I just hope I can get the board soon. Need to test a few things with this chip and BIOSes and then I'm set to go. ;) :p:
I just hope I can get the board soon. Need to test a few things with this chip and BIOSes and then I'm set to go. ;) :p:
So what's the best BIOS out currently for this board if you have a Phenom? I am seriously thinking about trying the DFI.
LOL......Ask sir KTE I have just Knighted Him and He's obligated now:hrhr: :D
For Phenom I cannot say and my opinion on the Bios offering from DFI is from the Dual Core perspective and it could be that my opinion basis would be completely different if I were running Phenom:cool: When I hear rumors circulating that their is a fine line with the A64 & Phenom Bios coding and it either favors one or the other when coding Bios I have to wonder if I am a little hard on DFI Bios Team lately???? But I certainly welcome guys like KTE that have a strong working knowledge of the Phenom as it will help me with my theories on this Bios situation as of late and either validate my opinions or contradict them either way its all good with me as I really just want to know whats up with this Recent Bios and others before because its bugging the sh@t out of me not being able to heavy info from Phenom users on this board!
Oh KTE where art thou:welcome:
Well, I only know bits and bats but I'll give it my best shot as I expect possible by an air cooling user when I can get it.
Can anyone tell me if you have the TLB patch applied to the latest or best DFI BIOS for Phenom?
If yes, do you have an option to turn it off through the BIOS? (TLB cache option is there IIRC)
If yes, then do you have any Super Pi and WinRAR comparisons with no patch Vs patch but turned off?
Thanks :)
thx for that "instability" statement, im sure that was necessary.....Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
it's looking like not enough cpu volts instead, going another .5v over what is already prime stable is solving the lockups after loads (for ref 235 and up)
my question about the vdroop was to get MORE, since that's the smallest i've ever seen
going on 2 days at 2.73ghz, 248ref, 8x nb+ht, no lock-up yet going from load to idle... hope it holds
Hey, Iketh whats up man? Sounds good man anymore feedback for the current Bios compared to previous?
Iketh, yes it's necessary and it wasn't a sarcastic comment but a factual statement to help you - in bold so you don't miss it. People are quick to blame anything where instability arises and I've seen this from the beginning, usually the elusive bug. But as Sami stated many times, if it does that then it's just oc instability. Like now, I can P95 2.8G through multiplier alone but it will lockup randomly even after bootup if I leave it to idle -> instability, nothing else. And I'm not willing to feed it high volts which it'll need, which'll throw temps too high and thus it's unstable even if it passes a few tests. :)
If you have more Vdroop, your system would fail stability testing and you'd need to add more BIOS volts based off your last post.
:shakes: , so Orthos/CoreTemp and or CPU-Z were causing my freezing... I ran 11hour+ with 14x250, RAM 1:1 4-4-4-12 and some other tightish timings.
So now I finally found that Ill try and check some other RAM OC'ing and maybe I could get a higher CPU OC. Ill try the Memory Hole Remap as well.
One question guys is DFI 790fx compatible with swiftech H20 - 120 Compact liquid cooling kits? THANKS
Bah, HDD still corrupts with RAM running 267Mhz. Crap. Also tried to boot while DVD drive (using ATA while HDD's use SATA) but didnt matter.
Oh well, back running 251Mhz 4-4-4 timings then. Tried to enable Memory Hole but that didnt help either.
Though I dont understand why the HDD would corrupt while running high memory speed. I'd expect the PC to reboot/BSOD/hang earlier than just corrupt the HDD?:shrug:
These boards are really great with the exception of the storage options and you really need a Raid Controller to be 100% satisfied or perhaps I am spoiled but I think I will opt for the first conclusion:D
How can i do overclocked? :D
Spread Spectrum - Disabled
CPU Host/HTT Clock - 246MHz
CPU Host/HTT Boot Up Clock - 230MHz
CPU Host/HTT Adjust Gap - 2MHz
PCIE Clock - 100MHz
Onboard LAN1 - Disabled
Onboard LAN2 - Enabled
Onboard 3132 Mode - Disabled
CPU VID Control - 1.42500V
CPU VID Special Add - Auto
CPU NB Voltage Control - 1.30000V
CPU NB VID Special Add - Auto
DRAM Voltage Control - 2.07V
SB PLL 1.2V Voltage - 1.40V
NB Core Voltage - 1.330 V
NB PCIE Voltage - 1.120 V
NB HT Voltage - 1.350 V
Virtualization - Disabled
AMD K8 Cool&Quiet control - Disabled
NPT Fid control - x11
CPU-NB DID - 1
CPU-NB FID - 04
AMD CPU stepping - P0
HT Link Width - 16bit
HT Link Frequency - 1.6GHz
IH Flow-Control Mode - Disabled
HT Link Tri-State - Disabled
2x LCLK Mode - Disabled
UnitID Clumping - Disabled
Timing Mode - Manual
Memory Clock Value or Limit - DDR 800
DCTs Mode - Unganged
CKE based powerdown - Per Channel
Memclock tri-stating - Disabled
2T Mode - Enabled
CAS Latency Time - 4 CLK
Precharge delay (tRAS) - 12 CLK
DRAM RAS# Precharge - 4 CLK
DRAM RAS# to CAS# Delay - 4 CLK
Bank to Bank Cmd (TRRD) - 2CLK
TRC - 16T
TRTP - 2 CLK - 4 CLK
Write Recovery (TWR) - 3 CLK
Write-Read Command (TWTR) - 2 CLK
TRFC0-3 - 105.0ns
Trdrd - 2 CLK
TrwtTO - 3 CLK
Twrrd - 0 CLK
Twrwr - 1 CLK
CS/ODT Pin Fine Delay - Enabled
TLB Cache Mode - Enabled
Bank Swizzle Mode - Enabled
Auto Tweak Performance - Enabled
Optimal Performance Mode - Enabled
DRAM Drivers Weak Mode - Normal Drive
Output Driver Comp. - Auto
Advanced Chipset Features:
Memory Hole - Disabled
Memory Hole Remapping - Enabled
Auto Optimize Bottom IO - Enabled
Bottom of (31:24) IO space - C0
System BIOS Cacheable - Disabled
Onboard FDC Controller - Disabled
Onboard Serial Port - Disabled
Onboard IRDA Select - Disabled
CIR Port Address - Disabled
PCIE Configuration:
Secondary Dual Slot Config - Auto
P2P b/w Primary/Secondary - Enabled
GPP Power Limit, W - 25
GFX Port 1/3/4:
Gen2 High Speed Mode - Disabled
Link ASPM - Disabled
Link Width - Auto
Slot Power Limit, W - 75
PCIE GPP Link Width - 2.1.1.1.1
NB-SB Port Features:
Link ASPM - Disabled
VC1 Traffic Support - Disabled
HD Azalia Audio - Disabled
OnChip SATA Controller - Enabled
OnChip SATA Type - Native IDE
IDE DMA transfer access - Enabled
Primary IDE Controller - Disabled
OnChip USB Controller - Enabled
USB EHCI Controller - Enabled
OnChip USB KBC Controller - Enabled
USB Mouse Support - Disabled
ACPI Suspend Type - S1(POS)
C2 Disable/Enable - Disabled
Soft Off by PWRBTN - Instant-Off
PowerOn by PCI Card - Disabled
ACPI XSDT Table - Disabled
HPET Support - Enabled
POWER ON Function - BUTTON ONLY
PWRON After PWR-Fail - On
ATC Alarm Resume - Disabled
Init Display First - PCIEX
Resources Controller By - Auto
PCI/VGA Palette Snoop - Disabled
Assign IRQ for VGA - Enabled
Assign IRQ For USB - Enabled
PCI Latency Timer (Per 8CLK) - 8
INT Pin 1 to 8 Assignment - Auto
PCI Express relative items, Maximum Payload Size - 128
is this the setting that I should do??? THANK YOU!!:up:Quote:
Originally Posted by Iketh
so I was about to do some benching/test on this board, however....
Got win xp x64 installed and running. Updated it and everything and on the last build I had I used speed fan to monitor temps, so I figured I'd use it on this build as well....wrong. It froze my computer as it was loading, then when I re-started it, I get a C1 diagnostic LED code and it doesn't boot at all. I tried taking out the battery, disconnecting power, clearing cmos (and various other combinations of that). Is my system/bios hosed or what?
Well Phenom I don't have but all of the 2 times with the 1/3/08 Beta and 1 time with 1/3/08 Official release I have gotten C1 Errors each time I have installed that Bios:down:
well, it's still original bios...didn't flash it yet on that board 11/22/07
Hey BrotherE,
Saw another thread on here where c1 is a memory error (you suggested it that one it could also mean the bios chip needs to be re-programmed). If re-programming does need to be done, what is the procedure for that? You do that sort of thing, don't you?
*edit* n/m somehow by pressing the pressing reset/power buttons one last time on the motherboard it finally worked and my cmos cleared. I booted up *yay*
those settings are 8+ hours prime stable (cpu AND blend) running D9GMH modules and my particular phenom... my problem has always been lock-ups from load-to-idle statesQuote:
Originally Posted by Zabething
so i posted for anyone (particularly KTE) to laugh hysterically at one of my settings and say "THAT'S UR PROBLEM !!!" because i feel a lock-up is innevitable as it has always been when running reference clocks above 234
this time around (for the official 1/3/08), i got 250 as stable as i could, which was a lock-up in 1-15 mins after boot, then simply lowered reference by 2 clocks until im not locking up anymore... 248 took 3 days to lock up, and so far 246 hasn't failed...
EDIT: take note that i corrected voltages i previously listed, not sure how i goofed that up
If all else fails that would be the last resort and you need programming tools to do all of that (Hardware) that is/Quote:
Originally Posted by serial099
So here you go SB600 VS SB700 ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau
http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...3&postcount=32
Right... after setting all RAM timings to the max I tried once again 12x267... It did corrupt my HDD.
I wanted to see where the max would be then and tried 265Mhz and it worked. I thought about the 680i and its straps so I tried 275Mhz and it booted, but back at 267Mhz it doesnt... Right...
Anyway, now I only need to find a way to get it to run at 293Mhz but no luck yet. Also it looks like if I select a HTT which has a pretty high Delta compared to the previous HTT the HDD corrupts, but if I set it less high, boot, restart, higher etc it doesnt corrupt lol.
Hello guys, I 've been reading this thread for a while now but I had nothing to say so i didn't wrote before.
Well I supose I could say a "thank you" to Brother Esau and everyone else about their effort and help that they provide to all of us.
Anyway I just wanted to share with you something that I found over Sapphire's download section and I think it's very helpfull.
Here you go then: Bios Guide Description
Quote:
Originally Posted by tictac
Hey, thanks tictac:) not really the big difference I was expecting to see:(
@an|ko..............Rock on man thanks for the Bios PDF it answers some questions for me that I have been trying to find out:up:
So after some swapping/troubleshooting I figured out that somehow one of my ramsticks is bad. Or at least it would appear that way. Have a pair of 1gb corsiar xms2 sticks and when I put one of them in (we'll call it stick a) it boots fine but when I put stick b in (either by itself or with stick a) it stops booting and gives me a c1 error. Strange it went bad after I tried to run speed fan.
I've never experienced that where a piece of software seems to have such an effect on a piece of hardware. Going to try and tweak out my bios settings today on that board, but being I'm down to 1gb of ram atm might not get too impressive of numbers off of it.
*edit* BTW, double-checked and this one did have the 11/22 bios on it just to clear up that mystery
I don't know how it is these days but Back in the DFI NF4 days We all avoided Corsair Ram on DFI motherboards like the plague!
well, this is the first time I've gotten either corsair ram or a DFI board. I figured that Corsair was a good name brand and DFI being a good name brand, so it'd mix well together.....wrong on my part. I notice you have OCZ, do those play nice with DFI? Other brands that are on the up and up?
Got a $50 gift certificate at Newegg to spend, so I guess I'll just have to put that towards some new RAM...*sigh*
People deny it but its my belief that DFI boards are tailored towards OCZ Ram Primarily, also OCZ works very closely with DFI and I have yet to get anything but the best results with DFI/OCZ combo:cool:
Yes these FLEX 9200 on this board will do 1190mhz @ 2.12vdimm in Bios
I would recommend the FLEX 9200 or the Reaper 1050
I do not see much in the way of selection for what you might want at Egg Head as I would recommend OCZ, Mushkin, G-Skill , Crucial and from what I see with current availability you would probably fair the best with the Crucial right now for what they have at new egg
Those Flex's look nice yeah, problem however is the huge heatspreaders which won't fint below the TRUE:(.
Did some more testing with the RAM btw. I tried the 10x351 thingy with dividers and somehow my system holded very much longer, looks like AMD still loves running dividers:p:.
Though didnt manage to hit anything near 293Mhz, more like 280 which results in 3.4Ghz...
Also a few quick tests at 280Mhz in Everest showed a huge drop in performance vs 251Mhz 4-4-4. So Im happy as it is now. Maybe an updated version of the 03/01 BIOS without the issues in it will solve it a little. Maybe more Vdimm will solve it but I dont feel like running much higher than 2.25V on 2.1V rated sticks with standard heatspreaders (not big sized ones). I do have a fan over them but still.
Time to move onto the GPU's again and do a little pencilmod I'd say:D. And of course wait for a better BIOS and maybe it will improve things.
Thanks for the recommendation. I'll poke around the egg and see what (if anything) I can come up with for a replacement. I think I want to go with a couple of 2gb sticks at PC6400 or better (probably better). The OCZ selection on there with the above restrictions is slim pickings ATM that's for sure.
Yes this Ram with this Board has its limitations if Air Cooling that for sure! I just Barely make the grade with my FLEX / Tuniq Tower 120:D
I hit a very nice 305mhz on my Team Xtreem and finally hit the limitations of cpu running 1:1 (305x12) Guess it could have went higher was only @ 2.2V
Lockup is not inevitable unless the system is unstable and no one laughed at you neither shouted. Your CPU was unstable as is a known characteristic for Phenom to show in this way but you kept puzzling over why and I informed you, either lower it down or add volts if you really want a stable oc, because it's unstable. Known this behavior since November with Phenoms, nothing new. I get it with the new 9600 BE too, the second its over 2.712G. I need to shoot up from 1.32V to 1.392V to get it stable then, i.e. no lockups whilst idling. The more load you put on Phenom, the better it seems to do but the minute you bench memory/idle 20 mins, you'll see it freeze if you have too low volts. If I boot 2.812G at 1.3V it does the exact same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iketh
Brother: Change of plan. Can't get hold of DFI board, tried another MSI RD790 today and the CPU didn't do any better at all, so I'm giving it a miss until B3 now. :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau
what is the size of those fan stick on your mosfet?
is it runnin on a high speed (rpm)?
Hey Brother,
What were you trying to link to? That product says it deactivated. (at least for me)
Fixed:confused:
I assume this as a replacement to the 70x70x15 fans for the transpiper?
Currently I'm using a 70mm Yate Loon fan and it seems to working out ok and undervolted it sounds just as quiet as any other fan in my system.
http://www.performance-pcs.com/catal...ducts_id=22820
Quote:
Originally Posted by serial099
how was the speed then (rpm)?
I have a 70mm x 15mm AMD Heatsink Fan on my Transpiper as well:)
BY Popular Request
Hmmm,
lol.
I decided to give my 4x1GB OCing one more try. I upped Voltage to 2.3V and used (10x350)/6 and it friggin booted up:eek:. Though couldnt get it to even finish 32M for 3 tests. Upped to 2.35V still no go. At that point I decided to stop it since D9's, at least like a year ago, liked the die after a few months of high Voltage. Though Ive no clue whether that was due to bad PCB/memory controllers (actually only saw this by people with Intel boards...).
Not taking the risk but maybe 3.4V would have made it. Though the little I could test with Everest showed good results, with untweaked subtimings 36.0 ns latency, 11.5GB read/write.
But as I said I dont really feel like to go higher than 2.35V. I know the memory wont die instantly but if I could manage to get it stable I'd be tempted to run it 24/7 while Im not so sure how long the RAM would survive. They weren't really hot to touch though at 2.35V but still.
Most likely this amount of Volt is needed as Im running 4 DIMMs.
Anyone played with the Drive Strenght settings for RAM yet? It used to improve OC'ing but then again I heard high Drive Strength can kill D9's fairly quick. Though Ive no clue whether 2.0x is high or 1.0x is high:confused:
That new Sapphire board here seems to be a clone of the DFI mobo. The Layout looks identical.
Only difference it's alittle more expensive here in germany atm.
Yep, it can increase oc/stability. Just have a high MaxAsyncLatency value and you should be good. If drive strength is incorrect, the system should tell you at bootup when it performs the calculations.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammsteiner
Also, for anyone running P95 and having it stable and later getting freezes/lockups do this: open up AOD, monitor every core. keep your eye on it and what the cores are fluctuating to. I bet if it was 100% stable and you're sure of this but you start getting freezes, there must be PLL movement, i.e. 2.6G set must be shooting up past 2.7G for a quick second and causing lockups. ;)
Just keep an eye on your cores for a while to see if there's any large fluctuation; it'll occur at idle, not under load.
lemme understand this better... u talking about 2.6GHz overclock right? and at idle a core might speed to 2.7GHz????Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
what does PLL stand for?
Hmmm thats interesting infor KTE. I had my 9600 BE running at 2.7Ghz stable at 1.262v. Would boot fine, ran prime 95 stable for 24 hours. Stable in all benchies, like 3dmark06 and pcmark05. But, every once in a while after restarting for unknown reasons when I would go to start up Coretemp, or Everest to monitor temps it would lock those programs and refuse to load them. Granted that was also on 1.2 Bios on the k9a2 plat, so any gain from being at 2.7 was wiped out by the TLB fix. Rolled back to 1.13 to get away from TLB fix, and ended up having to knock the OC down to 2.5 at 1.25v for full stability.
Someone on Toms hardware has a theory that part of the Phenom's issue is a possible hotspot in the die, revolving around either the Northbridge or L3 cache. I do believe that the individual core readings that coretemp shows are correct. Under full load at 2.7 my cores were staying below 31c, but CPU temp according to everest was running and staying below 40c full load on all 4 cores.. So that temp difference between the cores and CPU has to be coming from somewhere.
Phase Lock Loop circuitry. It's what works your HT Ref clock at 200Mhz. If there is a jitter in the signal that it puts out, or a spike it will effect the cores as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iketh
can you uninstall your phenom and cnq driver? hope that fixed freezing issue. oh if you open more tham one program that do i/o operation like coretemp and everest that no good. just use one program ok?
I pointed what I mean out about two weeks ago with my last 9600 BE. Look here=> http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...&postcount=736
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/1236/fluctru8.png
Froze straight after that. :(
At any core clock, even just idling at 2.35G. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Iketh
I'm on 1.13 BETA, it gives me best results TBH. But I'll try for some high bandwidth dependent numbers by rolling over to P0E next. Sami showed 211 x 12.5 CPU, 211 x 12 IMC/HT and 211 x 2.66 RAM and I know this chip does 216 x 12.5 CPU, 216 x 12 NB/HT and 216 x 2.66 RAM easy. Imagine CR1 at 1148 with low volts.. would be nice don't you think? :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Mathos
The monitoring apps read from the sub-IHS temp probes AFAIK but the highest internal core temp reading is what EVEREST labels as "CPU" and that has to stay <70C.Quote:
Someone on Toms hardware has a theory that part of the Phenom's issue is a possible hotspot in the die, revolving around either the Northbridge or L3 cache. I do believe that the individual core readings that coretemp shows are correct. Under full load at 2.7 my cores were staying below 31c, but CPU temp according to everest was running and staying below 40c full load on all 4 cores.. So that temp difference between the cores and CPU has to be coming from somewhere.
Just know for sure, that idling, on air/water (not chilled), the CPU cannot be ambient temps, as an IC will current running through and resistance. On just air cooling, 95W TDP, even 45W TDP, with CnQ enabled (which IIRC throws TDP down to 60W on Phenom) the temps cannot be less than ~+8C above heatsink ambient (not room ambient, but heatsink ambient which is hotter than case/room). These are IC limitations once there is TDP. The RD790 chip has a 10W TDP and at 22C ambient it will be idling at plus 28C, so you can judge next to that for accurate/inaccurate values.
Not sure what is happening with temp values nowadays, we know Intel has big problems with its Penryn line probes mostly faulty but some are sounding ludicrous. I saw someone boasting about 1.65V 4.5G full load on normal air at 40C. I mean, yeah, 5W TDP chip, fair enough, but at >180W TDP? That honestly made me wonder :wth: is wrong here.
Why should this cause the problem if CnQ is BIOS disabled tictac?Quote:
Originally Posted by tictac
I installed the driver after my freezing actually.
100% true. ;)Quote:
oh if you open more tham one program that do i/o operation like coretemp and everest that no good. just use one program ok?
Opening CPUZ/EVEREST/CoreTemp along with AOD will and can cause this problem. That's why I only try and open one. Worst is if you have any of them open and try to open AOD. That'll usually throw the PLL haywire up fast.
ok .. lets see how high your phenom can clock stable in windows safe mode.
Well, for me, we have problems as Safe Mode puts 2-3 minutes of 70-100% processor load whilst booting and doesn't let any driver/app work to show frequency. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by tictac
However, I tried it just now. Same limit as before -> 2756 and below stable and sub-2840 into Windows capturable. Booted this pretty easy first time.
http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/7...board01oe2.jpg
Already tried high MAL but well, about 10ns. That booted up fine however stability was a complete other thing not showing its face.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
Well, the DFI BIOS at least has all those Drive Strength options like in the AOD. I saw a post of ozzimark somewhere (as he had the 4x 1GB record in the DDR2 database for AMD). He used some sort of program to change Drive Strength however Ive no clue what the calculations are behind those settings.
And how would the system tell me at boot up if calculations are incorrect? post codes? Like I got to reset my CMOS? Or more as Im about to start Windows, detecting IDE drives etc? Is there anywhere some sort of guide for it?
And as I said, I heard D9 can get killed pretty fast when Drive Strength is way too high/strong, so Ive really no clue but I'd like to learn about it:rolleyes:. The fact I got it to run 293Mhz and do 1M SuperPI calculations and a few Everest tests tell me it's somehow possible to keep that speed, but I'd like to keep the V's a little bit reasonable though.
Also, as far as I understood, Drive Strength etc doesnt decrease performance but is like PCI-e clocks right? It can increase stability but if the frequency is too high/wrong it can kill the cards/DIMMs in it?
Ok, I tried setting Drive Strength to weak mode and the 3 strengths of 1.50x to 1.0x. Posted however didnt go beyond 'FF'. Set the changed strengths to 1.25x instead and it booted and ran 32M SuperPI with 2.3V :D. DIMM's weren't very hot, warm though, I guess about 30~40C. Gonna play some more later on but Drive Strengths are awesome obviously.
Just tried 2.25V but that wasn't doing it, got the SQR error in SuperPI. However maybe a little more Drive Strength tweaking will solve it. At least I know one of the changed settings doesnt like to be at 1.0x. So Ill trial and error wise try to find the one(s). Also the original 1.0x Ill try to start at 0.75x.
Less Voltage and less Drive Strengths seem to be a sweet spot, at least for D9GMH. Voltage isnt much of a problem for me though, more worried about Drive Strengths as they can kill D9's if they're way too tight.
FYI, Ive a 80CFM 92mm fan pointed towards the DIMM's from ~10cm and an unknown CFM 120mm fan 10cm above the DIMM's sucking hot air out of the case. So Ill try and get better results.
I dont feel like changing the Ohm settings though as that seems a little bit dangerous.
AFAIK lowering Drive Strengths doesnt hurt performance, not sure about it really. Does anyone know?
No actually in some instances it increases it due to the way the memory interact s and the the way the data is transmitted to the Memory controller in the cpu.
It also could be that Transend Memory does not completely play well with DFI Motherboards that just may be the case as DFI Boards are very picky with Memory!
Not sure if this will help anyone, but my experience from playing with Drive strenghts on my Lanparty nf590SLi board, was that by changing the Drive Strength values, my memory was more stable overclocked further in MHz but worse timings, or that my memory would be more stable with tight timings, but much lower overcklock in MHz (same Voltage). Long time since I played with those values, so I dont remember exactly what made the difference for what.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammsteiner
I hope somebody got the point :rolleyes:
You mean the Drive Strength or the performance? Cause increasing the Drive Strength is the thing Im just trying not to do. If it's about performance, yeah. Certain lower timings dont automatically translate to better performance. When I had the A64 3400+ Clawhammer with OCZ PC3700EB I remember tRAS lower than 10 and higher than 10 gave worse performance than tRAS of 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau
Haha, yeah, DFI is quite picky, especially combined with AMD CPU's:ROTF:. But with some tweaking things gets less worse:cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau
Im now running back at 2.3V again and set all Strengths to 1.0x apart from one, was set to 1.25x (can't remember which one anymore though) however it looks like I picked the right one as it booted up:D. Will post later on which one I changed.
However, Im thinking right if I set all those settings lower the Drive Strength becomes lower too right? I mean, it looks like a multiplier so lower multiplier would give lower... yeah lower... wtf Ive no clue.
Maybe Drive Strength is more about the Ampere trough the slots? Higher Volt with same Ampere gives more Watt which might be the thing killing D9's. If Ampere is lower Watt's will be reduced too. But Ive no clue on that. I just would like to know whether Im actually decreasing or increasing Drive Strengths the way Im changing things now. At least I set the DRAM Drivers Weak Mode to Weak, that's for sure weak then:p:
phenom does NOT have individual core temp capability, :banana::banana::banana::banana:ty i know... one diode for the entire packageQuote:
Originally Posted by Mathos
It has 14 temp probes actually but for some reason, only one beneath the IHS and one internal core is gauged by software. That's why all Phenom core temps are always in sync. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Iketh
Well its like this .....If you feed High Voltage to you're Ram in return you must give your CPU more Voltage as well. So in essence AMD processors "Prefer" Lower voltage memory thats just the way it works perhaps a thorough reading and understanding of the Architecture would be a wise move for you ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammsteiner
YOU Must learn How the Memory Communicates with the Memory Controller if you want any success on AMD Platform without damaging you're components!
Balance is the solution Wood Pecker , not Voltage!
I found a PDF of AM2 CPU's with a lot of info. Also how RAM manufacturers should program the modules to work with AM2. However the fun part is it's all written in strange program language and not making any sense to me.
Are you talking about the BKDG?
drive strengths increase and decrease performance most of the time... i used winrar's built-in benchmark when playing with drive strengths on my asus m2n-e, it's possible for one setting adjustment to give +30MB/s and vice-versa
No idea, I mean this one:Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
http://www.amd.com/us-en/assets/cont...docs/32559.pdf
And it makes no sense. I lost any clue right after Cas Latency lol.
At this point I hate Intel. Normally there was a guide for every AMD fart after 3 minutes of a released product and now there isn't even a slight little explanation of those Drive Settings. I know the 790FX isn't that old however those timings excisted already on the nForce 590SLI, and that one has been out for a long time.
Yeah it's the BKDG but not written for you but for BIOS and software developers, so it makes perfect sense to them. ;)
Well, it's actually quite interesting as far as I can understand it:D.
Also found this, looked at the wrong chapter previously:p:.
So AFAIK reducing On-Die Termination reduces resistance of some sort of power. I guess that power goes to/is available for the DIMMsQuote:
Originally Posted by AMD spam posts
Adress/Command Drive Strength if you want tighter timings, if you increase the multiplier you might get just that little bit better stability with timings
MEMCLK Drive Strength increasing might give you a little more stability by increasing the multiplier for the last few Mhz
etc
Or am I on the wrong side and should it be the other way around? Decrease the multi's?
Thus to go short for the little I understand, Addr/Cmd Drive Strength could be set lower than default 1.50x, MEMCLK might be tried a little higher to 2.0x to increase stability in high Mhz. Data Drive Strength has maybe something to do with 1T/2T timings, could be set lower eventually.
CS/ODT Drive Strength and CKE are still a big questionmark for me but Im sure Ill find it tomorrow somewhere.
And On-Die Termination... meh, still dont feel like playing with that really.
And after those 6 Drive Strength settings, why is there still the DRAM Drivers Weak Mode:confused:
Allright, I searched for the D9GMH B6-3 datasheet from Micron and found out the following
CS/ODT Drive Strength is about the resistance for all sorts of DQS parameters, varying from 50, 75 and 150Ohm. However the BIOS setting on this motherboard is about the CPU ODT. Also I dont know if the multipliers effect the resistance or actually the Ampere so resistance gets reduced.
CKE Drive Strength is some sort of control thing on the DDR2 for about everything which the Memory Controller will receive.
Announcement:....D.F.I Recalls / Removes...... 1/03/2008 Official Bios:up:
Here's the Post from RGone .....@DFIClub
So... i tested the 1/03/2008 bios and finally i get a nice 385 Mhz bus speed :)
http://91.121.66.101/img/ok_9x385.jpg
But i can't get something like 8.5x385 perhaps with the next bios...
This is a useful read into its technical aspects: http://www.altera.com/literature/an/an408.pdfQuote:
Originally Posted by Rammsteiner
Mess about with MaxAsyncLatency instead of Drive Strength, you're wasting your time. ;)
DRAM Drive Strength is maximum set by default on most boards but traditionally the DFI sets them very low (weak) which was good for Samsung TCCD and nothing else that I know recall. This RD790 frm DFI sets it pretty high up. It's for DRAM stability when more than one DIMM exists especially under loading. Most RAMs will like strong DDS which let's you attain higher clock speeds usually. This is DRAM Drive Strength, different to Data Drive Strength, which loves high signal strength and weaker values.
ffs, Read the whole CPU PDF and Micron PDF and then this:ROTF:. I decided this afternoon already to quit it and set everything back as they were, Normal Drive Strength and 1.00x to the top three ones and 1.50x to the lower three ones. Especially after I booted into Windows but everything flipped and I got a warning about HDD corruption and possible registries being deleted:eek:.
I decided to stay with the current settings, 4-4-4-10 with 2.25V @ 502Mhz. Does the work fine and does after all even less than a 500MB/s transfer less than the 586Mhz 5-5-5-15. So Im fine with this now I guess.
Thx though KTE for linking that, makes a lot more sense with less pages!
And new DFI BIOS... 1/30... w0000t, curious what that will bring us.
Yes I am very Glad that DFI decided to listen to all that has been posted here :)
Remeber Kids...... Church Mice Get nothing thats why I encourage all of you to get involved and give you're feedback on the DFI Bios for this board as it takes more than one person to Rock the Boat :D Catch my Drift? (No Pun Intended):rofl:
Announcement: .......""NEW" ...1/30/2008 ..Beta Bios Test the Bios at you're own Risk! Sorry guys but I am getting ready next week to move back East and there is no Physical way I can be there to help in the event of a Bad Flash due to the move!
Campbell;)
EDIT:.....OK...So far no C1 Error , No Problems with NIC Latency . No Problems with Ram Latency with Internal Values set incorrectly in DRAM Table , Different Bios Layout ...Me Likes so far , and nothing ATM seems bad :up: ;)
GO AHEAD BOYS Flash to new BETA:)
My first impressions are allright.
I love the newer lay-out a lot. There are no descriptions on the options but the options them selves are a lot clearer though. I love that.
Only thing I like less is that instead of hanging in some sort of POST code after the IDE devices check it now hangs before it so you got to reset CMOS before you can change it back again. It's not a disaster, just a little annoying.
Didnt notice anything else yet though, not really 'tested' BIOS's before. But as I said, the new lay-out is a lot better though:D
Just to add: when you play with Drive Strength, be very cautious. Weaker is better, the weaker, the better for your RAM's. D9's regularly have higher than usual current passing through them, higher than ProMOS and Elpida DDR2 IC's anyway, hence they run hotter at the same voltage/settings and require higher power although they also overclock better. They also, for this reason, will fail quicker especially if not cooled sufficiently, motherboard overvolts and if the supply line isn't regulated well from idle to load transitions of loadline offshoot V. Different boards/BIOSes can set differing drive strengths and this can and does kill RAM when you're left wondering how. Worst case scenario is if your SMPS has too much ripple voltage on the +3.3V, with poor voltage regulation on the motherboard along with high voltage and high drive strength RAM => bound to die very quick. ;)
Every IC is different with it's limits regardless of the same conditions and manufacturing process. If you feed your D9's above the threshold they "like", they will degrade and start to suffer from electronmigration instantly. Then you see users moaning about dying RAM when they DID apply high voltage themselves at least once. ;) Typical sign of that is, you need higher voltage for stability at stock rated settings, and as time continues, this voltage will increase up-to at least the 2.6V region just to run CAS4 800 with Crucial Ballistix 1066 5-5-5-15 2.2V.
Yeah,
thx for reminding. That's why I was looking earler for those 6 Drive Strengths as I didnt even know whether they're the Drive Strengths able to kill the RAM. They're on auto now however Ill play with them soon and decrease the multipliers as much as possible.
Know not of the IDE/Sata HDD issues due to the fact I run a Raid Controler so I cannot comment good bad or indifferent on that subject but so Far the Bios is very good and none of the previous issues I experienced on all 3 different Flashes with the 1/03/08 Beta & Official release are present :up: New Layout in Bios is nice clears up allot of confusion related to PCI-E settings and in general its very nice.
One thing I notice though is that there is still not proper support for AMD Overdrive on this Board lock ups and BSOD in Windows when installed and that just by having it open to view temps and settings not even making any adjustments though AMD Overdrive:confused: I don't overclock in Windows any way never have but something tells me that there is something lacking in Bios code that allows AMD Overdrive tio coexist peacefully:rolleyes:
Can some of you guys install the new 1/30/08 Beta and see if AMD Overdrive is a issue for you and also give feedback in general please Phenom users please join in on this!
Gave up on AOD long time ago. Dont like Windows OC/ing anyway. Only things I believe in are Atitool, Memset, CPU-Z and CoreTemp.
Anyway, got a new OC for today, about the max for my PC: 11x320:D. 3.52Ghz and the RAM ~DDR1006. Had to change MAL from 4ns to 6ns though but it's stable now and a lot of bandwith. Only thing decreased was the latency in Everest, from 36.5 to 37 and read performance went down with about 50MB/s. Then again Write went up with about 100~200MB/s and Copy with 50MB/s. Was faster over all in SuperPI as well.
Found the max now I think, will do some GPU tuning soon as well and then reinstall Windows and GAME!:D.
Poor school, or it's me sitting behind the TV while Priming or gaming:ROTF:
If AMD Overdrive could be on the same caliber as Uguru is then we would have something good to work with!:shocked:
http://service.futuremark.com/compare?3dm06=4994260
As description already states, not 100% done yet with the subtimings. Mainly things as tWRWR, tWRRD and tRDRD aren't optimized yet.
For now Ive this in 3.5 beta (from left top to right bottom):
4-4-4-10-2T-15-7.8us-3-4-3-4-105ns-105ns-105ns-105ns-4-3-4-4-16x-7-6ns-E-8-13.
And still got to do the pencil mod on the GPU's too.
well guys, i have gone over the thread and find no mention of this issue so it might be new but here goes.
brand new 790FX-M2R, shipped BIOS was the november one. i have tried every BIOS under the sun with the same results. basically, the system is locked at 133MHz HTT. the BIOS shows default of 200 (thats as low as you can go) but in Windows, everything reads 133MHz. i can adjust multi, memory timings, and NB frequency it seems, but HTT does nothing and is always 133MHz~135MHz with the memory on a 1:2 ratio.
once in a while after a BIOS reset, if i don't go into the BIOS and let the system go straight to windows i get a 200MHz, once i got 242MHz, but after a reboot, back to 133MHz. here is a shot of CPU-Z:
http://www.3oh6.com/forum_posted/0801/dfi_cpuz-2.png
BTW, does the same thing with a Phenom processor as well. any ideas? anyone experienced this? TIA for any help.
3oh6: you're not opening AOD are you? If so don't and see what it does. AOD is known to cause this problem, throws HT ref. sub stock on opening.
have you install amd phenom driver?
tictac who is the most beautiful girl in you're avatar?
nope, not opening AOD. CPU-Z is the first thing i open after boot and it shows the 133MHz HTT.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
for the Phenom chips yes, i tried installing the Phenom driver, no change. still boots at 133MHz. with the 3200+ there was no CPU driver loaded.Quote:
Originally Posted by tictac
i have borked a couple installs and have done fresh installs with both the 3200+ and the phenom chips with the same results. i just did a long battery out CMOS clear (3 hours) followed by a re-flash of the official December BIOS. i noticed this time that there was 'No Update' on the very first line of the flash during the write of the new BIOS...should there be? i am just using the .EXE and letting it write the floppy then do its thing automatically from boot.
also, as i was thinking if there was a way to see CPU frequency before windows i saw the new Memtest thread from Eva so popped it in and it too shows a CPU frequency in-line with 133MHz HTT except for after the first boot after a CMOS clear in which case it is running 200HTT. so it is being set in the BIOS and not some funky thing with Windows reading it wrong.
thanks for the help guys, obviously no one has seen this before but hopefully i can get it sorted without having to send the board back for a new one.
Nvrmind this, decided to do another Prime run but longer now (only ran 2 hours last time) however it BSOD'd. Stupidly enough, I changed a few timings in Memset where I wasnt even sure that's stable.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammsteiner
Testing CPU now with Small FFT's @ 11x320 1.488V. Memory is just below 200Mhz and enough V's on them for sure. Just a pure CPU test time now and see what it really can do without messing with timings. I so suck on OC'ing now and then, full with stupid actions really.
Well something is wrong with 12/11/07 and I told DFI in detail my thoughts on it when using Alpha release and why they made it publicly available I don't have a clue!Quote:
Originally Posted by 3oh6
Also I want you to follow these instructions carefully please there is something wrong with the Bios and the way it Programs the Flash Chip and DFI has just now acknowledged this
Please do the following and this will be requiring 3 Bios Flashes don't question just do please:yepp:
First off you will probably have to reinstall Windows get over it reality may just be that!
First off Download 11/07/07 Bios ....11/22/07 Bios.....1/30/08 Bios all Zip Packages Please
Clear cmos properly and Boot with DR DOS with only a PS2 Keyboard then insert 11/07/07 Bios and Type AUTEXEC.BAT ..let it Flash and do a proper clear cmos for 10 Minutes Boot set Date / Load Optimized Defaults save/exit ..........Let the DMI Data Pool Build ......see if you can get into Windows (I doubt it) due to Different SB600 Option Rom
Then repeat the Process with 11/22/07 Bios
And repeat once again with the 1/30/08 Bios Please
See if that straightens you're Arse out:D
Just so you know I program Bios Chips and I noticed that unless you start with the Initial Release 11/07/2007 on the actual EEprom Programmer It does not Program correctly if you just Erase the chip and program directly with 11/22/2007 Bios:shakes: So from my Findings I program with the 11/07/2007 Bios on my Programmer and then just update Bios via Normal Motherboard Flash and it yields more satisfactory results.
This should not be the case! I should be able to take any .bin file off of the site and it should have all Bios code in it but it does not and I have erased re-programmed to and fro with this board and there is most definitely something going on with the way the Bios is being coded internally at DFI
ALSO.........What Operating System are you trying to use?
ALSO....If you really want to clear you're cmos Properly I recommend using a program called Kill Cmos it will clear that cmos like no other way! You can find it on Tmods CD or Google it!
crap, i was running 1.3.08 bios for about a week, then last nite i went and downloaded speedfan, as soon as i ran it, i get a hang, i reboot and get a c1 error (first ever with this system), i followed all the steps in clearing cmos (through both jumpers and holding the reset and pwr buttons down, also tried different ram, cant confirm if they are 1.8vdimm as some have mentioned to try, please is there anything else i can try to get this thing up and running again other than having to rma the board, TIA
at the time of the hang the system was running at default bios settngs, so disregard the sig
enko
i am running XP.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau
thanks for the advice and the thorough instructions but it didn't change anything. i followed your instructions and still just end up with the same situation.
i noticed when flashing the first BIOS only half of the first line had no flash as well with the second BIOS. the third was back to not flashing the whole first line. not sure if that means anything but that is all that i noticed.
You can find the Tmod/Loggan cd here.
Also have you tried flashing with no command line switches?
Tmod
3oh6: uninstall the CnQ/Phenom drivers>reboot and see how it goes, if you haven't already tried this separately.
Also, with Phenom, check the BIOS options to see any NB/HT multiplier option. Make sure they're set to 9x (1800MHz), any more and you'll get a low HT ref. clock.
i have just been flashing with the autoexec.bat and followed BEs instructions above which said go with autoexec.bat as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tmod
yeah, it isn't a Windows issue...the clocks are the same in Memtest in DOS.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
and i am back on the 3200+ to rule out anything else with the Phenoms.
First time I've heard of it and it looks like your PLLs are stuck. When I had this board, I tested Phenom and X2 BE-2350 in it and they ran fine even with the early BIOSes, no such problem. I am leaning strongly to a fudged board here if both chips give the same problem whilst no one with working boards experienced this. GL :)
thanks mate...thats what i am leaning towards as well. although BE has my hopes up with some sort of BIOS issue that might be fixable.Quote:
Originally Posted by KTE
I think I asked before but it wasn't answered... has anyone with a Phenom and D9s been able to run plus 1200 RAM on this board?
What about >1200 4-4-4-4 (volts)?
What about 1200 5-5-5-x/4-4-4-x with >2.4G IMC? (EVEREST/Sandra/Pi)
What about 3-3-3-x >900-1100?
What about CAS4 1066 1T?
Has anyone been able to boot 1300 with RAM known to have done it easily?
The MSI RD790 has most of these limitations.
Have any of you gotten a hang error when waiting for the raid bios to scan your sata drives? I can't seem to enable raid on the new bios or the last one.
Thanks
If that didn't do it which I did not think it would unfortunately sound like you need a RMA:(Quote:
Originally Posted by 3oh6
thanks anyway man, i appreciate the help none-the-less. it looks like this one is going back. not sure i am ready to go round 2 with these beasts though.Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Esau