, ln2, etc.

Usama aka Ferrari Freak