hmm are they trying to be like AMD? Keep quiet about problems, but have a party on how they were able to resolve issues?
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hmm are they trying to be like AMD? Keep quiet about problems, but have a party on how they were able to resolve issues?
HaH finally a possible release timeframe........thanx alot bigtoe :toast:
I rather hear a possible release date then nothing at all.
Thanks bigtoe.
Offtopic, how big is that toe ??
If only they could listen to the wise man, c'mon' Sapphire/ATI get it right.Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
Thanks tony.
september for retail, like i always said....although i heard last week that they may be able to push it up earlier than I expected, like end of july/early august. My b-day is july 29th...would be nice to see a crossfire system in my office when i go in there in the morning....just gotta wait on the mobo and the vidcards.... :rolleyes:
I'd much rather wait an extra month if it means getting a board with less, or dare I say it.........NO bugs :D and more mature bios releases
I rather have the Mobo first so I could build my darn system........so much easier that way........I have already gotten a friggin AN8 Ultra in the mean time before Sappire comes out with this overdue baby.......... :slapass:
The boards were functional back to CeBit five month ago so i have the feeling i waited a couple extra months already, plenty of time to debug unless something went horribly wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha0ne
I would rather it had as few bugs as possible, but dont want to wait to until the end of august just to see the board released.
G
I talked with Sapphire representive in Computex and this is what he said to me:
White PCB is extremely hard (and expensive?) to manufacture. This is because of all the burning marks etc what comes from soldering the components to PCB. Will they mass produce the white PCB boards? The impression I got wasn't too excited... Guess why Crossfire board is black, not white?
Two weeks ago I asked (from different representive) that when will be the PURE motherboards available? He answered: sometime this summer and didn't specify would it be single or crossfire solution.
Another motherboard manufacturer told me that the support they are getting from ATI isn't too good regarding the chipsets. He also wished that ATI would spend time and money to promoting the chipsets.
i think we will get blue boards :slap:
i think my words were..."Show people that you can give them what they want, and then take it away...well that would cause mutiny anywhere. Release a board that is differnt from the one posted in the XS thread, and the board will flop".
:fact:
Now i know alot of people did not like the white, and i understand that burns may happen, but i also know that this would only happen if the assembly was careless. I bet they ran off 50 or so boards, and half of them were not in "saleable" condition.
:stick:
methinks my decision to not wait any longer and forget the crossfire solution was a good one. :rolleyes:
Maybe they'll have something nice in taipei...
ATI support DOES suck, you know this sampsa. i had a compatibility problem with a card and a board. i asked for a recommended board as they say the board did not offer a true .8v for AGP(you know how that works), and the board they recommended was the board i was using in the first place. Blaming the problem on other components when in reality the product you sold your customer was faulty, and you know it, is not the work of a company that will stay at the top ranks for long.
Funny, that rumour has it ATI may be bought-out.... :D
The delay might just be related to this tidbit....
Quote:
Originally Posted by DigiTimes
So they can't seem to get their new boards or graphics to the masses.......nVidia comes out on top again for the time being. It's this see-saw effect that keeps these guys from dominating the market, which is good for all of us when it comes to keeping the cost down.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EMC2
As weird as it seems, it could very well be just for this. I reckon this would prolly be a marketing's monkeys thing then. Marketing sucks :(
Agreed.Quote:
Originally Posted by LowRun
I'm go to sleep ..... zzzzz , maybe when ATI shows Xfire board and Vids , nVidia also shows SLI II , who knows :D :rolleyes:
ATI :slapass: :slapass:
Here is a full quote from Sapphire:
"We expect to have review samples of the PURE during the summer"
So review samples this summer... mass producion...??? September, october?
Also, I can't see any other decent ATI based motherboards around either. I doubt this High-End mobo for extreme overclockers would be the first one to appear in market.
I will get a Sapphire Crossfire in December, by then all issues wud most likely be solved and my AN8 Ultra would be 6 mths old........ :p:
@ bigtoe @ Sampsa.......did you both happen to ask Sapphire if they will be supplyin Graphics cards based on Fatal1ty's built-in concept of being able to adjust core and mem voltages without us having to mods the cards physically. If wud be nice to hear a reply from Sapphire regarding this matter........ :D
Does it seem counter intuitive to people that the company comes to someone like bigtoe to find out what options people want, and so really target the board at our community, and then have a wait for possibly marketing reasons for the board while they must know that our community craves the latest hardware and so by pushing it back are costing themselves sales (the very sales they tried to get by coming to bigtoe in the first place)?
G
Watch Nvidia one-ups them and announces NF5 releasing soon and everyone skips the ATI and waits for NF5 mobos :P
gotta admit i'm getting rather disappointed in the amount of time its taking for them to show.. :(
EDIT
Should mention its largely because the feature set will be outdated by the time we start getting them :(
I bet the DFI Lanparty UT RDX200 CF-DR will be out before Gropuer. And much more interesting then the Grouper. Btw does the Grouper have an official name?
Grouper is just an ATI reference design, like Bullhead and Halibut, the thing is its a balls out enthusiast board like nothing i have seen as an ES sample before.
I just heard its getting close to release, it looks like Sapphire now have press boards so we may see a PR soon.
Way to pee on the parade dudeQuote:
Originally Posted by situman
no one can rain on their parade if Sapphire or ATI put out their "umbrellas." The longer they take, the sooner Nvidia will rain on the parade.
yes it does seem that way. I couldnt wait any longer so i went with the an8 ultra. Im not buying another 939 until socket m comes out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master_G
Well, the DFI will maybe come out first, but i just can't see what makes it more interesting :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gambit_2K
:woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
The early board DFI is supposed to send you didn't show up yet?
I won't be getting the dfi one unless it performs better than the sapphire one.
DFI & Gigabyte will be first to market. Sapphire will follow end of August maybe.
From conversation with ATi rep
i think this looks promissing:
http://vr-zone.com/?i=2452
http://vr-zone.com/?i=2237&s=1
no real eta yet but they have what they need.
:woot:
this has been posted a while back
:woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
can't wait :)
The timing of this thing will be perfect.. just when i'm heading off to do custom harvesting. argh.
You dont need to with your setup m8 :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Delirious
bigtoe......any pics of the Press boards :p:
when can i buy this mobo?, my lanparty is holding my cpu back so badly i can only get 2850 to bench with box cooler :) no go for 2900mhz
could possibly be ur cooling. 2.85ghz on STOCK cooling, think about that.
http://www.ati.com/buy/promotions/cr...ady/index.html
offer ends by the end of september for buying a crossfire card and getting 100bucks from ati, so wouldnt that mean there should be some crossfire mobos out before then?
i signed up heh
We can see them Crossfire mobos here courtesy of ATI :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterburner
hmmm only the blue value sapphire board on there no white one that we are waiting
Different power setup too :(Quote:
Originally Posted by Millyons
The MSI and Powercolour only seem to have the grouped fets
That's because Grouper isn't a crossfire board. The TUL board listed is actually the Sapphire Crossfire board.Quote:
Originally Posted by Millyons
MS 7194 also.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Tinker
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Tinker
oh ya sorry i wasnt paying enough attention
even if this makes it out by the end of july (god knows which color/version), i can't see myself upgrading knowing we lost ~2 months on the new core revision processors. i dont know the date of the next core release for AMD, but i was really hoping to have a grouper x2 combo as the top of the line system for more than 6 months.
damn i hate this industry
Quote:
Originally Posted by LowRun
Mainly because Oscar Wu is working for DFI, and Sapphire are pretty new at this. And the Grouper is there first try at an enthusiast board. But we'll have to see.
I threw the idea of an accessable video card BIOS at nVidia years ago, where you could adjust core and memory voltages and memory timings. My reply was that it was not feasable and would void warranty. I said it is done with motherboards, why not video cards. I never got a response to that. Now it seems years later the idea may come to fruition, by some snot nose just because he can play games well.
By them time we see these boards, nVidia will have the next gen of nForce and SLI out soon. Has anyone seen anything to tape?
so is the enthusaist board gonna come in crossfire version also or just for single card
The Fatal1ty X800XL has these functions I believe......I am hoping Powercolour and Sapphire will follow suit and maintain a pricing edge :)Quote:
Originally Posted by SPQQKY
Pls correct me if I have been mistaken....... :p:
YesQuote:
Originally Posted by Millyons
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...878#post948878
This is a super ES-board, as many have said. But then making it available to gamers/overclockers is the game and not just to few lucky1s.
:fact:
I just stumbled upon the article(www.techtree.com) in which ATI India's head said about wide CrossFire availibilty by september :slapass: . Well....I think it will be mid-to-end september . I think it makes sense for ATI to get R520 out with these boards as 7800GTX has taken good lead already. But you never know with ATI, took them so long to get SB issues settled and also to get 520 yeild issues settled as per many of the reports round the web.
Waiting for ATI CrossFire went lil beyond my capacity :mad: and I have asked my cousin to get Abit AN8-SLI. Anyways all d best , ATI :slapass: .
@ Bigtoe
Tony, during the time you've had the board have sapphire supplied you with any bios updates? If so has this improved anything clocks wise?
I was also wondering if sapphire have made any revisions to the boards, or is the one you have a final reference design?
I'm really really interesting in buying this board, the one thing that worries me is do Sapphire have the ability to put out frequent bios updates and tweaks the way Oscar does for DFI?
I'm really looking forward to a review of this board when it finally arrives.
It seems the delay is really driver related. Ati's crossfire drivers are still buggy according to a preview by Anandtech. They had trouble running some AA modes and stuff like that. So until the drivers are finalized, the boards probably wont show up yet.
Sapphire are shipping their version of grouper to reviewers right now, so you should see reviews real soon. I have had 15+ bios upgrades over the development period and im still helping after the boards have launched.Quote:
Originally Posted by madpete
We are working on higher 1t performance, we have already managed to get 2t real sweet (highest performance I have see upto now) 1T is also good but you can always improve things ;)
I hope you all like tweaking as this board has tons of ram and drive options etc...
does 1T go as high as on nf4 at least or is it lower
woo for tweaking!
Big Up to you bigtoe......you are freakin invaluable to us :woot:Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
:toast: :toast: :toast:
No x700... :( sucks.. I wanted to have an uber low budget system :D
Hmm.. maybe ill just have my friend register for the coupon and buy a crossfire x800 for now :slobber:
Word to the nth power. You tell 'um what's up. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterburner
If we have Tony coaching Sapphire on bios updates, it's a good indication they'll have some nifty bioses comparible to DFI's. It looks like the "PURE" series xfire really might be taking on DFI's crossfire board for the out-of-the-gate and perhaps even overall xfire title.
One quick Q, if it's been answered, apologies. DFI's using the ATi SB on their enthusiast xfire board...Is Sapphire using the ULI or ATi? I see DFI took everything that wasn't incorporated onto the ATi SB and just put stand-alone controllers and such on-board. If the Sapphire uses the ULI, and it controls everything like SATAII and such, which do you think is more efficient?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
That is really good to hear, and makes me think this board could be really special. Thanks for all the input and info you have given us. :toast:
As far as I know both Sapphire and DFI are using the ATI SB. Regarding bios support this will probably come from ATI for those who follow the reference designs, those who deviate will probably work on their own bios.
Oskar has worked on the DFI crossfire, so expect something special from DFI, its out real soon and i should with luck have a preview board and i will post on Xtreme.
1T overclocks on grouper are a little less than the DFI NF4, some will see 300+ 1T some will not. I do know 2T is almost as fast with the tweaks we have worked on and i have benched 320+fsb this way. The board is REALLY fast with VX or good BH die dimms and 2-2-2 all 1T. Developement still continues though, so don't panick because you can not do 310fsb, I just run 285 2.5-3-3- and play with rartio's etc and im still getting 3400+ in memtest86 at high clocks ;)
One last thing, remember the grouper design was a single 16x slot board so no crossfire on this one, the reference crossfire board has all the same power regulation as the grouper, it just has the different NB and the extra 16X slot etc ;)
Keep it comin......... :toast:
I would much rather have the single 16x as 2 VGA is a bit silly to me, not to mention way too expensive for two vid cards so its gonna be Grouper for me :)
I just want a baord that boots up everytimeQuote:
Originally Posted by alpha0ne
:stick:
I got an answer from Sapphire:
"I should have samples soon but I haven't been given a date for them yet"
So basically they gave no information at all.. :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiff
that used to be standard, and now its a feature LOL
:rofl:Quote:
Originally Posted by Millyons
wait, isnt the whole(or at least most) point of the new ati chipset for crossfire capability
sweet.. would be nice with my FX-57 :DQuote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
Guys look on Anandtech at 12 midnight EDT Wesley is posting the first official look at the sapphire retail board that is to be released real soon.
They even kept the board white which we doubted ;)
I'll be keeping an out for that too :)
They even kept the board white which we doubted ;)[/QUOTE]
thank god. It's soooo bling :)
Thanks. Well time to grab grouper and not worry about how to cool northbridge with water... Wait a second... it doesn't really need that kind of cooling now does it? :) Too bad they didn't test it with UTT... I should get spare rig setup with grouper and another X2 to test how things fans out before shoving it under my phase unit... :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Prometheus
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtoe
Very cool, looks like a great board.
Thanks for the heads up man. :toast:
damn nice review!
I might wait for the second revision as I only recently bought my Ultra D but this is definately my next board, especially since they have kept it white :toast:
:slobber: Even VTT tracking is there in bios, another subtle thing to tweak... It definitely looks like a killer board - might be my first non-DFI one for years unless I finally manage to buy the Asus for Dothan first :D
this board looks nice, I might get it if its not too much. I'll wait for bh-5 results first but.
Thank you Prometheus !
It's been a long time waiting on this mobo,nice to see you do the first review of it.
I'm relieved to know the SB450 got it's bugs ironed out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prometheus
I'm in as soon as the Crossfire version is out. The bios options look great!
My psychic hotline called and said that many memory sticks (and a few CPUs) will die as enthusiasts rush for OC glory on these boards. :woot:
Mine tells me that this one may even bootup everytimeQuote:
Originally Posted by gundamit
VX, BH5 etc all clock just as good as on the DFI NF4, My EB actually hits the highest stable fsb on the grouper in dual channel mode booting from bios.
The only minor issue is 300+ is a little harder but thats being worked on with bios etc, at 280+ its real fast as i said before and 2T has been tweaked to perform real well also.
Crossfire has ALL the same bios options as grouper, so if you want dual video cards you won't be disapointed.
bigtoe sir, thank you very much for bringing all those bits of info and :woot:
Halibut - Activate!
Yea man we are very grateful............. :toast:Quote:
Originally Posted by LowRun
Does anyone have any idea what the MSRP will be when it hits the shelfs? Anyone think sub $150?
hey it didnt mention when it will hit the shelfs did it? I might have missed it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by situman
:) :clap: :toast:Quote:
Originally Posted by Anandtech
thanks Wesley :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Prometheus
eva getting one of these are you?? Me too, lets see who can get their BH-5 the highest!
TCCD is where its at :fact: :p:Quote:
Originally Posted by blackjok3r
Sapphire tells me they will officially launch next Friday, August 5th, and that most markets around the world should have retail boards for sale by August 15th to 20th. My review was based on what is supposed to be the shipping Award BIOS.
Crossfire boards are ready to go, but my guess (and it's just that) is that ATI is having an internal was between groups that want to ship Crossfire now and those that want to release Crossfire with R520 in a couple of months. As soon as this is decided you will likely see Crossfire rollout quickly.
IMHO Crossfire needs to ship now. If R520 performs near nVidia 7800GTX the only way you can see a performance difference with dual R520s is with a 30'' Apple Cinema at $4000 to $5000 running 2500x2000 with eye candy all on. The new cards in dual mode are MONITOR limited. A single 7800GTX or R520 will be plenty for most people - even Xtreme Forum members.
EDIT: I should have read the first four pages before... :)
just get a x800xl to hold you over until r520 drops in price like 7800gtx. I wonder if Nvidia is launching the 7800ultra at the same time. teehee that would be interesting.
Any details about the price ? :hehe:
:rofl: ... Some members don't really care about "plenty". They are the freaks thats keep the Xtreme circus so entertaining. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Prometheus
Ah, no more for me please. I've got plenty. lol
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prometheus
He obviously doesn't know about Xtreme :hehe:Quote:
Originally Posted by gundamit
There's a lot more red plastic and two less pci-e x1 slots on anand's pic of halibut than on the pic that was floating around before. Also, two sata ports, a cmos chip and some other IC are all missing from below the pci slots at the bottom of the board in Anand's pic.